How do you find a PPC expert?

[directmarketingadvice]

He doesnt claim the google qualification is any more than it is.....which is an explanantion of what the mechanical processes needed to create and run a google campaign...ie how all the controls work, what the knobs and levers do!!

I'm not so sure that's the case.

To repeat something I said earlier in this thread:

"He has a directory that promotes Adwords people.

There is one necessary and sufficient condition for him to promote them: that they have this badge.

That, to me, suggests he believes that this is by far the most important quality an adwords manager could have.

(i.e. everything else is secondary to this)"

Now, if he believes the qualification is "how all the controls work, what the knobs and levers do" - which I think is a fair description - then, IMO, his behaviour isn't consistent with that.

But, maybe he'll respond to your post and agree with your description and that'll clear things up.

Finally, IMO, there are 4 types of people that have this qualification:

(1) Those that were working for an agency and forced to get it. These people can't be judged one way or another.

(2) Those that thought the training wasn't up to much, but wanted to stick the badge on their site. Fair enough. It's not my choice, but different strokes for different folks.

(3) Those who thought they'd get thorough training from google, and were disappointed. Maybe they were a little naive, but we've all been sold a pup one time or another.

(4) Those who thought they'd get thorough training from google, and feel they got thorough training. It's these people I'm concerned about, because they're missing what's really important when it comes to creating a profitable campaign. (and they have a tendency to get uppity with people who don't have the badge)

Again, just my 2p.

Steve

 

[Silky]

As an outsider and merely a customer here, I've got to say that the qualification is to me like a business degree, it shows the user has researched his field, but in essence I'd be looking for experience, success and testimonials.

There are thousands upon thousands of business graduates out there, but few who have actually put in practice what they've learned - or even relearned what they've studied because sometimes the theory can be quite different to the practice. The AdWords qualification may be completely different in this respect but I still err on the side of cynical.

Absolutely no harm at all in having the accreditation, another flag to the websites, but only one part of the jigsaw.

Silky

 

[AdwordsPro]

Just about everyone here 'gets' the qualification, what it is, what it's not, what it's good for, and what it's not. That's good enough for me. I'll be continuing to reference the Adwords Professional Directory until someone gives me a credible reason not to. If it adds no value to your life then just ignore it - it's not comprehensive after all and no one's forcing you to look at it.

If you are going to employ someone to manage your PPC/Adwords account then definitely look at reputation, referrals, and testimonials. Don't necessarily take these things at face value though: referrals will often come from networking clubs that pressurise members for referrals; testimonials from small grateful clients are easy to come by and if they are not direct from the client are subject to 'creative license'; reputation is also manufacturable in a world where affiliate schemes are in abundance. Just be careful! Ideally get a referral from someone that knows what they are talking about and that you can trust, and look for a short tie-in period and ownership of your account (not just access to it).

In my view also look out for the Google certification and (working) verification link - because it 'guarantees' a level of knowledge/training in an otherwise unregulated market where the set of tools is both getting easier to use automatically (in a way that will often lose you money) and getting harder to use manually (in a way that makes and saves you money).

Consider all the arguments and make your own mind up!

 

[Gillie]

There is only one field where I have ever taken notice of letters or exams after a name.

I can't really see why its so important to have this qualification, and to the lay person such as me, frankly my dear, I don't give a damm, to paraphrase some southern gent or other!

I work off one thing, referals, ie I ask, someone tells me what experience they have had with the person, what kind of results they have had, and then I go chat and if I am happy, I utilise their services end of!

 

[gooner]

There is only one field where I have ever taken notice of letters or exams after a name.

I can't really see why its so important to have this qualification, and to the lay person such as me, frankly my dear, I don't give a damm, to paraphrase some southern gent or other!

Gillie, what it does, rightly, or wrongly is tick the box for one of the main triggers in Marketing/Sales

Authority...

 

[Gillie]

Ok, so it means something does it??

Well I am an average punter, well no I lie, I am actually very aware and keep up to date on most things, but sorry, this average punter don't give a damm about some wonderful badge, I want results, and the only way to know I am going to get them is to have someone recommended and ask them about their results. The badge means diddly squat to me!!

EDIT: So much for marketing etc ... when I don't know or care about it!

 

[directmarketingadvice]

I agree with Gooner that it gives the sense of "authority" and that authority is a powerful sales tool.

However, I also agree with GBMaps who asked on another thread:

"How can it be, that someone can read up on google adwords, do a google 'test' and practically overnight become a 'professional'"

And that's my beef about the badge: it conveys an authority that goes way beyond it's actual substance.

And, IMO, it misleads the prospect into thinking he's hiring someone with training/experience that's equivalent to the training and experience required to gain a "professional" qualification in other fields.

And, I often wonder if the naming of the certification (i.e. the use of the word "professional") was done knowing this confusion would occur.

Either way - whether it was careless or calculated - I find it a little distasteful.*

And, if I had my way, this ghastly thing would be banished from existence.

