What security for a new laptop?

[imageonline]

Have always downloaded avg free, and adaware, but wonder if buying Norton or similar would be better for a Toshiba home premium laptop.

Any suggestions please?

 

[makemoney]

Have always downloaded avg free, and adaware, but wonder if buying Norton or similar would be better for a Toshiba home premium laptop.

Any suggestions please?

You can get Norton for around 12 pounds or less for a 3 pc licence ([FONT=&quot]£[/FONT]4 per person?)

 

[Rudi]

I wouldn't recommend Norton nor McAffee (I don't think anyone would). Your best bets would be amongst G-Data (I recommend this, uses 2 scanning engines both BitDefender and Avast, separately two of the best), NOD32 or Kaspersky.

G-Data's InternetSecurity is £34.95, whereas if you wanted more features (see the comparison chart) specific for Notebooks such as the hardware-based locking and complete file backup you could look at Notebook Security which is a bit (read: a lot) more pricey at £49.95, but depending on what you want it could be better.

All of the above said though, what are you using the computer for? If it's for a savvy user then you're probably better off getting Microsoft Security Essentials (Free) or Avast Free, because usage will be (read: should be) minimal.

 

[cart-com]

Hi, The 2 security suites N and M are RUBBISH! Up grade to Avg Internet Security 2012. If you want a licence for £25 let me know ill give you one years for £25. I;m a authroised Partner.

 

Is this purely for Home use? If so, then take the free option of AVG, it'll suit fine.

If you find you need a little more than that, then load MS Security Essentials on there too - it runs alongside AVG with no problems (one of the few).

Norton and McAfee are a little OTT and resource-hungry really, and can be a PITA on home machines for the average user.

If it's a business PC then you should be buying a license, so AVG Internet Security is a nice option for the price.

 

[qualitydsgn63]

You should download antivirus for it.Don't use while charging.

 

[Posilan]

As Comspec said, install AVG Free if it's for personal use - it's excellent.

I also recommend you install Prey on it - http://preyproject.com/

In the (hopefully unlikely) event it gets stolen, you can "activate" prey to track the laptop down and even take a picture of the thief if it has a built in webcam. Again, this is free.

Steve

 

[Dan_HiHosting]

I'd second the recommendation for Avast. It's free, doesn't riddle your computer with bloat like Norton (which is also notoriously difficult to remove - it behaves a lot like the viruses it's meant to protect you from), and it comes highly rated in security software rankings.

I personally switched to Kaspersky as you can often get good deals for it (e.g. £30 for 3 computers), and it's also decent.

Although there are rumours about it opening ports up and links to the russian government etc. They're only rumours as far as I'm aware, and as long as you're not working in government that isn't an issue.

NOD32 was very good for active defence back in the day.

You've got active defence to protect you from incoming threats, and then passive/scan defence for existing malware, or anything you've put on your computer etc.

You can roughly translate that to having a firewall, and anti virus. Although the latter comes in active and passive varieties too.

Back in the day you'd probably have separate programs for each but these days a lot of that is integrated.

You can run windows firewall/defender alongside Avast or Kaspersky no problem. For personal use that should more than suffice.

Rudi's advice is good so I'd go with that.

Hope that helps.

EDIT: Virus Bulletin is good for rankings: http://www.virusbtn.com/vb100/RAP/RAP-quadrant-Aug-Feb12-850.jpg

 

[HungryHorse]

I don't really understand the whole need for antivirus protection in most situations. Simply don't download or execute something which is going to damage your system. I have not used antivirus software in probably around 6-7 years and not had a problem. Just know what you're downloading and know what you're running!

I'm no expert but I'd go for AVG if it's a must. I've set this up on friend's systems many times and it's done the job of stopping them from accidently running anything malicious.

My personal opinion is that antivirus software slows down your system a lot and gets in the way a lot more than it helps Especially when it's doing things like checking every file which is accessed.

 

[Posilan]

I don't really understand the whole need for antivirus protection in most situations. Simply don't download or execute something which is going to damage your system. I have not used antivirus software in probably around 6-7 years and not had a problem. Just know what you're downloading and know what you're running!

How do you know?

