I think I may need a PPC advisor

[ecommerce84]

Hi guys,

I have been going through my adwords account tonight and my cost per conversion has rocketed, literally doubled in price and conversions are down.

I need to sort this out but simply do not have time. I am unsure of how Adwords cmapaign managers work though and have a couple of queries:

1. How exactly are they paid? Based on performance? or some other way?

2. Surely these guys will not know my market, or does that not matter?

I enjoy the marketing, but now I need to concentrate on selling.

If anyone ould recommend a good consultant, i'd be interested to hear that too.

Thanks,
Craig.

 

[estwig]

Steve Gibson long time member on UKBF takes care of all our PPC, top guy.

 

[ecommerce84]

Hi Estwig,

Thanks for the reply. I've seen his posts on here, he seems knowledgeable. What sort of region is your PPC spend per month? Mine is edging on £650, which may not seem like much to some of the bigger players but it was only about £320 a couple of months ago.

 

[RayB]

Another vote for Steve Gibson here

 

[estwig]

Mines under £200.00 per month but it is targeted very specifically at my ideal client, within 10 miles of my house.

Please don't ask me any techy questions, me is a builder.

Steve is a lovely bloke and very professional, it don't hurt to talk to him, see what he says.

 

[Scott-Copywriter]

Yep the best person for the job is probably Steve, theres some other Adwords consultants on here too.

 

[stugster]

Steve Gibson long time member on UKBF takes care of all our PPC, top guy.

Alas if you do not contact Steve, you are shooting yourself in the footsie.

 

I'm speaking to Steve at the moment with PPC stuff for CSNM very helpful so far.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Thanks for all the kind mentions, folks.

Maybe I should re-brand myself as "UKBF's most recommended PPC consultant".

Steve

 

[stugster]

Hi Estwig,

Thanks for the reply. I've seen his posts on here, he seems knowledgeable. What sort of region is your PPC spend per month? Mine is edging on £650, which may not seem like much to some of the bigger players but it was only about £320 a couple of months ago.

I just re-read this post. If Steve can't bring you fantastic results for what you're paying just now, we'll need to ban him from these forums!

 

[UKSBD]

If you're only spending £600 a month don't make the mistake of thinking you
can get someone to manage your PPC and you won't have to do anything.

When your budget is that small you might be able to find someone to set it
up for you and maybe check on things once or twice a month, but you will
still have to do the daily checking.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

If you're only spending £600 a month don't make the mistake of thinking you
can get someone to manage your PPC and you won't have to do anything.

When your budget is that small you might be able to find someone to set it
up for you and maybe check on things once or twice a month, but you will
still have to do the daily checking.

Of course, when you hire a PPC person, you're paying for their time as well as their expertise.

And, if you want them to check your campaigns every day, then that's going to cost you.

However, if you were to check them yourself everyday, that would cost you too. Time is money, after all.

Would you really spend 20 hours a month managing your own budget of £600?

Maybe, maybe not.

That decision doesn't depend on your budget, it depends on the value that management is likely to add to the business.

You can be in a niche market where you're only able to spend £200 a month on clicks but any sale produces £2,000 profit.

In that case, a pro who can eke out just one extra sale a quarter would be well worth £2,000 a year in fees.

And that's because, although that would almost double your PPC "cost", it would net you £6,000.

(and add 4 clients to your client list)

Steve

 

[UKSBD]

I agree, but it doesn't matter how good the PPC consultant is, the campaigns
still need to be checked at least twice a day.
On a £600 budget that isn't going to happen 90% of the time.
You might get some campaigns where 1 sale may produce £2,000 but these
are few and far between.

 

[PI Guy]

If anyone could recommend a good consultant, i'd be interested to hear that too.

there's only one PPC Consultant and thats Steve Gibson who's so good i had to blog about it. http://www.salgadoinvestigations.co.../25/adwords-works-for-salgado-investigations/

 

[directmarketingadvice]

it doesn't matter how good the PPC consultant is, the campaigns
still need to be checked at least twice a day.

Interesting. I've never felt that way.

Checking twice a day would be roughly 30 minutes each day ie. 15 hours a month.

Even if someone only charged £15 an hour, that's £225 a month ... and that's just for checking.

All the time spend writing ads, optimising groups and campaigns, doing keyword research etc (plus, in my case, all the post-click stuff I do) would all have to be added on top of that.

I'm sure there are campaigns that would justify that sort of attention - just as there are business that need a full time marketing department - but, in my experience, once they've been running for a while most campaigns are fairly stable day by day.

i.e. they're marketing systems where £x goes in and £y (subject to daily statistical variation) comes out.

