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Employing in Philippines - I'll never hire in UK again.

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by JohnnyCash, Feb 3, 2011.

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  1. LinkBright Media

    LinkBright Media UKBF Regular Full Member - Verified Business

    291 33
    An interesting bit of feedback from my other half here, who (remotely) managed a team of technical support staff in Manila, Philippines when he worked in a company offering services similar to IBM. He says the team members had an excellent standard of English, they are dedicated and often think outside the box and use their own initiative (which I found was acutely lacking in ALL the full time and freelance Indian staff I have dealt with in the past). He gave me the thumbs up for giving this a try :)
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: LinkBright Media Member since: May 15, 2010
    #61
  2. seanheather

    seanheather UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    203 39
    I am aware of that, but the key principles are just the same whether you have a multi million pound profit business or not. It was only an example.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: seanheather Member since: Jan 2, 2011
    #62
  3. crossdaz

    crossdaz UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    2,773 778
    I know what you're saying but maybe pc world wasn't a great example. They need to employ better people not cheaper people.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: crossdaz Member since: Sep 3, 2008
    #63
  4. bdw

    bdw Banned

    6,568 1,269
    It does not take a top economist to realise that when we start moving jobs abroad employment in the UK suffers (think banking, insurance and call centres) as does our economy and hence your business. It really is quite simple. Your customers need money to spend on your products. ;) If all of the UK jobs that have been taken out of the UK were returned we would be in clover.

    Interesting? More like a doomsday scenario for employees. This would create an employee underclass and the people who would suffer most would be those who were so desperate for a job they would sell their rights (like the immigrants currently in the UK).

    I am sorry but reading this thread I can't help but get the picture of many you rubbing your hands in glee at this prospect and it is not a nice picture. I agree that there is a problem but it is not a people problem. It is a government (and management) problem so perhaps you should be directing your ire at those who caused it.

    I am commenting on this as someone who has worked in the UK since 1964 and never been unemployed. I have also been self employed since 2001. I have as they say, had a good look around and I have seen what many employers will do when they are allowed to get away with it, like knowingly killing people. We don't want to get back to that do we?

    The list below includes just a few examples of what happens in our society with employee rights and minimum wage. Think what it would be like without it (and note that Filipinos are one of the largest groups to be exploited, not just here but Worldwide).

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/8171318.stm
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7150468.stm
    http://www.december18.net/article/u...t-and-exploitation-migrant-and-agency-workers
    http://www.foodproductiondaily.com/Quality-Safety/Exploited-workers-found-at-major-UK-food-firms
    http://www.heraldscotland.com/tesco-urged-to-end-worker-exploitation-1.913705
    http://www.building.co.uk/news/whit...e-foreign-worker-exploitation/3037172.article

    So if you want circumvent human and employee rights I suggest that you get in touch with some of these people. they will show you how it's done.

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: bdw Member since: Aug 13, 2008
    #64
  5. BizGurl

    BizGurl UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    3,020 791
    From what I'm reading on this thread, the general feeling is that Filipino's are merely more then cheap production machines to be used to make a quick buck or two.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: BizGurl Member since: Sep 15, 2009
    #65
  6. DesignerNick

    DesignerNick UKBF Big Shot Full Member

    3,455 615
    A Philipino person I spoke to was qualified in law. They didn't want to work in law as it meant 70 hours a week so they were happy to work 35 hours a week for only slightly less money then if they worked 70 hours a week as a lawyer and they didn't have to leave their house.

    They were always ready to help and they felt lucky to have the job. It was a pleasure to work with them.

    It isn't really exploitation is it?
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: DesignerNick Member since: Apr 22, 2009
    #66
  7. MASSEY

    MASSEY UKBF Legend Full Member

    10,328 1,783
    They make out of the deal to dont they. Cost of living is to high here. Im lucky no one can out source my services.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: MASSEY Member since: Nov 29, 2009
    #67
  8. luckyg

    luckyg UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    334 15
    Very interesting thread. I let my only full time staff member go after repeated warnings for using facebook too much and not doing his job as he was on FB too much. Since then I have been unable to find the right candidate who I feel will do the job right.

    Do you think outsourcing to Phillipines could work for the customer service phone part of an online business? Taking queries, giving profuct advice etc?

    Accents might put UK customers off?

    Maybe it is only usable for admin and IT work?
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: luckyg Member since: Sep 17, 2008
    #68
  9. RadiusBPO

    RadiusBPO UKBF Ace Free Member

    1,393 381
    Exact SD. Some of my guys were working 50-60-70-80 hours per week for $0.50-0.70 per hour. They now earn twice as much for half the work and get to work whenever they want.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: RadiusBPO Member since: Jun 11, 2010
    #69
  10. JohnnyCash

    JohnnyCash Guest

    1,427 480
    Is that not what all employees are?
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: JohnnyCash Member since: Dec 8, 2010
    #70
  11. RadiusBPO

    RadiusBPO UKBF Ace Free Member

    1,393 381
    You have to spend a bit more and look harder (and I wish I still had the contact) but there is a school in PH somewhere which teaches the english accent (most have US accents) and they are used by UK companies.

