Customers Turning Up Late

[Sarandipity]

Apologies if this has been asked before - I did a quick search and could only see posts about chasing payments - or if this is the wrong place to ask.

I run a baking company from my home. Customers can pay for delivery or collect for free from me. Most, of course, opt to collect to avoid a charge. I arrange a specific time for them to be here as I cannot gaurantee I'll be in at whatever time they decide it's convenient for them to stop by. Unfortunately, I'm not a shop that is simply open 9-5 with staff on hand to help them. Probably 50% of my customers seem to view that as a loose agreement and turn up late, often significantly late, without notice. Yesterday, someone was nearly 2 hours late, without letting me know (I of course forgot to get their number, so that's on me). Beyond being incredibly inconsiderate and rude and frustrating me to no end, it's disruptive. I often need to leave to run business errands, deliver an order, set up a wedding...or even do personal tasks like walk the dog.

Anyway, I've sucked it up till now but after the 2 hours yesterday, I've decided I really need a policy for showing up outside your allotted time to protect myself. But I'm wondering about the legalities involved. I thought, perhaps, agree on a 30-min slot with customers and tell them I can't gaurantee I'll be available outside that time slot and they need to get in touch immediately to rearrange a mutally suitable time; that that won't necessarily be possible for the same day as I might be scheduled to be out of town setting up a wedding after their original scheduled time or what have you...or that what they've ordered may not keep much past their scheduled collection time and they'll essentially be forfeiting their order, without refund as they were a no show and I've already paid to make it.

My husband thinks this might get me into trouble, increasing the likelihood of ever ending up in small claims court, and he may be right. But I have to do something and I can't figure out a reasonable solution where I'll not be opening myself up to trouble. Does anyone have knowledge of what I can and can't enforce? Surely it can't simpy be a matter of excusing people waltzing in hours late without consequence. Or at least I hope not! TIA!

(oh, and in case it helps, I take full payment for orders in advance, so it's not an issue of not getting paid)

 

[Supercoach]

I really don't think you will end up in court for not being at the shop when customers turn up late
Get your terms and conditions right but, frankly, if this is causing grief and not making you any extra money it's time to ask yourself why you do it.

 

[Newchodge]

As long as you make the conditions clear before people place their final order, I can't see a problem. Does the customer have the ability to negotiate the timing of the 30 minute slot? That should mean they have no excuse not to be there.

 

[HFE Signs]

As above, cover it clearly in your terms. I'd also highlight it in your confirmation of order so it is as clear as it can be and leaves no doubt. Best of luck

 

[STDFR33]

thought, perhaps, agree on a 30-min slot with customers and tell them I can't gaurantee I'll be available outside that time slot

Tell them you won't be available outside the timeslot.

Having a loose policy means it will always be abused.

 

[Lisa Thomas]

Charge them extra upfront and give them back some money if they turn up on time...?

 

[Sarandipity]

Thanks for all the quick replies!

I always arrange it with the customer, so they can yay or nay the time - it's mutually decided. Early on in my business when I noticed people were going to disregard the agreed upon time, I starting saying I had to be or would be out from the time the agreed slot ended, and people still show up late. I've had people turn up after I've told them I'm not in any more so we will have to rearrange asking where I am. I mean, you couldn't be any clearer!

I usually leave discussing the finer details of collection till after an order has been confirmed (paid), so I will start including those points at the time of inquiry once I decide on a definite policy. I did consider a late fee paid at collection, but that could get very akward very quickly, so Lisa your suggestion is definitely worth considering. Thanks for all the help so far!

 

[The Byre]

Getting Brits to be punctual is impossible.

For starters, they think work starts at nine - try seven or eight.

Then they have their clocks set one hour behind everybody else's.

Then, despite starting work two whole hours AFTER everybody else in Europe, they think it's OK to be swanning into work at 9:30 or even ten (muttering some rubbish about trains, dogs to vets or the school run!)

So imagine you are a buyer at a German factory and you want to buy some bearings. Buyers like to clear their desks before lunch time, but you have to wait until 11am to call the sales department at some UK company, before anybody in authority bothers to turn up. Half the day is gone, before this guy thinks it's OK to turn up for work!

