Unable to find good employees. Anyone else have this problem?

[Ali-print]

I have been running our business for many years. Over the years I have had to make employees redundant and rejuvenate the business. As the business has grown I have had major problems in recruiting the right people. I have been through 8/9 accounts people. 4/5 office customer service staff. 4/5 warehouse staff.

We are constantly hearing about large unemployment and yet I find it so hard to find good workers???

I have always been the type of person that if I'm employed by someone I will do my best to help the company. The people I employ don't seem to care about my business or the work they are doing.

One of my major problems is knowing how much to pay a person. I s business of course so I have to make sure I am getting value for my money.

My business competition are beating me because they are building strong businesses. Good design departments, good technology (websites), good marketing and good customer service dept's.
I feel for me to compete I need to be doing the same.

I am not a fan of recruitment firms. They charge a lot and you really never guaranteed a good employee. You end up paying there fees and then having to let the employee go after 3 months.

I am also not a fan of the apprenticeship schemes. The people coming through are so bad and that is if they turn up. Also the training firms offering these apprentices don't seem to be teaching them properly. It's all just about ticking boxes and getting paid by government.

I have also tried graduate schemes but the quality of graduates is so poor. I haven't had the training they have had and I end up showing them how to use program's.

 

[Steve Sellers]

Have you ever considered using psychometric tests? All the rage in HR at the moment! (not plugging it as I dont do it) I have heard many say that they are very accurate.

 

[Wavecrest Ltd]

I'm currently recruiting to replace someone who is retiring.

I've advertised on social media sites Twitter and Linkedin and also on my company blog. I've used tow local internet based sites.

No shortage on volume of applicants. However, it would appear that a lot of people are incapable of reading! My ads clearly state that we require someone with shipping office experience. What do we get ? Letters from people who have never worked in any type of office let alone a shipping office.

It's a waste of my time and there's. I have a feeling a lot of these applications are at the behest of the Job Seekers Allowance system. The unemployed are told to apply for a certain number of jobs a week to continue to receive their JSA. As a result letters are sent off for completely unsuitable jobs just to hit the target.

I have also found people who seem to just be going through the motions. One chap had written to me four times over the last year (including only a few or so ago) asking if we had any suitable vacancies. His CV looked promising so I tried to call him. First time no answer. OK waited another couple of days and tried again. Still no answer so I sent a text asking him to contact me to arrange an interview. No reply...

I will not use recruitment agencies as their fees are exorbitant especially in our industry.

I have to partially disagree with the OP regarding apprenticeships (from our experience at least). We have employed a young lad in ourwarehouse who came through the apprenticeship scheme. He has been an asset to the business. Very willing attitude and keen to learn. Maybe he's the exception to the rule? Hopefully not for the sake of the country!

Where I do agree with the OP is the training company did seem keener on box ticking and form filling than the welfare of the apprentice.

Glen

 

[ludachris]

I s business of course so I have to make sure I am getting value for my money.

How bad does your staff retention rate have to be before you stop blaming the employees and start blaming yourself?

Trying to get value for money for your employees implies you pay them next to nothing and expect them to do a stellar job. Perhaps take a look at the way you treat your staff. Look after your employees and your employees will look after you.

Chances are your warehouse and customer service staff are on minimum wage, or close to it, so why not find other ways to motivated them?

Obviously this is guesswork going on the tone of your original post and you may have just been unlucky with staff, If that's the case i suggest you at least try a recruitment agency for the higher caliber of CVs you'll get in.

 

[danielrobert48]

I agree with you that recruitment companies do not provide good employees.
They are usually concern with the commission they'll get so they usually don't pay that much attention which your business need so you should recruit the employees on your own.

For that, you should learn to judge people first then go for hiring them as most of the times the person apparently seems very beneficial for the organization but when you have interaction with them in terms of your business they return in less effective for the business.

At the same time you should have a continuous interaction with your hired employees so that you know what they are doing in their lives. This can help you in learning if the person will remain with you or will leave you.

It totally depends upon you how you make them stay with you.

Good Luck !

 

[Vectis]

I think I'd probably agree, it is difficult to find decent workers.

We closed our offices a few years ago and now only use freelancers who get paid a set sum, agreed in advance, for the work they do. That way, if they don't work they don't get paid and we don't use them again.