    Would an American accent put your customers off?
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: RadiusBPO Member since: Jun 11, 2010
    #71
  12. luckyg

    luckyg UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    334 15
    Yes I think it would. I feel with an online business customer wants reassurance they are buying from UK business and the UK accent will reassure them.

    If you remember the contact I would be grateful for it. This thread has really got me thinking!
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: luckyg Member since: Sep 17, 2008
    #72
  13. gmoto

    gmoto UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    150 20
    My thought was with that for this I could afford to employ someone full time, hopefully ongoing; rather than getting someone that has less qualifications to work for less time because they need more money per hour just to keep a roof over their heads.

    I was born in Botswana, though only lived there for the first four months of my life and haven't returned to that country since. However I've always had a pipe dream of building a manufacturing plant, or whatever there - cheap labour that for a very small wage (for the UK) would actually be made quite wealthy by local cost of living standards. Also, I feel that sort of thing would do a hell of a lot more than a lot of 'charities' manage.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: gmoto Member since: Jan 14, 2011
    #73
  14. LinkBright Media

    LinkBright Media UKBF Regular Full Member - Verified Business

    291 33
    You're absolutely right. Charitable donations only work short term. To create long term results you have to stimulate the local economy with new business. You only have to look at the positive effects of Kiva.org to see this works.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: LinkBright Media Member since: May 15, 2010
    #74
  15. Consistency

    Consistency Banned

    8,214 1,545

    Not at all, we would have every respect for them and pay a fair wage for a fair days work but within the affordability of the business. This is not an option open to us but I fully understand.

    It is not slave labour at all but it is cheaper work where we do not have to wipe their backsides as they can do this themselves without the nanny state suing us because they wiped it on company premises and suffered arm ache during the process. Slight exagerration but only slight.

    We as employers are tired of all the red tape and with holiday pay, notice pay i.e. money not worked for, the government do not care less as they still get all the taxes from it. It is not a tax free payment and so the money that the employee gets in his pocket, the true cost of this free money to them is substantially higher. It is the business that makes a direct loss.

    One of the joys of working for a small business used to be that the employees and employers bonded, got to know each other, worked together and had a friendship and mutual respect. This balance is no more and a new wave of behaviour seems to have taken over.

    Employees know they have so many rights and so know that even if they do wrong they can still win a tribunal if the employer has not followed a section of a technicality. The employer knows that a smaller business has a lot of responsibility and that employer may be granted a bit more freedom and goodwill. Therefore there is more to take the pee out of.

    An employee should therefore start at the bottom and earn a respect that works both ways as there are some marvellous employees out there, I know because I have one and he is worth his weight. He is an absolute credit and when we have employed new people, and they have been no good, it is his hard work that has carried us through. The good employees are not being given the chances as well now because even employers who were once patriotic and were adamant they would never employ out of their own country, are now throwing that sense of loyalty away because the employee mentality is too often being thrown back in the employers face.

    It is a sad state indeed, as both employee and employers lose out. When a small business has a good employee, it can work so well. Having a laugh and bouncing off each other, looking out for each other, a sense of belonging, pride, caring is all good to a small business and opens up the business to expansion but because of laws, and sneaky employees and employers being considered the big bad bosses, good employers are forever watching their back when they should be watching their business.

    Tribunals from what I have read have increased by 56% last year. I do not think there are 56% more bad bosses.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: Consistency Member since: May 21, 2010
    #75
  16. iArtist

    iArtist Guest

    0 0
    I guess this cartoon says it all

    [​IMG]

    Sadly this is what we're becoming known for, vast differences and inconsitencies with prices, lazy workers and...well...poor quality service providers. I don't believe this is TRUE, but it is a belief that is gaining hold.
     
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: iArtist Member since: Jan 1, 1970
    #76
  17. bdw

    bdw Banned

    6,568 1,269
    Sorry, perhaps it's just me but I don't think that cartoon is funny at all and you have already posted it elsewhere. :(

    Well, anyone reading this thread could be forgiven for forming a different opinion.

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: bdw Member since: Aug 13, 2008
    #77
  18. iArtist

    iArtist Guest

    0 0
    You don't have to think it's funny, it's a statement not a 'joke'.

    Meanwhile on the subject of repetiveness...aren't you always complaining about what forum members do? That is repetitive and dull..
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2011
    Posted: Feb 6, 2011 By: iArtist Member since: Jan 1, 1970
    #78
  19. workingnomad

    workingnomad UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    59 5
    I have started using odesk and have been very impressed with Philopinos so far.
     
    Posted: Feb 7, 2011 By: workingnomad Member since: Feb 28, 2009
    #79
  20. realmaverick

    realmaverick UKBF Regular Free Member

    492 54
    The downside, is you never get to work as a proper team. I'm personally in a similar position. But I would like eventually move to an office, and have everybody work together, all buzzing off one another and creating excitement of the projects.
     
    Posted: Feb 7, 2011 By: realmaverick Member since: Mar 2, 2007
    #80
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