STAFF, Trainee jobs Youngsters, Where have they gone !!

[SpikeFMT]

Where have all the young people gone ? I have a trainee position for an 18 to 20 year old to learn the tyre trade working both in a depot and training up to working out on the road fitting after a year. I have, however, had very little response and those who have have either No drivers licence despite it being a requirement in the advert or don't want to work Saturday or Sunday. I started off as a trainee tyre fitter some 30 odd years ago and have built up to having 2 depots and 9 mobile vans but the younger ones today don't seem bothered about having a job. I am offering a permanent 40 hr week, not a zero hour contract job with a good rate of pay when trained £23-£25K for the job.
How are you all finding the job market with the younger ages

 

[Mark T Jones]

They are all busy becoming influencers on TicToc.

At some point they will work out that you have to actually work to earn a living

 

[Blackford Biz]

Where have all the young people gone ? I have a trainee position for an 18 to 20 year old to learn the tyre trade working both in a depot and training up to working out on the road fitting after a year. I have, however, had very little response and those who have have either No drivers licence despite it being a requirement in the advert or don't want to work Saturday or Sunday. I started off as a trainee tyre fitter some 30 odd years ago and have built up to having 2 depots and 9 mobile vans but the younger ones today don't seem bothered about having a job. I am offering a permanent 40 hr week, not a zero hour contract job with a good rate of pay when trained £23-£25K for the job.
How are you all finding the job market with the younger ages

One constraint on the labour force is that this "younger" generation is smaller in numbers as the general population moves towards the retirement of the boomers. Younger people can go straight into college so there are less kids on the market, so it's not all about salary.

 

[Bob Morgan]

They are all busy becoming influencers on TicToc.

At some point they will work out that you have to actually work to earn a living

. . . 'Thought Leaders in Diversity and Inclusion,' was mentioned in another thread

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

I understand that young people have no intention to work at all
I have a couple of hours on Wednesday afternoons I could come around and change some wheels

 

[WaveJumper]

Well at 16 they have choice they have to stay in full time education until 18 either at college or start an apprenticeship, many seem to just go on to a collage. I think from around the age of 17 the uni path is open to the youngsters which for many seems to be, the be all and end all for a nice doss and racking up a huge debt, leaving the rest to be social media "stars"

On the subject of being able to drive have you seen the costs involved these days, well out the reach of many youngsters unless they have the support of mum and dad. perhaps offering a chance to get an applicant through their driving test as a carrot with he proviso if they leave in a set time they have to reimburse you.

 

[SpikeFMT]

Well at 16 they have choice they have to stay in full time education until 18 either at college or start an apprenticeship, many seem to just go on to a collage. I think from around the age of 17 the uni path is open to the youngsters which for many seems to be, the be all and end all for a nice doss and racking up a huge debt, leaving the rest to be social media "stars"

On the subject of being able to drive have you seen the costs involved these days, well out the reach of many youngsters unless they have the support of mum and dad. perhaps offering a chance to get an applicant through their driving test as a carrot with he proviso if they leave in a set time they have to reimburse you.

Unfortunately they have to drive from day 1

 

[Bob Morgan]

Apparently, it is considered 'So Last Century' to be able to drive! - There is status in having someone to do it for you, or use Uber! In my day you got called a 'Bus W****r!'

 

[tony84]

Have you thought that it might not be young people dont want to work, it might be that they dont want to do the type of work you are offering (hence why you are paying so well)?

I used to work on a Saturday in a call centre for a bank. But I used to turn up hungover, sometimes even drunk and I could get through the day easily enough. You cant really do that doing manual work on potentially busy roads, you certainly cant be driving.

The world has moved on in 30 years. Work/life balance plays a bigger part in peoples lives.

Presumably if you are getting calls from apprentices who can not drive they are not going to be going out on their own. Can you not make it a part of taking them on that they pass their test within x months ?