Steve

 

[HungryHorse]

How do you know?

- data intact
- card details not been used by anybody else
- login details not compromised
- system running smoothly

etc etc

Put it this way; if I have been infected with a virus, trojan etc then I certainly don't see the problem with these because it has caused NO inconvenience to me whatsoever The day it does cause an inconvenience to me, I'll eat my hat! om nom nom.

Well your very lucky, malware doesn't tell you when your about to download it

I don't really call it lucky, just a bit of thought before running everything and anything. In my experience, malware does often make it clear that it's there eating away at your system.

How do you expect malware to jump on your system if you're using an up to date web browser, up to date operating system, aren't running things that you're not supposed to, aren't visiting "dodgy" websites etc?

I lied. There was one occasion after being on the same network as my Dad's system with open permissions running Windows I ended up infected with some crap. Solution was simple though... format the system and she was sweet again I don't store any important data locally. I use my web browser, Git, Notepad++/gedit, Gimp, Spotify, PuTTy/terminal and that's about it. Never had any major problem, nothing that can't be solved.

Backup your data, know what you're running and save yourself from being immensely slowed down by antivirus software (or looking at it from a different prospective, same yourself some dollars that you'd have to spend on a higher spec system to handle the antivirus software smoothly)

 

[Posilan]

How do you expect malware to jump on your system if you're using an up to date web browser, up to date operating system, aren't running things that you're not supposed to, aren't visiting "dodgy" websites etc?

This view is at best a complacent and verging on an arrogant view - not all virus/malware is loaded by voluntary action and not using AV, especially on an Internet connected windows PC is just asking for trouble...

Steve

 

[HungryHorse]

This view is at best a complacent and verging on an arrogant view - not all virus/malware is loaded by voluntary action and not using AV, especially on an Internet connected windows PC is just asking for trouble...

Not arrogant, just my view on things based on my own personal experience. Sure I could be wrong but I know two things:

1. Running antivirus software was always a huge inconvenience to me as it crunched away scanning files, scanning files as I accessed them etc. This in my experience always slowed down my systems (lower end systems but still...)

2. Not running antivirus software has never resulted in any inconvenience to me in many years. There isn't anything which "could have been" resulted to a PC infection as I've not been a victim of fraud, stolen identity or anything so far. I guess the only thing I could be missing here is my system being used to take part in DDoS attacks etc - if this has been done, it has never caused a problem to me... a bit selfish but hey, it's true.

I should also note that I never notice any processes running unexpectedness. Again, in my experience, these processes actually make themselves very obvious.. spotted a mile off when they're running!

Given this, I'll continue to run the way I do now and hopefully not have any problems. If I do have a problem then I guess it serves me right but it's probably nothing that a quick format won't solve, unless I'm being targeted specifically. Even then they can use my system to access systems which I connect to, but those systems themselves have backups pulled from various locations across the globe so there will never be a catastrophe - just a small inconvenience which I'm yet to experience.

It's just the way I feel after using systems with antivirus "protection" and without. It does nothing for me, or hasn't so far. A precaution for many perhaps but I'ma live on the wild side for now until I'm made to look stupid.

I use a mixture of Windows and Ubuntu systems for desktops.

Edit: Looking at your website, the services you offer and the fact that you're an "authorized reseller" of AVG... it's obvious that you're going to disagree with my opinion. Just speaking from experience is all, I'm sure thousands of people out there still want to feel safe and run whatever software to look after their system on their behalf!

Edit 2: Run a basic hardware Firewall if it makes any difference to you, all inbound blocked etc.

 

[Rudi]

Like HungryHorse I don't use an Anti-Virus either, it generally is obvious when you're downloading something that's untrusted, and to be quite honest how often do you really need to install new applications? As a developer and somebody that does test a lot of applications etc I obviously regularly download .exe files and execute them so I'd place me at a high risk.

For normal users it's almost simple, if you see this:

.. you probably shouldn't be running it - unless you know *exactly* what it is.

I of course don't leave it 100% to my knowledge and let G-Data perform a scan of my system every 3-6 months or whenever I remember. I've never had a single issue with this method.

