Help pls, strategy to get employees actually working ....

[Wowee]

Hi, I work for a small company, who have always been very "laid back" with admin staff. This has resulted in an incredibly lax attitude - 1 member of staff basically treats the office like an internet cafe, another is going down that route, following the example.
Both have worked there for some years, the main offender joined straight from school 10 years ago, has never worked anywhere else, and also has a fine line in "smart comments" if anyone tries to mention how much work isn't getting done - her timekeeping and reliability are also somewhat flaky, but she constantly pleads her single mother status as an excuse (currently part-time anyway, 16 hrs per week)

I have been there 18 months-ish, just been appointed Office Manager, and have the task of trying to get this sorted. Apart from a lack of work being done, the quality of work which IS done is pretty poor (largely due to staff having their mobile phones on their desks while processing invoices etc, more interested in text conversations with friends & family than actually getting the numbers right). This causes all sorts of problems - and it's usually me that has to resolve them, which takes me away from the management accounting that is supposed to be my main role.

The directors (who allowed this situation to happen) know this can't go on. However, they don't want to have to introduce a complete ban on such practices - and I want to attempt to avoid a battle with staff if I can - altho I know I can't be Miss Popular and solve this problem.

There was a company meeting earlier this week, at which a director explained to all staff that revenues need to rise, costs need to fall or we could all be out on the street. But these 2 girls are unlikely to understand the implications of their own actions - or maybe they do ... I reckon that if 1 of them actually WORKED during the time they are in the office, we could do without the other 1 altogether

So, how would you approach this please ?

 

[AllUpHere]

I'd say the first thing to realise is that there is no way you are going to get this sorted without ruffling a few feathers. They are going to have you running round in circles if you try to take a 'softy softy' approach. Having been allowed to get away with this for so long they are bound to resist any half hearted attempt you make.

You might want to sugar coat it a bit, but my general message to them would be no phones in the office, turn up to work on time, or bugger off.

NB. Run anything you decide to do by HR first, to make sure you aren't shooting yourself in the foot from a legal perspective.

 

[Wowee]

W

NB. Run anything you decide to do by HR first, to make sure you aren't shooting yourself in the foot from a legal perspective.

Oh for the luxury of an HR dept !! We are very small, don't have an HR dept, previously one of the directors dealt with personnel matters (ineptly) . Said chap is on the way to retirement, which is how come I now get the task I've got.

Unfortunately I know we can't just adopt a "no phones in the office, turn up to work on time, or bugger off" stance. It'll have to be a long drawn-out disciplinary process to move either of them on - and the difficult atmosphere in the office won't improve productivity in the meantime

 

[avecSys]

Disciplinary process is by far the best action. Targets need to be met or the company goes down, end of. Draw up these targets and introduce them in a slightly lacked manner, basically you need to apply these by keeping everything rather the same but imply harsher changes will be made if the work is not done.

So I would approach it like you are having everything handed to you and say you want to be the good person, not the bad. Explain that you don't want to bring these harsh rules in but if the job is not done you will have to. So you can still have the relaxed attitude as long as the targets are met. Then explain that the targets and work are part of the job description, if these are not met then disciplinary action is the only route. That way you come across as the person that needs results, but wants to keep the atmosphere relaxed.

 

[AllUpHere]

There are plenty of HR consultants about who you could use to make sure things are done in the right way. In fact I am sure some will be along to advise you on the thread once they stumble across it.

You are perfectly within your rights to expect the employees to do a decent amount of work, and turn up on time. If you give them specific instructions regarding what is acceptable and what isn't (and they continue to fail to meet the minimum standard) you could swiftly have them out the door by following a proper disciplinary procedure.

You are going to get an awkward atmosphere in the office no matter how you try to deal with this. After having got away with it for so long, I don't think they are going to roll over and become star employees, just because you ask nicely.

My comments are based purely on experiences as an employer. What you really need is specific HR advice to find out exactly what you can and can't do, so you know what your options are.

 

[Newchodge]

You can introduce a no phones in office policy immediate;y. You can draw up proper procedures as to what will happen if people turn up late. Then you have to bite the bullet and ensure the policies and procedures are adhered to.