One of the most difficult parts of running a business is finding good staff. Even at interview stage so many of them just weren't bothered. None of us in the office dressed particularly smartly i.e. we would only wear suits if we were going out meeting clients, not every day to work, but some of the interviewees took dressing 'casual' to a new extreme! Then there were the ones who made no effort to speak at the interview - it was as if they had just turned up expecting to be offered the job. We had to drag answers out of them!

Then there were the best of the bunch who we actually employed. Unfortunately we had to let about 90% of them go within the first 6 months as they clearly weren't ready or willing to do a day's work. These were all, by and large, youngsters with University Degrees. I've since lost all my faith in University education. Many of them were very adept though at keeping their social network sites up to date, in work time of course!

We're a small business, at best we employ 12-14 people and talking to other small business owners, many of them too have the same problems with staff. So, no, you are not alone!

 

[Richie N]

I am not a fan of recruitment firms. They charge a lot and you really never guaranteed a good employee. You end up paying there fees and then having to let the employee go after 3 months.

If you are having to let the employees go after 3 months then this may be due to your recruitment strategy and hiring, can't see how you can blame an agency for this.
They introduce candidates but you employ them!!

 

[stefanss]

Every boss or CEO expect 100% from an employee. I saw huge number of bosses who will expect from employee to work Saturdays just for a company good. But when you ask that employee if he is satisfied he will say NO. Because of that he will never give you 100%. Whenever you say "do it for company good", that means "not good for an employee". Also, an employee will never think about company the way owner will.

 

[thelegalstop]

Finding, building and managing a good team is crucial for each business.I will tell you my experience - when I was young and had no experience, no body wanted to to work for them, however there was a manager, who simply believed in me and appreciated exactly the fact that I have no experience - he helped me learn and get more experienced and I will be always grateful for this.Basically, if you have the chance to hire a motivated, intelligent person, who does not have much experience - do not hesitate to do it - it will pay off!

 

[LuisaML]

Why don't you hire a HR to deal with the recruitment and staffing, it may be more economical on the long run.

 

[Displaycentreuk]

Agree entirely with OP but I dont think that it is a money issue.

One of the issues, I believe, is that it is more comfortable and easier to hide in a big organisation. In a small company it is very obvious when someone is not giving 100%.

I have employed a number of people with very impressive track-records on high salaries who, frankly, have not had a clue about delivering 100%.

The other factor is that sensible employers will pay well to keep good people becuase of the full cost (and implications) of trying to find decent replacements. So the good people are not searching for jobs so where do you find them?

The recruitment agents with whom I have worked also complain about the lack of good people. Of course they put forward anyone who they can find in the hope that a candidate will stick and they will get their commission.

Chris

 

[Kevincloud]

I had been in employment since the age of 17 (cancer at 30, no one would hire me after, so i am now my own boss) I always gave my all, a certain employer knew i would get the job done and assumed it would be ok to treat me less favourably than other new staff, heavier work loads and excessive overtime>> "He put`s his head down and gets on with it" <<
your staff are just as important as your customer base....most think its just a case of show the carrot on the stick and they will do it, but remember to give the odd cube of sugar and you get better results all round.

 

[Deleted member 61074]

Whenever you say "do it for company good", that means "not good for an employee". Also, an employee will never think about company the way owner will.

So true! When I was an employee if it was asked to do something for the benefit of the company i always translated this as " please do this for free and dont expect a financial reward, but rest assured your contribution has just lined your bosses pocket"

Little wonder i went self employed!

 

[Deleted member 162294]

So true! When I was an employee if it was asked to do something for the benefit of the company i always translated this as " please do this for free and dont expect a financial reward, but rest assured your contribution has just lined your bosses pocket"

Little wonder i went self employed!

So if you needed someone do a little something extra regardless of how trivial or big, what would you say?

I only ask because I've been thinking the same thing.

 

[Podge]

So if you needed someone do a little something extra regardless of how trivial or big, what would you say?

I only ask because I've been thinking the same thing.

Provided the employer is as accommodating as the employee they should have no trouble getting the "extra's" done. Nobody want's to be taken advantage of.

 

[tony84]

Your not a fan of graduates, people on training schemes or people from recruitment agencies....

Have you tried looking at this from the perspective of the employee? Maybe once you have sacked them (not straight away), asking them if there is any reason why they were not performing (Training, happiness etc). Or you could possibly put a box out for the staff to leave feedback, have it so its confidential and it may actually help your business improve.

Its not quite the same, but when we had a pub we welcomed ideas from the staff. I dont know but im guessing it helped them feel like they were part of the business helped them get excited about something within work.

