Setting up Kitchen & Bathroom business

[bloorino]

I have decided to take the plunge and leave my comfortable sales job to start my own kitchen & bathroom design supply and installation business. I have had 12 years experience in the industry before i went in to sales 2 years ago.

Does anyone have any words of wisdom that may help me getting on my feet?

 

[Beachcomber]

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

I'm sure you have all the usual bases covered - local competition / team of installers / advertising / suppliers / minimising costs etc.

Will you be opening a showroom or running in home visits (or both)? Have you got a web site with basic kitchen planner tool using the range you offer?

 

[CKG]

I've seen loads of these types of outfits come and the vast majority go over the years.

They were universally crap at making sure the installation side of things ran smoothly. Bits missing or not being ordered, making too many promises and generally over selling and under delivering on the whole situation.

Couldn't fault their showrooms and sales patter though.

 

Keep positive and get your name/brand recognised like crazy. Think also about how you market your business.

If you ever need anything designed such as adverts, flyers, business stationery... feel free to contact me. I can help

 

[Willself]

Well they say the recovery is on the way!! Kitchens are the number 1 item when people consider a Re-furb!! followed by bathrooms// central heating etc etc!

One advantage on-line selling offers is...you can offer Top//Middle//Bottom. ranges without the need for stocking..Sell first!!
then source....

A first class fitting TEAM!! is the key...Every Sucess!!

 

[steve the fitter]

If your doing the selling the only other things you need are good installers and a supplier who can get the order right first time. Both very important.

 

[bloorino]

Thanks for comments. I'll give you a little more back ground. I was in the trade for 12 years and consider myself a damn good fitter, i also have first class plumber/gas fitter and a good labourer.

I was just wondering if anybody has any advice on the best routes to market> Where should i be advertising? Is there anymore i could be doing?

I have a website which is almost up and running. I am very passionate about making this business work and would like to have a showroom in a year or 2.

I have a great local supplier who makes the units in house and i also get a good deal on my appliances.

Basically has anyone got any success stories they want to share and how they achieved it.

 

[Tw Installations]

Well.....

I dont think there is any easy answer to your post,

Being a good "fitter" does dont make you good in business, I guess it comes down to want you want if its just a couple of kitchen a week then I think you could get there pretty quickly.

If it running 5 fitting teams putting out 20 kitchens a week then there is no easy answer to this Just hard work, comon sense and business knowledge.

I am in this industry too but I think the answer might lie not in the kitchen side of things, its the business side.

Nothing prepares you for doing it own your own, its all about knowing the market, knowing when the peak buying times are, measure your marketing, log every new enquiry, plan out logistics for the jobs themselves, constantly monitor and refine your sales process, build up relationships with the suppliers, build up a great team and much much more.

These very forums are a fantastic way to start though and there are loads of good helpfull people on them.

Best of Luck

Tommy

 

[saxondale]

Well.....

I dont think there is any easy answer to your post,

Being a good "fitter" does dont make you good in business, I guess it comes down to want you want if its just a couple of kitchen a week then I think you could get there pretty quickly.

If it running 5 fitting teams putting out 20 kitchens a week then there is no easy answer to this Just hard work, comon sense and business knowledge.

I am in this industry too but I think the answer might lie not in the kitchen side of things, its the business side.

Nothing prepares you for doing it own your own, its all about knowing the market, knowing when the peak buying times are, measure your marketing, log every new enquiry, plan out logistics for the jobs themselves, constantly monitor and refine your sales process, build up relationships with the suppliers, build up a great team and much much more.

These very forums are a fantastic way to start though and there are loads of good helpfull people on them.

Best of Luck

Tommy

one a day?

 

[Willself]

Well like many markets, it has its TOP!! people like Smallbones, Poph-en-pho...my spelling is a disgrace!!

Middle people like Kitchens Direct!! Magnet!!etc, and local Showrooms in every town...Who mostly fill this segment!!


And the DIY..bottom end!! B&Q..spring to mind!!

Where do you see you self!! if you want to grow your base locally then
Take a FULL page in your local Rag!! Advertise on your local Radio Station! in terms of PR......you might "OFFER! A fully Fitted Kitchen!!
to the lucky winner of 1-125!! first Quotes...or...installations!!
That way you certainly generate INTEREST!! what you do afterwards
in down to your skills!!.....GOOD LUCK!!

