Your Online Shop Sucks!

[The Byre]

I normally buy either from Amazon (seldom) or eBay (several times a week). I also buy from wholesalers if their online shop is sensible - but most are not!

Today I wanted to buy a book from some pea-brained company called On-Buy. I could not!

They had the book. I have the money. I have all the usual methods of payment - credit card, debit card, PayPal acc., etc.

• Step One - they want my email address. In she goes!
• Step Two - Enter your mobile number. I have zero idea what my mobile number is and even if I did know it, I am certainly not going to give it out to some damn online shop. It's private and if someone wants me urgently, they can be patched through from the office. Landline only and no texting. End of story.
• Step Three - Name and postcode. I enter my name and code.
• Step Four - Pick an address. Our address is just not there in whatever half-baked database they were using. There is a collection of daft names that people give their houses, all that stupid 'Mon Repos' and 'The Larches' drivel, but no numbers - and many of the silly names that are there, have been changed! We are officially 18/24, though 18 will find us. The number 18 is announced in large numerals at the end of our driveway, together with the name of the company. Buildings have numbers so that if they get run away and get lost, they can be returned to their owners. That's all you need.

With no mobile number and unable to enter any address and with no option to enter stuff manually, the basket remains 'hung' or 'orphaned' until such time as it times-out or gets closed manually.

The thing is, I bet they paid good money for that crap design. A design that probably losses them sales each and every day.

So here's the skinny -

• You certainly are not going to get my mobile number!
• If you must use one of those half-baked address databases, put in an option to enter the correct address by hand. None of them are even close to being accurate!
• Take a leaf out of eBay's book. Buy item. Pay for item. End of story. Job done!

I am now going to get a barrage of comments, telling me that it is not that simple because - and there will then follow all kinds of feeble excuses, such as 'We get too many wrong addresses.' and 'We need to text the customer.'

You also will never be able to text me as my phone is always switched off unless I am away for more than a day.

The book is available on eBay and Amazon, I stick to one of those!

 

[Mark T Jones]

But you mustn't use Amazon & EBay because they don't pay taxes, because they can afford good advice.

Whereas we are a small, independent business - we don't pay taxes because we haven't worked out how to make money.

 

[UKSBD]

I bought something from another site (rather than Amazon, SCAN or AO.com) for the 1st time in about 3 years the other week.

2 days after ordering it I got an email saying it was out of stock and would be about 5 days.
Over a week later they arrived, 4 of the same thing instead of 2 of each size.

I emailed them back, with photo showing the dispatch note and wrong products.

3 days later they replied, apologising and said they would send out replacements ASP.

Went on to Amazon, found similar (cheaper) ordered them and they were with me next day.

Just checked my Amazon orders and I've bought 64 items in last 15 months with not a single problem, bought 1 thing from another website - 1 problem

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Step Two - Enter your mobile number. I have zero idea what my mobile number is and even if I did know it, I am certainly not going to give it out to some damn online shop. It's private and if someone wants me urgently, they can be patched through from the office. Landline only and no texting. End of story.

Surprising how many people don't understand that my mobile phone is for ME to make calls and not for random people to call me.

 

[Mr D]

I sell on OnBuy.
Fair few sales overall. I just do not buy there. The stuff I am after is not available through the site.

Judging by their growth a lot of buyers will provide the details requested. Come to think of it probably 90 percent of the sites I register with to buy from or to use their services ask exactly the questions the OP was asked.
And more.

Every one of my suppliers asks at least those questions.

Is it a problem for the retailers or for the particular customer?

 

[The Byre]

But you mustn't use Amazon & EBay because they don't pay taxes, because they can afford good advice.
Whereas we are a small, independent business - we don't pay taxes because we haven't worked out how to make money.

I am a small company and I use two accountancy practices (UK and Germany) that both have a veritable army of specialists, plus I have other resources I can draw upon and if I didn't know something about how to minimise taxes in one or the other country, I would ask someone (e.g. here!) and above all - LISTEN!

The only financial difference between a well-run business with an online shop that works and a chaotic business with an online shop that asks for a mobile number and works only from an out-of-date database is sales.

 

[Paul Carmen]

@The Byre some good points here, as one size doesn't fit all. However, the main difference for many people is they've already saved this data with Amazon/eBay, which is often why it feels much less painful...

