Why are managers not recruiting 16 - 24 year olds?

internetspaceships

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It is CLEAR that if you are hiring the wrong candidates who are up to no good, you are simply not making the right reqruitment choices and there are flaws that need adressing personally. Hiring the latter is your fault, nobody elses. There is plenty, enterprising young talent out there gasping for one single chance.

Maybe you should have read my first post on this thread? I'm one of the ones hiring people in this age group.

Post number 9, first page. Just to be clear of course.
 
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14Steve14

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[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Whilst the main problem may be the young person, some blame must fall on ignorant employers. My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV, and also writes a full covering letter or email with every application. She checks with her mother and alters any letters accordingly. What is most annoying is employers that do not even confirm any type of receipt of receiving what ever she sends. Emails are free to send so why not just say that the job has been taken, or she is not suitable. She has applied for many jobs, and of the 40 odd applications, has only had a few interviews and even fewer acknowledgment of any letters or emails sent. I must add that she has passed one college course with a distiction, and is currently at college studying ICT, so any work she applied for was only part time. It is starting to get her down, and she cant see why she should apply if she never gets any feedback. I suppose that is part of the viscous circle she is in.[/FONT]
 
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10032012

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Each time we have had to replace workers we have had 10-15 applicants from the job center and about half don't even turn up for the interview, the rest won't pay for their CRB (even though it is refunded after 4 months) I accept maybe one or 2 of them couldn't find the money to pay but surely if they really wanted to work they could borrow it from someone until their 1st pay packet..

CRB for a kitchen job?
 
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internetspaceships

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[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Whilst the main problem may be the young person, some blame must fall on ignorant employers. My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV, and also writes a full covering letter or email with every application. She checks with her mother and alters any letters accordingly. What is most annoying is employers that do not even confirm any type of receipt of receiving what ever she sends.

Possibly the professionally written CV could put employers off? I prefer to see a CV that says something about the candidate as opposed to the stock phrases that seem to be the norm these days.
 
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cjd

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    Just thinking exactly the same.

    Professionally produced CVs are utterly useless, they've been massaged to death. Any interviewer wants to know the character of the applicant, not read the verabge produced by the CV spin doctors.
     
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    10032012

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    Just thinking exactly the same.

    Professionally produced CVs are utterly useless, they've been massaged to death. Any interviewer wants to know the character of the applicant, not read the verabge produced by the CV spin doctors.
    This is why I do not issue job descriptions when advertising a vacancy.

    These days too many jobseekers copy and paste the job description into their CVs. (A step further from the using the job advert to write the covering letter) Then you got the lower standard jobseekers who send in a poor CV in the first place. You can't win it seems.
     
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    [FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Whilst the main problem may be the young person, some blame must fall on ignorant employers. My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV, and also writes a full covering letter or email with every application. She checks with her mother and alters any letters accordingly. What is most annoying is employers that do not even confirm any type of receipt of receiving what ever she sends. Emails are free to send so why not just say that the job has been taken, or she is not suitable. She has applied for many jobs, and of the 40 odd applications, has only had a few interviews and even fewer acknowledgment of any letters or emails sent. I must add that she has passed one college course with a distiction, and is currently at college studying ICT, so any work she applied for was only part time. It is starting to get her down, and she cant see why she should apply if she never gets any feedback. I suppose that is part of the viscous circle she is in.[/FONT]


    That sort of attitude from employers is by no means restricted to the young. I was made redundant in 2007 in my mid 50s and I found the same scenario.

    I put it down to the prospective employer having HR staff with no manners!
     
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    That sort of attitude from employers is by no means restricted to the young. I was made redundant in 2007 in my mid 50s and I found the same scenario.

    I put it down to the prospective employer having HR staff with no manners!

    Its a buyers market.... you shouldn't expect replies back unless you are being invited for an interview. When people are getting 100's of applications they aren't going to bother replying to everything. Moreso when at least half of them don't pass the 10 second test and are immediately delivered to the bin.
     
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    Fred_the_frog

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    [FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Whilst the main problem may be the young person, some blame must fall on ignorant employers. My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV, and also writes a full covering letter or email with every application. She checks with her mother and alters any letters accordingly. What is most annoying is employers that do not even confirm any type of receipt of receiving what ever she sends. Emails are free to send so why not just say that the job has been taken, or she is not suitable. She has applied for many jobs, and of the 40 odd applications, has only had a few interviews and even fewer acknowledgment of any letters or emails sent. I must add that she has passed one college course with a distiction, and is currently at college studying ICT, so any work she applied for was only part time. It is starting to get her down, and she cant see why she should apply if she never gets any feedback. I suppose that is part of the viscous circle she is in.[/FONT]

    Her college should provide her with work experience. Get her to find out about that, it could be a potential way in if she performs well in the work experience.
     