Steve

 

[UKSBD]

That is why I said to the OP,

"Don't make the mistake of thinking you can get someone to manage your PPC
and you won't have to do anything"

Of course you can't do the daily checking on that low a budget, but it should
just come as 2nd nature that when he switches on in the morning he just
quickly checks and then does same thing later in the day.

I wouldn't set many campaigns up and just assume they're all going to run fine
even if they've been running steadily for a week or more funny things can
happen.
On numerous occassions I've had ads running nicely on a nice low clicks only
to see them stop displaying because I'm suddenly not bidding enough.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

but it should just come as 2nd nature that when he switches on in the morning he just quickly checks and then does same thing later in the day.

Maybe I'm completely missing the point, but I don't see much difference between the business owner checking it himself or paying someone to do it.

If you check it yourself, there's a cost. If it takes 15 hours a month, then that's 15 hours that aren't spent doing things to bring in sales.

Now, the checking could be 15 hours well invested, but that's a question that has to be asked, not something that can be assumed to be the case.

I wouldn't set many campaigns up and just assume they're all going to run fine even if they've been running steadily for a week or more funny things can happen.
On numerous occassions I've had ads running nicely on a nice low clicks only
to see them stop displaying because I'm suddenly not bidding enough.

The google adwords algo is, for the most part, fairly stable ... but it can be volatile around the edges.

If you're:

(a) bidding at or near the minimum for your phrases

(b) doing things that can get you "google slapped"

(c) have quality score issues

(d) have a bad history with google

you can find your ads are disabled and google wants you to pay more money.

So, yes, you'd have something that's so unpredictable you need to watch it like a hawk.

However, if you've got a straightforward campaign where you're paying above the minimum and where your top keywords are being well targetted (ie. have a good/great quality score), google doesn't tend to mess you around.

... and, when it does, it's part of a larger shift and any PPC consultant that's got his/her ear to the ground will have hear about it on the forums.

(or seen it in other campaigns they manage)

So, for a "normal" business, with a "normal" campaign that's well managed, I'd say that checking twice a day is a poor use of time/resources.

Just my 2p.

Steve

 

[Rob Holmes]

It's easier to just set up sms/email alerts to alert you if something happens that means an ad won't be shown etc.

I guess I look after in excess of 300 adgroups, most with a healthy spend - all with a few versions of my own secret style of 'high click' pulling/converting ads - and I give them all a once over every couple of days if I'm not logged in and writing ads, in which case I'd notice anything strange (good or bad) going on anyway.

Rob

 

[Words of Magic]

There's no doubt that Google Adwords can bring your business alot of traffic but its a fact that most users that have tried to run their own campaigns have failed to create an impressive return.

A qualified Google Adwords Consultant can maximise the best return on your marketing investment and bring new customers to your business.

As a fully qualified Adwords consultant, I can ensure that your
Adwords campaign is configured correctly to achieve the lowest possible price-per-click whilst maximising your click-through-rate.

Although steve gibson is a competitor of mine, very few people know we are good friends and either of us can help you achieve the best possible results from adwords.

Wishing you all the success in the world,

 

[ecommerce84]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all the replies. Stugsters comment almost sounds like a challenge!!

Just to clarify my budget isn't set at £600, this is my current spend, but Return on investment and cost per conversion has gone up. I would happily spend £600,000 a month if it bought in enough conversions and I stll made a nice profit. My budget is uncapped at long as ROI is good.

What I am concerned about is the quality of my spend and the people its attracting. Competition appears to have hiked up the CPC. I am more than happy to check my account on a daily basis, I ahve been doing so for 3 years. What I would possibly like is someone who can set my account up effectively and update it once/twice a month with new adgroups etc as new products become available.

There is only one thing that concerns me with hiring external help (and I'm sure it isn't the case with Steve and Paul, but it has put me off in the past) is that the consultant will make a complete balls up. My ads will suffer, cost will go up and I will be left owing them money. I'm not sure how much market knowledge the advisor should have.

Thats my only concern, but I'm sure someone can put my mind at rest.

Thanks for all the comments as well guys. I am truly grateful and welcome any further thoughts on the matter.

Thanks again,
Craig

 

[Words of Magic]

My top tips in order to reduce your cost per click when up against stiff competition:

Your Keywords

Its not enough to bid on ten or twenty keywords. If you do your only be bidding on the most obvious, most expensive ones. As a rule of thumb you should try for atleast 100 and use third party keyword tools to generate more.
Thats how you can get clicks for less that 5p.

Your keywords should always include phrase "" and exact matched [] terms. Using these will tell you more about your traffic and will let you get some search terms at lower bid prices than your competitors are paying.