This will mean:
introduce policies
monitor them and immediately speak to anyone in breach, initially point out the breach, and explain what you expect
Further breach speak to them in a formal meeting, keep minutes and explain that further breach will result in start of disciplinary process and could ultimately lead to dismissal.

Warn the directors in advance to expect ruffled feathers, complaints etc, but tell them that unless they back you on this nothing will change.

If you need any help drafting policies, please feel free to drop me a PM. I can also offer an end of telephone service if needed to talk you through any sticky bits!

 

[Wowee]

Thanks Cyndy for your advice. I may well be PM ing you shortly.
Problem is that I'm not going to be able to throw much money at this problem right now, we're trying to cut costs all over the place.

 

[Wowee]

You can introduce a no phones in office policy immediate;y. You can draw up proper procedures as to what will happen if people turn up late. Then you have to bite the bullet and ensure the policies and procedures are adhered to.

This will mean:
introduce policies
monitor them and immediately speak to anyone in breach, initially point out the breach, and explain what you expect
Further breach speak to them in a formal meeting, keep minutes and explain that further breach will result in start of disciplinary process and could ultimately lead to dismissal.

Warn the directors in advance to expect ruffled feathers, complaints etc, but tell them that unless they back you on this nothing will change.

If you need any help drafting policies, please feel free to drop me a PM. I can also offer an end of telephone service if needed to talk you through any sticky bits!

Hi Chaps & Chapesses,
I thought I would update you here with what is going on, partly because I think I'm going to need a bit of moral support over the few weeks.
I had decided that we had to get something in place, and a new year seemed like a good time to start.
So my 3 admin staff have been informed of the following (names omitted for obvious reasons) :

"As you are aware, the company has had a difficult year in 2014, and we need to make a number of changes to the way we all work to ensure the company succeeds in 2015.

In order to improve efficiency and professionalism in the office, the directors have decided to implement the following policies.


1. Use of personal mobile phones during office hours

Personal mobile phones are no longer allowed on your desk or in view during working hours, please keep them in your bag or in a closed drawer.

It is recognised that sometimes employees have matters that need to be dealt with by phone during the working day, and you may take a SHORT break from your desk in the morning or afternoon to deal with such matters. We anticipate that part-time staff will usually be able to deal with such matters outside their office hours or on non-working days.

Of course you may use your mobile during your lunch break period (30 minutes for full-time employees).

You may give the office telephone number to anyone who may need to contact you in an emergency, such as relatives/schools etc, but obviously this number should not be used for general personal or social calls.

2. Internet use during office hours

Company employees are expected to use the Internet responsibly and productively. During working hours internet access should be limited to job-related activities ONLY.

The directors are happy to allow personal use such as reading news pages, using Facebook or other social media sites, and online shopping during your lunch break period (30 minutes for full-time employees), although obviously this precludes accessing adult material or any other sites which are inappropriate in the workplace.

The above policies will apply with immediate effect. Non-compliance with the policies will be regarded as a disciplinary matter, and may be dealt with accordingly.

Please reply to this email to confirm that you have read and understood it. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me or Mr Managing Director for clarification "


And of course, things have kicked off -
The least bad of the 3 has gone into a major sulk because there has been no "consultation period"

Offender no 2 has tackled me directly and says she won't comply. Apparently her main problem is that her children often run of credit on their mobiles, and she needs to be able to see if they have sent her a Whatsapp message in an emergency - her children are all in their 20s and should be independent adults by now (they don't have disability issues or anything), even my 15 year-old son can manage his phone credit !!
Neither of these 2 are now speaking to me in the office (which gives me time to get on with things - result)

The worst offender is off for medical reasons this week (I wanted the policy in place before she came back) altho she has read the email and responded that she understands- I had no idea she was receiving email sent to her work account on her personal mobile, I'm not really very happy about that .. but that is another issue. This person is the one with most attitude issues, so I'm sure she'll fuel the fire when she comes back

When tackled by no 2 yesterday I took the following line
1. The whole point is that we need to have a more professional and focused attitude towards work
2. They are NOT being cut off from outside contact altogether, and they can be contacted by family/school whatever if need be, just by conventional phone rather than constant texts/messages on mobile
3. This is the only change the directors have asked them to make towards helping us to recover from last year’s problems
4. This step is being taken to help ensure that we all still have jobs over the next year, and hopefully can offer them a raise in wages if things improve as we hope.