 

[Tw Installations]

one a day?

Yeah I think one a day is achievable, I know a few companies put out this much, some are in the private market, some contract for the insurance companies and some tender for the local councils. Also companies like reface ( replacing doors, handles worktops etc ), in and out in a day, not as much profit per job but its based entirely on volume and its the year end figure that matters.

Tommy

 

[Brad Naylor]

Do you watch Coronation Street?

Well, there's a bloke on there at the moment called 'Jer' or something who runs a business just like you're talking about. Nice van in his company livery 'Klever Kitchens'; no other real overheads, and obviously a decent enough fitter.

He couldn't even make a decent living when the market was booming. Now it's gone tits up he's in hock to loan sharks, has lost his van and tools etc, is a druggy and is having to resort to marrying Gail Tilsley to get himself out of the brown stuff. Desperate times call for desperate measures...

But that of course is soap opera fiction. In reality blokes like 'Jer' are doing OK generally.

I buy my kitchen carcasses from a local manufacturer like the one you describe. Overall his volumes are well down on a couple of years ago; where he was making 20 kitchens a week he is down to 8 or 10. He tells me though, that the guys selling and fitting a kitchen per week out of a van have not been affected in anything like the way that the smart shops you see in every town have. Many of those have seen their business vanish almost completely and are going bust left, right and centre.

If you are happy for now to do say 3 or 4 kitchens or bathrooms per month with you doing the bulk of the fitting work yourself I would say your idea is a goer. Cost things right and £1000 per week nett profit should be achievable in pretty short order. Higher volumes neccesitate lower margins, bigger overheads, and teams of fitters. I would urge you to wait until things settle down a bit more before even thinking along those lines. The real recession might not have even started yet!

I would say that now is a good time to start thinking about the promotional work for your new business. A website is great, but this is a very competitive sector and getting your site seen by anyone is going to take time. Leaflet drops and local newspaper advertising could kick start things a little, but there is no point whatsoever until December 27th. That is the day that Mrs Average starts thinking about upgrading her home interior - with Christmas out of the way. I would keep the day job going for now, then!

Best of luck.

Brad

 

[bloorino]

I'd just like to say a big thanks to everyone who has commented, its great being able to get advice from people in the trade.

Anymore comments greatly recieved!!

 

[LicensedToTrade]

Hey bloorino, I just wanted to wish you all the best in your new venture.

I'm responsible for Marketing for Saint-Gobain Building Distribution UK (We own Jewson and Graham) so obviously I know a little about marketing our Kitchen service through Graham and Jewson. If you have any specific question you need some pointers on please feel free to PM me and I will try my best to give you a hand.

We don't do much external advertising these days, we don't need to. We very very rarely use radio or published advertising but it takes a lot of time to get to that stage.

 

[TargetNumberOne]

My brother and I started up a similar business 5 years ago operating from my garage, only we were selling kitchens and bedrooms. Back then we had no showroom (that came in year 3) and the business came in from ppc marketing and advertising in our local papers, plus flyer distribution.

The fastest route to market was through online advertising - and incidently this was also the most cost effective.

Looking at the 2008 figures, our cost per lead was approximately £230 using PPC, whereas with local advertising was just over £500. We did take out an expensive Yellow pages ad during our first year, and received approximately a dozen calls, which generated one sale.

Other important things to mention - we project managed the whole operation and had to go through a number of fitters before finding someone reliable. I know you're a fitter yourself but please be aware that if that what you want to do, you may have to hire someone to give you a hand managing with the sales calls, appointments, kitchen designs, placing orders, accounts and general admin, etc.

All in all, there is a lot of competition out there but by the same measure, some of the operators have gone out of business (e.g. MFI) which means that there is an opportunity for smaller more agile businesses. Focus on building a good relationship with your customers and providing a good quality of work. If you can get referrals from existing customers you can write your own cheque in this industry.

Hope that helps and good luck!
Tony

 

[estwig]

Quick way to get right to people who definitely want a kitchen;

Your local council website will have a section with all the local planning apps and possibly building control apps as well, names and addresses of people having extensions built. 9 times outta 10, new extension = new kitchen, write to these people and introduce yourself, follow up with another letter approx 6 weeks later. This will generate work for you, but you gotta get orgnaised, get into mail merge in Word and creating databases in excel.

look at who is building the extension and write to the builder as well, offering him a mark-up, or a kick back, on your services/prices.