 

[UKSBD]

On the subject of being able to drive have you seen the costs involved these days, well out the reach of many youngsters unless they have the support of mum and dad. perhaps offering a chance to get an applicant through their driving test as a carrot with he proviso if they leave in a set time they have to reimburse you.

I think that is the big problem.

My lad was intending to go to UNI, where having a car is pointless.

Because of this he never even bothered taking lessons or trying to pass.

He changed his mind about UNI but now can't get the apprenticeship he wants as he needs to be able to drive.

 

[thetiger2015]

It's quite a niche job that you're recruiting for and 30 years ago was a different landscape.

Plus, a lot of the people you're looking for are doing plastering/electrical work. £300+ per day, self employed after a couple of years working with a professional. Building trade is where it's at, not vehicle maintenance.

Also, the driving license thing, it's really expensive now to run a car. Insurance can be £3,000 a year for an 18 year old, plus another £3,000 on a second hand car plus fuel...why bother? If one of their mates has a van, they'll just go round doing property maintenance work or go to the local housing development and graft down there for a week or two, couple of grand in their pocket and then on to the next job or go to Ibiza with the lads for a week.

Retail is also struggling with recruitment, for the same reasons I think.

 

[Gecko001]

If you want people who think that their future careers involves working in an office or at home in front of a computer and knowing all there is about social media computers etc, then advertise through all the online channels, but I suspect you do not want those people. So have you thought about trying to recruit people by targeting places where young people interested in cars and who have driving licenses might be? I am thinking motorsports events or autoparts shops. A simple "trainees wanted" sign outside your depots might attract a few people that are interested in applying for a job with your firm. Adverts in chip shops, or anywhere that does not involve online perhaps could get some interest as well. They might apply online eventually of course, but it is finding the right people in the first place seems to be waht is needed.

 

[IanSuth]

Unfortunately they have to drive from day 1

Not being silly but have you looked at the cost of driving lessons nowadays (£25-30 ph)

Also you are after someone who has learnt to drive in the last 1-3 years

For nearly 2 years of that there were no driving lessons / tests and when restarted they were well overbooked.

I have a 23 yo son and a soon to be 21 yo daughter, he took most of his lessons pre-pandemic then had to use a dodgy app to track down available test slots near him to be able to get a test last year. The daughter is riding a 125 on L-Plates, even getting the renewal of her CBT was hard enough.

I am not sure where you are based but having a car is wishful thinking for many late teens, if near London they need one ULEZ compliant (and other cities going the same way). So even if they get through a test after 10 hours of driving lessons (£300 + £23 theory test + £62 practical) then they need to insure (>£1k for a 1 litre banger with black box parked offroad) tax it and pay for fuel.

Now what are you paying them day 1 (as opposed to when they are qualified)

If you want a loyal decent worker why not take them on to work in a depot on an apprenticeship, offer to pay for driving lessons (my uncle learned to drive as a trainee mechanic way before he was allowed to take his test) with a claw back if they leave too soon

 

[Newchodge]

Unfortunately they have to drive from day 1

Why, if they are being trained up to do mobile fitting, not doing it from day 1?

 

[Blackford Biz]

Where have all the young people gone ? I have a trainee position for an 18 to 20 year old to learn the tyre trade working both in a depot and training up to working out on the road fitting after a year. I have, however, had very little response and those who have have either No drivers licence despite it being a requirement in the advert or don't want to work Saturday or Sunday. I started off as a trainee tyre fitter some 30 odd years ago and have built up to having 2 depots and 9 mobile vans but the younger ones today don't seem bothered about having a job. I am offering a permanent 40 hr week, not a zero hour contract job with a good rate of pay when trained £23-£25K for the job.
How are you all finding the job market with the younger ages

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

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Global effect of what your seeing

 

[MBE2017]

Personally I think there are plenty of youngsters looking for a decent job, but you just don’t see too many advertised.

Employers fail to advertise what they are after effectively, use language and terms no one else really uses, or are scared to say what the job entails since they know it is a shitty dead end job.

