SEO is not a rip off

[JustOneUK]

Following on from recent threads....

SEO is not a rip off. If you open a website chances are you won't want to learn how to code the page first - if you do then you are probably looking at HOURS/WEEKS/ even MONTHS of learning...and how do you know what to learn first?

The same goes for SEO. If someone can SEO your site for you, structure a link campaign, do your keyword research and get you onto page 1 of the search engines.. do you really want to sit around learning all that stuff yourself?

The price that someone charges for their service is simply how they value themselves. If you choose to use ANY seo company you should investigate them first and possibly get a second opinion (be warned that SEO's like to b1tch* at each other, so that second opinion is hardly going to be awe inspiring)

If you decide to also use PPC, so be it. That is a form of ADVERTISING and should be used alongside any good marketing campaign.

My 2½ cents
James.

* just getting round the naughty word blocker

 

[Future Freak]

I don't think people are saying that all SEO's are rubbish - just that there are a lot of blaggers out there. The same goes for web developers. I know from 7 years of being a web developer that there are good people and bad people doing that job - ranging from proper pros down to someone with a copy of Dreamweaver and no ideas.

As someone who knows a little bit about SEO - I'd personally only want to pay an SEO for their results after 6months to a year and then the payment would have to be based upon results and not the supposed "work" done. Anyone who wants loadsa money upfront for grand predictions of results, is a blagger in my eyes.

 

[Steve2507]

As someone who knows a little bit about SEO - I'd personally only want to pay an SEO for their results after 6months to a year and then the payment would have to be based upon results and not the supposed "work" done. Anyone who wants loadsa money upfront for grand predictions of results, is a blagger in my eyes.

Excellent point (but I expect the "professional" SEO'ers won't like it. That is why we are hiring someone to help do it, but they will work for us only (i.e. on staff) with a bonus for results.

 

[Simon-M]

Snake oil is the way to go. forget SEO. Snake oil is the new Grey. Why worry about SEO when snake oil is so great. it gets you well above what the SEO's say you will get and it has beneficial results on your health.

How can you even think about SEO when snake oil is so much better for your results?

 

Excellent point (but I expect the "professional" SEO'ers won't like it. That is why we are hiring someone to help do it, but they will work for us only (i.e. on staff) with a bonus for results.

Totaly agree Steve ,thats why I only do 50/50 split on profits,and no upfront payments at all.

If it does not work then I lose my time and effort.

But if your that good there is not much risk providing you pick a viable product.

Earl

 

[An Oasis]

That is a form of ADVERTISING and should be used alongside any good marketing campaign.

And the marketing mix these days is???? A topic worth debating as sooooo much has changed from ye olde days.

 

[cmcridland]

As someone who knows a little bit about SEO - I'd personally only want to pay an SEO for their results after 6months to a year and then the payment would have to be based upon results and not the supposed "work" done. Anyone who wants loadsa money upfront for grand predictions of results, is a blagger in my eyes.

The problem with this approach is that if an SEO company is confident enough to work on a site for 6 months with no payment to only then be paid on a results basis why would they work on other peoples' sites? It's likely to be far more effective to develop websites in-house.

In my opinion this is the reason why it's so hard to find good SEO companies. As soon as they become really good they increase their fees hugely and/or begin to develop their own websites.

 

[wayzgoose]

Let's put the cat amongst the pigeons - anyone can learn the basics of SEO - good wording; keywords; page titles; simple things like not having main headings as graphics. The list goes on but it can be worked on yourself. You can often find that very small changes can have spectacular results and if you give that work to someone else you'll never know what they are. Just keep improving, keep checking the search engines and watch where those visitors came from and the keywords they used to find you. It's an ongoing thing that is equal in importance to the main subject of your web site.
Alan.

 

The problem with this approach is that if an SEO company is confident enough to work on a site for 6 months with no payment to only then be paid on a results basis why would they work on other peoples' sites? It's likely to be far more effective to develop websites in-house.

In my opinion this is the reason why it's so hard to find good SEO companies. As soon as they become really good they increase their fees hugely and/or begin to develop their own websites.

Well you raise a valid point,but often an SEO will not have either the skill for a given business or be prepared for the capital outlay on starting a business on there own.