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    JandJC

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    [FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Whilst the main problem may be the young person, some blame must fall on ignorant employers. My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV, and also writes a full covering letter or email with every application. She checks with her mother and alters any letters accordingly. What is most annoying is employers that do not even confirm any type of receipt of receiving what ever she sends. Emails are free to send so why not just say that the job has been taken, or she is not suitable. She has applied for many jobs, and of the 40 odd applications, has only had a few interviews and even fewer acknowledgment of any letters or emails sent. I must add that she has passed one college course with a distiction, and is currently at college studying ICT, so any work she applied for was only part time. It is starting to get her down, and she cant see why she should apply if she never gets any feedback. I suppose that is part of the viscous circle she is in.[/FONT]

    If I was your daughter I'd contact the agency or potential employer within 48 hours of sending my CV and firstly introduce myself and the reason for my phone call...and then try and obtain feedback...Potential employers or at least the recruitment agent will observe that your daughter is a candidate who is really interested in the roles advertised (not saying she isn't). It just gives her the opportunity of selling herself and at least she can then obtain some justification of not making it to the interview stage - using this constructive criticism will also be a benefit as she will know what she has to do!

    Hope that helps?
     
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    I would have to agree with the above comment. Get your daughter to contact the company that she has applied to as this may well get them to take a second look at your daughters CV.

    When I was a store manager I received a lot of CV's for jobs I was advertising and unfortunately which I found out at a later date let a lot of quality people slip through the net. If a prospective employee had contacted me after sending their Cv in I would definitely have given it a second look as their name would stick in my mind as somebody who definitely was looking to be employed by me.
     
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    you shouldn't expect replies back unless you are being invited for an interview.



    Whilst that is obviously true, it's also a damning indictment of how good manners have disappeared during the last 40 years. Let's be honest, if someone takes the trouble to apply for a job with a company, to just totally ignore them is downright rude.

    Maybe I'm getting old though. :|
     
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    Whilst that is obviously true, it's also a damning indictment of how good manners have disappeared during the last 40 years. Let's be honest, if someone takes the trouble to apply for a job with a company, to just totally ignore them is downright rude.

    Maybe I'm getting old though. :|


    Who does it help to send out 1 line letters or emails saying 'application received' though? If the job advert clearly says you'll only be contacted if successful then everyone knows where they stand... I don't see it being rude at all but efficient.

    Its definitely not helped with the quality of applications from people who 'takes the trouble to apply' - most of them are clearly just scattergun approaches of the exact same cover letter and CV sent absolutely everywhere. And a high proportion of these fail my 10 second rule.... if someone can't be bothered to spell check a cover letter before sending it then I can't be bothered writing back to them to confirm receipt of it :)
     
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    KC12

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    Sorry if this a little ranty, I'm trying to impart information that you may find relevant, but this a rather emotional subject for me.

    Who does it help to send out 1 line letters or emails saying 'application received' though? If the job advert clearly says you'll only be contacted if successful then everyone knows where they stand..

    I missed an interview because HR had a technical error with their computer system. Since the advert stated you'd only be contacted within x weeks if successful, I assumed I was not. As an internal candidate they at least called to ask why I hadn't gone for interview. They did actually interview me after, but it seemed very stitched up, and if I hadn't already worked there, or HR hadn't spotted their error..

    At least if you e-mail everyone, the candidates know where they stand, and know if there is a problem.

    As for the young people being hired, I think part of the problem is it is hard to sort the wheat from the chaff. Middle age people are likely to have experience, unless they have been on benefits all their life(some may have).

    Younger people, don't. A degree or college use to be a way to show you turned up on time, put in more than you had to, developed yourself etc, but targets means uni now bend over backwards to accommodate people who don't turn up. It used to be volunteering, but now there in short supply, and particularly difficult to get if your unemployed, as the organizations are worried people will leave after getting a job. Difficult to use tutors if looking for a job outside of term time.

    When claiming JSA I went to a training course 5 days 9-3, most of the skills were covered in college(could be useful for school leavers and one or two things were helpful) ,uni careers services anyway. There weren't enough computers for job searching,I kept thinking the reference at the end will solve my problem.