I am assured by the directors that they will back me up if (when) staff complain to them.

Sooo - we shall see

 

[Paul_Rosser]

Thanks Cyndy for your advice. I may well be PM ing you shortly.
Problem is that I'm not going to be able to throw much money at this problem right now, we're trying to cut costs all over the place.

With staff like that can you really afford not to spend the money on having the matter dealt with? As it's more than likely costing you much more than the cost of getting some proper HR advice will.

 

[Newchodge]

Good luck!

You might consider pointing out to number 1 that these changes are non-negotiable, and while you could have had a consultation period it would have been hypocritical, given that the changes atre non-negotiable.

Don't forget to tell number 2 that the consequences of non-compliance are clear.

Hope number 3 comes back in a good frame of mind!

It will work out, as long as the directors continue to back you. It is, sadly, a common problem that one of them will sympathise, apologise, blame you and imply that the rules aren't meant to be absolute!

 

[tony84]

Pull them in to a meeting. Introduce yourself properly, let them know why you have been brought on board with the specific aim of increasing productivity.

Let them know if things do not improve during Jan and Feb you will be bringing in a mobile phone ban - if mum needs it for the school ask her to give the school the office number - and an internet ban for anything other than before/after work and during lunch time.

You could also look to suggest bringing in monthly reviews based on quality and productivity... but you would rather not have to do that as its more work for everyone involved - so its their actions or lack of which will result in that being brought in if it is.

Then end on you have arranged for a few free beers after work on a friday. Maybe if numbers and quality are hit there is a free night out up for grabs?

I dont envy you.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

What you have done sound right to me, I do suggest you get a employees handbook made at some time sooner rather than latter with all rules and things like holidays etc explained.and start with the disciplinary rules and what justifies Gross misconduct, explains written notices and there options when called to a disciplinary meeting and time frames

 

[NickGrogan]

Any particular reason you haven't fired them?

Offender 2 says she won't comply, you say the rules are non-negotiable, and non-compliance is a disciplinary matter. So the conversation should probably end with something like, "Sorry you feel that way, it's been nice working with you, but these are the rules and so we are going to have to let you go. I'll confirm your last day shortly"

If the other 2 don't comply after this. let them go as well.

Given you refer to your own staff as offenders, probably a good idea anyway.

If you don't enforce the rules, why bother having them?

 

[Newchodge]

Any particular reason you haven't fired them?

Offender 2 says she won't comply, you say the rules are non-negotiable, and non-compliance is a disciplinary matter. So the conversation should probably end with something like, "Sorry you feel that way, it's been nice working with you, but these are the rules and so we are going to have to let you go. I'll confirm your last day shortly"

If the other 2 don't comply after this. let them go as well.

Given you refer to your own staff as offenders, probably a good idea anyway.

If you don't enforce the rules, why bother having them?

Brilliant. Immediately resulting in an indefensible unfair dismissal claim, given the employee has been there 10 years and the rules were only brought in this week!

 

[Wowee]

Brilliant. Immediately resulting in an indefensible unfair dismissal claim, given the employee has been there 10 years and the rules were only brought in this week!

Yes, I thought exactly that.

Interestingly, lady no. 2 - who said she wouldn't comply - has been working happily today with no phone on her desk, didn't even get the phone out at lunchtime. So I think after some initial bluster she may well have realised it isn't worth the fight (I'm crossing my fingers).

 

[NickGrogan]

Brilliant. Immediately resulting in an indefensible unfair dismissal claim, given the employee has been there 10 years and the rules were only brought in this week!

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/reasons-you-can-be-dismissed

Reasons you can be dismissed
There are some situations when your employer can dismiss you fairly.

A ‘substantial reason’
You may be dismissed fairly if, for example:

• you unreasonably refuse to accept a company reorganisation that changes your employment terms

Unfair dismissal
Your dismissal could be unfair if your employer doesn’t:

• have a good reason for dismissing you

Strange that the Government website agrees with me...

The company is changing the employment terms, ie no internet, no phones at work, etc, and the employee is refusing to accept the changes, they have a GOOD reason for dismissing.

Your earlier post recommends dismissal if the rules are breached repeatedly. The employee stated that they will not be complying with the rules at all. This is more than a simple breach and should be dealt with appropriately.

