where do you think that the theory comes from? the reason I use my accountant is that he puts more time into keeping up to date with the law (I don't have the time), and he has more experience of business accountancy than I do, by acting across a range of businesses - which brings a breadth of experience into my business...fz04, you have a total misunderstanding of practical / theory / learning...
chicken and egg - you are claiming that the practical can only come after the theory... nonsense
if practical always came only from the theory, then Google would (with all their PhD bods) have developed the perfect theory and then implemented it. The fact that they keep tweaking it / developing it clearly shows that this is not the case.
The simple reality is that theory comes from practical as much as practical comes from theory - if you are familiar with rapid development models then you will understand the approach (v. the waterfall methodology).
And that is how SEO works in real life - those experienced practitioners on here and else-where will have theoretical knowledge, but it is continually refined by testing / implementing / observing / analysing - adapting the theory, back to testing / etc. - i.e. in and out of practical and theory...
anyone who goes into the SEO industry on a theoretical basis will be useless until they have actually done some SEO and seen the results and then re-learned their theory
and just to qualify - I am a qualified teacher and do a lot of teaching in a number of fields - what I have posted above is known and accepted across education / research / training / etc. no-one would train as a teacher and know the theory and go straight into their first job without any practical experience... however people do go and get hands on learning - classroom based, augmented with theory, but strongly locked into practical experience and this is how teacher training is developing - practice is considered far more important than theory.
my experience in the IT industry (which is considerable) also demonstrates very clearly that the most competent designers / coders / project managers / SEO bods / etc. are those who learn by doing it (yes, they will read and absorb theory as well), and continue to do so through their careers... those with theoretical knowledge only soon get it knocked out of them by the reality of business
nonsense
I have no accountancy training, but am quite capable of running the book-keeping / doing a VAT return / end of year company accounts / P&L / etc. etc.
Similarly I have no legal training but did my own legals for a business I ran with major VC investment into it - and ran rings around their lawyers including finding some major legal flaws in their work...
I would suggest that perhaps you need some experience before you start telling everyone else how it is done!
There are undoubtedly cowboys on this forum as elsewhere - but I would be very cautious about making comments like this - you have no idea of the relationships / work done by those companies or the results gained for their clients...
Once again you are making theoretical assumptions without basing them into the practical reality of life.
Please do not confuse theoretical learning and practical ability - sorry, you are totally wrong - in fact your theory is clearly itself not based in the practicality of real life - once you understand that then it will make sense!
You need to pull yourself out of the belief that theory is all and go and get some practice - then you will have a far more balanced and realistic view on life!
Alasdair
however the reason I posted initially is because you keep starting threads making exactly the same point - that theory / academic background is all - and practical experience doesn't count!
- it is definitely boring to see the same, unproven, theory being wheeled out again and again in a short period of time - it is in effect a slap down for the responses you receive as it shows that you are posting it to make a point, not to have a discussion - you obviously have no interest in reasoned logic or argument as you receive that and then just repost the same point... Haha, what a lot of nonsense.
Unless by "academic background" you mean an ftp account for a university you work for, that would certainly make ranking for competitive terms easy
That is good to hear - and yes, this discussion could go on a long time - because you don't seem to wish to listen to the combined wisdom of a number of very experienced people on here - fine, we all have our polemic views
No problem had you made the point once - interesting discussion - but to have people respond and then to keep posting the same perspective wrapped in slightly different wording could be seen as spam
or maybe you see it as an exercise in SEO spinning of content ?!
and if you think that your above example is all there is to practical SEO I think that you have just demonstrated the proof of my arguments - thank you...
as you are so determined that academic background (and you seem to imply in your threads that no-one else has one - or an equivalent one - you might just be surprised!) is the most important aspect to SEO I give you a simple challenge (simple to one of your academic status!):
prove to its absolute conclusion the following hypothesis:
That a person with an academic background {insert any def. of that background you like here} will be better at SEO than any one else - regardless of that other person's experience, knowledge and ability.
with your academic background you will of course be familiar with the need to prover your hypothesis... and you seem so convinced regarding this hypothesis that you should have no difficulty at all in proving it.
As for level of proof - I would like to see it in the form of a paper published in at least one reputable academic journal - a journal recognised by academia internationally; or if not published - at least in a form which could be published in such a journal. I (and no doubt many others) are very familiar with this process, I also have access to a number of university professors who will no doubt be happy to evaluate your proofs...
Of course, if you are not able to do that then we must consider the hypothesis unproven... which might just mean that we would take a view that practical experience is really rather useful after all.
looking forward to it
Alasdair
mmm most intrigued... hate to move from theory to reality for a moment, but perhaps you could (when you have finished my earlier challenge!) just demonstrate to us all:
how the packet switching routine on a router makes any difference to wheter the content on migh site is relevant or not to a particular search query...
ahhh Fred - you need a new car - www.buyanewcar.com looks good
no Bob, was going to look there, but my router packet switched and I suddenly found myself on the down line heading straight for www.howtocareforsmallpets.com - must be good I thought - these search engines analyse everything, so I bought myself a hamster wheel and roll off into work each day
Alasdair
)come come - you can't make comments like that - proof my dear chap - back it up - substantiate your assertations....
there's a good fellow
Alasdair
(P.S. - do wait for me to finish correcting typos before you quote me
without making any claims to be an SEO specialist, though I suspect I might know more about the practicalities than you do, as I do it every day...aha - the fundamental flaw in your logic (if logic it is Jim!)
you believe (incredibly) that you have to have a degree in computer science to understand this... your demonstrable lack of understanding of this whole discussion shows that you might possibly be wrong
there are plenty of folks on here who would have a crystal clear understanding of the underlying technology and algorithms, but might not have a piece of paper to throw darts at - your belief that without a piece of paper people would just not be able to understand is arrogant and simply wrong...
anyway - you haven't answered my challenge yet - if you can, I will switch to your way of thinking - if you can't, as I suspect by the fact that you have no evidence / logic / argument to back up your statements, then sorry - you need to reconsider your stance...
the simple fact is that there are people on this forum, and elsewhere, who undoubtedly have greater: qualifications / IQ / experience / ability / understanding / etc. etc. than you do - so setting yourself up with a theory which is impossible to prove, and simple to disprove just makes you look foolish... in many ways that is your own outlook - if that were to be the only consequence then no doubt no-one would bother responding - however, you make claims which are ludicrous, and it is important to counter them so that members who come on here to learn do not go away with a wrong idea...
at present there is a real danger that if anyone actaully believed your claim they would toddle off and buy in a bearded professor to analyse their company / market / compeition, interrogate the great Google to work out its logic and write a 20,000 word thesis on how to improve the company's position in the search engine rankings - no doubt fascinating, but a total waste of time - lets see an accurate and balanced view here - for those reading - get in companies who can demonstrate what they have done, and explain logically what they will do, and then over time show you what they are doing - simple - no need to worry about bits of paper!
Alasdair
how would you know - you have clearly stated that you are not an SEO person...
whereas I do at least run a successful design company
Alasdair
Taking that analogy, I find it odd that a fair few people (even some from this forum) trust me to assist them in employment law matters. When the theoretical study was scheduled I was bunking off, but my practical experience is derived from twenty years of practical experience defending employees as a trade union rep - I learnt a lot more than theory in that time.
While there are one or two potential clients that were more interested with a certificate to my knowledge & experience in law, most people still trust me... because I know what Im talking about! And bar some practical training with the TUC, all my legal knowledge is derived from practical experience. You can demonstrate an ability to learn, but the SEOs on here can demonstrate an ability to get a site up the rankings; practical experience is far more useful than theory.