It is also a benefit to have a partner or partners in order to lessen the work load.

Earl

 

[pws1970]

Make Poverty History! Cheaper SEO Now!

That's what you'll get soon enough : every web design / development firm and a few others claiming they'll do the job at a minimum of cost.

The end result : clients unhappy and the industry having to absorb the impact of more negative press.

Its a changing scene and you have to adapt to survive - we see ourselves as a seo / search marketing company now more than just someone who provides seo.

The other thing to remember when selecting an seo company is do they promise a guarantee on results met. That way both client and provider know the ground rules before the campaign begins.

 

[sm1]

One problem I found when speaking to SEO comapnies a few months back is that they won't pay on results as they have to pay their workers and they can't wait 6 months etc. That's what I found...personally I don't agree, but that's what they say.

Cheers

 

[I, Brian]

As someone who knows a little bit about SEO - I'd personally only want to pay an SEO for their results after 6months to a year and then the payment would have to be based upon results and not the supposed "work" done.

That sounds like a good policy - I'd like to hire your firm to provide webdevelopment and design services. Only I want to see the results of the work and how it converts first before I pay for these services.

Let's put the cat amongst the pigeons - anyone can learn the basics of SEO - good wording; keywords; page titles; simple things like not having main headings as graphics.

SEO is a specialist and full-time profession. If SEO were so easy that anyone could do it, there would be no such thing as SEO's.

I think the grand problem is that SEO covers different specialities:
http://www.internetbusiness.co.uk/20042008/seo-a-service-covering-many-specialities/

 

[Future Freak]

That sounds like a good policy - I'd like to hire your firm to provide webdevelopment and design services. Only I want to see the results of the work and how it converts first before I pay for these services.

Unfortunately, I'm not a web developer these days - I sell t-shirts. As soon as I start wildly claiming that wearing my t-shirts will get you "laid" by beautiful, sexy women, or that wearing my t-shirts will get you to the top/front of the queue outside Stringfellows on a Saturday night - then you can start paying me on a performance related pay.

 

[wayzgoose]

SEO is a specialist and full-time profession. If SEO were so easy that anyone could do it, there would be no such thing as SEO's.

Yes there would because people are lazy. They don't consider SEO work as part of the work needed to run a web site. And I stick to what I wrote - anyone can do it - it just takes effort.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Yes there would because people are lazy.

That doesn't make sense at all.

Why shouldn't a business owner delegate work to others?

Do you think Branson flies his own planes?

Steve

 

[I, Brian]

anyone can do it - it just takes effort.

I think someone investing most of their time in running a successful business it makes absolute sense to outsource key specialist tasks to specialists as required. Otherwise trying to take it all on board can just become very time consuming.

Also, as in the link I provided - sure, anyone can learn basic On Page SEO, but taking it a step further into the different specialities will be a waste of time and money to invest in for most businesses, because it's diverting resources from running the core business itself.

2c.

(I love the T-Shirts idea, though. ).

 

[JustOneUK]

And I stick to what I wrote - anyone can do it - it just takes effort.

I think I already said that in the ORIGINAL post... :|

The same goes for SEO. If someone can SEO your site for you, structure a link campaign, do your keyword research and get you onto page 1 of the search engines.. do you really want to sit around learning all that stuff yourself?

But why would you WANT to learn SEO?
Pay someone else to do it (and save yourself all that learning time) whilst you entertain your customers at cocktail parties and golf events, and make sales

 

Anyone can do SEO.?

Anyone with 2 hands and 2 eyes and the ability to remain vertical can become a brain surgeon.

so yes given sufficient training I would have to agree,just strange that there are very few of either.

Earl

 

[pws1970]

No one is doubting that anyone can do SEO!

Anyone can kick a ball but it takes dedication, talent and a lot of commitment to become a professional footballer ... and even in the professional grade there are various levels of competence.

In fact you could apply that analogy to any profession.

The question you should be asking is why certain companies / individuals excel in this profession and why others meander or worse tie companies into long contracts with little roi for their hard cash.

Edit : What I am getting at is you can't blame the service, in this case SEO, for the bad practices of companies / individuals.