    Out of 20 people on the course only 2 showed up every day all day. One guy went to the pub across the road at lunch on the 1st day and never came back until the afternoon of the last day! I wonder if that is representative sample of JSA claimants as a whole?

    Great the other guy and I thought, our references from this course will set us apart from the crowd. Ah but the course organizers are paid for each successful outcome aren't they? At the end of the week, we were all given identical references, (6 months later when I was changing job the email and phone no longer worked!, So I had to get an additional reference! Luckily I was changing jobs just before the xmas school hols.) printed from the computer with the name changed. No wonder that guy had come back, he had been on one before and knew how to get the same out of it as me.

    Every day I was 5 min early, I wore a suit, I worked hard, I was always back from lunch on time, eager to learn, to please. Yet I got nothing to distinguish me from someone who could only be ars** to turn up twice in a week! How will the employer know which to pick? No wonder they go for older people
     
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    10032012

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    KC12: don't take it too personal. The references are temporary short-term templates (as you mentioned) to give the jobseeker a reason to jump through the jobcentre's hoops so they (the provider) can get a job outcome payment if you secure a job. When you are at a provider you are technically employed (i.e. in the stats) - so such outcome is a deferred "bribe" (how I see and understand it anyhow)

    I recently took on 2 employees - one was on one of these courses... An hour before the employees began work, I got an answer machine message from one of these providers. They wanted me to confirm whether the person had a job for my company. They had not even started work and they wanted their money.
     
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    GradwellDotCom

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    When I was 18 and fresh out of college I was on JSA for about 2 months. I got offered a job and accepted it, and went to the job centre as usual for my weekly appointment a few days later.

    I explained that I had been offered a job and was waiting to receive my contract in the post. The woman who dealt with me laughed in my face and called me a silly girl for believing that I had actual been employed! She got very difficult with me because I was no longer applying for jobs, despite the fact that I had been offered one.

    I was incredibly happy that the next time I came in was my last, and I could say that my contract had arrived and I was starting work shortly. The staff are far from encouraging and out of the many different people I interacted with, only one of them was polite, helpful and encouraging. This is despite the fact that I had a strong CV and was obviously actively seeking work.
     
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    criswhite

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    Price should always be a factor in college selection, though a fair amount of students are aware of this. A recent study of recent freshmen by researchers from UCLA found it is becoming a very large factor in their choice of alma mater. Learn more at: personalmoneynetwork about Cost a major factor in college selection.
     
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    14Steve14

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    Whilst that is obviously true, it's also a damning indictment of how good manners have disappeared during the last 40 years. Let's be honest, if someone takes the trouble to apply for a job with a company, to just totally ignore them is downright rude.

    Maybe I'm getting old though. :|

    No you are not getting old. You are just from the old school who think that having manners and being polite is the way things should be.

    All joking aside. What is so hard with an employer sending emails back to applicants. A simple cut and paste reply by clicking a reply button on an email would take a few seconds. Remember, that whilst you are looking for an employee, the potential employee is also sizing you up as a business. Its first impressions again.
     
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    fisicx

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    [My daughter is 17. She has a professionally written CV
    And that right there is why she isn't getting anywhere.

    I don't want to see a professionaly written CV. I want to see the one SHE has written. I want to know about her and not what some expert has crafted.
     
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    14Steve14

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    And that right there is why she isn't getting anywhere.

    I don't want to see a professionaly written CV. I want to see the one SHE has written. I want to know about her and not what some expert has crafted.

    She has a job now, which she enjoys, and which she got after sending a professionally written and styled CV. It looked so much better than what she was taught to do at school, and contained the information that employers wanted to see, in the order that they wanted to see it, and not what she wanted them to see. It cost a few quid to get done, and it worked. Money well spent.

    Would she have got the job without a correctly written and styled CV we will never know, but if it made her stand out from the rest of the applicants then it worked.
     
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    StaceyPreedy

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    I think poor attitude is the case here, I'm 27 and I've been running my business for two years. I look a little bit younger than my age and I have people give me shocked looks when they meet me but I've worked hard all my life, my first job I worked 75 hours a week at 18 and I was promoted for my hard work. I think people need to stop this ridiculous notion that older people work harder, I have actually found this not to be the case and when you work in a company that is fast expanding I've also found that getting them to adapt to change is impossible. They are too laid back, I personally will be employing anyone that can successfully write a CV that they have actually read before sending (this seems to be rare) and seems generally interested in getting a job with my business. Unfortunately this is also rare. It's sad to say but I think a lot of people write CV's like they have no chance of getting the job and aren't really sure whey they are even applying. Anything that says to me, yeah I want this job and I want it bad is all I'm after and we're just not getting this.
     