Good luck.

 

[LicensedToTrade]

Quick way to get right to people who definitely want a kitchen;

Your local council website will have a section with all the local planning apps and possibly building control apps as well, names and addresses of people having extensions built. 9 times outta 10, new extension = new kitchen, write to these people and introduce yourself, follow up with another letter approx 6 weeks later. This will generate work for you, but you gotta get orgnaised, get into mail merge in Word and creating databases in excel.

look at who is building the extension and write to the builder as well, offering him a mark-up, or a kick back, on your services/prices.

Good luck.

It's good advice but be careful about who you mention it to. Planning permission documents are put online to make local residents ware of what is happening around them in case they should want to petition against any action. It will explicitly state when you enter the website that it is not to be used by companies trying to solicit business from individuals. Lots of people do it, but just be careful. Your hit rate will be inflated due to the fact that you are approaching warmer leads, but at the same time you will often find that people have been granted permission to extend their kitchen but they have no intention of acting on it for another few years which can be an annoying waste of your time. Good luck.

 

[estwig]

It's good advice but be careful about who you mention it to. Planning permission documents are put online to make local residents ware of what is happening around them in case they should want to petition against any action. It will explicitly state when you enter the website that it is not to be used by companies trying to solicit business from individuals. Lots of people do it, but just be careful. Your hit rate will be inflated due to the fact that you are approaching warmer leads, but at the same time you will often find that people have been granted permission to extend their kitchen but they have no intention of acting on it for another few years which can be an annoying waste of your time. Good luck.

I was doing this for almost 3 years, at our peak we were sending out 400 letters a month, offering to build the lofts and extensions. We had a turnover touching £500k, just doing large domestic work. Not for me anymore though, the stress is unreal!!

One problem we did encounter early on, was people wanting to know how we got their details, some people got really p*ssed off about it. So the opening line to our letter was something like, 'having seen your building application on the local council website, we would like to take this opportunity to introduce ourselves.' That overcame the problem.

It's still a brilliant, direct form of marketing, for the right business.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

What business skills do you have? Do you understand Cashflow, this is probably the one area where companies fail when new

They make a business plan based upon what there dreams are made of and not based upon cold facts of life

The large companies have spent a fortune in marketing you have so far probably spent very little, so you will be up against some strong players from day one. Did you go out and get cold customers when you were selling or did the company do the hard bit and just leave you to close the deal.

It's so easy when you start up to expect orders to flow in but for the first year that seldom happens and after the initial burst, they slow down and Cashflow becomes the problem

If you are fitting you are not selling and the other way round, is time set aside for repairs and to just put things right.

I know nothing of your personal experience so can just paint another side that seems to happen very often, but good luck and dont day dream when making your business plan, just be realistic

 

[bloorino]

TargetNumberOne: What on line advertising worked best for you? How busy are you at the moment? I plan to design the kitchens myself, as i have done this as part of a uni course i did plus i did it in the past. I have some good contacts, my dads a great plumber, i'v got sparkies etc who i know. Do you think i need to look at getting a business partner if possible??

Estwig: Thanks for that will look down the council planing route.

Chris Ashdown: I have done limited cold call selling, my current role is more account management, I do have basic business knowledge. Do you have any tips to help me on the business side of things??

 

[Tw Installations]

What area are you covering Bloorino?

England?

 

[Chris Ashdown]

All the banks issue a free business guide when you ask them about setting up in business, these guides which can normally also be brought from WH Smiths etc offer all the knowledge you require, the are also council lead buisness classes in most towns to help with start-ups and may also have grants

The main thing is your business plan, it's easy to write it to impress the bank with large growth numbers etc, but you should be writting it for yourself to find out your weak area's, what your competition are doing, your break even point and your cashflow forcast.

