Anyone used People per hour?

I have applied for some jobs which I priced it at £25 per hour for say 10 hours work and people were bidding pennies, there is no way you could compete with it except for by leaving a good impression when the job is buggered up and they need somebody to do it properly :)

You are right. However, you will often find fellow British people under cutting you :) I can show you print screens where UK guys have always been cheapest as opposed to Indians from Indian (not UK nationals). I have actually lost money. And I nearly always chose the local guy.
 
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As a regular supplier on Elance and other similar sites, I can say this:

Elance provides the highest quality jobs of all of them

Yes, there will always be people bidding at ridiculous rates. Suppliers in low cost of living countries aren't actually the major problem, it's people who work for a hobby and don't need the money - people who have a working partner, or are retired, for example. Those two groups combined can drive prices down, but only if you let them.

I win plenty of work at much higher prices than the lowest bid because I am able to defend why I charge what I do. I'm not usually the most expensive, usually in the top 30%, but sometimes I have been the most expensive and still won.

In order to make money out of it, you have to differentiate between clients who value quality and those who just look at price. You can spot the latter a mile off after a while, they sit ridiculously low budgets and say things like "This will be a simple job for someone who knows what they're doing".

I think the key is this; I could write 100 SEO articles for $1 each, but how long would that take me, and what else could I do with that time? I have settled on what I feel my time is worth, and I don't even bid for anything below that, regardless of how good a 'fit' the project is.

I agree with what Smarter Webdesign says, I would caution a little tact though. I managed a project for a client and used Elance to find suppliers. One, who I didn't choose, then messaged me to say that the suppliers I'd chosen were bound to do a poor job for me and I should give her a call when I needed someone to do it properly. Cheek!!

Christopher
 
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Hi all, i'm new here. I just googled People per hour and found this thread interesting!

I've just started out on PPH as a graphic designer and like others have said it seems to be a waste of time. I'm spending valuable time bidding for projects at insulting prices so I have given up. I know my work is some of the best on there so I refuse to bid any lower than the highest price but you really can't compete with people under cutting you and promising the moon on a stick. People who post the projects are price driven anyway, that's why they go there instead of direct to a good freelancer or an agency. They should know though, like anything in life you get what you pay for!
 
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Seriously, try Elance instead. My top tips are:

Keep your prices where you want them

Write serious, thoughtful, relevant and detailed bids that demonstrate your professionalism

Have work samples on your profile and attached to each bid that showcase your expertise

I've won plenty of work where my bid was the highest, and I've also been told that the client wants to hire me, but could I reduce my rates, and I said no.

When you get to see other peoples' bids, it's worrying how many are a generic cut and paste, or say, "We have all the expertise you need for your project and we give you best price"

Some clients will always be bargain hunters and will under-value you if you let them. You can spot them with phrases like, "This should be a simple job for someone who knows what they're doing" or "I'd do this myself but I don't have the time".

They're like people who take their car into the garage and say, "I've taken the engine out and stripped down the cylinders, and all I need you to do now is change the broken bit and put it back together, it shouldn't take you long, I'll give you £5 for it"

Moon on a stick... haven't heard that in years. Made me smile.

Sell your services on quality and price them to reflect that.

Of course, if you're not very good then you're stuck, really. Or if your service is web design or SEO. That's an incredibly commoditised market, and very difficult to maintain prices in, unless you're offering some kind of packaged or managed service, and then you're quite right, people tend to go to agencies for that rather than Elance.

What is your service?
 
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Greetings all,

I am on the process of developing a site similiar to People Per Hour but the main difference is that the site is only for UK Businesses. The site will provide a UK Employment platform enabling businesses and startups to hire, find help, raise their profiles and attract new business only in the UK.

I would like to know whether there is a demand for a site specifically for the UK market and whether you would use it?
 
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yes, I have used people per hour and it has loads of UK people of good quality.

true, you'll get poor quality there as well, so you need to be careful
 
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RKM, to be honest, if I was a Dragon on Dragon's Den, I'd be out.

Because... If I only want to hire a UK provider, I can specify that on Elance, and if I just want the lowest cost then location isn't really a consideration.

Besides, you have quite a hill to climb in terms of marketing the thing.