Steve

* Be honest, would you want to hire a "professional" accountant with that sort of training? Or an electrician? Or builder? Or anything else for that matter...

 

[fisicx]

It is the use of the word professional that causes me the most pain. The traditional use of the the word professional indicates not only a required level of qualification and competence but also a regulatory body. Unless there is a governing body then the use of the word professional is meaningless. A bit like calling a cleaner a sanitation engineer or a burger flipper a professional caterer.

 

I agree with Gooner that it gives the sense of "authority" and that authority is a powerful sales tool.

However, I also agree with GBMaps who asked on another thread:



And that's my beef about the badge: it conveys an authority that goes way beyond it's actual substance.

And, IMO, it misleads the prospect into thinking he's hiring someone with training/experience that's equivalent to the training and experience required to gain a "professional" qualification in other fields.

And, I often wonder if the naming of the certification (i.e. the use of the word "professional") was done knowing this confusion would occur.

Either way - whether it was careless or calculated - I find it a little distasteful.*

And, if I had my way, this ghastly thing would be banished from existence.

Steve

* Be honest, would you want to hire a "professional" accountant with that sort of training? Or an electrician? Or builder? Or anything else for that matter...

You know...Id never even noticed that!!

I have paid the thing so little attention, I thought it was
"google adwords qualified"

I had no idea it was billed as
"google adwords qualified PROFESSIONAL!!

Whole different complexion

ADVERTISING STANDARDS AUTHORITY!!! -
Please go fire a warning shot over googles bows - for wilfully and deliberately misleading

 

[AdwordsPro]

Here are some quotes from the web defining the word professional:
"A person who earns his living from a specified activity"
"engaged in a profession or engaging in as a profession or means of livelihood"
"An expert"
"exhibiting a courteous, conscientious, and generally businesslike manner"
"A person who practices an occupation involving high standards of intellectual knowledge after successfully completing the required education and training."

There are plenty more like this - which particular definition are people concerned about? Don't forget that in order to be 'qualified' you have to build and maintain a reasonable level of spend over time.

Now, bearing in mind that Admagic said this to stevegibson:

As I said once before some moons ago, I think you are going a bit over the top with this.

and (about me)

He doesnt claim the google qualification is any more than it is.....which is an explanantion of what the mechanical processes needed to create and run a google campaign...ie how all the controls work, what the knobs and levers do!!

The following quote seems to fail the definition of professional (IMO): "exhibiting a courteous, conscientious, and generally businesslike manner".

It's the talking it up to the point that "having it automatically makes you better than people that don't have it" that's the issue... because it's just complete bull****.

An interesting contrast between those last two quotes.

To stevegibson: You have been judgemental of Google's qualification, giving them a score of 1 out of 5 for your criteria. When I said you were wrong, you asked if they'd changed the training videos in the few hours since you checked before your post. Let's ignore the fact that it would have taken you a few hours to check them, and the fact that they are a recent addition to the course (something you failed to mention). Later you challenged me to find a specific thing relating to one of your 'missed criteria' - it took me seconds to do it. Finally, you say I should have mentioned that it was a fairly recent addition to the course ... the same course you reviewed a few hours before? The change wasn't that recent.

It's clear to me that your assumptions are not based on your knowledge of Google's training materials or the exam. So what are they based on?
Surely it can't be as simple as being afraid of a little competition? You can't be that insecure.
So, why the chip on your shoulder?

 

[DuaneJackson]

Sorry to interupt, has anyone seen my cat? I think it came this way. No? OK, I'll move along.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Adwordspro,

Your rant is full of more holes than swiss cheese.

To stevegibson: You have been judgemental of Google's qualification, giving them a score of 1 out of 5 for your criteria. When I said you were wrong, you asked if they'd changed the training videos in the few hours since you checked before your post. Let's ignore the fact that it would have taken you a few hours to check them

I don't understand this at all.

Why would "the fact that it would have taken you a few hours to check them" have anything to do with me asking "if they'd changed the training videos in the few hours since you checked before your post".

Do you understand that me checking happened in the period before me posting, not in the few hours between my two posts?

and the fact that they are a recent addition to the course (something you failed to mention)

Why was it necessary for me to mention they had added a few videos on website optimizer?

In what way does it change my argument that 4/5 items on my list are missing from the training?

. Later you challenged me to find a specific thing relating to one of your 'missed criteria' - it took me seconds to do it.

You should have posted your findings

Finally, you say I should have mentioned that it was a fairly recent addition to the course

In which post number did I say that? I suspect you're confused or misunderstood an ironic remark.

It's clear to me that your assumptions are not based on your knowledge of Google's training materials

Really? Clear to you?

This forum has been going for a lot longer than the few weeks since you joined. Maybe you want to check the archives. You'll find many posts where I recommend adwords newbies check out the learning center videos.

Some people may conclude from those posts that I've actually watched them.

So what are they based on?

See above.