Amazon use postcode/address lookup when creating an account or adding a new address too. They use the Royal Mail database in the UK and any site worth its salt should use this too. It massively improves conversion on mobiles by not making customers type all their details (it's poor not letting you manually enter it though), although some B2C businesses will take the view that the delivery errors & cost/fraud element may offset the lost sales if they can't verify an address.

Almost all sites require/need a phone number for shipping/delivery purposes, or won't let you check out/sign up (it shouldn't force it to be mobile), and there should be a guest quick checkout to maximise conversion too.

The problem going forward is mobile phone 2 factor authorisation is either coming, or exists in a non mandatory state already on many sites (at least for card/PayPal fraud checks on many sites payments). Many sites are already asking for mobiles as a 2 factor authentication, as it reduces fraud and makes it easier to reset passwords. eBay have started this, although you can chose to ignore it currently.

 

[Fagin2021]

Many companies - big and small - have a 'Sales Prevention Department' - might be people, might be a website, might be a process. Sometimes they're surprisingly difficult to identify.

When information is asked for that isn't essential for order processing or delivery it should be optional.

 

[Pish_Pash]

I have a website & sell stuff ... I configured it in such a way that meets my needs as an online buyer...I don't make anyone add their phone number because that absolutely screams "SPAM PHONE CALLS"....I want to checkout to be as frictionless as possible...a 'guest' visitor paying with Paypal - BOOM, slam dunk.

It has no bells or whistles (this impacts page load times) ...basically see a product, add it to your basket & get the hell checked out/paid.

 

[Mr D]

I have a website & sell stuff ... I configured it in such a way that meets my needs as an online buyer...I don't make anyone add their phone number because that absolutely screams "SPAM PHONE CALLS"....I want to checkout to be as frictionless as possible...a 'guest' visitor paying with Paypal - BOOM, slam dunk.

It has no bells or whistles (this impacts page load times) ...basically see a product, add it to your basket & get the hell checked out/paid.

I'm in a village, we often get calls from delivery drivers who are lost trying to find the house. Can be driving around an estate over a mile away. Without a phone number I'd have had delayed or missing parcels a lot more.


Must say I've not had spam phone calls except from food delivery companies - and can't really complain about them even as I did give my number and the number one sales technique I learnt decades ago is follow up the contact.
Worked for me for years - still works for me in business now.

 

[Pish_Pash]

I'm in a village, we often get calls from delivery drivers who are lost trying to find the house. Can be driving around an estate over a mile away. Without a phone number I'd have had delayed or missing parcels a lot more.

Must say I've not had spam phone calls except from food delivery companies - and can't really complain about them even as I did give my number and the number one sales technique I learnt decades ago is follow up the contact.
Worked for me for years - still works for me in business now.

I always give the delivery drivers my number (where the customer hasn't provided it)....so I have a good handle on how many drivers aren't able to find their target ...I get zilch phone calls.

The thing about customers providing a phone number & being worried about spam calls ...it's perhaps the perception (perhaps not the reality - I don't use their numbers for anything other than contact about their order, nor would I ever sell them on)...but if I think any customer will be the slightest bit hesitant to give me his/her shekels whilst checking out, I don't force him/her to do it.

 

[Mr D]

I always give the delivery drivers my number (where the customer hasn't provided it)....so I have a good handle on how many drivers aren't able to find their target ...I get zilch phone calls.

The thing about customers providing a phone number & being worried about spam calls ...it's perhaps the perception (perhaps not the reality - I don't use their numbers for anything other than contact about their order, nor would I ever sell them on)...but if I think any customer will be the slightest bit hesitant to give me his/her shekels whilst checking out, I don't force him/her to do it.

I live on a road off a road - I put delivery instructions in paperwork and still get drivers looking for a place that does not exist or even heading out of the village as cannot find us in it.

The village has multiple groups of houses that are hard to find.
Or the house can be found but not the entrance.

Wonderful world of town planning.

However a phone call when there are problems, when delayed or even when early....
Can be pretty handy.

And as a business having a customer phone number can prevent a problem escalating.

 

[MBE2017]

I have three Amazon accounts, my private one for personal purchases lists 273 orders during 2020, 83 this year so far.