Remember no cashflow no business, so keep tight reins on your credit control and cash, when you start up I think most people would be better off purchasing second hand equipment or renting / leasing if possible so that they can keep as much cash available for the rainy days ( some people chasing technology obviously cannot use secondhand but thats a different story)

Don't put money into the company at start-up and then take your pay out of the company, as you will be paying double taxes on it ( you have already paid tax on your savings), much better to keep a few months salary back out of the company and live off that first whilst taking nothing out of the company

Good Luck

 

[TargetNumberOne]

TargetNumberOne: What on line advertising worked best for you? How busy are you at the moment? I plan to design the kitchens myself, as i have done this as part of a uni course i did plus i did it in the past. I have some good contacts, my dads a great plumber, i'v got sparkies etc who i know. Do you think i need to look at getting a business partner if possible??

Just responding to your questions ...

What on line advertising worked best?
PPC marketing using Google Adwords

How busy are we?
After our worst Q1 ever, we had a very slow start at the beginning of the year, we've had the busiest Q4 to date. Obviously this has a lot to do with the experience we've gained over the last 5 years, and constantly advertising our business online plus in local papers and local magazines, etc.

Having good contacts always helps, especially if you can get those contacts to drum up some business for you.

Getting a business partner?
I wouldn't say you need someone right away, but it should be something that you bear in mind as your business starts to develop. I had my brother to rely on and to share reponsibilities with - e.g. if he was on appointments, I would be taking calls, handling sales enquiries, placing orders or taking deliveries. You might want to get your Dad involved as a partner to help you out during the first 6 months or so, or until you can afford to employ someone full-time.

Kind regards,
Tony

 

[patientlady]

Hi bloorino
I work on a farm and one of the units has just been let to a guy in a similar situ to you. Anyway he has linked up with a company like you and they manufacture the units and he fits etc. What I thought was great is that he has produced a great brochure which has all his units, the spec, the drawing, colour pic, but most importantly the fitted price of each unit! Additional costs are work surfaces. So you can almost work out the price yourself with fine tuning from you the designer! and negotiate a little discount too. All the units are wood and he has set up a kitchen environment in the unit on the farm at little cost so that he can show off his work! He doesn't man it just shows when he gets alead I think... Hope this helps

 

[Camille-I]

Kitchen & bathroom design supply and installation is hot and a potential business. Life is the main theme of a person, and house basic installation and beautification would be a must need.

 

[bloorino]

To answer Tw Installation ? I will be mainly covering Staffordshire, but wouldn't rule out going further a field.

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

If at all possible avoid taking on a partner. Have you ever heard the phrase 'a camel is a horse designed by a committee'?

I operate two kitchen/bedroom/bathroom warehouses. The bulk of our business is kitchens. We specialize in affordable kitchens and here it seems that the market is booming. We offer supply only which is increasingly popular as well as fully fitted.
I would advise you to take small ads in as many local newspapers as possible, nice and simple with a clear message. Avoid wasting your money on yellow pages etc. We also get a great response from low-tech road side signage.

We may be able to supply you with some products as we have great contacts - PM me if you are interested.

 

[bloorino]

I have just had a week off work to install a kitchen, customers are over the moon and have already recommended me to their friends.

Heres my problem, i now have 2 kitchens to design, supply and fit for the end of Jan, but i still haven't quit my job yet. Do i hand my notice in Jan and go for it or do i try and sub the work to someone i now???

I really want to take the plunge but is 2 jobs enough??:|

 

[Tw Installations]

I have just had a week off work to install a kitchen, customers are over the moon and have already recommended me to their friends.

Heres my problem, i now have 2 kitchens to design, supply and fit for the end of Jan, but i still haven't quit my job yet. Do i hand my notice in Jan and go for it or do i try and sub the work to someone i now???

I really want to take the plunge but is 2 jobs enough??:|

Its all down to you whether you feel confident emough to take the plunge.

As we speak I have zero kitchens linned up for January so you are officially in a better position than me.

However, I have a few years worth of knowledge and I know when I want it the work is there, I just need to press certain buttons to bring it in. Its a learning curve and Presonally I'd say if you have a little money to help you get by for a wee bit then 100% go for it. If you are smarter than your average tradesman then it should not be too hard to make a decent living and stay ahead of the competition.

Others may disagree but fortune favours the Brave and there is no better feeling working for yourself, being your own boss and choosing what hours and lifestyle you want to have.

How many kitchens would you need to fit per month to match your current salary?

Good Luck
Tommy

 

[Brad Naylor]

I have just had a week off work to install a kitchen, customers are over the moon and have already recommended me to their friends.

