Matt Cutts on the Future od SEO

[Duncan_W]

found a video blog post containing an interview with Matt Cutts (Google SEO Guru). Talking about the future of SEO.

Thought it was interesting so have posted a link on our Web Marketing Blog.

Basically what he is saying is: "Its not just about getting to the top of Google, its about generating business"... "SEO's are are starting to realize that they need to be Marketers!" - Well Glory be!

Though I am sure there will be other opinions out there!

 

[petera]

I've come into SEO from an offline marketing background and the commerical knowledge i've gained in the past has been a massive contributing factor to the success i've achieved. Websites are nothing to do with IT, they are purely a marketing tool and as such they need a marketing mind to maximise their benefit. The majority of SEO people i've worked with have come into the industry from a web dev background, and while their technical knowledge and ability to implement the necessary changes is superior to my own their commercial awareness is poor. Before i take a barrage of abuse i'm not suggesting that all techies are commercially niaive, just the ones i've worked with.

The creation of compelling content, linkbait articles, user centred design etc. are marketing disciplines. They generally require creativity, customer focus, good copywriting skills and market research - that's why, in my opinion, it's more important that SEM professional have marketing skills than technical skills. If you're not technically minded you can always get a web developer to implement your marketing changes.

(covers head and waits for the onslaught)

 

[Duncan_W]

We shall handle the onslaught together, as I am definatly with you on all you say. Could have written it myself

 

[JustOneUK]

found a video blog post containing an interview with Matt Cutts (Google SEO Guru). Talking about the future of SEO.

Thought it was interesting so have posted a link on our Web Marketing Blog.

You couldn't have posted the link here?

 

[gooner]

I've come into SEO from an offline marketing background and the commerical knowledge i've gained in the past has been a massive contributing factor to the success i've achieved. Websites are nothing to do with IT, they are purely a marketing tool and as such they need a marketing mind to maximise their benefit. The majority of SEO people i've worked with have come into the industry from a web dev background, and while their technical knowledge and ability to implement the necessary changes is superior to my own their commercial awareness is poor. Before i take a barrage of abuse i'm not suggesting that all techies are commercially niaive, just the ones i've worked with.

The creation of compelling content, linkbait articles, user centred design etc. are marketing disciplines. They generally require creativity, customer focus, good copywriting skills and market research - that's why, in my opinion, it's more important that SEM professional have marketing skills than technical skills. If you're not technically minded you can always get a web developer to implement your marketing changes.

(covers head and waits for the onslaught)

Agreed . I think people will also find this post interesting ( sorry not enough posts to create a hyper link yet !) learntoduck.com/search-marketing/seo-is-dead.

My own view, I have seen too many business owners spend too much time fretting over page rankings in google. One friend in tears because from one day to the next he had dropped out of the serps. If your business is dependent on google, you don't have a business, you work for google. Don't be a slave to the goog. Focus on the things Petera mentions, build an optin email list, and you are on the right track.

 

[Duncan_W]

I don't actually agree with Gooner, I think ensuring your site can be found on search engines (SEO by another name) is still incredibly important part of the marketing mix, and will remain so.

What will change is that it will move from a techie issue to a marketing one.

As Google (currently, like it or not, they are the most important Search Engine) improve what they do, they will increasingly aim to deliver good interesting & relevant results for a given search term.

If your site contains high quality & interesting content on a relevant subject, and Google consider your site to be worth listing (Why Page rank is important) you are likely to get listed.

So getting a good listing will rely on creating a site with good, relevant, well written content that is of interest to your market (all Marketing issues), rather than ensuring that the page structure & design is Google friendly, and stuffed with your trophy key phrase.

So is SEO dead? no it is just evolving!

 

[gooner]

I don't actually agree with Gooner, I think ensuring your site can be found on search engines (SEO by another name) is still incredibly important part of the marketing mix, and will remain so.

What will change is that it will move from a techie issue to a marketing one.