 

[tompeters]

Do you know the reason why past employees have left the company? Is there any common reason? Looking into this may help you identify any possible issues.

 

[CeliaNorway]

Hi there!
I'm sure you have resolved your issues by now,but if you haven't I MIGHT be able to be of assistance
I have been researching in the apprentice /CEO relationships and find that most of the apprentices apply so they can finish their apprentice ship program.
The ceo's employ because they (most of the time) want to mould the to be "extraordinary" from a young age.surely that would be ideal,right?
What the "yougen's" don't realise (because of limited believes ) is that the initiative,commitment and passion that they would gain a senior full time secure job!

Why don't you hire a HR to deal with the recruitment and staffing, it may be more economical on the long run.

 

[CeliaNorway]

Sure you can!
But, what "most" people forget is that the HR needs to know what you're really after,REALLY after.....and if the founder/manager,CEO etc haven't got a Clear route to communicate out to the public what kind of personalities,what kind of values they need/ the HR would be just as clueless......I have made the same mistakes until I realised,"I need to find the person that is right for us and the person finds the company right for them! So if you feel you keep getting the same results with the apprentices ,try a new approach,otherwise things won't change
"If you aim at nothing,you will hit it everytime"

 

[MBE1]

Afraid the OP needs to look at himself, his recruitment selection process, and also ask a simple question.

When necessary he made workers redundant, why the suprise that workers like himself look after number 1? I'm sure at the time he felt it necessary to let people go, but workers think along the same lines as well.

It is always hard to pin down what makes an inspirational leader, why certain people follow and accept their vision, few have the ability to carry the workers with them.

 

[deniser]

I have been advertising two jobs for the past two weeks -adverts in the window in a high footfall area, local FB and Twitter - and have had only one single applicant who had so much holiday time booked off that he isn't really available to take the job!

I didn't want to use the Job Centre until I absolutely had to because last time I did my emails almost crashed from the amount of people who applied totally randomly with no regard to the job description (one applicant's covering letter was all about how he wanted to become a mechanic and this was a retail job which has nothing to do with cars) or even its location (some were at the other end of the country) or the email itself was just shocking in spelling and grammar or littered with text speak (one of the jobs is customer services including writing) - the ad got copied by countless other online job sites - and I got so many irrelevant applications (also from people wanting to keep their benefits?) that I couldn't sift out the good ones and had to pull it after a day - and ask the other sites to take it down.

I think this time I will ask for applications by post so that the people who don't want the job won't apply; it's too easy to fire off an email!

But yes, in answer to the op, really hard to find any employees let alone good ones.

 

[The Byre]

We advertised for a specific job as writer and translator for English and German. Applicants were told to call a specific telephone number within a set time and on that number were told to submit one page of text, describing why we should employ them, as a PDF within 24hrs.

Some became abusive, some told us that the task was impossible to do, some just didn't understand what a PDF is or how they should get it to us. In the end we received 139 replies, of which just two actually managed to follow those instructions. We employed both of them.

As for university graduates - we get several hundred unsolicited CVs every year and the standard of the letters and emails is staggeringly low. Also the standard of the education is about as low as it can possibly get without actually giving degrees for actually being able to breath. This is almost entirely due to the growth of vocational degrees. Media studies, film and video production, music business - all completely useless!

We get people with BScs that cannot give the interviewer a single physical law. Typical was one lad who claimed a BSc in 'Music Technology' yet could not read music or a circuit diagram - so no music and no technology was covered in that degree course. Most young applicants for jobs involving producing texts cannot write without making fundamental grammatical mistakes (there, their and they're being typical).

And when you talk to the lecturers at their universities, you realise why the students are so unsuited for the work market. The lecturers and professors are daft and unmotivated as well.

Then there is the work ethic and in the UK, the lack of work ethic is alarming. We have just had one bozo calling in to tell us that he can't come to work and needs a day off sick. Reason? "Oh, well, I'm just too drunk to drive!"

I did not renew the job for one mechanic, because if a supervisor was not actually standing over him, he just stopped working.

I could go on, but the OP has a valid point. Some young people are definitely brilliant and hard working, but finding them is getting more and more difficult.

 

[Ashley_Price]

So true! When I was an employee if it was asked to do something for the benefit of the company i always translated this as " please do this for free and dont expect a financial reward, but rest assured your contribution has just lined your bosses pocket"

It's always interesting how an employee views a question like this. Many think like you did, but I managed to change one employee's mind, as she was of the "pay me more and then I'll do more" mentality.