Heres my problem, i now have 2 kitchens to design, supply and fit for the end of Jan, but i still haven't quit my job yet. Do i hand my notice in Jan and go for it or do i try and sub the work to someone i now???

I really want to take the plunge but is 2 jobs enough??:|

That sounds like about a month's worth of work in your order book; going into Christmas with a month's work booked in for the new year is a position lots of established businesses would envy - see post above!

January heralds the start of the prime selling season for kitchens and bedrooms - indeed any kind of home improvements. If you have been able to sell two kitchens in the run-up to Christmas - probably the worst time of year for bringing in new business of this kind - then you should confidently expect to be able to do at least as well over the coming months. Attracting leads and converting them is time-consuming however, and it is difficult to see how this could be combined with a full-time job long-term.

Sooner or later you are just going to have to take the plunge. From what you've told us, now seems as good a time as any to me, but only you can make that decision.


Cheers
Brad

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

That sounds like about a month's worth of work in your order book; going into Christmas with a month's work booked in for the new year is a position lots of established businesses would envy - see post above!

January heralds the start of the prime selling season for kitchens and bedrooms - indeed any kind of home improvements. If you have been able to sell two kitchens in the run-up to Christmas - probably the worst time of year for bringing in new business of this kind - then you should confidently expect to be able to do at least as well over the coming months. Attracting leads and converting them is time-consuming however, and it is difficult to see how this could be combined with a full-time job long-term.

Sooner or later you are just going to have to take the plunge. From what you've told us, now seems as good a time as any to me, but only you can make that decision.


Cheers
Brad

2 Kitchens..? A months work...?
Nooooooooooooo - Our fitters must be superhuman!

 

[Brad Naylor]

2 Kitchens..? A months work...?
Nooooooooooooo - Our fitters must be superhuman!

Well, there's kitchens and kitchens...

Mine average around £10k each. I reckon I spend two days designing, planning, and organising, followed by 5-8 days fitting. Maybe another day or so in the workshop making end panels, corner posts etc.

If I do 2 a month I'm clearing 4-5 grand net...

Sounds like you're working too hard, mate!

 

[MASSEY]

I have decided to take the plunge and leave my comfortable sales job to start my own kitchen & bathroom design supply and installation business. I have had 12 years experience in the industry before i went in to sales 2 years ago.

Does anyone have any words of wisdom that may help me getting on my feet?

will you be doing the design and subcontracting the installation process

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

Well, there's kitchens and kitchens...

Mine average around £10k each. I reckon I spend two days designing, planning, and organising, followed by 5-8 days fitting. Maybe another day or so in the workshop making end panels, corner posts etc.

If I do 2 a month I'm clearing 4-5 grand net...

Sounds like you're working too hard, mate!

I don't do any installation work. I do work very hard though - obviously the return is directly linked to effort expended.

 

[bloorino]

How many kitchens would you need to fit per month to match your current salary?

Good Luck
Tommy

Well i have just made £2500 in 2 weeks which is what i earn a month at the moment. But i don't have to pay for car, phone, food etc. If i could do a complete job a month at first i would be happy as i could do little bits and pieces to fill the rest of the month.

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

So.....?
Have you come to a decision yet?

 

[maxine]

bloorino

If there was any advice I would give it would be to talk to others in the trade... builders etc and get email addresses, phone numbers and meet as many as possible before you start. Also people like property agents, conservatory companies etc.

Our business (plumbing and plastering) has been on it's knees all of this year and only just picking up from last quarter and we have been finding it really tough to hold onto profit from bathroom supply and fit. Most of our profit has been from domestic plastering which is the complete opposite of the 4 years prior.

In terms of advertising our best returns have been from website development, targetted leaflets and telemarketing to business and consumer.

Good luck

 

[David Morson]

Hope for the best but never try to put every thing on stake. NO doubt, Own business is far better than jobs.

 

[chenhxb]

good luck,i only say that.everyone has his choice and we must grasp it.friends,i am from China,i want to know you.i think the life will be better

 

[brothersrice]

You can get a website to reach to your potential customers. In your website give the necessary details of kitchen planner, offer and the price you offer to get that service. You can create a page for online quote so that the interested visitors can have some ideas about the price.