Good luck, though.
 
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Proceed with caution!! I have used this site, got 26 quotes for a job worth twice/three times as much as it would normally cost great, RIGHT? I Went with a developer, not the cheapest but one who looked decent, when the going got tough he just looked at the bottom line of the job and gave up, 4 months late and still not finished! You pay for what you get, never agree to more than 1/3 up front and choose your sub-contractor well, insist on completion clauses and draw up contracts. Peopleperhour is good in the way that they keep all logs of all emails, and you can pass files such as contracts over their messages systems. Proceed with caution!
 
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Greetings all,

I am on the process of developing a site similiar to People Per Hour but the main difference is that the site is only for UK Businesses. The site will provide a UK Employment platform enabling businesses and startups to hire, find help, raise their profiles and attract new business only in the UK.

I would like to know whether there is a demand for a site specifically for the UK market and whether you would use it?


Quite possibly there is, although when i was looking for a developer tenders came in from people in the UK but they told me they would outsource to their company in India. So how are you going to police your platform? I think a "fair play policy" would be a great idea 2 or 3 disputes and your out kind of thing, weed out the cowboys- feedback is so important, people/companies cant do bad jobs and hide anymore! Good luck mate
 
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Elance seems to be getting good feedback, so perhaps that is the place to be.

I wonder though if there are any sites like this that will only accept UK suppliers because in some cases people still just want to buy British if only to eliminate communication problems. This would also avoid the problem UK providers have in competing on price with countries where their cost of living is so much lower. So if a site like this doesn't exist maybe it's time that one did!
 
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Just use a regular site and require the person to be in the UK. I'm sure some already let you specify "local only" for jobs where the person needs to be able to come on site, and you can just ignore applicants who aren't.
 
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I have had some really bad and good experiences on PPH. One guy Colin Jarvis from DSGN tried to get me to pay direct. And then he wanted more money. He was just stupid. He didn't realise how much money he could have made off me if he just did the work. I showed the evidence to PPH, and they said they were powerless to do anything even though I had it all record on email. The only power they have is a slap on the wrist.

I have also met some really good guys on there who work hard for their money and deliver.

Lesson for me, do everything via PPH.
 
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If you DID go direct, then it's probably against the T&Cs you agreed to because you are stopping them getting their cut.

That, said, I'd probably try to go direct once I found someone I could trust - use PPH for a short time to test people out.
 
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You are right. It is breaking their terms. I regretted going direct. It was my mistake as I was willing to go along with the freelancer in question.

As I said, I have found the best way to use PPH is on the record through their system. You do find some good people. But there are tons of dodgy ones as well.
 
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Here is a list I compiled to mainly Design categories. Elance (the posh one) is the best one for me. I made £400 for a simple Cartoon I did a while back. Apart from that I have had a certain amount of success on Freelancer.com and Scriptlance. I've been on PPH for a while and not a single bite yet.

http://toonoutlet.com/
http://www.freelancer.com/
http://www.t-shirtlogos.com/
http://jobs.designcrowd.com/ (Mainly Competition based)
http://www.guru.com/ (not free)
http://www.scriptlance.com/
http://www.greetingcarduniverse.com/ (Not free)
http://www.threadless.com/ (Competition)
http://www.swishswosh.com/ (Competition)
http://www.ifreelance.com/ (not free)
http://jobs.odesk.com/
http://www.peopleperhour.com/:|

I recently discovered http://www.jobrapido.co.uk/ which actually gives email alerts to most of these sites which is very handy.

Yes providing contact information is against protocol for most of these sites. That's why when a Project is awarded that is when these are disclosed. That is really the service they provide. Stands to reason really. That is why I have a contact info free website which serves as more of a Portfolio when bidding on Projects. (See signature)
 
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Apropos my last post as toward underpricing, PPH have dialogue boxes which give you instructions to make the most effective bid.

Bid description

A good bid is.......

Realistic- A sensibly priced bid will be more credible than one with the lowest price. To view data on Bids awarded, visit PPH Economy

Detailed- A bid which details your approach, deliverables and timelines will instil confidence in the Client about your ability to deliver the Job.

Tailored- A bid customised to Job requirements is more likely to be accepted than a generic or templated bid.

