Starting up and I am hitting a wall already

[Givingitago]

Hello all.
So I have decided to jump ship as a taxi driver and stay part time until I build my business. But I have hit some hurdles and have already had to adapt.

I decided to go down the waste management route. Garden, household, business waste.
Done due diligence. Checked prices for disposal. Waste carriers licence. Bought a tipper with a cage.

Now I haven’t had logos printed on my uniform yet. Don’t have tipper signed. Lucky as my stumbling block is hire and reward insurance.

This is 6k as a 40+ year old.

So understandable that I need to adapt my business model.

Now my insurance for carrying my own goods. As a business with public liability insurance is normal and fair priced. Or should I say (affordable)

I will now become a business with the description of gardener.

Grass cut, hedges trimmed, gardens tidied up.

So. Me removing rubbish and junk from said gardens to tidy it up. Be it old sofas. Endless bags. Smashed wardrobe. Etc.
Removing this to tidy up the garden.

I am being paid to provide my service. No one is telling me where they want the items taken. Obviously they want them disposed of in a legal location. But wood goes to a wood yard. Brick goes to a brick yard. General waste is disposed of in a waste merchants yard.

I have a waste licence certificate from GOV.
Everything is in order.

But this insurance is driving my head to another level.

I don’t want to end up losing my taxi employment by getting points or a ban.

Is my theory correct or do I need hire and reward end of story?

Any advice would be appreciated

 

[Newchodge]

@Frank the Insurance guy should be along soon.

 

[Givingitago]

Can I also highlight that upon completion of any work. The customer will be given a copy of the following with receipt.

All goods/waste received from this contract while in transit are now rightfully owned by (business name) to use as sees fit for purpose. No reward shall be gained from those items.

Signature of both parties and dated.

 

[fisicx]

Makes no difference who signs what. The insurance company are unlikely to care. It’s a business carrying materials for disposal.

 

[bovine]

Similar question was asked a couple of years ago, and it wasnt clear if you actually need hire and reward.

Waste Removal Insurance Advice

Hi everyone, bit of a weird and awkward one. I’m 18 and running my own waste removal company primarily for domestic customers. I use my own personal car and a trailer rather than a van. Would I need to have ‘Hire and Reward’ insurance to collect waste even if I state in the terms and...

www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

Are you gardening or waste disposal - 2 very different businesses and insurances?

 

[Givingitago]

Are you gardening or waste disposal - 2 very different businesses and insurances?

Well I will be now mowing lawns with a petrol mower.
Petrol strimmer.
Chopping branches and trimming hedges.
Clearing a garden to make it look respectable.

If that involves chucking an old mattress and shed into my truck to tidy up. Then so be it.

I just now need to make sure I can get rid of the stuff or have to leave it and work around it.

I was prepared to rip out houses. Clear tenancy ending. Clear a garage. But now I know these are literally hire and reward.


But obstacles in the garden. (No metal collecting) are removed as part of the gardening process

 

[fisicx]

Well I will be now mowing lawns with a petrol mower.
Petrol strimmer.
Chopping branches and trimming hedges.
Clearing a garden to make it look respectable.

If that involves chucking an old mattress and shed into my truck to tidy up. Then so be it.

Again, two totally different things. Stick with the garden waste. Not even sure you need a waste operators licence for this. Our gardener doesn’t, he dumps everything in the local recycling.

 

[Jay F.]

Again, two totally different things. Stick with the garden waste. Not even sure you need a waste operators licence for this. Our gardener doesn’t, he dumps everything in the local recycling.

This doesn't answer the question, he's not asking you what he should do, he's asking if he needs the hire and reward insurance for moving additional stuff from the garden as part of the garden job.

 

[Newchodge]

I'll try again @Frank the Insurance guy

 

[HFE Signs]

Waste and recycle is a lot more complicated than it was several years ago, I'd stick to garden and compostable waste and gardening services if I were you and trial that.

 

[Frank the Insurance guy]

I'll try again @Frank the Insurance guy

Sorry @Newchodge - I missed the earlier post!