The building I am in required some steels girders be placed into the walls when it was being built. I ordered a 20-ton crane to turn up 8am to take the girders off the truck and place them on the building. A neighbour then said that he had a smaller crane that could do the job at half the price.

"Too late!" I said. "I've placed the order and I'll leave it at that!"

We waited for over half-an-hour and then I contacted my neighbour who kindly trundled over with his smaller rig.

At bloody ten o'clock a giant 60-ton crane came struggling up our driveway, by which time, we had nearly finished the job! I have forgotten what idiotic excuse we got, but do remember the sleepy look on the driver's face!

As for the OP and the collection problem - the only thing I can suggest is to set a time when you are always in and stick to it - and ALWAYS collect the money with the order!

 

[MikeJ]

Yes. It's obviously the British that are always late. I mean, you can't imagine a Spaniard, Italian, Greek or French guy turning up late for anything.

And Americans? They were several years late for the last couple of world wars (but appear to be keen on being early for the next one)

 

[The Byre]

Having worked in Italy for an American engineering company and later for a German TV company, I know what true suffering really is!

I have had Italians turn up one hour late for important meetings and actually think that they were more or less OK!

And never have I enjoyed the fun and games we got when the German TUV was commissioned by a US manufacturer to investigate an Italian manufacturing plant they had just bought and write a full report on their standards!

Staff came and went just as they pleased and the winch to raise and lower pallets of goods from the upper floors to a delivery area was an angle grinder with a pulley-wheel attached and a thin wire rope! The place was so chaotic, that the US parent just took the IP (which was the main purpose of the acquisition anyway) and closed everything down.

 

[STDFR33]

but do remember the sleepy look on the driver's face!

The driver was probably very, very tired.

He has to work incredibly hard so that his taxes can fund the bailouts of countries such as Greece or Spain where they think working a full day and paying tax is a fools game.

 

[Clare@ClarityTaxation]

Can you not increase your prices slightly and then always deliver? If they are collecting I'm assuming they are local so the additional cost to you wouldn't be much, and it's better than sitting around waiting for people....?

I'm a stickler for time keeping, it would drive me batty if someone turned up hours late!

 

[Toby Willows]

Take their mobile number and text them a reminder the day of collection. Something along the lines off "just a reminder that you have booked in to collect your cake between 3pm and 4pm. Unfortunately we can't guarantee to be in outside these hours so please phone us ASAP if you need to change times". This confirms and reminds them the time slot, but is also a positive for the customer as you are providing an alternative, it's not simply "collect then or tough". If they fail to show make sure you T&C's are clear about no refunds for no shows. Many people simply need, and these days expect, a reminder. Lord knows why though!

 

[deniser]

Can you make an arrangement with a local shop which does have standard opening hours such as a corner shop or newsagent so that the cakes can be collected from them rather than from you?

I have exactly the same problem with my online business. I used to give customers an option to collect from my shop as well as the delivery options but I had such problems getting people to collect their parcels that I had to abandon that idea.

With cakes they are presumably needed for a specific event but with clothing, people just clicked on the Collect option often without even checking the location. I had one customer that I chased constantly and when she eventually replied, found out she was 100 miles away and had no idea where we were. I then had to bill her the postage again and it was a lot of hassle. Other people just assume that they can get some distant relative or friend who lives in the area to come in but of course that person is busy and can't get to us so the parcel sits there for weeks.

It is all too much hassle so we don't allow collections anymore. You could perhaps consider delivery only?

 

[Gecko001]

Charge them extra upfront and give them back some money if they turn up on time...?

This is the best solution as far as I can see. Call it a discount. It means that the customer will know not fail to miss the terms and conditions regarding your opening times.