Surely it can't be as simple as being afraid of a little competition? You can't be that insecure. So, why the chip on your shoulder?

Is this projection?

Have you read the last few posts in this thread? Don't you see how there are a lot of people who think the use of the word "professional" is dodgy/misleading?

Why don't you ask these people - most of whom aren't selling adwords services - why they're afraid of your "competition"?

I suspect they'll tell you that what they really fear is that they'll be suckered into hiring someone who calls himself a "pro" but is just someone who passed a multiple choice test.

SO, I think I've answered all your questions.

Now, let's get back to the thing you keep dodging:

"Here's what I'm seeing: you have a directory that promotes Adwords people.

There is one necessary and sufficient condition for you to promote them: that they have this badge.

That, to me, suggests you believe that this is by far the most important quality an adwords manager could have.

(i.e. everything else is secondary to this)

And, if that's the case, it would suggest you think the training is of such a high level that having it places you above those that don't.

Now, it's possible you don't believe that the badge is so important. In which case, one has to wonder what's the motivation behind creating - and promoting on this forum - your directory.

Is it a calculated attempt to position yourself above other members?"

Do you want to answer that? Or just keep running away from it?

Steve

 

[Tin]

Sorry to interupt, has anyone seen my cat? I think it came this way. No? OK, I'll move along.

LOL

 

[Gillie]

AdwordsPro, if you ask the man in the street what he would expect from a professional, somewhere in his diatribe, I would expect him to say answerable to someone, ie a member of a professional body. So if things go wrong and someone wants to complain they feel comforted that they can, but as far as I can make out, this badge of yours is just that ... to say that you understand what google wants you to and that you have a grounding in what the job entails , yes?

Just a throw away comment though, as a mere potential client wishing to use adwords ... why does it throw up such debate amongst those who do this for a living? As far as I can tell you have some who declare it the bible and some who say it should just be treated as someone with a basic knowledge ... which is why I will revert back to my normal way of finding the right person for the job ... go ask around and check them out!

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Here are some quotes from the web defining the word professional:
"A person who earns his living from a specified activity"
"engaged in a profession or engaging in as a profession or means of livelihood"
"An expert"
"exhibiting a courteous, conscientious, and generally businesslike manner"
"A person who practices an occupation involving high standards of intellectual knowledge after successfully completing the required education and training."

There are plenty more like this - which particular definition are people concerned about?

I think it's the "expert" sense of the word and how using the word "professional" for such a basic level of training can be seen as misleading prospects.

... I don't know why you're asking this as the answer should have been clear from the handful of posts that preceded yours...

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Just a throw away comment though, as a mere potential client wishing to use adwords ... why does it throw up such debate amongst those who do this for a living?

I don't care if someone has it... until they use it as a stick to beat those that don't.

At that point, I think it's quite resonable to point out that their Emperor is buck naked.

I think Admagic's definition is about spot on:

an explanantion of what the mechanical processes needed to create and run a google campaign...ie how all the controls work, what the knobs and levers do!!

Then, if you add the following belief:

"Google want as many people to advertise with adwords as possible. Therefore they've made the interface as simple as they possibly can"

(which I think that's a fairly logical conclusion to draw)

it turns into:

"training to learn how to use an interface that's designed to be really easy to understand".

And, when you add the word "professional" to describe that training, you can understand why some people feel it's misleading prospects.

Steve

 

[Esther]

I would just like to say that Steve's white paper on PPC was an interesting read, thank you!

The whole thing takes me back to my A Level maths exam paper *shudder* and I'm still not convinced that I've totally got this Adwords thing sussed but I'm certainly a lot wiser than I was an hour ago.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

I would just like to say that Steve's white paper on PPC was an interesting read, thank you!

The whole thing takes me back to my A Level maths exam paper *shudder* and I'm still not convinced that I've totally got this Adwords thing sussed but I'm certainly a lot wiser than I was an hour ago.

You're welcome.

I understand where the maths comparison comes from as my debut in marketing was as a statistician.

I tried to keep the report "as simple as possible, but no simpler", but there's no getting away from the numbers.

I just hope - and feedback has been positive - that even the maths-phobes can get through it and take away some ideas that'll help them.

Cheers,

Steve

 

[AdwordsPro]

Another link to show why Google doesn't score 1 out of 5 (far from it):
http://www.google.com/support/conversionuniversity/

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Another link to show why Google doesn't score 1 out of 5 (far from it):
http://www.google.com/support/conversionuniversity/

God, it was 4 days ago, let it go.

Steve

PS What you're linking to isn't even training for the qualification I was criticising. If they added that to the training, I'd probably be less critical.

 

[AdwordsPro]

Some more excellent resources from Google, helping you with ROI/conversions etc.
http://www.google.co.uk/intl/en/adtoolkit/learningcentre/

The training doesn't replace experience of course, and you need to do your own extensive experiments, but it's a useful addition and helps you to keep on top of the latest developments (Google never stands still!).