Hire & Reward cover is essential if you are transporting goods in exchange for payment

What is the customer buying and what is the expected outcome - Gardening Services and Garden clearance are 2 different things. If you are mainly providing gardening services but then also taking away some of their rubbish etc - then you must get Hire & Reward Insurance.

If you are providing gardening services, and are just taking away what you have done as part of that work (eg. grass cuttings, hedge trimmings etc), you would not need Hire & Reward Insurance.

 

[Gecko001]

From the above it looks like your business model requires hire or reward insurance. But does it? If you do get a job where say someone has died leaving an overgrown garden with junk in amongst the undergrowth, then surely you could still take on the job but hire a skip to get rid of the junk. It might be worthwhile to get builders insurance to do this, but it could be cheaper than getting hire and reward insurance.

 

[Newchodge]

From the above it looks like your business model requires hire or reward insurance. But does it? If you do get a job where say someone has died leaving an overgrown garden with junk in amongst the undergrowth, then surely you could still take on the job but hire a skip to get rid of the junk. It might be worthwhile to get builders insurance to do this, but it could be cheaper than getting hire and reward insurance.

The issue t6hen is that the OP's intended business is waste disposal!

 

[MOIC]

Stay as a taxi driver and increase your hours if needed to earn extra.

Not sure your proposed new business, with ALL the expenses, will be more lucrative.

 

[Gecko001]

The issue t6hen is that the OP's intended business is waste disposal!

Yes, the OP wants now to do gardening but still have the facility to do some waste disposal. The waste disposal side of the business is the issue, as you say. I suggest to just sub the waste disposal out to the skip hire contractors. The OP will still have to take the junk he finds in the property and put it in the skip, which cannot really be described as gardening, so his insurance for gardening might not cover him for that. Hence, my suggestion to get builder's insurance as well if he thinks he needs it. I do not think builder's insurance is a legal requirement, unlike hire or reward insurance for disposing of the waste.

 

[Newchodge]

Yes, the OP wants now to do gardening but still have the facility to do some waste disposal. The waste disposal side of the business is the issue, as you say. I suggest to just sub the waste disposal out to the skip hire contractors. The OP will still have to take the junk he finds in the property and put it in the skip, which cannot really be described as gardening, so his insurance for gardening might not cover him for that. Hence, my suggestion to get builder's insurance as well if he thinks he needs it. I do not think builder's insurance is a legal requirement, unlike hire or reward insurance for disposing of the waste.

The OP does not want to do gardening services. they just hoped that by calling it gardening services they could hide the Waste Disposal.

 

[DontAsk]

Hire of a skip for every job would probably cover the cost of insurance.

 

[Gecko001]

The OP does not want to do gardening services. they just hoped that by calling it gardening services they could hide the Waste Disposal.

Not a good business model perhaps and probably will get them into trouble with officialdom if they find out, which will probably happen when the waste disposal firms grass them up for calling themselves a gardening firm (pun intended)!

 

[BizWaste]

Well I will be now mowing lawns with a petrol mower.
Petrol strimmer.
Chopping branches and trimming hedges.
Clearing a garden to make it look respectable.

If that involves chucking an old mattress and shed into my truck to tidy up. Then so be it.

I just now need to make sure I can get rid of the stuff or have to leave it and work around it.

I was prepared to rip out houses. Clear tenancy ending. Clear a garage. But now I know these are literally hire and reward.


But obstacles in the garden. (No metal collecting) are removed as part of the gardening process

Hi.

If you're collecting and transporting garden waste as part of a business, it’s classed as commercial waste and you’ll need the proper licences to stay compliant, especially for carrying waste and disposing of it legally.


Best of luck with the new venture!

 

[Newchodge]

Hi.

If you're collecting and transporting garden waste as part of a business, it’s classed as commercial waste and you’ll need the proper licences to stay compliant, especially for carrying waste and disposing of it legally.


Best of luck with the new venture!

The OP has the licencs, it's the vehicle insurance that is the issue.