In any market there are highly specific, high priced words that everyone is bidding on - and there are low priced, generic words that most people can't get to work. Sometimes generic phrases can pay off.

Your Ad Copy

Every single word in your ad makes a measurable difference, even the captilization. Split test and find what does and doesnt work in your market.

Your Bidding Strategy

Usually the top position gets you diminishing returns. Lower positions attract a higher quality prospect because they've taken longer to find you.

Good luck with whichever consultant you choose to use,

Wishing you all the success in the world,

 

[creospace]

Speak to miles at topclickmedia.co.uk , if you google 'adwords management' you will see him up the top there

Gary

 

[UKSBD]

Maybe I'm completely missing the point, but I don't see much difference between the business owner checking it himself or paying someone to do it.

If you check it yourself, there's a cost. If it takes 15 hours a month, then that's 15 hours that aren't spent doing things to bring in sales.

Now, the checking could be 15 hours well invested, but that's a question that has to be asked, not something that can be assumed to be the case.
Just my 2p.

Steve

I'm not saying you specifically allow 15 minutes in the morning and 15
minutes at night just to check.
Just that anyone running a program should keep an eye on it a couple of
times a day, it can just be as simple as opening an extra window whilst
waiting for something to upload or even whilst your on the phone.

This is what I said in my original reply,
"If you're only spending £600 a month don't make the mistake of thinking you
can get someone to manage your PPC and you won't have to do anything.
When your budget is that small you might be able to find someone to set it
up for you and maybe check on things once or twice a month, but you will
still have to do the daily checking."

Do you disagree with that statement?

 

[directmarketingadvice]

This is what I said in my original reply,
"If you're only spending £600 a month don't make the mistake of thinking you
can get someone to manage your PPC and you won't have to do anything.
When your budget is that small you might be able to find someone to set it
up for you and maybe check on things once or twice a month, but you will
still have to do the daily checking."

Do you disagree with that statement?

As I said before, what you can justify investing in Adwords management (in both time and money)

"doesn't depend on your budget, it depends on the value that management is likely to add to the business.

You can be in a niche market where you're only able to spend £200 a month on clicks but any sale produces £2,000 profit.

In that case, a pro who can eke out just one extra sale a quarter would be well worth £2,000 a year in fees.

And that's because, although that would almost double your PPC "cost", it would net you £6,000.

(and add 4 clients to your client list)"

I have some adwords clients who spend under £600 a month in clicks but are very happy with the service they get from me (judging by this thread and other threads on UKBF where my PPC services have been recommended).

But maybe because I'm giving their campaigns (and websites) a lot more time and attention than the person you described that just "sets it
up for you and maybe check on things once or twice a month".

Steve

 

[RayB]

I like Steves approach to PPC - say you spend £600 PM now with X ROI then get Steve involved and spend more (including the cost of managing) but ultimately get a better ROI (profits increase by a larger amount than the cost invested) - you cannot lose.

PS - UKSBD knows a thing or 2 about all things internet BTW - top banana

 

[UKSBD]

I don't disagree with Steve, all of what he says is right.
All I am saying is, it doesn't matter how good your PPC guy is you should still
not rely on them 100% and should keep an eye on things yourself too.
Even if it just a case of logging in once a day to make sure your ads are
running OK.

 

[ecommerce84]

say you spend £600 PM now with X ROI then get Steve involved and spend more (including the cost of managing) but ultimately get a better ROI (profits increase by a larger amount than the cost invested)

Ray,

Couldn't have put it better myself, that is exactly what I am after (isn't everyone?).

Craig.

 

[Scott-Copywriter]

Steve could you let me know on here or through PM how much you charge for the Adwords management when you get a chance please.

 

[RayB]

I don't disagree with Steve, all of what he says is right.
All I am saying is, it doesn't matter how good your PPC guy is you should still
not rely on them 100% and should keep an eye on things yourself too.
Even if it just a case of logging in once a day to make sure your ads are
running OK.

I dont think anyone thinks you disagree with Steve - you are making a positive contribution to the debate (and as I mentioned you deffo know your stuff)

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Steve could you let me know on here or through PM how much you charge for the Adwords management when you get a chance please.

For anyone who's interested, prices are on my site here: PPC Services

Steve

 

[creospace]

The people I recommended have staff at google headoffice who give them dedicated support because google recognise they do a fantastic job and think they are worthy of it I guess.

Like a lot of things it is something you can do yourself but you can achieve better results by using the expert consultancy of professionals in the relative field, in this case adwords management or the other search engine equivalents.