Not a single problem bar one breakage, replaced for next day. People can learn a lot from Amazons incredible service levels, and I rarely check prices, since speed, stocks and reliability are the most important factors to myself, all the things lacking elsewhere.

 

[SillyBill]

Amazon Business is insanely good as a service. Now we buy a lot of our business "consumables" on it. I made the unusual mistake recently of ordering an item we buy a lot of (from Amazon typically) from another online retailer to save a few pennies. Later that day, e-mailed...card payment refunded as they didn't have the stock. So I found another site selling the same product at a similar price (cheaper than Amazon). Order confirmed. Doesn't turn up. 3 days later e-mail arrives they don't have stock, would I like to change the pack size or get a refund. Straight onto Amazon, with us next day. I very rarely get tempted by a cheaper price elsewhere and this was a good reminder as to why I don't. I am often glad I am not an online retailer because as a simpleton I sometimes look at Amazon and think its scary how good they are for any other to compete. They have almost solved every problem, nailed the brief so spectacularly it takes some thought to contemplate what big gains are left or others to differentiate with. Other than them helicoptering the products to me within 2 hours (which they are spending millions on developing) it can't actually get much better. Wouldn't surprise me if they working on teleporting the products too.

 

[UKSBD]

People can learn a lot from Amazons incredible service levels, and I rarely check prices, since speed, stocks and reliability are the most important factors to myself

I'm the same.
I even tick the Prime box, even though I know it may be more expensive.

 

[UKSBD]

Amazon Business is insanely good as a service.

Although I've been buying on Amazon for years, I didn't really know about Amazon business until last year, I still haven't joined as a business but have earned £400 from their bounty program

 

[SillyBill]

Although I've been buying on Amazon for years, I didn't really know about Amazon business until last year, I still haven't joined as a business but have earned £400 from their bounty program

Its great. And most importantly it means I don't have my accounts lady chasing me for an invoice for a pencil sharpener or any other enquiry. Another reason to do more odds and ends through Amazon so I don't have a thousand receipts to reconcile with accounts/credit card statement. Give everyone the access/permissions they need and Amazon, as per anything else, makes it piss easy for everyone. One of the best investments we make in a calendar year, without doubt. Discounts are nice too.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

When the interwebby was in it's infancy it was good for finding smaller more helpful suppliers that you could talk to. In the name of progress the top tier websites became dominated by bigger companies and then Amazon walked in and now dominates every product search.

I can happily say that Jeff Bezos' Amazon has only taken a few shillings off me at times of extreme emergency via orders placed by my daughter through her account. Other than that I won't use it.

Don't get the problem giving out a phone number? Having been at the sharp end of next day delivery in the early days of mobile phones, a number on the parcel allowed a quick phone call to ensure the customer was in and going 10 miles off route was worth it. Now I feel it's a benefit for my customers to be contactable for exactly the same reason.

 

[japancool]

Reading this thread makes you wonder why anyone else bothers.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

For anyone uneasy about giving their mobile number, Ofcom publish a range of numbers that can be used in TV programs and such.

For mobiles: 07700 900000 to 900999

Other numbers: https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-tel...tion-for-industry/numbering/numbers-for-drama

 

[Deleted member 335660]

I normally buy either from Amazon (seldom) or eBay (several times a week). I also buy from wholesalers if their online shop is sensible - but most are not!

Today I wanted to buy a book from some pea-brained company called On-Buy. I could not!

They had the book. I have the money. I have all the usual methods of payment - credit card, debit card, PayPal acc., etc.

• Step One - they want my email address. In she goes!
• Step Two - Enter your mobile number. I have zero idea what my mobile number is and even if I did know it, I am certainly not going to give it out to some damn online shop. It's private and if someone wants me urgently, they can be patched through from the office. Landline only and no texting. End of story.
• Step Three - Name and postcode. I enter my name and code.
• Step Four - Pick an address. Our address is just not there in whatever half-baked database they were using. There is a collection of daft names that people give their houses, all that stupid 'Mon Repos' and 'The Larches' drivel, but no numbers - and many of the silly names that are there, have been changed! We are officially 18/24, though 18 will find us. The number 18 is announced in large numerals at the end of our driveway, together with the name of the company. Buildings have numbers so that if they get run away and get lost, they can be returned to their owners. That's all you need.

