Team Members advertising a competitor's service

[Getaway2018]

Hi there,
I run a therapy practice with independent practitioners working as part of the practice by renting out my therapy rooms to them and giving them referrals etc. It is a great business with great reputation.

On two occasions however I have found advertising materials for a "competitor" (first in the waiting room) and today in one of the other rooms. The "competitor" offers a workshop that we don't offer and whilst I am ok with referring clients to other centres if they offer a therapy we don't offer (as this is for the benefit of the individual and in our profession the ethical thing to do) this workshop is not a necessity. I'd rather the team members run the workshop themselves (they are trained to do that) instead of signposting but they don't want to do that.

Here's my questions: What would you do? I have to say that I feel very uncomfortable with this situation and it feels very parasitic to me having advertising materials for someone else at my business if the other business does the same as we do apart from this one workshop. Secondly, whoever that team member is will argue that they are not an employee but only work under by business' banner and that they can advertise a service if they think it will benefit the client. (All I could kind of agree with if it didn't feel so parasitic). I should add that the other business has never returned the favor and encourages practitioners to advertise them in other businesses.

I am looking forward to your thoughts on this and thank you in advance.

 

[Stitchbob]

They may not be employees, but there's still a "my house, my rules" argument. You're perfectly within your rights to make it clear that you do not permit advertising of any outside services inside your premises.

 

[Newchodge]

What does your contract say? If you don't have a contract banning this practice, you need one NOW

 

[Mr D]

You could be annoyed at employees doing that. People who rent rooms off you? Not sure what you can do.
Who is leaving the material?

Could a patient be leaving the stuff? Multiple patients?

Several years back I was part of a project that designed then launched a service for the town. With permission we arranged to advertise it with leaflets in 20 locations owned by 6 organisations.
A few months after launch we had complaints from several organisations regarding us leaving our leaflets in their facilities. None of the staff on the project had.

Inside of a year people were approaching us from places within a radius of 40 miles who had come across the leaflet in a local (to them) place. Part of my feedback system was asking where they had come across us.
The project only ever supplied leaflets to 20 locations and they had no interest in spreading the leaflets around.

It was clients.

 

[Stedurham]

No chance bin them, your promoting a competitor and they may not offer same service, but give it time and they might plus why by having them in your place your are really recommending them. There service. Plus be rubbish for all you know

 

[Getaway2018]

The leaflets have 100% been left by one of the team members as they have taken a training course with the competitor.
The first time this happened (someone has left them in our waiting room) I explained that this is not allowed unless it is a training course for us therapists and then only to post it in the office kitchen. The person I am suspecting is someone else this time and has before asked about advertising the workshop to our clients.

 

[Getaway2018]

You could be annoyed at employees doing that. People who rent rooms off you? Not sure what you can do.
Who is leaving the material?

Could a patient be leaving the stuff? Multiple patients?

It is definitely a team member.

 

[Getaway2018]

You could be annoyed at employees doing that. People who rent rooms off you?

I run the business they work under. Although they are not employees, they work from my business and are part of a team of therapists. By advertising a different centre the person is potentially supporting a competitor and also not referring to someone else in our team.

 

[Khurram Aziz]

In cases like this you should have a clear contract that stipulates against this. Definite conflict of interest.

 

[BustersDogs]

How can they be team members if they are independent? Who finds them their clients?

 

[fisicx]

I run a therapy practice with independent practitioners working as part of the practice by renting out my therapy rooms to them and giving them referrals etc.

So what does the rental agreement say about promotional materials?

 

[estwig]

It's stealing, stealing your clients, your business and therefore the food off your table!

I used to be a builder and if I caught any of my subbies doing work on the side for any of my clients, I very quickly made their life very difficult, it sent a clear message.

You don't sh*t on your own doorstep!

 

[Getaway2018]

In cases like this you should have a clear contract that stipulates against this. Definite conflict of interest.

I will be sending out an email and add to the contracts.

 

[Getaway2018]

How can they be team members if they are independent? Who finds them their clients?