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    StaceyPreedy

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    In a lot of places yes that is why they are not employed absolutely. There are still many cases though where people just pass them off in jobs that require little skills. The trouble is we all would normally roll into a job from our education. At present with little work going round many are stuck at home not getting experience to even start getting anywhere past 24. I guess you can say it's a good mixture of lack of experience, lack of work to get experience and the few that just have general views of youngsters being lazy etc. To be honest, I know many people above and below 16-24 and really its the older generation that seem to be out of work around me.
     
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    owas

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    I am quite shocked at some of the negatives comments here about young people. Yes granted, some are lazy sods, but so are older people. I am 26 and have always worked since I left school, and never less than 40 hrs a week. I didn't get a single GGSE, cant spell f-all. But I was given a chance to prove myself, I work hard at what I do and am good at it, and have now had the opportunity to start my own business.
    But also saying that, you hear of so many "young" people complain that they cant get work, as there's no opportunities, well go and bloody make them!
     
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    fisicx

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    So how do you gain a job in that particular work if no one will give you a job in it because you don't have the experience?
    You start at the bottom sweeping the floor and work your way up.

    It's not so much the lack of experience, it's more like the unrealistic expectations.

    Young lad I know won't work weekends because he likes to go clubbing. He had one job but left because they blocked facebook. But he still thinks because he likes IT he is going to get a job working in IT support. I asked him about his skills and his answer was: 'don't need to know anything - all I have to do is look it up on Google'.

    He is still unemployed.
     
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    DPearce

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    I am 21, so dead in the middle of the 18-24 bracket (check that mathimatical competency :p) and I have to say the media does not paint the best picture of youths today; but it is alot easier for the media to stereotype and catorgorise certain demographics.

    I am sure everyone can relate to the frustration of being turned down employment due to the lack of experience; young people tend to be kicked out in the rain until a forward thinking company gives them a waterproof jacket.

    I am glad for the rise in Apprenticeship places as this will give many school leavers, who may not have gotten the greatest qualifications, a real chance of a CAREER; not some minimum wage retail job and quite frankly being taken advantage of.

    Granted, many youths are just lay-abouts and have no get up and go in them, but for those who have a real work ethic, are bright and could really make something of themselves deserve better, from the government and from many business owners. Seeing them type of people working 40+ hours utilizing next to none of their skills is quite frankly depressing.

    Hopefully one day I am in the place to be able to give young adults a chance to make something of themselves; when that day comes the sense of satisfaction will be grand.
     
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    AT700

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    Honest answer is theyre useless in the main.


    Not all 16-24 year olds are useless!

    I'm 22 and consider myself successful and a valuable member to our Business!

    I left School with no Qualifications (I admit I was very imature at School, like most!) but was offered a chance upon leaving and managed to secure a Job as an Office Junior. Within 5 years I've had 4 promotions and been headhunted by Industry leaders and PLC's on three occasions.

    I put my success down to working hard, committed in going that extra mile but most of all turning into work everyday with a mature head on my shoulders and respect to what I do.
     
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    Alan R Price

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    Honest answer is theyre useless in the main.


    Not all 16-24 year olds are useless!

    I'm 22 and consider myself successful and a valuable member to our Business!

    I left School with no Qualifications (I admit I was very imature at School, like most!) but was offered a chance upon leaving and managed to secure a Job as an Office Junior. Within 5 years I've had 4 promotions and been headhunted by Industry leaders and PLC's on three occasions.

    I put my success down to working hard, committed in going that extra mile but most of all turning into work everyday with a mature head on my shoulders and respect to what I do.

    That's great to hear. And I agree that not all youngsters are useless. We are a business rescue and insolvency practice and we recruit frequently from a local training agency that continues to train its candidates once they have found employment - Starting Off in Kettering/Northampton. We put all such trainees through a modern apprenticeship and subsequently accounting technicians' exams, all through Starting Off; and if they are up to it we will then offer them further training in the professional/para-professional insolvency qualifications.

