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"Only" 2 horses died this year and the winner was whipped so hard it was bleeding at the end. But it's all jolly good entertainment!! 
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"Only" 2 horses died this year and the winner was whipped so hard it was bleeding at the end. But it's all jolly good entertainment!!
awful, who calls it 'sport'?
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I can only repeat what I wrote a week ago, even though I was ridiculed by some for saying it. Frankly, the race should be known as the National Disgrace, not the Grand National. Every year, in the name of tradition, we force horses to jump over fences that are known to be dangerous. There is absolutely no excuse for not redesigning the worst obstacles so they are more safe for the horses.
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They have been redesigned the fences a number of times over the years and done so again this year. On most years you'll find no deaths at the Grand National. It's just in the last couple of years we've had 3 deaths.
Lets not mess around, the problem is simple, were asking around 40 horses to jump over the same fence at the same time, in pretty much whatever weather.
If you want zero deaths, then you really need to be against Horse Racing in general, rather than trying to make it safer, because for the horse, it's inherently dangerous given their bones won't repair once broken.
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Consistency
That was the one I was thinking of!
I can't stand horse racing, there are deaths every year and although folk say they enjoy it, they are beaten hard and beaten down.
It is a sad sorry state.
God bless them and to think we would not have one World War One without the assistance of these majestic beasts.
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Horse racing isn't even a sport. It's just a form of gambling. If you took the betting out of it no one would be the slightest bit interested.
It's no different to dog fighting in my opinion.
It's no different to dog fighting in my opinion.
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it was, but lets not get caught up on numbers. basically, it's not a nice thing but a British tradition perhaps.
Ever since I was a little girl I've hated it, horses falling like that, and can't stand in films when they go into battle etc
urgh
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it was, but lets not get caught up on numbers. basically, it's not a nice thing but a British tradition perhaps.
Ever since I was a little girl I've hated it, horses falling like that, and can't stand in films when they go into battle etc
urgh
I agree it's not nice but some one lost 50k on a bet apparently which made me feel better- pretty mad
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I think its a Brit thing, putting a bet on - after all this is a tradition - but its just a real shame that the horses are put under so much pressure that they end up going that way
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Yep. I read 3 earlier but it said 4 on a bbc article I read later, so I stand corrected.
As FreelanceSoftwareDeveloper said 5 horses died at Cheltenham a month ago. It can happen at any race meet, but the jump races are a concern.
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This is the point. For the vast majority of races, no horses are killed. But for one or two very specific races at particular courses, horses are killed on a regular basis. Again, there's no excuse whatsoever for not redesigning those courses and maybe even changing some of the race rules to protect both horse and rider.
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Banned
It's laughable "horses abused and forced to race", "cruel". If those saying that knew the first thing about horses they would know what nonsense it actually is.
Better ban football as well then after what his chops collapsed the other week. Skiing, fatalities every year. Surfing another dangerous sport. Sheep dog trials - all those worried sheep and abused dogs. I've got to cross the road later, 1,000 die every year doing that, hope it's banned soon. Formula one racing. Javelin, all those pointy sticks being thrown about.
A horse coming to an end doing something they love is sad, but not a bad way to go. Better way than that cow or chicken went so many of you will be serving up for Sunday lunch!
Better ban football as well then after what his chops collapsed the other week. Skiing, fatalities every year. Surfing another dangerous sport. Sheep dog trials - all those worried sheep and abused dogs. I've got to cross the road later, 1,000 die every year doing that, hope it's banned soon. Formula one racing. Javelin, all those pointy sticks being thrown about.
A horse coming to an end doing something they love is sad, but not a bad way to go. Better way than that cow or chicken went so many of you will be serving up for Sunday lunch!
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So which horse told you that?
Rare to find a thread where eveyone agrees.
"The sport of kings" may say it all.
Earl
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Consistency
We will hear next that the foxes love being hunted, it is a game of kisschase in their eyes!!
Of course people will disagree, if they love it so much why do they need to be whipped to bleed?
Of course people will disagree, if they love it so much why do they need to be whipped to bleed?
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Banned
So which horse told you that?
Rare to find a thread where eveyone agrees.
"The sport of kings" may say it all.
Earl
I know horses, I know they love to race, if they are going to die it's has to be better to go doing what you love rather than stood in a field on a rainy day.