That's how a lot of therapy businesses work in the UK. A therapist will take out a lease or buy premises ie set up a therapy centre and let the other rooms to other therapists and psychologists. Of course only after interviewing and vetting them etc. They pay rent for the room usage and get referrals via the business. Other practices also work in such a way that they also take a share of the therapist's fee. In return they provide everything the therapist and clients need. So although everybody is self-employed it is a little bit like a cooperative of professionals.
In my practice therefore most clients are referred through me, unless they advertise themselves.

 

[Getaway2018]

So what does the rental agreement say about promotional materials?

Unfortunately nothing. There are practice rules but it was so unthinkable for me that someone might do that that it didn't enter my mind. I guess it's one of those business things people learn as they go along unless they have run a few businesses before.

 

[Getaway2018]

It's stealing, stealing your clients, your business and therefore the food off your table!

I used to be a builder and if I caught any of my subbies doing work on the side for any of my clients, I very quickly made their life very difficult, it sent a clear message.

You don't sh*t on your own doorstep!

Absolutely! I have now identified who it was and it was indeed someone who had asked before if they can advertise and I had said no. It is mind boggling how this happens in a profession that has such strict ethical frameworks.

 

[Stedurham]

prove a point get rid of them, its unacceptable in my opinion and I'm guessing when people go to your competition with the leaflet, there will be some sort of back hander, given to who is working at your place

 

[Newchodge]

I will be sending out an email and add to the contracts.

You can't just add to the contracts. A contract is an agreement between 2 parties. Neither party can unilaterally amend a contract

 

[Getaway2018]

prove a point get rid of them, its unacceptable in my opinion and I'm guessing when people go to your competition with the leaflet, there will be some sort of back hander, given to who is working at your place

Gosh, I didn't even think of that. That's pretty dark. I wonder how I can find out if he does that.

 

[Getaway2018]

You can't just add to the contracts. A contract is an agreement between 2 parties. Neither party can unilaterally amend a contract

Ok, then I will send out a memo. It's a small business and people can be asked to leave easily as I'm not employing them. I do have a clause however that I will end the contract if there is any behaviour that is unethical and/or could damage the practice.

 

[estwig]

Gosh, I didn't even think of that. That's pretty dark. I wonder how I can find out if he does that.

You can't find out.

The guy is stealing from you, get rid of him before he does it again, or other people get the same idea.
Tell him tomorrow at the end of the day, so he doesn't have time to steal anything else, not to come back on Monday.

 

[Newchodge]

You can't find out.

The guy is stealing from you, get rid of him before he does it again, or other people get the same idea.
Tell him tomorrow at the end of the day, so he doesn't have time to steal anything else, not to come back on Monday.

Subject6, of course, to his contractual rights.

 

[estwig]

Subject, of course, to his contractual rights.

Subject to cutting his thieving hands off!

 

[Newchodge]

It never ceases to amaze me how many people, on a forum for business people, think that the law can be ignored when it is inconvenient.

 

[estwig]

It never ceases to amaze me how many people, on a forum for business people, think that the law can be ignored when it is inconvenient.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people go looking for regulations to comply with, instead of just doing the right thing.

In this case the guy is stealing and you gotta get rid of him quick. By the time you faff around looking for rules to comply with, he's stolen half the business and poisoned a big chunk of what's left.

 

[Stedurham]

I had a friend who's got a bathroom company supply and fit. He had tillers all subbys working for him that did the pvc and tiling. They asked if they could leave leaflets just for tiling to fill in odd days when they didn't have work. He had know this team for years and let them, next thing there fitting full bathrooms and under cutting him on a weekend. Obviously they are now gone, but he has had 1/2 complaints from workmanship they did in customers houses on the guvvy weekend jobs. Customer well you recommended them you gave leaflet etc. Funnily enough tillers changed numbers to stop them getting in contact, cost him £1000 ish to put work right and only did it as his reputation is excellent and didn't want to affect it. Both said customers have reccommened people since and he has done work for them.
Get rid speak to someone about legalitys, they had no contact and were self employed so didn't have issue

 

[Ian J]

It never ceases to amaze me how many people, on a forum for business people, think that the law can be ignored when it is inconvenient.