    One of the biggest obstacles we find in recruitment however is that so many applications we receive from under-30s are poorly-written, with little attention to detail. They are obviously composed on word-processors but no attempt has been made to use spelling, punctuation or grammar-checkers. Excellent written communication skills are essential in our business because we frequently have to express precise and complex legal and technical arguments and ideas; and if these skills are not apparent in the CV/application, the candidate will not succeed. 20 years ago this was simply not a problem; however it seems that many of the basic literacy/numeracy skills are no longer taught in schools, judging by what we see. Indeed, many of these badly-written CVs come from graduates, and I frequently see communications from young solicitors and accountants that simply don't make sense, yet their clients are paying for their services!


    We don't consider it is part of our role to teach staff how to read, write and add up properly. I know I probably sound like a boring old f*rt but I can only report my own observations.
     
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    Nuno

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    Quite agree Alan, and it is compounded by the growing necessity to be both literate and numerate in the modern economy. As employment trends change the core skills are becoming more rather than less important.

    You are neither an old f*** in bemoaning this, nor alone. Terry Lehey and numerous other large and small scale employers have done the same. It seems only the Department of Education and the Teachers unions still insist that standards of literacy and numeracy are higher than ever.

    I hope for the kid's sake, and the country's sake, Gove's reforms will help.
     
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    Philip Hoyle

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    Indeed, many of these badly-written CVs come from graduates, and I frequently see communications from young solicitors and accountants that simply don't make sense, yet their clients are paying for their services!

    +1. I've just had the misfortune to check over a lease drafted by one solicitor, and reviewed by my clients' own solicitor. After one solicitor had drafted it and another had reviewed it and passed it to my client for signature, you'd have thought it would have been somewhere near right wouldn't you? It was an absolute disaster zone. Not only were there literally dozens of typo's allover it, but some of the fundamentals were wrong too - such as percentages of insurance and property repairs that the lessee would be liable for - wrong way round - should have been 33.3% insurance and 25% repairs, but they'd drafted it as 25% insurance and 33.3% property repairs. Also it mentioned upper/lower floors whereas the property itself is single story and it should have referred to north/south or left/right. I couldn't believe what a shambles it was.

    Definitely seem to have lost attention to detail these days. When I started 30 years ago, the boss would have been horrified if a letter had gone out with a spelling mistake but it seems that spelling mistakes are tolerated these days. Bad enough if it's an obvious mistake and the reader knows the true meaning, but especially in legal and accountancy related issues, very simple mistakes can translate into huge mistakes, especially if the spelling mistake turns a verb into a noun or vice versa combined with poor sentence construction resulting in the reader misunderstanding and taking the wrong course of action.

    In one of my previous jobs, we took on a graduate who had an accountancy degree, but didn't know how to do double-entry book-keeping - the foundation stone of accountancy! I couldn't believe it. We had to send him on a simple book-keeping course at the local college. After 3 years of a Uni degree course and a 2:1 degree, it was ridiculous that he had no basic book-keeping skills.
     
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    Vrs_Ltd

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    I interviewed a man yesterday (24 years old), when I asked him why he wanted to work for us his reply was "er, I want more coin to buy new xbox games" - I'm not joking. It was frightening to think he was only 6 years younger than myself.

    Some of my best employees have been young, part time/weekend staff, but on the flip side so have my worst.

    In my experience, there seems to be no inbetween with the younger generation they seem to either be very good with a great work ethic, or a complete nighmare.
     
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    I interviewed a man yesterday (24 years old), when I asked him why he wanted to work for us his reply was "er, I want more coin to buy new xbox games" - I'm not joking. It was frightening to think he was only 6 years younger than myself.

    Depends what the job is I suppose. I have to admit I laughed to myself when I read the above comment.... but is it really that bad of an answer if you're looking for someone who can put 6 cakes in a cardboard box 4 times a minute for an 8 hour shift?

    Its a simple job, for simple people. At least he has a goal and realises he needs a job to achieve it.
     
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    Berkshire Business

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    I agree Alan, not all youngsters are useless, some don't help when you get comments like where mentioned above 'need coin to buy more Xbox games' very unprofessional.- Although I do agree that not all youngsters are useless, some are very motivated and willing to learn, then again some just don't bother.
     
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    NineteenPounds

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    I am 24 and my business partner is 22.

    To be honest, I find that generally I probably speak to around 1/100 guys and girls around my age category that are as like minded as my self and my biz partner. And out of those 100 I could probably only imagine a one or two of them working with us.

    It is a bit worrying!


    Hi everybody,

    Youth unemployment is rising in the UK and I would like to ask employers and potential employers for their opinions about why this is.

    I look forward to your response.

    James.
     
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