Didn't need anyone to tell me, I thunked it all by myself through first hand experience
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So which horse told you that?
Rare to find a thread where eveyone agrees.
"The sport of kings" may say it all.
Earl
I,for one , strongly disagree with the Daily Mail type sentiment spewed out every time a horse dies but certainly not worth arguing on this forum...
Get yourselves over to the Daily Mail website.
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Banned
You can hardly compare fox hunting as they are not willing participants!!
I also saw what looked like blood, which would be unacceptable through whipping and if was the case the jokey would already be under investigation. I presume it either wasn't blood or someone else's. Look at the picture below, it's not there at the finish line.
Actually looking at that picture again there may be blood (if it's not the horse's markings) at the top of his right leg, that wouldn't be due to whip but more likely catching another horses shoe, or gained over a jump.
The whips (crops actually) and not used to hurt the horse into going faster, in fact a large percentage of the time the crop won't even make contact with the animal.
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Also, the crops are made from quite soft, flexible material not unlike a LARP weapon, designed to cause as little discomfort as possible when used correctly, and there are stringent rules on their use.
Horses' broken bones heal just the same as any other mammal's, the reason they have to be destroyed if the leg is broken is because they would have to be immobilised for up to six months for full healing, and the leg may never be as strong again, so effectively the racing career would be over, and as virtually all male jump horses are geldings, there's sadly little reason to keep them alive when they maybe won't ever race again as rehoming a racehorse is very difficult, their needs can be extremely demanding, much more so than an ordinary riding horse. Also, as horses have a natural ability to dope their own blood with extra oxygen stored in the spleen, and the massive amounts of adrenalin going through their system, they are notoriously difficult to sedate; this applies to all equines, but is particularly problematic with racing Thoroughbreds. Therefore, in the interest of puiblic safety at a racecourse, it's sometimes considered to be the best course of action to put a horse down rather than try and catch it, calm it, immobilise it, and treat it on a public area where it could cause further injury to itself and also be a danger to the poeple around it.
The decision to destroy a racehorse is never taken lightly, not only are they worth a heck of a lot of money, they are genuinely loved by the trainers and stable lads who look after them and often the owners too see their horses as more than just a financial asset. It causes great grief when one has to be euthanised.
The Grand National course has had many modifications, the highest jump is still the Chair at 5' 2" (same height as me), but by reducing the height of many other jumps, one has to wonder if they're being taken at higher speeds, thus not really reducing the accident rate.
The course also had, this year, a dedicated specialist cool-down area for horses and trainers/lads only, with no admittance to public or press, and with specialist vets on standby, just to cool the horses down after the race and help them recover without the incursion of the public.
I agree that there are too many runners, limiting the number of starters to something like twenty-five maximum would help, as fewer than that finish anyway.
Personally, I enjoyed the race and thought that maybe, after seeing what Synchronised did at the starting area, that he shouldn't have been passed fit to run after that incident, but I'm not a vet and so he was allowed to run. I have to wonder if something didn't go wrong at that point when he tipped AP McCoy off, and maybe that had something to do with his death? Just speculation.
I thought it was an amazing finsih, though I felt sorry for the second placed horse, lsong on the last stride by a matter of millimetres.
Horses' broken bones heal just the same as any other mammal's, the reason they have to be destroyed if the leg is broken is because they would have to be immobilised for up to six months for full healing, and the leg may never be as strong again, so effectively the racing career would be over, and as virtually all male jump horses are geldings, there's sadly little reason to keep them alive when they maybe won't ever race again as rehoming a racehorse is very difficult, their needs can be extremely demanding, much more so than an ordinary riding horse. Also, as horses have a natural ability to dope their own blood with extra oxygen stored in the spleen, and the massive amounts of adrenalin going through their system, they are notoriously difficult to sedate; this applies to all equines, but is particularly problematic with racing Thoroughbreds. Therefore, in the interest of puiblic safety at a racecourse, it's sometimes considered to be the best course of action to put a horse down rather than try and catch it, calm it, immobilise it, and treat it on a public area where it could cause further injury to itself and also be a danger to the poeple around it.
The decision to destroy a racehorse is never taken lightly, not only are they worth a heck of a lot of money, they are genuinely loved by the trainers and stable lads who look after them and often the owners too see their horses as more than just a financial asset. It causes great grief when one has to be euthanised.