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/overview

Dismissal is when your employer ends your employment - they don’t always have to give you notice.

If you’re dismissed, your employer must show they’ve:

• a valid reason that they can justify
• acted reasonably in the circumstances

They must also:

• be consistent - eg not dismiss you for doing something that they let other employees do
• have investigated the situation fully before dismissing you.

Hence my advice to sack the other 2 as well, be consistent, enforce the rules - otherwise why have rules anyway.

Perhaps you can explain why 10 years of service makes a difference (my understanding is rights are the same if you have more than 2 years service) and why is should take someone more than a week to put their phone away and get off of Facebook when at work.

 

[Employment Law Clinic]

Brilliant. Immediately resulting in an indefensible unfair dismissal claim, given the employee has been there 10 years and the rules were only brought in this week!

I love indefensible dismissal claims. In this case, I would argue insubordination – failure to follow a reasonable instruction (not to use mobile devices at work) – or simply because after 10 years employment, it would be reasonable for an employer to expect their employee to actually work during working hours; regardless of how long it’s been since they got this concept, it’s still a perfectly reasonable request, and if there is a failure to comply it would be within the scope of a reasonable employer to dismiss, subject to warnings, etc.




Karl Limpert

 

[DavidWH]

I'm glad it's not just me.

We've just had terms of employment drawn up for our apprentice, the sick days, Facebook, excessive breaks, and the incident of distributing images from our library to mates pushed me on the edge.

She got the terms yesterday and has been off sick today. We've had to redo all the work she spent all day yesterday producing as it was substandard, and did the one thing I told her not to do!

Work is work, business is business. They'l moan and complain bit stick with your policis and it will become the norm.

 

[Newchodge]

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/reasons-you-can-be-dismissed

Reasons you can be dismissed
There are some situations when your employer can dismiss you fairly.

A ‘substantial reason’
You may be dismissed fairly if, for example:

• you unreasonably refuse to accept a company reorganisation that changes your employment terms

Unfair dismissal
Your dismissal could be unfair if your employer doesn’t:

• have a good reason for dismissing you

Strange that the Government website agrees with me...

The company is changing the employment terms, ie no internet, no phones at work, etc, and the employee is refusing to accept the changes, they have a GOOD reason for dismissing.

Your earlier post recommends dismissal if the rules are breached repeatedly. The employee stated that they will not be complying with the rules at all. This is more than a simple breach and should be dealt with appropriately.

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/overview

Dismissal is when your employer ends your employment - they don’t always have to give you notice.

If you’re dismissed, your employer must show they’ve:

• a valid reason that they can justify
• acted reasonably in the circumstances

They must also:

• be consistent - eg not dismiss you for doing something that they let other employees do
• have investigated the situation fully before dismissing you.

Hence my advice to sack the other 2 as well, be consistent, enforce the rules - otherwise why have rules anyway.

Perhaps you can explain why 10 years of service makes a difference (my understanding is rights are the same if you have more than 2 years service) and why is should take someone more than a week to put their phone away and get off of Facebook when at work.

You can certainly dismiss for failing to follow a reasonable instruction. Provided you follow a reasonable procedure. The fact she has been acting this way for 10 years makes it even more necessary that she is given fair warning of the change in policy and given time to make the change. You were proposing to dismiss her without due process for stating that she would not comply. In fact, the OP has stated that she has immediately complied.

 

[Newchodge]

I love indefensible dismissal claims. In this case, I would argue insubordination – failure to follow a reasonable instruction (not to use mobile devices at work) – or simply because after 10 years employment, it would be reasonable for an employer to expect their employee to actually work during working hours; regardless of how long it’s been since they got this concept, it’s still a perfectly reasonable request, and if there is a failure to comply it would be within the scope of a reasonable employer to dismiss, subject to warnings, etc.




Karl Limpert

Exactly. Nick was suggesting instant dismissal during the initial conversation when the employee said she would not comply. Instant dismissal, without investigation, without a hearing, without warnings is rarely sensible and would be indefensible (even by you Karl) in these circumstances.