With no mobile number and unable to enter any address and with no option to enter stuff manually, the basket remains 'hung' or 'orphaned' until such time as it times-out or gets closed manually.

The thing is, I bet they paid good money for that crap design. A design that probably losses them sales each and every day.

So here's the skinny -

• You certainly are not going to get my mobile number!
• If you must use one of those half-baked address databases, put in an option to enter the correct address by hand. None of them are even close to being accurate!
• Take a leaf out of eBay's book. Buy item. Pay for item. End of story. Job done!

I am now going to get a barrage of comments, telling me that it is not that simple because - and there will then follow all kinds of feeble excuses, such as 'We get too many wrong addresses.' and 'We need to text the customer.'

You also will never be able to text me as my phone is always switched off unless I am away for more than a day.

The book is available on eBay and Amazon, I stick to one of those!

Yes no excuses on addresses etc. we use woocommerce and it’s generally good.

Ironically I just put a notice on our website to let people know that we need their mobile and email address for courier tracking so you see that is the problem. In fact with Brexit this has become more important as U.K. wants its import tax.

 

[MBE2017]

In fact with Brexit this has become more important as U.K. wants its import tax.

The EU does not though?

 

[Mr D]

Reading this thread makes you wonder why anyone else bothers.

Because there is money to be made.

Can even make it on Amazon with them buying from the same suppliers.

 

[The Byre]

I just put a notice on our website to let people know that we need their mobile and email address for courier tracking so you see that is the problem.

So how do you sell to someone like me who has no idea what their mobile number is? Come to think of it, I don't even know where the damn thing is!

Many people do not have a mobile.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

Ironically I just put a notice on our website to let people know that we need their mobile and email address for courier tracking so you see that is the problem.

Does the customer have to give you a mobile number, do you also ask if he/she has a discount code and wants to sign up to your newsletter?

I think a lot of the problem is online retailers relying on the default settings of whatever system the are using without realising how many hurdles they are leaving in place?

 

[Deleted member 59730]

So how do you sell to someone like me who has no idea what their mobile number is? Come to think of it, I don't even know where the damn thing is!

Many people do not have a mobile.

I know where my mobile is. Its in the car in case of emergencies. My landline is sitting on my desk. My landline gets answered. my mobile does not.

 

[Mr D]

So how do you sell to someone like me who has no idea what their mobile number is? Come to think of it, I don't even know where the damn thing is!

Many people do not have a mobile.

I don't know what my mobile number is.
So I look it up.

Takes seconds.

Yes, lots of people don't have mobile phones. They do have access to a phone.

 

[Guy Incognito]

We ask for a contact number - doesn't have to be mobile. It's for the courier to be able to contact if needed, as all of our deliveries are oversize and require someone to be at home.

We will be moving to a postcode lookup system soon as incorrectly entered addresses causes dispatch issues, but there will be the option to override / edit.

 

[Aniela]

I normally buy either from Amazon (seldom) or eBay (several times a week). I also buy from wholesalers if their online shop is sensible - but most are not!

Today I wanted to buy a book from some pea-brained company called On-Buy. I could not!

They had the book. I have the money. I have all the usual methods of payment - credit card, debit card, PayPal acc., etc.

• Step One - they want my email address. In she goes!
• Step Two - Enter your mobile number. I have zero idea what my mobile number is and even if I did know it, I am certainly not going to give it out to some damn online shop. It's private and if someone wants me urgently, they can be patched through from the office. Landline only and no texting. End of story.
• Step Three - Name and postcode. I enter my name and code.
• Step Four - Pick an address. Our address is just not there in whatever half-baked database they were using. There is a collection of daft names that people give their houses, all that stupid 'Mon Repos' and 'The Larches' drivel, but no numbers - and many of the silly names that are there, have been changed! We are officially 18/24, though 18 will find us. The number 18 is announced in large numerals at the end of our driveway, together with the name of the company. Buildings have numbers so that if they get run away and get lost, they can be returned to their owners. That's all you need.

With no mobile number and unable to enter any address and with no option to enter stuff manually, the basket remains 'hung' or 'orphaned' until such time as it times-out or gets closed manually.

The thing is, I bet they paid good money for that crap design. A design that probably losses them sales each and every day.