EDIT: Just as an aside this is also with inbound/outbound rules explicitely defined to be what I use, which reduces attack vector massively.

 

[HungryHorse]

Well im out of this thread as sometimes there is no answer to stupidity

You mean since you realised that somebody else is on at least a somewhat similar wavelength to me, you have no argument to give and drop out. Hardly living up to your signature now, are you?

 

[HungryHorse]

Does anybody here run antivirus software which doesn't slow down your system and file access? If so, are you using a higher end system, low end or what? No matter which way you look at it, surely on a low to mid end system antivirus software which scans every file access (if you run it in this setup?) is going to be a massive inconvenience? Do you just deal with it for the benefit of added safety (or at least the feeling of safety?)

I should also note that I've known friends systems to become infected even whilst running an up to date version of AVG with an up to date library (or whatever the name is.. forgotten).

 

[Dan_HiHosting]

Whilst it may be fine for you, I certainly wouldn't recommend others to not run antivirus. Especially when the OP stated they just got a new laptop, which I'm sure can even handle Norton, and certainly a better and less resource intensive anti virus programme.

Whilst the chances are slim, you could have had a trojan on your system and had valuable files and documents stolen over those 6-7 years, and you'd have no clue about it.

If you're running Linux then the need for anti virus can certainly be questioned, however the OP is running Windows only I believe. Even with the latest updates, windows whilst better than before isn't impervious to attacks/malicious code even if you don't download from untrusted sources etc. Anti virus heuristics can help protect you against zero day exploits and so forth.

At the end of the day, Avast and Avira both provide decent aniti virus programmes for free for personal use, and Kaspersky and other decent paid for programmes are inexpensive, so there's really no reason not to run decent anti virus on a modern system. And you don't have to have it scan your files all the time if you don't want it to.

I personally don't trust windows, the internet etc enough to have my personal files exposed without a few layers of protection in between. Each to their own I guess.

And reformatting your computer every time you encounter an issue is hardly efficient. Running anti virus is much like insurance. Hopefully you never need it, but if you do, you should benefit from some protection to save you time, effort, and issues.

 

[Posilan]

Does anybody here run antivirus software which doesn't slow down your system and file access? If so, are you using a higher end system, low end or what? No matter which way you look at it, surely on a low to mid end system antivirus software which scans every file access (if you run it in this setup?) is going to be a massive inconvenience? Do you just deal with it for the benefit of added safety (or at least the feeling of safety?).

We deploy AVG Business AV to all our supported customers and monitor the installations via a central admin console (we see any out of date machines, virus infections prevented, other issues etc).

The vast majority of PC's have no problems running it on standard settings - for really old PC's (that should really be decommissioned anyway) we sometimes turn off more advanced features like Link Scanner, ID protection and so on keeping just the AV resident shield and email scanner on.

*ALL* AV software will slow down file access very slightly as it carries out a quick on demand scan, but it's better to be safe than sorry especially as you are a business and potentially processing client data.

As an IT company, we simply cannot run the risk of a machine becoming infected and potentially compromising client machines and/or data and therefore take all steps we can to assist us in preventing infections.

Steve

 

[Rudi]

Just as an aside please note I wasn't suggesting the OP doesn't run an anti-virus.

 

[HungryHorse]

Whilst it may be fine for you, I certainly wouldn't recommend others to not run antivirus.

True.

Especially when the OP stated they just got a new laptop, which I'm sure can even handle Norton, and certainly a better and less resource intensive anti virus programme.

Even on a new system I find that antivirus software slows down read access too much.

Whilst the chances are slim, you could have had a trojan on your system and had valuable files and documents stolen over those 6-7 years, and you'd have no clue about it.

With all due respect, if I have no clue about it, I probably do not care. If it becomes a problem, I'll know about it. i.e. some valuable document which was previously on my system alone, is found in the public domain - at that point, I know that my system has been infected/intruded

At the end of the day, Avast and Avira both provide decent aniti virus programmes for free for personal use, and Kaspersky and other decent paid for programmes are inexpensive, so there's really no reason not to run decent anti virus on a modern system. And you don't have to have it scan your files all the time if you don't want it to.

