who do I sue?

[Steve Jones2]

I was asked to fix 2 laptops for a company in the city of london. I was contacted by a lady who works there. This included emails which seem to be from her company email address.

To cut a long story, on the day she only gave me one latop to fix.If I 'd known this my price would have been very different,or i might not have even accepted the job. She did this without consulting me.
She also told me the laptop contained senistive company data, and made me sign a confidentiality agreement. I mention this as further evidence it was a company laptop.

Having done what I was contracted to do on the laptop she did give me, she then decided she'd only pay me less than half what was agreed. I accepted this under duress.

I gave her a chance to pay the full amount, and warned her i'd issue a summons if not paid.
I've issued the summons in the company name. She's now said it was her machine, which I don't believe. I've asked her for her personal address t, which after a struggle she's given me- though not with proof of address, which I assume I'll need in case she's just made up an a address.

Am I able to amend the summons, or will I have to start again?
Or on the evidence I have, shall I just carry on with suing the company, and not the individual.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

It will be more economical to walk away and forget about it.

 

[Mr D]

The company will come back to you if its nothing to do with them. May also have words with the individual.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

Keep going for the company There is very little evidence that this individual placed the order

 

[Steve Jones2]

Update- she has provided me with an address, but refuses to prove the address with utility bills/driving licence. She says she doesn't have to.
I've told her I won't amend the summons wiithout proof of address.
Otherwise she could be using anyone's address, couldn't she?

 

[Mr D]

Update- she has provided me with an address, but refuses to prove the address with utility bills/driving licence. She says she doesn't have to.
I've told her I won't amend the summons wiithout proof of address.
Otherwise she could be using anyone's address, couldn't she?

Sorry, she has provided the address - are you in a position to demand proof?
Are you required to hold proof of address for someone you are taking to court?
Or is she in a position to refuse?

More importantly, either you are chasing the company or you are chasing her. Which is it?
If the company then no need for her personal address.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

Don't amend it. It looks like she is very keen for you to change the summons This gives you a bit more leverage
Its clear that after all this they are still trying to avoid the debt. Don't put up with anymore messing around Explain to her that the company is liable and your not wasting anymore of your time on it .
They might actually pay up if you don't do what they want you to do .

It is hardly going to stand up in court
We booked it in the company name but when we decided not to pay. We made somebody else at another address is liable !

 

[Socio South West]

How much is the bill? How much time are you wasting chasing it and how much stress is it causing?
Use the time to put procedures in place to stop this happening again and pursue other earning business - time much better spent unless the amounts are significant.

 

[Lisa Thomas]

How much are we talking about?

I would go after the Company. You believed the order was placed by the Company and everything she said and did led you to believe that.

What is her status within the Company?

 

[Scalloway]

The OP has two other threads on variations of this subject. I would suggest spending some time with a lawyer would be more productive than endlessly arguing online.

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/suing-a-limited-company.398112/

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/customer-cancelled-part-of-contract.398349/

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

The OP has two other threads on variations of this subject. I would suggest spending some time with a lawyer would be more productive than endlessly arguing online.

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/suing-a-limited-company.398112/

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/customer-cancelled-part-of-contract.398349/

I disagree some people are only happy when litigating and we should fully support Steve Jones if he wants to have a dust up everybody

 

[Steve Jones2]

I don't know her status,She may be a lwyer with this fiorm of lawyers, or just a secretary.
What I do know is she had company information on the laptop- that makes it a company laptop as far as I'm concerned.

BTW, she's just emailed to say she won't send me proof of ID until I've sent her proof of mine! And i'm the one suing her!

 

[DavidWH]

Issue against the company.

If you issue against her personally the pre action protocol is different and drags it out longer.

If she emailed you from a company email, your argument it was for the company is stronger, plus it will confirm the facts they only sent one, not two.

You collected from the company address?
The laptop contained company data?

I'd say it's a strong argument.

Issue in her name, will it get to court and she claims it's the companies, case thrown out, your out of pocket, spend more money claiming again against the company.

 

[Lisa Thomas]

I don't know her status,She may be a lwyer with this fiorm of lawyers, or just a secretary.
What I do know is she had company information on the laptop- that makes it a company laptop as far as I'm concerned.

BTW, she's just emailed to say she won't send me proof of ID until I've sent her proof of mine! And i'm the one suing her!

Doesn't the firm have a website? How many employees does it have? Have you checked Companies House to see if she is a Director and if there are other Directors?

 

[smallclaimsassistance]

I don't know her status,She may be a lwyer with this fiorm of lawyers, or just a secretary.

So the "company", to which you refer, and which you have sued, is a legal firm?

Business is well known for ignoring or otherwise failing effectively to deal with legal papers. Legal firms are not. To that end, given the timescale we appear to be dealing with here (first post 4 days ago, which appears to imply proceedings issued (against the "company") last week, I am staggered that a legal firm has had a set of court proceedings for a week and you have heard nothing from the company.

Even if the above ("I don't know her status,She may be a lwyer with this fiorm of lawyers") is a mistake, and the "company" is not a legal business, I'm surprised you have heard nothing at all from the company.

What I do know is she had company information on the laptop- that makes it a company laptop as far as I'm concerned.

No it doesn't. Emails from the company address are more persuasive, although not compelling, but I'm afraid company documentation on a laptop does not of itself comprise evidence that the device belongs to the company. In my previous role as a partner in a firm of solicitors, at any one time, I had several gigabytes of company/partnership data on my personal laptop. That didn't at any point make it a company laptop, nor did it make the company responsible for the contents.