Actually legally a pure penalty charge for late collection is not a valid clause in a contract unless it represents a cost actually incurred by you, so you have to be sure of your ground before charging extra. Even if you have worked out a charge based on damages to you, you might spend a lot of time in court explaining it to small claims judges. They might find in your favour but the bad PR would probably ruin the business.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

I cannot work out if its you playing at running a business or awkward customers
I don't know how many customers you have a day and what sort of time limits you place on customers but why can you not do one delivery round at say 5:30-6 at night and leave yourself free for the rest of the day or alternatively make some outside containers which are waterproof and locked with a number operated padlock so all you have to do is place the goods in the container and give the customer the lock code

 

[obscure]

You need to stop letting customers waste your time. All orders are delivered.... no ifs or buts. Your time is valuable and would be better spent actually doing business than hanging around waiting for people.

 

[MBE1]

Another vote to go for delivery only.

 

[Thermodynamic Man]

And just supposing when you go to deliver it there is nobody there?... no next door neighbour...then what? Sorry... just playing devils' advocate there
From the posts that have already been written above there are some really good ideas pushed forward and I am sure you could come up with a system made from a hybrid of some that suit you.
The fact you have been paid for the cake I believe is a big bonus because had you not been paid I could see you not only chasing deliveries/collections but also your money..
As somebody said we have no idea how many cakes you make and what you do for the rest of the day and your availability
If it is down to collection you could state on your terms that collections can, for example, take place between 1.00 - 2.00pm Monday to Saturday or by a prior arranged appointment. Collections outside of this time are not permissible and the customer will have to arrange an alternate day. Home deliveries are available @ £x each and a further charge of £x will be incurred should the need arise for us to re-visit. Something along those lines anyway.
If all is made plain clear when you take the order then the onus is on the customer and not you to make sure they get the cake. If you let them play you....well you are just letting them have their cake and eat it ( lol...sorry... just couldn't resist )

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

You have highlighted a problem here that my business has suffered over recent years
We have always done economy deliveries business to business and we turn up any time in business hours and it worked well. Until the working from home businesses starting using it then the drama and moaning started . I cant be here ,school run walk the dog checking granny ect ect life stories given on the phone
This is my opinion and will differ from the others but Im only speaking from experience . If you have a good product that your customers like and the business is viable then its your job to insure that somebody is there .If you enforce marshal law on your valued customers they just wont bother
I cant just say Im going to leave everything unattended so its not fair on me and other members of this site if you can

 

[DavidWH]

the only thing I can suggest is to set a time when you are always in and stick to it - and ALWAYS collect the money with the order!

Seem's the simplest method, between 10-12, make sure you're about, outside of those hours you go about your daily business. If someone cannot make it between those hours, charge. Make sure it is clear to the customer when collections are available.

 

[Sarandipity]

If only things were always so cut and dry. I've been running my business for 5 years so I am not naive and have a good handle on what I'm doing; I just thought I'd get other's opinions on how I could improve on this matter or if it's possible to make it as uncommon as possible. I'm glad I'm not the only one who has experienced similar problems.

I thought of delivery only, but then I lose customers. I have a lot even outside my local area (people come from 3+ hours away), so it would quickly add up for them and they would just go to their local business even if the quality isn't as good. Money is precious so no matter how loyal they are, I think eventually it could make an impact. Also, as Thermodynamic man noted, folks aren't always in when they should be - I've had this happen and while I have a strict policy and procedure in place for it, it still happens.

I can't simply have one time frame where people can collect their orders on any given day because people work more normally structured jobs - so they might need to collect on their lunch break, before work, after work, etc. It's not the varied times through the day I care about, that's expected and simply part of my business. It's the rudeness and total disregard for time I can't get my head around and I'm trying to establish a method of improving that. I think 30-minute times slots, plus a reminder on the day and up-front clear policy regarding not turning up on time and/or without notice is the way to go for now. We will see how it goes and reevaluate.

Thanks, everyone!

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Take back control and dont let them walk all over you

Get a answer phone and leave a message on it of when you will be back and inform customers that after the agreed time they need to phone your number to be told when you will be back just like royal mail leaving a calling card, if they cannot keep to the time then they wait around or no what time to call back

 

[woodss]

Definitely a case of just needing to grow a spine (no disrespect) and come up with a policy that you stick to. Firm delivery hours - can't make it? Come tomorrow.