I find antivirus software to be really annoying in general. Even if you just want to do one-off scans, it still insists on running some form of the software in the background. (again this probably isn't always true but in my experience with software such as AVG... or perhaps I was just missing the right settings, who knows)

I personally don't trust windows, the internet etc enough to have my personal files exposed without a few layers of protection in between. Each to their own I guess.

I don't trust Windows as such and certainly don't trust the internet. What I do trust in is myself not to run anything which is going to cause a problem and Chrome to not allow anything to magically jump out of a web page and embed itself into my system without Chrome or Windows giving some kind of clue that this has just happened! If that can happen on a day to day basis then I guess loads of people are in trouble.

And reformatting your computer every time you encounter an issue is hardly efficient. Running anti virus is much like insurance. Hopefully you never need it, but if you do, you should benefit from some protection to save you time, effort, and issues.

I would rather just format the system than have the antivirus software tell me all is safe, that "the virus has been contained". Once formatted I *know* the system is safe to use. Since I probably format my systems every 1-2 years anyway, having a little hiccup with an infection once every few years is not going to cause bother to me with the formatting afterwards.

 

[Posilan]

Once formatted I *know* the system is safe to use.

Not really - soon as you connect it back to the LAN you may get it reinfected by a worm from another PC on the network you may be unaware of.

And just because you don't see any signs, it can still be infected and part of a botnet.

Steve

 

[HungryHorse]

but I know people who have even managed to pick up things with anti virus

Yes, you make a good point here as to why antivirus software should be used... sounds like it's working so well. The antivirus software which allows viruses to run on the system - sounds great! I would honestly rather stick to how I'm doing things now.

 

[HungryHorse]

Not really - soon as you connect it back to the LAN you may get it reinfected by a worm from another PC on the network you may be unaware of.

Which other PC? My phone? The other system which I manage and is clean?

There are limited systems on my local network and none have any problems as far as I know.

And just because you don't see any signs, it can still be infected and part of a botnet.

If you bothered to read, I made this point myself before. I know this is selfish but if my system is part of a botnet and the activity is not causing a problem to my system (so much so that I don't even notice it)... then I'd much rather be a part of the botnet than run that antivirus software which is going to slow my system down !

In any case, I think I'd notice the process running. It can't hide for that long.

Bottom line is:

- antivirus software causes me a problem, personally.
- not running antivirus does not cause me a problem, personally.

What's the big fuss guys?

Hell even one off runs of the likes of Adaware which I run occasional are SLOW AS HELL and eating into my time.

 

[Talay]

A few months ago I had one of my PCs get sick. All manner of stuff was crashing it left, right and centre. Boot in safe was still sick, couldn't restore to a good place even though had dates available. I hadn't seen anything like it before. Nothing I did could bring it back and I was at the point of junking it to be honest.

I found IoBit Advanced System Care and it fixed the system. The free one did that and after a while I upgraded to the paid for one.

I also run MSE but Advanced System Care is what keeps the dogs at bay at the moment.

 

[Posilan]

Which other PC? My phone? The other system which I manage and is clean?

Sorry, I assumed you were sharing the LAN with other PC's when you said:

-There was one occasion after being on the same network as my Dad's system with open permissions running Windows I ended up infected with some crap.

What's the big fuss guys?

Well, if it suits you to take the inherent risks and potential fallout then who am I to argue? It's not an action I'd ever recommend or condone so we'll have to agree to disagree

Steve

 

[HungryHorse]

No but it princes that it's not just going to pop up and say hi I'm a virus please give me permission to download

Where did I say that was going to happen?

I don't need slow anti virus software to tell me that the image I'm downloading and about to try and open is not actually an image.

Here you are telling me, the person who's experienced very minimal (I would word it "no" personally) problems with not running anti virus software, that I should be running anti virus software... yet you "know people who have been infected whilst running anti virus software". Sounds quite ridiculous to me.

If you found that these systems where infected whilst running anti virus software and that software wasn't detecting the problems itself... why not remove the crap and carry on detecting for yourself?

Don't tell me again about things running without me knowledge because I honestly could not care less even if something was running without my knowledge... so long as it's not causing me a problem, what's the problem? (I know for a fact nothings running in the background without my knowledge though and I don't need software to prove this for me).