BTW, she's just emailed to say she won't send me proof of ID until I've sent her proof of mine! And i'm the one suing her!

Why are you corresponding with her? You've sued the company. She says the machine is her personal property. **Ignore her and wait for the response from the company.

NB: The above advice ** is predicated on your representation that the instruction came from or on behalf of the company. I have no idea whether you can prove that as I haven't seen the documents, and frankly no one can advise you without sight of the evidence, which appears to comprise solely an exchange of emails at the start of the episode. I would however strongly advise that once you get the defence from the company, if that defence denies knowledge and ownership of the device, you consult a lawyer immediately.

Not taking sufficient steps to ascertain the correct legal identity of your defendant (this is not an assumption, it's a fact - if you had, you wouldn't be asking the question here) could put you on the wrong end of an order against you for legal costs on the basis of unreasonable behaviour (Civil Procedure Rule 44.4). This is of particular concern given your apparent admission that you have sued a legal "company", who presumably will know what they are doing.

Finally, this

Having done what I was contracted to do on the laptop she did give me, she then decided she'd only pay me less than half what was agreed. I accepted this under duress.

will be difficult to prove, and in fact on the minimal information you have supplied, I can't see a court accepting the argument that you accepted under duress.

You could either have refused the offer and sued, or refused the offer and accepted the sum as a voluntary interim payment against their debt, and then sued. Both of these avoid making a contract. Your post states that you "accepted" which clearly implies that you did so in full settlement. Your version of events above suggests that you accepted then changed your mind. Whoever you have sued, I'm afraid that argument will be a very difficult sell to a judge. Again, I refer to my point above about costs orders for unreasonable behaviour.

Dean

 

[MOIC]

You could either have refused the offer and sued, or refused the offer and accepted the sum as a voluntary interim payment against their debt, and then sued. Both of these avoid making a contract. Your post states that you "accepted" which clearly implies that you did so in full settlement.

That above sums it up.

 

[Mark T Jones]

The OP has two other threads on variations of this subject. I would suggest spending some time with a lawyer would be more productive than endlessly arguing online.

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/suing-a-limited-company.398112/

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/customer-cancelled-part-of-contract.398349/

Homework?

 

[Steve Jones2]

Update- after asking her to provide a personal address (as she's asked me to amend the summons to her name only) she failed to respond to my request.
On the 5th time of asking she's given me an address, but of course I have no idea if this is really her address, or one she's made up.I've asked her for proof of address in the form of utility bill, but she's refused.

Clearly it would be pointless to sue her at a (false) address as this wouldn't affect her credit rating if she lost, and I'd not be able to impose any judgement.

Surely her lack of co-operation would count against her by a judge, and show I had no alternative but to carry on suing the company?

 

[Mr D]

Update- after asking her to provide a personal address (as she's asked me to amend the summons to her name only) she failed to respond to my request.
On the 5th time of asking she's given me an address, but of course I have no idea if this is really her address, or one she's made up.I've asked her for proof of address in the form of utility bill, but she's refused.

Clearly it would be pointless to sue her at a (false) address as this wouldn't affect her credit rating if she lost, and I'd not be able to impose any judgement.

Surely her lack of co-operation would count against her by a judge, and show I had no alternative but to carry on suing the company?

I'd be surprised if the judge was not somewhat annoyed all right. Perhaps reflected in eventual decision.

But not at her.

Binary issue, either its personal to her or its to the company.
You appear to want both.

Be pointless to sue her at a true or false address if its the company you need to sue.

 

[obscure]

and conversely it would be pointless to sue the company if it is actually her you need to sue. Continuing to sue the wrong defendant because you don't know the actual defendants address isn't going to go over well in court.

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

Who was the other party on the confidentiality agreement?

 

[Steve Jones2]

To be clear, I’m certainly NOT trying to sue both. I want to sue the company, but I believe the woman is playing a game by trying to (falsely) claim the laptop was hers.

All the evidence points to the laptop being company property.
If she were honest, why has she clearly avoided giving me her personal address, and proof of residence at that address?

Any reasonable judge will see the evidence I have which points to the contract being with the company. He will also see the exchange of emails where the lady has tried to not disclose her address.

 

[billybob99]

Sounds like a proper dodgy lady.

Is it a big company based in London.

In the past I've just popped over to LinkedIn, found the company they worked for and then higher management within - and dropped them all an email.

I got the result I wanted.

Worst case, shaming them is enough.

 

[Mr D]

To be clear, I’m certainly NOT trying to sue both. I want to sue the company, but I believe the woman is playing a game by trying to (falsely) claim the laptop was hers.

All the evidence points to the laptop being company property.
If she were honest, why has she clearly avoided giving me her personal address, and proof of residence at that address?

Any reasonable judge will see the evidence I have which points to the contract being with the company. He will also see the exchange of emails where the lady has tried to not disclose her address.

Yes as I said appears you want to sue both.

You say the evidence points to it being company property so why oh why oh why are you messing about getting her personal details?

I think we have rather different ideas how a reasonable judge will see all this.

 

[Mark T Jones]

You are making a lot of assumption of what judges will think. From experience I’d say the only safe Assumption about judges is that they will be a bit mental

(They might actually be reasonable but it’s nit a safe assumption)

In the circumstances I would send an LBA to the company. I. Reality they will probably settle, if they don’t you can enjoy and learn from the process

 

[smallclaimsassistance]

In the circumstances I would send an LBA to the company. I. Reality they will probably settle, if they don’t you can enjoy and learn from the process

He says he has already issued proceedings against the company and is awaiting their defence.

Dean