 

[NickGrogan]

You can certainly dismiss for failing to follow a reasonable instruction. Provided you follow a reasonable procedure. The fact she has been acting this way for 10 years makes it even more necessary that she is given fair warning of the change in policy and given time to make the change. You were proposing to dismiss her without due process for stating that she would not comply. In fact, the OP has stated that she has immediately complied.

How long is a reasonable time to put your phone away, close Facebook and get on with the work that you're paying paid to do?

Are you suggesting she needs to be weaned off of her phone over a period of days/weeks? That she should be allowed to check FB, but only every 15 minutes, not every 5 until she gets used to it? Really?

As an employer I'd say around a minute to log off FB and another minute to text your friends saying can't talk any more because I'm at work is reasonable.

I'd love to hear a defence based on I need weeks/months to stop using Facebook at work.

 

[Wowee]

How long is a reasonable time to put your phone away, close Facebook and get on with the work that you're paying paid to do?

Are you suggesting she needs to be weaned off of her phone over a period of days/weeks? That she should be allowed to check FB, but only every 15 minutes, not every 5 until she gets used to it? Really?

As an employer I'd say around a minute to log off FB and another minute to text your friends saying can't talk any more because I'm at work is reasonable.

I'd love to hear a defence based on I need weeks/months to stop using Facebook at work.

Oh Nick, on a personal level I agree with you entirely. However, as an employer I think we sometimes have to over-compensate in order to be seen as reasonable, so that is what will happen here.

As of today, Lady 2 (who said she wouldn't comply) has not got her phone out at all. - RESULT
Lady 1 (who wanted the consultation period) had a chat with the MD on Weds, and her phone has been prominently displayed on her desk since then. - She does have a very sick relative at the moment, which is one of her arguments against the policy. However, I did discuss it with her before informing everyone by email of the policy. I have told her that carers/hospital/everyone else involved can be given the office no. to contact her whenever needed, and that she could put her phone in her desk drawer with the sound on, so she could hear it ring (softly) and respond appropriately if it's a call she needs to take. She rejected these 2 compromise suggestions then. I plan to let it ride, then ask to see her in MD's office when he is in next week, point out that it WILL NOT be accepted, because we have to have the same rule for all.
Lady 3 (who I expect to cause most fuss) has informed us she will be off sick for 2 weeks, which at least lets us get to grips with Lady 1.

Oooh I AM looking forward to the weekend ...

 

[Karimbo]

set targets, including quality of work in the targets. E.g. if they are posting invoices incorrectly set a tolerable amount for human error e.g. 1% and if they consistently make more errors than allowed take disciplinary action.

You may well find that there isn't enough work for both of them in the office which is why they can spend all that time on social media and on the phone.

Having phone out on desk while at work isn't a problem in itself - if they can work productively and get all the tasks done quickly - they should get some allowance to chat and browse the net if they want.

 

[munaworks]

Just a very small psychological tip to offer, take it as you wish, it probably doesn't work in all cases.

Many times when people don't seem to be motivated to work, it can be useful to, rather than imposing measures or having a go at them, give them more empowerment and responsibility over their work. Usually when people are given a sense of responsibility they take their work more personally and don't see it as much as an external chore or bother.

 

[Wowee]

Just a very small psychological tip to offer, take it as you wish, it probably doesn't work in all cases.

Many times when people don't seem to be motivated to work, it can be useful to, rather than imposing measures or having a go at them, give them more empowerment and responsibility over their work. Usually when people are given a sense of responsibility they take their work more personally and don't see it as much as an external chore or bother.

Munaworks normally I would agree with you, but having worked alongside these ladies for 18 months prior to my promotion, I can honestly say I think it has all gone too far. They have been "empowered" - in that they were given no real direction or management at all - yes they knew that they needed to get all invoices posted, deal with customer queries etc but it was all done to the minimum standard they could get away with.
When I came in to sort out credit control, I was given a desk, PC and phone, and left to get on with it, that has been the 'management style' here for some years. It is only because I have worked with a number of companies (freelance) over some years that have a more focused attitude, I think.

I truly believe that the current staff need boundaries putting in place first, then we can look at setting them proper objectives (I'm planning appraisal meetings with each, which has never been done here), and letting them develop their own ways to achieve them.
I'm pretty sure that we will lose 2 (or maybe all 3) along the way, but I want to give them all the chance to stay aboard, or the choice to move on.