Your very point explains why people should NOT rely on ant virus software. Little old Dorothy thinks she's safe because she's running "virus super soaker blaster 2012"? No, as you said for yourself, the software can't always be relied on and a bit of education for the user goes further. This is why the "IT" education in schools needs to be GREATLY improved for the modern day, so people don't rely on the computer to keep itself safe but know how to look after it themselves.

 

[HungryHorse]

Sorry, I assumed you were sharing the LAN with other PC's when you said:

There was one occasion after being on the same network as my Dad's system with open permissions running Windows I ended up infected with some crap.

Yeah, I did word that as though we're always on the same network didn't I...

 

[HungryHorse]

Well I'm no expert but the guys that deal with computers all day every day seem to agre that anti virus is needed

Clearly not all of them:

1- me
2- the other poster who partly agreed with me
3- the millions of other people who "use computers all day every day" and haven't yet put their opinion into the topic

I would argue that people who "use computers all day every day" aren't necessarily experts though, that's for sure... I know tons of people who simply sit on Facebook (also known as "using computers") all day every day I also know tons of people such as my own Mother and Father who use computers all day every day for the purposes of their job but come to me without fail with every problem they have.

Just cause some guy "uses a computer all day every day", runs a "computer security business" and even has a poorly built website with logo's plastered all over it... it really doesn't make them the expert in the field. True story.

You would be a fool not to listen to me about horses that's for sure, given that I am a horse and you are merely a human.

At the end of the day folks, I am the anti-anti-virus and nothing can stop me apart from the anti-anti-anti-virus or a bit of horse tranquillizer.

Update: OR - a virus. A virus may stop me. Probably not though.

 

[MikeJ]

Microsoft seem to think anti-virus is a good idea....

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/antivirus-partners/windows-vista.aspx

Or you could believe a horse.

 

[martinbailey]

I use Microsoft Security Essentials. It just sits quietly in the background and does its thing without any annoying nag screens or popups.

I'd also recommend Spybot Search and Destroy.

I always delete McAfee and Norton as they are just too bloated. AVG is getting that way as well, especially on slower, older PCs.

But on a laptop I'd also install Prey - see preyproject.com. This is open source tracking software. You install it on the laptop and have access to a website where you can mark a product as stolen. You can make it silently email you information when it comes online, and even take a picture via the webcam. (Of course, most thieves that know anything will format the hard disc, and if you have a password they are not going to log in, but hey, it's free and another layer of protection.

 

[HungryHorse]

Microsoft seem to think anti-virus is a good idea....

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/antivirus-partners/windows-vista.aspx

Firstly, anti virus software IS a good idea for people who don't know what's malicious and what isn't etc.

Secondly, Microsoft aren't the best people to refer to on this regardless of their size because they have failed to protect consumers time and timer again in many ways.

I would definitely trust a horse - horses have really big heads, big eyes, big ears... they take in everything and are full of knowledge, you humans just haven't really managed to tap into it yet. It's OK though because I'm here now.

 

[HungryHorse]

I use Microsoft Security Essentials. It just sits quietly in the background and does its thing without any annoying nag screens or popups.

I'd also recommend Spybot Search and Destroy.

I actually have good experiences with both of these products. The best part of it is that Microsoft's product is built into Windows and FREE (well, not an additional cost anyway). People probably forget about Security Essentials quite a lot but it does the job and if you want to feel safe then you're sorted.

Despite everything I said in this topic, I might actually try enabling that again to see what it's like - I remember having it enabled on some systems by default in the past but surprisingly don't remember it getting in the way like just about every other piece of background running anti virus software. I'm down for software which runs quietly in the background and 1. isn't bloated and 2. doesn't bog down the system.

and yes, I made a comment about Microsoft and security above but clearly this has improved a bit on their part in very recent years... still, there are better companies to look to for security advice

I always delete McAfee and Norton as they are just too bloated. AVG is getting that way as well, especially on slower, older PCs.

Agreed. Even on modern low end systems I find them an absolute pain to work with. Plus you're going to hate that crap from day 1 when it has been FORCED onto your system by so many manufacturers.