One day (oh gosh, it sounds like a children's story), her partner was looking to get some videos converted to DVD, and was telling his girlfriend, in our office, he had found a service who would do it. She said to him "Make sure you don't pay them any money until you see the quality of the results."

I remembered this statement for the next time we asked her if she could do a little extra. Her response was, as usual, a polite version of "not unless you give me more money". I reminded her of what she had said to her partner, and continued "So you want us to pay you before we see the quality of the result?"

Yes, there are bosses out there that take advantage, but there are also many that if they ask if you can help out, it will be remembered, and you'll be rewarded, possibly in other ways.

We had a member of staff that was occasionally late back from lunch (5 or 10 minutes sometimes) and once in a while she would be a few minutes late in the morning. Did we say anything? Nope! Because she was also the first person to volunteer to stay after her finish time (up to an hour or so later) and help out or do extra work when we were up against it and it was "all hands on deck".

 

[Ashley_Price]

We advertised for a specific job as writer and translator for English and German. Applicants were told to call a specific telephone number within a set time and on that number were told to submit one page of text, describing why we should employ them, as a PDF within 24hrs.

I have to be honest, when I read this, I felt the instructions were a little harsh. You're looking for people to be writers and translators, would that include converting stuff into PDF? If not, then you were judging them on their computer literacy rather than they grasp of English and German.

Not everyone is completely computer literate. I just recently had to explain to a client we couldn't follow their instructions, as "convert the transcript into PDF" would mean they would not be able "to make alterations to the file at a later date". They hadn't realised what PDF was.

 

[zigojacko]

The whole country is screwed in terms of reducing the unemployment rate. The problem is the education or training in getting half the population to be able to apply for jobs properly.

We've had people apply for positions working on computers and their CV's were an absolute mess. Spelling and grammatical errors galore. And we've even had applicants who have wrote in text speak like lol and woz etc.

Maybe the government and educational establishments should focus on teaching and training the right skills in the first place. There are of course many that just don't give a shit anyway about getting a decent career. There are also others that just apply for absolutely anything - we've had the same copied and pasted covering letter from the same people for different positions before.

 

[Ashley_Price]

In the last few years we've never publicly advertised for staff (beyond the "I'm a fantastic typist" option on our contact us page).

The staff we have taken on (either as APA or before, as Bananaoffice) have been through personal recommendation.

 

[The Byre]

I have to be honest, when I read this, I felt the instructions were a little harsh. You're looking for people to be writers and translators, would that include converting stuff into PDF? If not, then you were judging them on their computer literacy rather than they grasp of English and German.

No, they were a test of the applicant's ability to follow simple instructions AND have very basic computer skills, as well as their ability to put together a written piece under very moderate time pressure.

 

[pioneer22]

OP, I would say if you are having a high staff turnover then you need to look at it from the point of the employee.

Are you paying enough?

What other benefits do your employees have? Pension? Holidays? Flexible Hours? Reviews and appraisals? Company handbooks? Correct training?

If you struggling to recruit staff, have you brushed up on your HR knowledge ? Or your interviewing technique, how do you interview? Do you have a chit chat? Or a competency based interview? Tell me about when you have dealt with a difficult customer etc.

Perhaps having a leavers questionnaire would be a good idea this wouldnt take very long to do and are very effective.

When I was a student I worked at Nando's the hours were long and pay was minimal dealing with rude customers. But we could have a beer at the end of the shift and we could have a staff meal, the majority of the staff stayed there for a long time. Which is surprising for a minimum wage job

 

[harper101]

Finding good employees is really a challenge,

Employees are really a factor in building reputation in every business, and eventually in business success.

 

[DavidWH]

We've taken an apprentice on... even though we told the training provider what roles they would undertake, they've put him on a business admin apprenticeship. When the assessor rocked up to find him brandishing a knife and applying vehicle graphics she wasn't at all surprised, they had to removed 4 already from inappropriate positions. Provided we show him word/publisher (which we don't use) all's good. The training provider made appointments and then didn't turn up, then turns up out of the blue. Time is valuable to a small business.

 

[Billmccallum]

Just a little case study:

Many years ago I helped a guy start a furniture manufacturing business,, got him £9K in grants, found a workshop and designed the branding for the business and off he went a happy man.

A year later he came back and said "I need help", I can sell stuff and I can make stuff, but I cant do both at the same time, so I end up working for two weeks with no money coming in before I can sell the stuff, so cant move forward, but I cant afford to rent a shop or pay a salary.