Not saying that applies to the OP, but most youngsters struggle to see a career, and only see a job being advertised. Who’s fault is that?

 

[IanSuth]

And remember to add to MBE2017's comment, what you see as positives in a job is not necessarily the same as for a 19 year old.

When you write a job ad you are SELLING so write it that way. What is your customer (a perspective employee) looking for, how is your job providing that (or a route to that)

There a few decent 19 yo's not at college and looking for work, you have got to find the one/s that are right for you and interested in you.#

It is likely they are not the academic ones (as they are steered to uni) so they are not going to be looking at the big online job sites - so maybe if you want someone with an interest in cars get down your local Car Cruise with one of your signwritten Vans and post a big copy of your advert (with few words and your mobile number) in it's window.

 

[BustersDogs]

Kind of agree on the driving thing. You want an 18 year old, who probably doesn't already have a job, to have a driving licence. Would you really want someone just passed their test driving your work vehicles? I have had success with young people in my business, but there is no doubt they do have more dinks and dents that those older! One guy passed his test while working for me, but I still made sure he'd had his first accident in his own vehicle, and had a year of experience before letting him out in my van! We drive dogs, so possibly you won't need to be that cautious, but if they are a trainee, why would they be sent out alone from day 1? Why would whoever is training them not be driving, unless they've lost their licence for some reason and the trainee is required to keep that person on the road? Just a guess, could be wildly wrong...


I feel it's complicated for young people now. What do they even learn to drive? With us being pushed to electric, is there even going to be still be the same test,, or will they have to redo it in 7 years time, are they in an area with charges and zones where they have to pay just to get of their own drive, or onto yours, maybe they figure just wait it out.

 

[MBE2017]

Have to say I’m not sure the OP has considered the insurance requirements for most insurance companies, the vast number of which make employing young drivers commercially uneconomic.

There is a reason most driving jobs require applicants to be 25 yrs old and above.

 

[BustersDogs]

There is a reason most driving jobs require applicants to be 25 yrs old and above.

Which is age discrimination and unlawful.

 

[Newchodge]

Which is age discrimination and unlawful.

Vehicle insurance companies have much higher premiums for those under the age of 25. Most won't give business use insurance. If that is unlawful, nothing has been done about it. It is perfectly reasonable to refuse to employ someone in a driving job if it is impossible to get insurance for them.

 

[BustersDogs]

Vehicle insurance companies have much higher premiums for those under the age of 25. Most won't give business use insurance. If that is unlawful, nothing has been done about it. It is perfectly reasonable to refuse to employ someone in a driving job if it is impossible to get insurance for them.

Ah, so we can ignore part of the laws on employment equality that we don't like? It's okay to discriminate as long as it's against young people?

There is a difference between impossible to get insurance and it being more expensive. I've had under 25s driving for me and it was perfectly possible to not only get insurance, but to get a reasonable price for it.

Perhaps other employers should just try harder.

 

[Newchodge]

Ah, so we can ignore part of the laws on employment equality that we don't like? It's okay to discriminate as long as it's against young people?

There is a difference between impossible to get insurance and it being more expensive. I've had under 25s driving for me and it was perfectly possible to not only get insurance, but to get a reasonable price for it.

Perhaps other employers should just try harder.

Most won't give business use insurance

It is perfectly reasonable to refuse to employ someone in a driving job if it is impossible to get insurance for them.

 

[Scubadog]

Where have all the young people gone ? I have a trainee position for an 18 to 20 year old to learn the tyre trade working both in a depot and training up to working out on the road fitting after a year. I have, however, had very little response and those who have have either No drivers licence despite it being a requirement in the advert or don't want to work Saturday or Sunday. I started off as a trainee tyre fitter some 30 odd years ago and have built up to having 2 depots and 9 mobile vans but the younger ones today don't seem bothered about having a job. I am offering a permanent 40 hr week, not a zero hour contract job with a good rate of pay when trained £23-£25K for the job.
How are you all finding the job market with the younger ages

The problem here is two fold

1) kids have to stay in education until they are 18. By 18 I had left school, dropped out of college, had a few jobs, been sacked from one or two and was finally ready to start figuring things out for myself.