The Grand National course has had many modifications, the highest jump is still the Chair at 5' 2" (same height as me), but by reducing the height of many other jumps, one has to wonder if they're being taken at higher speeds, thus not really reducing the accident rate.
The course also had, this year, a dedicated specialist cool-down area for horses and trainers/lads only, with no admittance to public or press, and with specialist vets on standby, just to cool the horses down after the race and help them recover without the incursion of the public.
I agree that there are too many runners, limiting the number of starters to something like twenty-five maximum would help, as fewer than that finish anyway.
Personally, I enjoyed the race and thought that maybe, after seeing what Synchronised did at the starting area, that he shouldn't have been passed fit to run after that incident, but I'm not a vet and so he was allowed to run. I have to wonder if something didn't go wrong at that point when he tipped AP McCoy off, and maybe that had something to do with his death? Just speculation.
I thought it was an amazing finsih, though I felt sorry for the second placed horse, lsong on the last stride by a matter of millimetres.
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Banned
So true, I have seen a well know jockey in floods on tears when his mount collapsed whist out training. It was a heart defect and the jockey sat on the ground with the horses head in his arms while he sadly died. Owners, jockeys, trainers, lads all really do care for the horses.
Before anyone starts they were just at a gentle canter when the incident happened.
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Ad hom attacks are usually symptomatic of someone with a weak or no argument.
The fact is that horse racing has little to do with sport and everything to do with gambling. This is what drives decisions, not some altruistic idea that the horses love it. I'm sure horses do enjoy running, but forcing them to race on courses known for tragedy? What utter nonsense.
Gambling drives other sports, too. Just look at the scandals in Italian soccer and elsewhere where teams deliberately lose. In the US, a basketball umpire was fixing games for money, and baseball players have thrown games on behalf of gambling syndicates. With the recent rash of controversial decisions in favour of the big-name football teams, you can't help but wonder what influence it has over the premier league also.
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I
I Love Spreadsheets
I think it is fair to say the horses love racing. If you watch the horses before a race you can see how excited they are and keen to get on with it. It is very difficult for the riders to keep the horses from rushing the tape at the start. This doesnt mean that they are aware of the extra dangers of the Grand National or the whipping they are about to get.
I myself think it is far more important to ban horses from public roads and to have heavier laws around amateur horse owners jumping horses in a field they have access to. Roads are truly terrifying place for many horses owned by armature riders. Unlike professional horses (police horses etc) they have not been trained to deal with traffic. This causes thousands of accidents every year, which in turn result in hundreds of horses being killed either as a direct result of the accident or through injuries not healing. Its also responsible for a handful of human deaths a year as well
Amateur riders pushing horses over jumps in a field they have access to, is also a big cause of fatal accidents for horses. Badly positioned jumps on to dangerous and unsuitable surfaces results in falls and broken bones, which in the case of the horse can lead to it being destroyed.
So I'm not against the race, I'am against the use of the whip. (If no one can use a whip no one has an advantage). I also think that the laws around horse riding has far bigger things to address, where innocent lives are at risk
I myself think it is far more important to ban horses from public roads and to have heavier laws around amateur horse owners jumping horses in a field they have access to. Roads are truly terrifying place for many horses owned by armature riders. Unlike professional horses (police horses etc) they have not been trained to deal with traffic. This causes thousands of accidents every year, which in turn result in hundreds of horses being killed either as a direct result of the accident or through injuries not healing. Its also responsible for a handful of human deaths a year as well
Amateur riders pushing horses over jumps in a field they have access to, is also a big cause of fatal accidents for horses. Badly positioned jumps on to dangerous and unsuitable surfaces results in falls and broken bones, which in the case of the horse can lead to it being destroyed.
So I'm not against the race, I'am against the use of the whip. (If no one can use a whip no one has an advantage). I also think that the laws around horse riding has far bigger things to address, where innocent lives are at risk
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I think the anti racing people should really get themselves informed on the welfare of racehorses and compare it to thousands of horses kept in fields where accidents happen every day.
An Italian footballer died two days ago of a heart attack on the pitch. Maybe Football sould be banned too. Also two hockey payers died recently whilst playing... so lets ban everything.
I will say that If I were the owner of the horse that subsequently died after throwing his jockey on the way to the start I would have withdrawn him at that point. He went on to unseat his rider and carried on racing of his own accord and was fatally injured several fences further on.