 

[munaworks]

Munaworks normally I would agree with you, but having worked alongside these ladies for 18 months prior to my promotion, I can honestly say I think it has all gone too far. They have been "empowered" - in that they were given no real direction or management at all - yes they knew that they needed to get all invoices posted, deal with customer queries etc but it was all done to the minimum standard they could get away with.
When I came in to sort out credit control, I was given a desk, PC and phone, and left to get on with it, that has been the 'management style' here for some years. It is only because I have worked with a number of companies (freelance) over some years that have a more focused attitude, I think.

I truly believe that the current staff need boundaries putting in place first, then we can look at setting them proper objectives (I'm planning appraisal meetings with each, which has never been done here), and letting them develop their own ways to achieve them.
I'm pretty sure that we will lose 2 (or maybe all 3) along the way, but I want to give them all the chance to stay aboard, or the choice to move on.

Fair enough, it does sound like you have considered this very carefully, in which case you can't go too far wrong in whatever choices you make. A delicate balance of carrot and stick is always best, the issue is always what that required balance is.

 

[NickGrogan]

Oh Nick, on a personal level I agree with you entirely. However, as an employer I think we sometimes have to over-compensate in order to be seen as reasonable, so that is what will happen here.

She rejected these 2 compromise suggestions then. I plan to let it ride, then ask to see her in MD's office when he is in next week, point out that it WILL NOT be accepted, because we have to have the same rule for all.

It sounds like things are moving in the right directions, but a couple of worrying points above.

Firstly, there is no need for compromise - the rules apply to everyone for a reason. People with relatives managed to work perfectly well before mobile phones were invented. Compromise is a slippery slope.

Secondly, letting it ride until the MD is in is only going to make things worse. You are the manager, they know the rules. If you let things ride, then come the meeting they'll just say "You didn't say anything, so I thought it was OK", etc. Tell them it's not OK, email them that it's not OK and you will be referring to the MD if it continues - (written confirmation). If they still refuse/don't comply - book a meeting with the MD, email them the time/date and explain why, along with any other HR policy (2nd written confirmation). All this shouldn't take more than 30 minutes - a reasonable time to put a phone away.

People normally comply after the first email and you have a nice audit trail should you need one.

All nice and HR friendly.

 

[fisicx]

She rejected these 2 compromise suggestions then. I plan to let it ride, then ask to see her in MD's office when he is in next week, point out that it WILL NOT be accepted, because we have to have the same rule for all.

Why let it ride? The rules are clear. Go see the MD Monday morning and point out he has undermined your position. Then tell this woman to put the phone in her desk and to give the sick relative the office number. Just like it used to be before the days of mobile phones. Don't put up with their BS. You are the manager not their friend.

 

[simon field]

What is it with people these days? What is this need to keep 'checking my facebook', 'checking my emails', 'checking for missed calls' etc etc.

What do they think is gonna happen if they don't keep 'checking'?

I can understand it from children and teenagers because it's what they see adults doing.

Many moons ago when I was an employee, if I'd kept skipping off to check what was on the telly I'd have been out the bleedin' door!

 

[john1989]

I agree with the majority of posters. I'm not a HR professional, but do understand the importance of following the correct procedure in these situations.

These three women have taken the piss for a long time, as it has been allowed to happen. It will be an uphill battle, but as long as you stick to your new policies they will soon realise it will no longer be tolerated - part of that is managing and enforcing your policies and not waiting until MD comes in. They have appointed you Office Manager for a reason ... I'm not saying that you should be snotty with them, but you should certainly be enforcing new procedures and rules.

If they don't like the new rules, and decide to leave of their own accord, I can only see this as a result under the circumstances. You might then replace them with employees that appreciate being employed, especially by what seems to be a relatively laid back employer.

Let's face it, we are creatures of habit, and don't like changes. The three employees won't like it, they'll try to make as much fuss as possible. Just ensure you do everything by the book and enforce the new policies properly.

 

[minhkien32]

Exactly. Nick was suggesting instant dismissal during the initial conversation when the employee said she would not comply. Instant dismissal, without investigation, without a hearing, without warnings is rarely sensible and would be indefensible (even by you Karl) in these circumstances.

oh, thank you Newchodge

 

[fisicx]

I plan to let it ride, then ask to see her in MD's office when he is in next week, point out that it WILL NOT be accepted, because we have to have the same rule for all.