As Google (currently, like it or not, they are the most important Search Engine) improve what they do, they will increasingly aim to deliver good interesting & relevant results for a given search term.

If your site contains high quality & interesting content on a relevant subject, and Google consider your site to be worth listing (Why Page rank is important) you are likely to get listed.

So getting a good listing will rely on creating a site with good, relevant, well written content that is of interest to your market (all Marketing issues), rather than ensuring that the page structure & design is Google friendly, and stuffed with your trophy key phrase.

So is SEO dead? no it is just evolving!

Duncan,

just to clarify I would advocate all that you say here, my point is from an organic listing point of view, too many people spend to much time doing everything to fit what google do, there is no point trying to second guess google. In many cases optimising the traffic you have now, will yield far better results than trying to target yet more organic search terms . Time spent using analytics and monitering conversion rates, is more productive in my opinion than, fretting over the google algo.

 

[Duncan_W]

I think we agree

 

[fisicx]

If your site contains high quality & interesting content on a relevant subject, and Google consider your site to be worth listing (Why Page rank is important) you are likely to get listed.

PageRank has got nothing to do with content. PageRank that part of the algorithmn that calculates the value of the internal and inbound links.

Note that I'm talking about PageRank (part of the algo) and not Toolbar PageRank (which isn't).

 

[directmarketingadvice]

You couldn't have posted the link here?

Here it is:

http://videos.webpronews.com/2008/11/18/matt-cutts-on-changes-at-google/

Steve

 

[Duncan_W]

Sorry, I was unclear yes PageRank (and I am talking about the toolbar page rank) is all about inbound links. So getting a good listing is about a combination of PageRank (Quality inbound links), and good, high quality content.

Combine the two and the result should be good quality traffic to your site.

 

Not sure I would trust young matt on SEO things.?

Google makes its money by selling.

SEO's make there money by selling.

So maybe the less SEO's sell the better it is for Google.?

So do you not think Googles accountant might delve into a bit of misinformation spreading.?

A No1 site in organics properly done will lay waste to all else including adwords.

Or maybe I am a twisted old geezer who is past being over awed by the big wide world.:|


Earl

 

[Duncan_W]

Not sure I would trust young matt on SEO things.?

I agree that Mr Cutts may well have ulterior motives, but they will only make money on Advertising if they deliver high quality results in their searches, and everything he says is consistent with that aim.

 

I agree that Mr Cutts may well have ulterior motives, but they will only make money on Advertising if they deliver high quality results in their searches, and everything he says is consistent with that aim.

well whatever Matt says,it would seem a fact to me that the poorer quality or lower priced goods that dominate the organic searches must mean more adword sales.e.t.c.?

and to suggest an SEO who has got to the top for a competative keyword does not know a tad about marketing is a bit silly.

And the statement that being No1 is not so important for sales is rubbish by googles own figures .like the No1 site gets 3.5 times the traffic of No 2.?

Earl

 

[Duncan_W]

and to suggest an SEO who has got to the top for a competative keyword does not know a tad about marketing is a bit silly.

Earl

I think you are missing the point. Getting to Number 1 on Google for the most competitive keyword is not Marketing!!! It is a useful marketing communication tool, but no more than that.

If your offering is no good, your prices are not competitive, your site does not instil confidence in your ability to deliver etc, then it doesn't matter how well you rank on Google, you will not sell anything.

and before you come back, I agree that even if all these are right, you won't sell anything if no one can find your site.

What I am saying is its not about SEO, or Site Design, Or Copywriting, or Pricing, its about getting the mix of all these things right. In other words its about MARKETING!!

OK, I will get off my soap box now

 

I think you are missing the point. Getting to Number 1 on Google for the most competitive keyword is not Marketing!!! It is a useful marketing communication tool, but no more than that.