I think that Estwig was joking about cutting his hands off. Or there again maybe not

 

[Getaway2018]

Quick update: The "team member" has replied and is saying that they are doing this specific therapy and are recommending this workshop as they think that their clients will benefit from it. She just forgot to pick them up and is happy for me to remove them but not to ditch them as they belong to her. She thinks that I feel she trying to undermine me. And wants to reassure me that she not. She enjoys working at my business and would like to continue working there. Why would she jeopardise that? I should share her what comes up for me thinking about this.


Well, what comes up for me is that I am running a business and supplying someone clients for something they don't need.

 

[Newchodge]

I think that Estwig was joking about cutting his hands off. Or there again maybe not

I thought he was deadly serious

 

[Stedurham]

Why don't you run this course is it something you can do if your customers are going elsewhere for it? Don't know about your business but seems like theres customers going from you to there for it

 

[Getaway2018]

Why don't you run this course is it something you can do if your customers are going elsewhere for it? Don't know about your business but seems like theres customers going from you to there for it

I have three people in my business who could run it but don't want to. I myself am not trained in it as I specialize in something else and have no desire to spend a few thousand on it.
People don't really need it. The information and the learning is the same as the clients get in sessions outside of a workshop. If that colleague didn't push it nobody would know about it, plus it's very expensive (over half a grand for 2 days).

 

[Stedurham]

I would talk to them again never know might have had a change of heart if the money’s good could fill quiet times for them

 

[Julia Sta Romana]

Hi there,

On two occasions however I have found advertising materials for a "competitor" (first in the waiting room) and today in one of the other rooms. The "competitor" offers a workshop that we don't offer and whilst I am ok with referring clients to other centres if they offer a therapy we don't offer (as this is for the benefit of the individual and in our profession the ethical thing to do) this workshop is not a necessity. I'd rather the team members run the workshop themselves (they are trained to do that) instead of signposting but they don't want to do that.

Have you asked why don't they do the workshop themselves in your therapy practice?

 

[BustersDogs]

That's how a lot of therapy businesses work in the UK. A therapist will take out a lease or buy premises ie set up a therapy centre and let the other rooms to other therapists and psychologists. Of course only after interviewing and vetting them etc. They pay rent for the room usage and get referrals via the business. Other practices also work in such a way that they also take a share of the therapist's fee. In return they provide everything the therapist and clients need. So although everybody is self-employed it is a little bit like a cooperative of professionals.
In my practice therefore most clients are referred through me, unless they advertise themselves.

Sounds like a way of getting round employment expenses. Wish I could do that with my dog business!

 

[Getaway2018]

Sounds like a way of getting round employment expenses. Wish I could dog that with my dog business!

You can. And I imagine that with dog walking you don't need to lease premises.
What is an issue however is that you have to very carefully vet people and still, just like with employees, there is no guarantee on how they will turn out whilst working.
I chose to open a private practice because it allows me to have a nice office and work whenever I want, not whenever another practice has rooms. The downside: A lot of people in my field sadly are either lethargic with no ambition, take advantage or have no business sense. Many people who do it are comfortable, ie don't HAVE to do it to pay bills but do it part time out of interest or a hobby job. There's a big difference also between attitudes of psychologists and psychotherapist and counsellors. I could write a book on how many "weirdos" I have met in that profession.

 

[Stitchbob]

Sounds like a way of getting round employment expenses. Wish I could do that with my dog business!

There's no reason at all why you can't. It's just a different business model. Instead of having employees who you pay an hourly rate to walk dogs for you, you effectively become an agency. Walkers pay you to manage their bookings for them, and for use of your business name. That can be a flat rate, a commission on each booking, or a combination of both. You take bookings and allocate them to walkers, and the walkers keep their income.

It's a perfectly standard model used in many industries where the entire service is provided by a single person but some level of infrastructure/administration needs to be shared - for example, most taxi firms operate this way. It's particularly popular in industries where a client may be loyal to a particular person, such as hairdressers or lap dancers.