Perhaps keep a log of who comes late and ask them if they'd prefer you to deliver for a specific amount, or jut remind them at the point of sale that they need to come between these hours or you won't be available. Or, use it to refuse business based on a past track record.

You may lose a few customers over this but perhaps it's a price worth paying if they were causing you unnecessary stress anyway?

 

[Gecko001]

I am surprised at the number of replies to this thread which say that you have to stop customers wasting your time. Isn't this a sort of Basil Fawlty way of running a business - running a hotel would be great if it was not for the customers or in this case the customers who want to turn up at my place of business at times that do not suit me.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Yup its great in my area where I phone up companies like WH Smith or River Island and ask them to stay open a extra two hours as I am to busy to collect my order
She is being reasonable in giving a time frame but expecting her to remain open after that is not something many companies would do, but we have all offered different approaches to the odd awkward customer

 

[geoffb]

Thought I needed to comment here....

Everyone seems to have missed the fact that you run the business from home.

I am also a home based business and have numerous people wanting to collect goods.
Everyone I turn down - delivery only

I am not a shop, it's a home - if the council or your home insurance finds out you could be in trouble with the former and uninsured by the latter.

We have real problems finding house insurance - because MOST do not allow home based businesses.
We had the council round once who were happy for us to carry on as long as we didn't have customers visiting our house

 

[silvermusic]

You need to stop letting customers waste your time. All orders are delivered.... no ifs or buts. Your time is valuable and would be better spent actually doing business than hanging around waiting for people.

^^^^^ Agreed entirely, anything else will always be a pain in the neck unless you're at home all day.

 

[Clinton]

I've been running my business for 5 years so I am not naive ...I thought of delivery only, but then I lose customers.

Let's go back five years. When you started the business you obviously thought

a) you'd run it from home to keep costs down / keep your hours flexible
b) you'd offer the option of collecting as that would get you more customers (the ones who wanted to save a couple of quid - cheapskates! - on the delivery costs or the extra price they'd have to pay if they bought the same product from a shop that has overheads).

You say you're not naive, but did you not anticipate lack of punctuality and customers messing you about on time? Not even with the type of customers who are that price sensitive that they'd rather not pay for delivery?

Am I the only one here who thinks that coping with the lack of punctuality is a fair price to pay for the huge advantages you enjoy over your competitors i.e. a) cost advantage because of no overheads and b) major time flexibility because you can do the school run and/or take little Buster to the vet to get his claws trimmed.

I'm trying to establish a method of improving that. I think 30-minute times slots, plus a reminder on the day and up-front clear policy regarding not turning up on time and/or without notice is the way to go for now..

I find myself agreeing with @Gecko001, it sounds very Basil Fawlty. Customers don't mess you about intentionally or out of spite. They have lives. They get held up at work, get stuck in traffic queues, have family emergencies. They treat all those as more important than the appointment with you. I suspect you'll have trouble changing human nature and getting customers to become more punctual. Start making rules and time slots and fines and penalties and you'll only end up alienating them and/or losing custom.

I'd say suck it up.

Or make delivery compulsory ...and accept the loss of some sales.

You can't, er, have your cake and eat it too.

 

[The Byre]

or take little Buster to the vet to get his claws trimmed.

You'd have thought that a man of his age would be able to cut his own toenails!

 

[MikeJ]

Not sure this is much use now as the OP hasn't been in since Thursday but...

I'd not give a time frame. I'd give a time. Saying "between 2 and 4" suggests you're flexible. Saying "2pm" gives a much firmer time, and something they'd aim to hit. If they're then 2 hours late, you're still there.

 

[Scott@Tracto]

As a consumer a 30minute time slot is not very good.

You have to put yourself in the mind set of a customer. Me and my girlfriend recently had a cake and cupcakes made by a home bakery and unfortunately we were an hour late picking them up. Life happens and usually we need these lovely bakery goods for an event that the person is also prepping for. As it's not something people do every day, they often underestimate how long tasks will take which can then make them late unfortunately.

Do you not sell your cakes to a local cafe? Can they not take delivery of your cakes to be collected for a small fee or perhaps some sort of key combination lock on a collection box at your home?