2) who on earth would want a salary of up to £25k when trained in what is a relativelydead end job? Hardly inspiring when you are 18 and have the whole world before you!

 

[BustersDogs]

Is there new comments in there, or just repeats? Feels like I'm watching the BBC. I will also repeat - It is not impossible to insure under 25s. I will expand - yes probably main stream insurers who compete on price comparison sites will not. Luckily for those of us who are able to make the effort - other insurance providers are available.

But I'll leave it there for now. I see where this is going.

 

[Scubadog]

Is there new comments in there, or just repeats? Feels like I'm watching the BBC. I will also repeat - It is not impossible to insure under 25s. I will expand - yes probably main stream insurers who compete on price comparison sites will not. Luckily for those of us who are able to make the effort - other insurance providers are available.

But I'll leave it there for now. I see where this is going.

And what's the price difference you are paying between an 18 and 25 year old?

 

[UKSBD]

And what's the price difference you are paying between an 18 and 25 year old?

I was led to believe that you can't discriminate because it was more expensive.

i.e
if it cost £1,000 to insure for a 25 year old and £5,000 to insure for an 18 year old, you can't use it costing £4,000 more as a reason to discriminate against the 18 year old.

Probably wrong though if Newchodge says so, she tends to know more about these things than hearsay.

 

[MBE2017]

Which is age discrimination and unlawful.

No it’s not, please do not spout such nonsense. Insurers are well within their rights to charge a suitable premium based on data, elderly drivers premiums are different from middle aged, too youngsters under 25 etc.

Insurance companies cannot discriminate premiums on sex anymore, not that they ever did, and as a result female policies increased.

In your line of work you might charge more for a huge dog which you could only safely walk on its own, compared to small dogs, where you could safely walk several at once. Does that mean you are discriminating or being sensible with a commercial decision?

 

[Bob Morgan]

It seems as though we have yet another thread that has become a victim of Business Use Vehicle Insurance!

 

[Scubadog]

I was led to believe that you can't discriminate because it was more expensive.

i.e
if it cost £1,000 to insure for a 25 year old and £5,000 to insure for an 18 year old, you can't use it costing £4,000 more as a reason to discriminate against the 18 year old.

Probably wrong though if Newchodge says so, she tends to know more about these things than hearsay.

We are in business....the choice nor to hire a youngster due to insurance is based on financial costs and risks...not their age.

There is a difference.

Discrimination on age is illegal.

Choosing to hire someone else based on the financial costs and risks is not.

 

[Newchodge]

I was led to believe that you can't discriminate because it was more expensive.

i.e
if it cost £1,000 to insure for a 25 year old and £5,000 to insure for an 18 year old, you can't use it costing £4,000 more as a reason to discriminate against the 18 year old.

Probably wrong though if Newchodge says so, she tends to know more about these things than hearsay.

It depends on the type of discrimination.

Indirect discrimination can have a defence of justification. For example a requirement that all firefighters must be 5'10" tall is indirect sex discrimination as women tend to be shorter than men and fewer women than men can meet that requirement. However if the requirement were that they had to be able to carry a weight of 50 kilos, while men are more likely to meet the requirement so it is indirect sex discrimination, it may be justified if all firefighters carried, as part of their job, a weight of 50 kilos.

There is no justification defence for direct discrimination. So if you must be over 25 to get a job that is direct discrimination for which there is no justification defence. There is a defence of Genuine Occupational requirement - this is used if a Chinese restaurant advertises for Chinese waiting staff - if it is necessary for authenticity.

A requirement that someone has held a driving licence for 2 years is indirect discrimination on grounds of age, but could be justified if an experienced driver is needed. Similarly a requirement that someone must be capable of being insured by their employer to do their job would be indirect discrimination, so potentially justifiable.