Since Windows has 'Security Essentials' built in, why do manufacturers think it's OK to have crap like Norton's software pre-installed... clearly making your average joe think that it's required, especially with the scary warnings that your antivirus is out of date, antivirus license expiring etc.

 

[Rudi]

Since Windows has 'Security Essentials' built in, why do manufacturers think it's OK to have crap like Norton's software pre-installed... clearly making your average joe think that it's required, especially with the scary warnings that your antivirus is out of date, antivirus license expiring etc.

It doesn't; It has Windows Defender built in. Microsoft Security Essentials is an entirely different product.

Windows Defender = Ad/Spyware
Microsoft Security Essentials = All Malware

 

[HungryHorse]

It doesn't; It has Windows Defender built in. Microsoft Security Essentials is an entirely different product.

Windows Defender = Ad/Spyware
Microsoft Security Essentials = All Malware

My bad, I noticed this just now when I had to go and download it.

Still, it's something which you can grab for free as part of your Windows license. It's a small download and so far looking very basic and fast to run, not like AVG etc. So far, so good. I'll update once it's ran a scan and more than likely tells me that the system is CLEAN (for all of you people who think this is unlikely because the genius anti virus bloatware hasn't been here to "protect" me thusfar).

Update: didn't even realise, the scan had started and my system is running smoothly whilst MSE is running this full scan in the background. Very impressed. Wouldn't say it's necessary but if it can run this smoothly then I'll happily keep it running in "real time" mode in the background. So far, no signs of anything bad creeping around (of course). Fully recommended over anything else. Of course for the likes of your software firewall, Windows also has this built-in so you don't need other products in your face 24/7.

 

[HungryHorse]

Horse had no protection for a long time, horse wasn't missing out on anything.

Seriously though, I don't mind it sitting there in the background if it doesn't get in the way. I still don't believe I need it but it can't do any harm in running. So, since MSE is doesn't such a splendid job of just running without bogging things down I'm going to leave it running and see how it goes. So far, happy.

If you're looking for an anti virus solution, check out Windows Security Essentials as originally mentioned by martinbailey. The paid packages often come with the likes of a software firewall built in, Windows also has this built in though - Google it.

 

[Rudi]

If you're looking for an anti virus solution, check out Windows Security Essentials as originally mentioned by martinbailey. The paid packages often come with the likes of a software firewall built in, Windows also has this built in though - Google it.

Errr, just to continue my clarification spree, I originally mentioned that

But yes, MSE is great for what it is, as is Avast Free.

 

[HungryHorse]

Errr, just to continue my clarification spree, I originally mentioned that

But yes, MSE is great for what it is, as is Avast Free.

Sorry must have missed that. Never heard of Avast Free will check it out, since I'm an anti-anti-anti-virus expert horse now. Wait til we get let out of the stables tomorrow and I tell my chums in the other field!

 

[Ryan_Richards]

With my personal experience i would recommend McAfee Antivirus Reason is there below :-

I have a good experience with Antivirus Like McAfee because McAfee provides good protection against malware and apart from that it doesn't slow down your system. and McAfee provide the best customer service ever.

 

[paulears]

If you have no virus protection this can be fine if there is nothing gin your machine, or on shared cloud drives that you don't have duplicated somewhere else. Not ever having had a virus is a daft reason for asserting you don't need one. I'd like to think that I am cautious and understand risk - yet two of my machines in the past year warned me a file was infected. Both were genuine cases of needing something. I loaded an old illustrator file and got a font missing warning - the document was from two computers back, so I get these from time to time, so I googled Babylon 5 font, went to a familiarise website and clicked download - the usual zipped file downloaded. As I unzipped it - AVG sprung into life and quarantined it - the zip contained an advertising virus - one of those that opens up advertising when you use the Web. No anti-virus really means stopping doing everyday tasks. Most of what I do requires me to download files in some shape or form. Not downloading from new sites is not really an option. The box that pops up asking permission is a very common task for me. I cannot imagine being able to work without downloading .exe files!

 

[Aldous Acker]

Norton is best anti virus software. you should go for Norton to secure your computer.