I agreed to work on a 10% commission as sales manager, developed the sale strategy, found display space and got started, first couple of weeks earned zero, but it developed quickly.

Within six months I set up a separate retail arm, found premises and sales got up to £5K a week.

At this point he decided that paying me £500 a week was too much for "just selling" and decided that he would only pay 5% instead of 10%, at which point I gave him his shop keys and left.

12 months later his business went bust as he could not find anyone who could mirror what I had done and he was too stubborn to ask me to go back and pay the 10% commission.

The point is that an employee will work to develop a business if they see the value for them, not just in financial terms, but being valued as part of the business.

 

[LocalGuy]

Just a little case study:

Many years ago I helped a guy start a furniture manufacturing business,, got him £9K in grants, found a workshop and designed the branding for the business and off he went a happy man.

A year later he came back and said "I need help", I can sell stuff and I can make stuff, but I cant do both at the same time, so I end up working for two weeks with no money coming in before I can sell the stuff, so cant move forward, but I cant afford to rent a shop or pay a salary.

I agreed to work on a 10% commission as sales manager, developed the sale strategy, found display space and got started, first couple of weeks earned zero, but it developed quickly.

Within six months I set up a separate retail arm, found premises and sales got up to £5K a week.

At this point he decided that paying me £500 a week was too much for "just selling" and decided that he would only pay 5% instead of 10%, at which point I gave him his shop keys and left.

12 months later his business went bust as he could not find anyone who could mirror what I had done and he was too stubborn to ask me to go back and pay the 10% commission.

The point is that an employee will work to develop a business if they see the value for them, not just in financial terms, but being valued as part of the business.

That is great what you did for that company, just a shame that some business owners cannot see pure value when it is staring them right in the face.

I too am a strong believer in giving the employee an incentive or drive to do well. (Almost) everyone has a strong desire to do well and they want to be rewarded for doing well. Performance schemes and benefits is always best, plus it also helps you attract employees that are hungry for work and money so they will go above and beyond.

 

[The Byre]

At this point he decided that paying me £500 a week was too much for "just selling" and decided that he would only pay 5% instead of 10%, at which point I gave him his shop keys and left.

And 10% is waaaay less than regular shop mark-up.

 

[Ali-print]

This issue is still causing issues for us and I agree with some of the posts that I have to look at our company policies and procedures. How the staff are trained and how they are the monitored and rewarded.

It is on my plan to set the structure over the next 3/4 months however right now we are just too busy to stop and start writing down procedures and structure everbody role.

I have just had another accounts person leave, in some instances I am glad, we have gone through the accounts and found many mistakes. All instructions were given to the employee but yet they failed to followed them and mis-posted many items. We complained to the recruitment agency we were paying and they never even responded to us. We have just found someone and they seem to be really good. Honest, methodical and eager to get their hands on the role. Only thing was we found him through another recruitment agency. The person called us a day after the interviews and said forget going through the agency and save your money I will come and work for you. Seems to have worked out well for all of us.

 

[Ali-print]

Now I am in search of a new Graphic designer and a Warehouse manager.

For a graphic designer I have approached a local university and posted a job ad on a designers Portfolio website. There is a great potential for this person in my company to become a key employee who would eventually travel to meet customers and travel around the world to visit fairs. But of course they need to prove themselves before hand.

For the Warehouse Manager, I am not sure what to do. The recruitment agency are charging 17.5% of the salary to find someone. My trust in agency's is really low now.

 

[The Byre]

Just put an ad in the local newspaper! We stay well away from agencies!

 

[AImports]

Try LinkedIn or facebook

 

[Ali-print]

[QUOTE="The Byre," ]Just put an ad in the local newspaper! We stay well away from agencies![/QUOTE]
Local newspapers are too much work. I haven't got the time anymore to read and fix interviews. And the amount of unqualified people you get is amazing

 

[nelioneil]

Try posting directly to a job board (e.g. reed/monster) or linked in. You can cut out the agencies completely.

 

[The Byre]

Local newspapers are too much work. I haven't got the time anymore to read and fix interviews. And the amount of unqualified people you get is amazing

Delegate HR to somebody in your company who gets this done for you. That can be just about anybody who can sort out who can use Creative Suite to ninja level and who is just whistling Dixy! Then you just have to talk to four or five possible candidates.

Even if you do it yourself, it is pretty easy to bin all those no-hopers and just look at the few who look real and contact them. I always take the view that I do not decide who gets the gig. The candidates themselves decide that for me!