However, the OP wants 18 - 20 year old staff. Which is direct age discrimination.......

Well, @UKSBD you did ask!

 

[MBE2017]

We are in business....the choice nor to hire a youngster due to insurance is based on financial costs and risks...not their age.

There is a difference.

Discrimination on age is illegal.

Choosing to hire someone else based on the financial costs and risks is not.

Just to add, when I had several drivers on my blanket insurance policy, if the company either refused under 25 yr olds due to excessive risks, or priced triple or more premiums, I am not going to cancel a good policy and pay a new much more expensive one, it would not be commercially viable.

All this woke nonsense has to stop, the world owes no one nothing. Firms want customers, it’s how they stay in business, why would they discriminate? Is this stupid argument going to apply to warranties. Should a one year old boiler cost as much as a fifteen year old boiler to maintain? Are insurance companies discriminating against cars, washing machines, boilers etc? Or just being sensible based on the data?

 

[IanSuth]

If you change 25 for 21 then you would find an awful lot of insurers have a blanket ban on under 21's in commercial vehicles - some also ban those with less than a certain amount of experience

I remember once our commercial division of the recruitment agency trying to help a guy who had joined the army and got an HGV class1 aged 18, when he left on medical reasons (which didnt affect driving) he was struggling as most companies couldnt look at drivers under 21 as in civilian life it is pretty much practically impossible to be qualified with experience by then so the insurers just didnt allow for it

 

[Casually made]

They haven't gone anywhere but the world has changed

If they aren't in uni doing some Mickey mouse course , Most will be stuck living at home with parents and will be until they are 30+ because our housing and rental markets are completely detached from all semblance of reality.

While this is demoralising what it means is younger people now have the luxury of picking what kind of work they want to do

They have no outgoings and probably little debt so there's no pressure to take some obscure work like tyre fitting.

As you have correctly pointed out the kind of applications you are getting are from desperate people that can't drive nor could probably afford to drive

 

[Bob Morgan]

While this is demoralising what it means is younger people now have the luxury of picking what kind of work they want to do.

Such as 'Thought Leaders in Diversity and Inclusivity?'

 

[Casually made]

Such as 'Thought Leaders in Diversity and Inclusivity?'

There is massive demand for content as most people spend on average 4 hours a day on their phones

Even now we are consuming online content

This can with a little effort and out the box thinking easily be monetised as many are doing

Pick a niche and talk about it long enough eventually you will have an audience , the world has never been more divided in opinion and culture

Like i said the world is a very very different place compared to 20 years ago

I jacked in my 9-5 in because i realised generating online revenue streams is literally endless and i realised sitting in an office for 40 hours at £14 an hour wasn't really making me happy or making the most out of my life

Many are coming to the same conclusions which is why employers are finding it so difficult to fill these arbitrary roles

Once A.I becomes more powerful a lot of jobs will cease to exist virtually overnight

 

[Bob Morgan]

Silly me for choosing a Profession! - I must prepare a Blog or a Podcast about it!

 

[IanSuth]

Once A.I becomes more powerful a lot of jobs will cease to exist virtually overnight

although i reckon tyre fitters are safe for as long as we have wheeled transport (EV's actually eat tyres faster due to higher weight and torque)

Can't see ChatGPT getting a recalcitrant bead over the rim anytime soon

 

[Gecko001]

Silly me for choosing a Profession! - I must prepare a Blog or a Podcast about it!

I think the time is fast approaching, if it has not come already, that a saturation point will be reached with blogging or podcasting. Writing more and more about less and less or less and less about things that really matter to most people just gets boring eventually.

 

[IanSuth]

I think the time is fast approaching, if it has not come already, that a saturation point will be reached with blogging or podcasting. Writing more and more about less and less or less and less about things that really matter to most people just gets boring eventually.

maybe the next growth area will be meta blogs blogging about a range of blogs blogging on a given subject