Did you win?

 

[Wowee]

Did you win?

Ah well - sort of

The lady who persisted with the phone on her desk still has it on her desk - supposedly hidden from my view ... She has asked the MD if he will provide her with a reference - I strongly suspected she had started looking for another job when I was promoted to Office Manager, so I'm anticipating her resignation is imminent.
The lady who was off sick is STILL off sick, having got signed off for another week - she was the one I was expecting to be most difficult, so don't know yet. Half of me is wondering (hoping even ??) whether she is also job seeking ...
Lady 3 has settled down, no problems - although she will be disrupted when lady 1 goes (she knows that is lady 1's intention - altho they seem to think I have no idea).

So, not an out and out victory, but not defeat either. I'm looking forward to us appointing someone who might have just a bit of enthusiasm for work to replace lady 1.

 

[Newchodge]

What was the MD's response to lady 1? Did you get the support you needed?

 

[Wowee]

What was the MD's response to lady 1? Did you get the support you needed?

No, of course I didn't get the support I wanted - I didn't expect it from him particularly - but he has told her he'll give a reference

 

[Newchodge]

Have you had a private discussion with the MD about this, or are you going to let it ride, in the hope that some other company will take this employee on?

Incidentally, well done for going through with this.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Just tell No1 when you pass her "i thought we talked about no phones on the desk" and walk away, that will remind her who is boss, otherwise No will see her getting away with it and start copying

 

[Wowee]

Have you had a private discussion with the MD about this, or are you going to let it ride, in the hope that some other company will take this employee on?

Incidentally, well done for going through with this.

I have had a private discussion with MD, and mentioned it to him in passing on 2 other occasions, but ... the problem is that he is a mild mannered older chap, on his way to retirement. He doesn't want any confrontations. My view is that you can't make an omelette without breaking eggs, and if we have to get tough then so be it ... BUT I can't do it without directors support.

At least he has said he will give a reference, and is making no offers to persuade her to stay - thank goodness.

Thanks for your on going support

 

[smallclaimsassistance]

You get people like this in every office, whether or not there is strong management at the top. I've had a few employees like this and the only way to deal with them is to impose rules and stick to them, as the posters above have said. I realise that this seems defused (or at least on the way) now, but I wanted to add a couple of points which may well help solve some of your issues.

You've allowed Facebook etc during lunchtimes now, but if you get an excuse (ie: infringement), block all social media sites on the server. Don't ask, just do it and tell them. They are not entitled to a consultation on issues like this. We had people spending too much time on Facebook about 5 years ago. We blocked FB, Twitter etc, and after a short period of moaning people got used to it.

Using mobiles is a tough one, and I agree with the poster above who said no mobiles; in the event of emergency, family can ring the office number. As someone above said, what did we used to do 30 years ago?

As far as difficult staff are concerned generally, as posters above have said, the attitude has to be met with disciplined application of the rules, however, if the trouble makers are among the least productive staff (as they often are - funny that...), you could help deal with this by introducing incentives.

I have no idea of your budgets or your payplans, but anything from a monthly bowling evening, to a bottle of wine to M&S vouchers (or whatever) does work. You implement work "targets" - they don't have to be traditional "targets", and could be something like whoever gets through the most "work units" in 1 month, whatever those are for you, gets the incentive. Either the top performer(s) are rewarded, or you set a threshold which will effectively exclude the lowest performers.

This would be my preferred option because firstly most staff are motivated, and secondly your problem staff will be excluded and will probably up their game to at least scrape through. If they don't, they will quickly lose the sympathy of the other staff, who will have little patience with their grouching, when the hard workers have gone the extra mile to get their just reward. This doesn't necessarily deal with the attitude, but at least it ups productivity and motivates the others, and of course, because of that, it more than pays for itself. If it doesn't deal with the attitude it should also isolate the others, who will either get fed up and leave or probably toe the line. I've seen it work several times. Plus, you're everybody's new best friend because you introduced it.

Hope it all works out anyway.

Dean

 

[Wowee]

Interestingly, the phone is no longer on Lady 1's desk this morning.
I think I might have reached the goal ...