If your offering is no good, your prices are not competitive, your site does not instil confidence in your ability to deliver etc, then it doesn't matter how well you rank on Google, you will not sell anything.

and before you come back, I agree that even if all these are right, you won't sell anything if no one can find your site.

What I am saying is its not about SEO, or Site Design, Or Copywriting, or Pricing, its about getting the mix of all these things right. In other words its about MARKETING!!

OK, I will get off my soap box now

I agree but generating sales is mostly about having the right product that the pubic want.

Hence why I will not take on any business that is flogging gear that is not viable IMHO.

Same as any business.

Earl

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Google makes its money by selling.

SEO's make there money by selling.

So maybe the less SEO's sell the better it is for Google.?

I don't see it that way.

Adwords might be what turns google visitors into money, but it's the quality of the search results that get the visitors there in the first place.

Google's focus in the last couple of years has been to raise the quality of adwords ads in an attempt to get a greater number of searchers to click on the ads.

That's the right way to do it.

If they had tried to do it by allowing more low quality spam sites near the top of the organic results, they would have been cutting their own throats.

Steve

 

I don't see it that way.

Adwords might be what turns google visitors into money, but it's the quality of the search results that get the visitors there in the first place.

Google's focus in the last couple of years has been to raise the quality of adwords ads in an attempt to get a greater number of searchers to click on the ads.

That's the right way to do it.

If they had tried to do it by allowing more low quality spam sites near the top of the organic results, they would have been cutting their own throats.

Steve

Not sure on that Steve .They have a massive hold on the market and a loyal following.

So I suppose what would serve them best would be highly relevent sites that did not convert well forcing people to click on adwords.?

I see a lot of totally rubbish site at the top of the organics.?

Earl

 

[petera]

I agree but generating sales is mostly about having the right product that the pubic want.

Hence why I will not take on any business that is flogging gear that is not viable IMHO.

Same as any business.

Earl

And, delivering a product that the consumer wants at the right price and through the correct channels (ie. relevant search results) is an online version of what.........that's right folks it's Marketing.

SEO is merely the 'place' part of the marketing mix and a chunk of the 'promotion'. The rest - Product, Price and the rest of Promotion is nothing to do with SEO, it's to do with projecting the right image and message through your website design and content, and offering a product that satisfies the needs of the consumer.
SEO puts your website in a prominent position to attract visitors but the website itself does everything else from there.

 

SEO is merely the 'place' part of the marketing mix

Oh do you mean by merely the easy part.?

Earl

 

[petera]

No, i can say from experience that is definitely isn't the easy part. In fact in the online marketing mix it's the most difficult part to achieve. However given that Google's entire business model is based on delivering the most relevant search results for any keyword, people know that if the website in position 1 doesn't satisfy their needs the website in positions 2,3,4 or 5 probably will. That's why the other elements of the mix are also essential.
What's the point in spending all that time and effort getting a site to the top of Google for it to convert 1% of visitors into an enquiry, sales etc. I'd rather have a user-centred website at position 3,4 or 5 converting 30%.

 

[AdwordsPro]

A No1 site in organics properly done will lay waste to all else including adwords.

A No1 site in organics wouldn't 'lay waste' to the 3 sponsored adwords links above it (properly done). In general, they would share the traffic. IMO.

 

A No1 site in organics wouldn't 'lay waste' to the 3 sponsored adwords links above it (properly done). In general, they would share the traffic. IMO.

well 4 out of 5 clicks go to the organic's.

of course this varies dependant on the product,but on some of my sites I have seen a figure of 50 times the traffic of PPC for an organic No1,hence we discontinued PPC.

The general public has a distrust of PPC,although I suspect this is not so true of web pro's.

There is also the other element that the description on PPC is very stunted.

Earl

 

[AdwordsPro]

well 4 out of 5 clicks go to the organic's.

I know what you're saying and that comes from Google itself - but it's a grand sweeping statement that includes all non-commercial informational searches.