This kind of facility is not found on the other sites. I won't give up on PPH. I'm actually determined to crack it.:(
 
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I have used PPH a couple of times now for some artistic design work and to find an SEO provider. I'm extremely happy with the results. From the buyer's perspective it works well and you seem to get plenty of bids at very competetive prices.

But when I tried to find telemarketing people it failed completely. I guess the sort of people interested in that type of work don't look at a site which seems to be mostly populated with IT and creative types.
 
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The one thing that really gets my back up about these sites is that the Employers can just cancel a Job willy- nilly if they don't find an appropriate Provider. This doesn't instill much confidence in me when placing bids and I've learned not to hold my breath and yes Jobs that you feel you really can do are awarded to the Indian/ Asian so called Designers. I saw one project that actually stipulated that they wanted an Indian Provider. You should have seen the ensuing abuse he got.

As it's been said previously, don't pin all your hopes on these sites when starting out but what I can tell you is that there are people/ Companies that make a very tidy living from just a single site such as Freelancer.com thank you very much. There are them that have like 5000 odd reviews and the like (God I hate them). I've got about 2 or three on the odd one so far. That's what it's all about. *Building a reputation. Every project you do is reviewed on completion. This works both ways. Both the Employer and the Provider have to give reviews on the quality of the brief and their communication skills and of course, speed. Not just the Artwork. Everything goes on record so you have to keep your nose clean if not perfect. I'm obviously talking from a Designer's angle of these sites and wouldn't know how it works for White Van Man but I would imagine the principle is the same.

It actually stands to reason. If I were an Employer I would be attracted by the fact that such a Provider has a good clean record. That is really the reinsurance that they are looking for. That is the gen behind this crack as far as I can see instead of just googling "Logo Designer" and taking on random chancers that are going to charge you an arm and a leg.

*Rome wasn't built in a Day and all that.
 
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Hi Scootex, sorry to hear about Colin Jarvis, do you have a Job ID for this so we can investigate?

Also, Funny Business Cartoons, anything you think we could do to make us a bit more 'posh' and get more interest?

Thanks

Jonathan, PeoplePerHour Community Manager
 
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I have had some experience using this site. To be honest, it is really aimed at getting freelancers, rather than permanent staff, to complete shorter projects. The only real issue that I have had is that freelancers that are not adequately qualified to take on my project ended up attempting it and failing. This wastes a lot of time. The credentials of these freelancers can be questionable and they seem eager to take on projects beyond their experience.

Just be aware of this and you should be fine :)
 
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Hi Neky, sorry to hear this. If you email our help team and say that you spoke to me on the forum, or if you link to your PPH profile so we can contact you, then we can match you up with appropriate freelancers to save you time.

Jonathan
 
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Hi Scootex, sorry to hear about Colin Jarvis, do you have a Job ID for this so we can investigate?

Also, Funny Business Cartoons, anything you think we could do to make us a bit more 'posh' and get more interest?

Thanks

Jonathan, PeoplePerHour Community Manager

No when I say posh, I mean it is affiliated with Elance University after all and yes you do have to pass an exam to complete Registration and all that. But I wouldn't go that far if I were you. All that the so- called Exam entails is to make sure you have an understanding about how the system works. But they give you all the answers and you can refer to them and do it in your own time plus you get 5 chances. It's not Rocket Science. Having said that, I failed 5 times and then had to register with a new email (I know, cheeky 'ey?) and passed first time.

You seem to have a big demand for Childrens' Book Illustration on there and it is a huge Market. I may just pursue this Avenue. Yes I do have a suggestion for what it's worth. Your Portfolio facility is a bit drab. Only 10 pics allowed for free Members? That's a bit tight.
 
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Thanks FBC, interesting system on eLance.

How many pictures would you like to see on the portfolio?

Jonathan
 
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I used to be a Designer on that site but left because of the silly prices designers from India bid on projects - there's no way anyone in the UK can match their prices..wouldn't say so much about the quality though..
 