An Italian footballer died two days ago of a heart attack on the pitch. Maybe Football sould be banned too. Also two hockey payers died recently whilst playing... so lets ban everything.
I will say that If I were the owner of the horse that subsequently died after throwing his jockey on the way to the start I would have withdrawn him at that point. He went on to unseat his rider and carried on racing of his own accord and was fatally injured several fences further on.
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As someone who was there yesterday - can I point out two things that have been mentioned in this thread that are not quite correct.
Firstly the winning horse - whipped so much it had blood on it? It walked past me on the way to the winners enclosure and at no point did I see open cuts on neck and hind quarters and certainly no signs of blood - and secondly the favourite actually broke his leg whilst running free after unseating his jockey the fence before. This horse hates jumping so much that it ignored the 'way out' it could have taken and actually carried on running and jumped the fence - landing badly - and at this point broke his leg.
Can I also mention that I have ridden since I was able to walk and at present do own an ex-racehorse - and certainly due to his temparment (this was his downfall whilst racing - nothing else) wouldnt dream of letting him anywhere near a road - but my old nag who died in her stable this last winter - she could be trusted to go out on the roads etc as she had been trained such - but yes too many amateurs do cloud non horse/non riders view of them with their disregard of so many things on the road - so yes, in this respect I would like to see some more education to young riders on this one.
However, back to the racing - everyone keeps mentioning that the course needs taming and horse number reducing - would you be surprised to learn, that since the field has been reduced to 40 and since the fences are getting smaller - more deaths have happened ....
Firstly the winning horse - whipped so much it had blood on it? It walked past me on the way to the winners enclosure and at no point did I see open cuts on neck and hind quarters and certainly no signs of blood - and secondly the favourite actually broke his leg whilst running free after unseating his jockey the fence before. This horse hates jumping so much that it ignored the 'way out' it could have taken and actually carried on running and jumped the fence - landing badly - and at this point broke his leg.
Can I also mention that I have ridden since I was able to walk and at present do own an ex-racehorse - and certainly due to his temparment (this was his downfall whilst racing - nothing else) wouldnt dream of letting him anywhere near a road - but my old nag who died in her stable this last winter - she could be trusted to go out on the roads etc as she had been trained such - but yes too many amateurs do cloud non horse/non riders view of them with their disregard of so many things on the road - so yes, in this respect I would like to see some more education to young riders on this one.
However, back to the racing - everyone keeps mentioning that the course needs taming and horse number reducing - would you be surprised to learn, that since the field has been reduced to 40 and since the fences are getting smaller - more deaths have happened ....
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The danger increases the easier they make the jumps at aintree and the horses end up going faster and faster...ask any professional in racing -which I am not.
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Dont know if anybody has seen the documentary about what horses have done through the ages for us, ploughing the land, war, helping man basically - and this tragedy happens today - racing is actually quite disrespectful to such a magnificent creature, down grading as such I think. Yep and all for gambling, the argument they love it - sorry no, if that was the case, why dont you just let them run around in a field together, Its money and that it is ultimately . what it is about. Damage limitation = no death, so why even risk any? Money. Dont matter because the next mare wiil just be AI and off we go again. Oh its not about money is it? People make 1000's breeding horses
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I know a breeder and the mares are not given a break from being pregnant, its horse farming
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It's been stated a few times now, but let me repeat the point since you're ignoring it: I, for one, am not against racing. I'm not against racing over the hedges. What I am against is pretending that the Grand National isn't dangerous to horses. Thousands and thousands of horses race every day, with virtually none injured. Look at the track record of the Grand National, though: It has a very long history of being dangerous for horse and jockey alike. Maybe changes have been made, but it's still Becher's Brook that causes the downfall of most animals. Simply replacing that one fence with something quite different would go a long way to help.
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Reminds me of old Roman times really and gladiators, let the fittest survive, before somebody plunges their sword into somebody, barbaric at least.
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I'm sure there would be uproar if every time a sports person died they went and shot an innocent horse!
I don't really care either way about Horse Racing, never interested me. You can't deny though that Horse Racing exists 100% for the benefit of Humans.
There is also a difference between rare events or 'accidents' and the predictable fact that 'some horses are almost certainly going to be killed this weekend'.
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And no need for any horses to die this weekend, considering that they have done for us over a lifetime, human selfishness again. Its human consumption - Horse dosent even come into it.
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