All my PPC is for non-informational sites (commercial & charity), and the traffic is way-higher in general than the 4/5 figure suggests. On some accounts I get figures that would make the No1 organic people cry - because they rely on their (SEO-ed) meta description to grab attention, and I can use all sorts of eye-catching techniques in my ad text.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

well 4 out of 5 clicks go to the organic's.

Maybe it used to, but I doubt that's true now that there are ads on the top left.

Also, as "Adwordspro" said, the split will differ greatly when you compare commercial searches and non-commercial.

Steve

 

[AdwordsPro]

I get figures that would make the No1 organic people cry

But they are probably getting the same traffic anyway:
1 search -> visit link 1 -> back button -> visit link 2 -> back button etc.

So we all think we're getting 60% of the searches ... and we are ... it doesn't mean every one else is sharing 40%!

Just a theory.

 

[nass]

I know what you're saying and that comes from Google itself - but it's a grand sweeping statement that includes all non-commercial informational searches.

All my PPC is for non-informational sites (commercial & charity), and the traffic is way-higher in general than the 4/5 figure suggests. On some accounts I get figures that would make the No1 organic people cry - because they rely on their (SEO-ed) meta description to grab attention, and I can use all sorts of eye-catching techniques in my ad text.

Yes, that's something I've observed too. In the organics the snippets are usually restrained, SEO'd, whereas in the adwords you get the sales speak. Not only that, but usually the special discount offers are in the PPC ads whereas the organics are less offer-orientated.

Mind you, in the Google webinar last week, the stat they showed was that people who had both the PPC and organic spot got 12% more sales by having both than people with just the top organic spot. So it all really depends if that extra 12% outweighs the cost.

 

I did say dependant on what the product was.?

Just my experience for the products we sell,and the multi site techniques I use which alows us to have results coming up 6 pages deep.

I stand by my original statement.

Earl

 

[nass]

But they are probably getting the same traffic anyway:
1 search -> visit link 1 -> back button -> visit link 2 -> back button etc.

So we all think we're getting 60% of the searches ... and we are ... it doesn't mean every one else is sharing 40%!

Just a theory.

What actually drove me crazy was when I did some experimentation on listings I had both the #1 organic on and the #1 PPC on. I asked myself "since these guys are hunting around for deals and prices, why should I pay £10 per click when, at the cost of a slight reduction in traffic, I get them for free". It kind of bugs me that with the whole SEM/PPC scene, accurate & verifiable stats are almost impossible to get hold of

 

What actually drove me crazy was when I did some experimentation on listings I had both the #1 organic on and the #1 PPC on. I asked myself "since these guys are hunting around for deals and prices, why should I pay £10 per click when, at the cost of a slight reduction in traffic, I get them for free". It kind of bugs me that with the whole SEM/PPC scene, accurate & verifiable stats are almost impossible to get hold of

But don't your sales tell you the results and surely PPC tracking will tell you what percentage came from where.?

Earl

 

[nass]

But don't your sales tell you the results and surely PPC tracking will tell you what percentage came from where.?

Earl

Yah, but if you have both and they click on both it's kinda hard to attribute it to one or t'other

 

[AdwordsPro]

Mind you, in the Google webinar last week, the stat they showed was that people who had both the PPC and organic spot got 12% more sales by having both than people with just the top organic spot. So it all really depends if that extra 12% outweighs the cost.

I agree with this 100%. If you don't nab one of the PPC slots above your hard-earned No1 (or lower) organic listing ... then one of your competitors will get it.

 

[gooner]

Yah, but if you have both and they click on both it's kinda hard to attribute it to one or t'other

Work with what you can control.
Set up a seperate PPC ad with just the keyword you have the organic no1 on. Use the [exact search phrase] Send your PPC traffic for that keyword to a different landing page, track the conversion process. You then have your answer.

 

[onlinebettinguk]

making one's website visible in TOP Rankings is also a hard core of SEO ! and what turns for business ?? didn't get u exactly !