So here's the skinny -

• You certainly are not going to get my mobile number!
• If you must use one of those half-baked address databases, put in an option to enter the correct address by hand. None of them are even close to being accurate!
• Take a leaf out of eBay's book. Buy item. Pay for item. End of story. Job done!

I am now going to get a barrage of comments, telling me that it is not that simple because - and there will then follow all kinds of feeble excuses, such as 'We get too many wrong addresses.' and 'We need to text the customer.'

You also will never be able to text me as my phone is always switched off unless I am away for more than a day.

The book is available on eBay and Amazon, I stick to one of those!

With no offensive due, this to more of a 'you' problem and a generational problem with 'not being with the times', although I can understand where you're coming from.

It's kind of like the older generation not understanding banking on your phone. Okay, it's not good if you're not used to phones etc but that is what the modern/current/upcoming generations use and that is the new norm. You can't always go on facilitating the older generations forever.

1) Only the 'older generation' care about giving out their phone number.

2) The modern/current/upcoming generations all know their mobile numbers off by heart or can get it on their phone in about 10 seconds.

3) The address thing is not even an issue. They do let you enter an address manually. You just didn't see it.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

With no offensive due, this to more of a 'you' problem and a generational problem with 'not being with the times', although I can understand where you're coming from.

Since the 'older generation' spend far more money than any other demographic, it's actually the retailer's problem.

 

[Aniela]

Since the 'older generation' spend far more money than any other demographic, it's actually the retailer's problem.

The 'new' old generation will be replacing them extremely soon, so that doesn't apply.

You can't always cater for the last generation that will not apply for much longer. Same reasons physical banks are dying. Everyone banks on their phone now.

A lot of the older generation (present older generation) don't even know how to use a debit/credit card, some can barely even understand the whole 'put your card and pin in' system. Do you see Amazon accepting payments via cheques for those types of people? Nope.

You can't cater for the last of the 'old generation' forever. Things change and move on.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

The 'new' old generation will be replacing them extremely soon, so that doesn't apply.

Good news for failing retailers then, don't bother trying to adapt to all demographics, just hang on a couple of decades.

 

[Aniela]

Good news for failing retailers then, don't bother trying to adapt to all demographics, just hang on a couple of decades.

Think you're misunderstanding what is being said.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

You can't always cater for the last generation that will not apply for much longer. Same reasons physical banks are dying. Everyone banks on their phone now.

No they don't and therein lies the problem. Because some of the younger generation are trying to design the world to fit mobile devices does not mean they really know what is needed. A few years ago I was talking to a web developer about a particular feature I needed on a website. "What's an invoice?" he asked. There is a reason why current systems have lasted for so many years, they work.

And the request for a mobile number can be solved by changing the name to "contact number".

(And one of my pet hates. Why did my HiFi switch get called a Function switch instead of an On switch when it is the only switch which does not have a function?)

 

[Darren_Ssc]

Think you're misunderstanding what is being said.

That happens a lot, I think it's age related?

 

[Aniela]

No they don't and therein lies the problem. Because some of the younger generation are trying to design the world to fit mobile devices does not mean they really know what is needed. A few years ago I was talking to a web developer about a particular feature I needed on a website. "What's an invoice?" he asked. There is a reason why current systems have lasted for so many years, they work.

And the request for a mobile number can be solved by changing the name to "contact number".

(And one of my pet hates. Why did my HiFi switch get called a Function switch instead of an On switch when it is the only switch which does not have a function?)

I guess you're of the older generation that I'm talking about.

Bet you have a heart attack at the thought of 2FA and contactless payments.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

I guess you're of the older generation that I'm talking about.

Bet you have a heart attack at the thought of 2FA and contactless payments.

2fa patented in 1998 by AT&T
Contactless payment first used in Mobil gas stations in 1997

You kids have taken a while to catch up.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Bet you have a heart attack at the thought of 2FA and contactless payments.

I have used cash once in the past 6 months. I avoid 2FA because I cannot see the need. It doesn't seem logical.

 

[Aniela]

2fa patented in 1998 by AT&T
Contactless payment first used in Mobil gas stations in 1997

You kids have taken a while to catch up.

Not quite the same as they are now, are they.

That's like saying "Electronic cars? Pfft. We've had cars since 1886. Catch up kids."

 

[Darren_Ssc]

dupe