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Unlimited as they do on Elance and possibly a better way of presenting them such a slideshow? It's not an absolute criteria but just a suggestion and who the hell am I anyway? Any potential Employer can see at a glance from a website (contact info- free obviously or is that not a big issue with you I'm not entirely sure) if they are interested. If I were to get very picky and here's something you can tell your techies....The link to your site on the bids is not an active blue link like you can do on Scriptlance in PM's. Scriptlance is the only one I know of that you can do this instead of the prospective Employer having to copy and paste it into their browser. This would be very beneficial and sustain more interest in my mind.
 
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We use ODesk- and had our blog done by a provider on here.

It cost us something like £130 altogether, looks pretty good too.
 
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Has anybody used this http://www.peopleperhour.com/index.php? From what I gather you place a bid for the total you would charge. The customer pays the site and when the project is complete they take 10% and pass the rest on to you. I'm thinking of giving it a go as it's free to register. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of it.

Taking back on what we have said, we have gained some great clients from this outlet however all bids are unrealistic and PPH is considered a 'cheaper option'
 
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Oh Dear, what a shame:(

elance-logo.jpg

Dear FunnyBusiness, Thank you for submitting a proposal for: "Logo/illustration". Unfortunately, the client has declined your proposal for the following reason:
Project Name: Logo/illustration
Client Reason: Bid is too high

We value your business and the services you provide through Elance. To view other open jobs, click here.

Sincerely,
Elance
https://www.elance.com
 
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Hi Scootex, sorry to hear about Colin Jarvis, do you have a Job ID for this so we can investigate?

Also, Funny Business Cartoons, anything you think we could do to make us a bit more 'posh' and get more interest?

Thanks

Jonathan, PeoplePerHour Community Manager

Yes!!

I have a freelance artists forum and what NONE of the freelancer sites provide is an affiliate program that has a code that allows a member to add a list of the jobs related to the website they are placed on. So if you could do this you would have an advantage.

I for example am looking for a widget type thing that updates with new jobs daily in the area of art and design. I want to place it in the job section of my forum so members can check in daily to see that jobs are available.

If you can get one, I'll have it!
 
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I am a client of PPH. I am very disappointed with the site so far.
16th November 2011, 10:31
The issue that I have had is that the freelancer was not not adequately qualified to take on my project ended up attempting it and failing. This wastes a lot of time. The credentials of the freelancers can be questionable to say the least and they seem eager to take on projects beyond their experience.

This is now in dispute. I have spent countless hours and emails trying to resolve this situation with the freelancer. The dispute process seemed to be the answer in the beginning, now having waited 2 weeks for an answer from PPH they are now saying.....

Due to to complexity and the money involved we would like to put this to our external jury for a resolution.
There is a cost equal to 20% of the funds held in Escrow but the decision is made by a 'jury' of at least 6 people who will study all documentation and messages and vote on the resolution. The majority verdict will be the resolution offered.
Please advise if this is the way you would like this to proceed and we will pass the information to our jury.

They are asking for 50% of the fee in question before mediation. This is far from a complex case. Yet PPH will receive £400 to mediate! This sounds like a good way for them to make money out of this process which is not mentioned in their dispute policy.
 
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For Disappointed - My advice is to seek advice about going through the small claims court. You can set up a small claim for about £40+. Definitely a better option than coughing up £400 for it to be reviewed by an 'independent' (yeah right) panel.
 
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Hi Disappointed,

That seems from what you say as unrealistic. And I would be wanting ALL the money back if judgement goes your way.
I can only assume that the freelancer is saying something different to what you say.

But having someone overstate what they can do is a real pain.
Its also happened to me and left me out of pocket and way behind schedule

Thanks for the warning.
I have used dotsqare.com and they do seem to be able to do what you want. I have only once had an issue and they got onto resolving that asap.
 
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It doesn't sound unrealistic to me.

6 people x 2 hours x £50/hour = £600

I don't think you've quite grasped the situation......None of this is mentioned in their terms and conditions. Nothing about a "Jury "of 6 people. I don't think this needs 6 people to sort out at my expense only. It is not 20% of the fee in question, but of the amount of my money in escrow.
 
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For Disappointed - My advice is to seek advice about going through the small claims court. You can set up a small claim for about £40+. Definitely a better option than coughing up £400 for it to be reviewed by an 'independent' (yeah right) panel.

I can't go to the small claims court because PPH has my money in Escrow and I have to deal with this dispute through them only.
 
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