How to get around this?

[Lucan Unlordly]

Part of our service to sports clubs includes their inclusion within our online search facility that enables people looking for the same to find the closest to them, based on post code area.

Search: XYZ Clubs in Telford for example and the levels of response vary widely. Some clubs appear first on Google, get dozens of enquiries, others less so, some zero, and this seems to be dependant on their own web presence, website, Facebook etc., Whilst that's understandable in some cases the sites and FB pages are seriously outdated, wrong phone numbers etc.,

Thinking this through, the only way I can see how our service could come up first on Google is to create a site that starts 'xyz clubs in' and hope that gives us a higher ranking up there with the clubs own presence.

Not sure if the above is very clear but all ideas welcomed?

 

[SEODEV#338055]

Do you see Google My Business as a threat or an opportunity?

https://www.google.com/business

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Do you see Google My Business as a threat or an opportunity?

https://www.google.com/business

Quizzical look!

Thanks, I haven't a clue what you mean but to clarify, the issue is not promotion of my company to existing customers, but promotion of our customers businesses in a way that trumps their existing web presence. I guess the closest thing I can think of is Trip Advisor which has the benefit of their being dozens of eg., restaurants that appear in a search. For ours, you may get a handful or just a couple.

 

[SEODEV#338055]

Quizzical look!

Thanks, I haven't a clue what you mean but to clarify, the issue is not promotion of my company to existing customers, but promotion of our customers businesses in a way that trumps their existing web presence. I guess the closest thing I can think of is Trip Advisor which has the benefit of their being dozens of eg., restaurants that appear in a search. For ours, you may get a handful or just a couple.

In that case Google My Business is an opportunity
https://www.google.com/business

Sign your clients up to Google My Business and add their website link

Google My Business will win anyway because it's top and it's daddy is the boss

If you can't beat them join them

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

In that case Google My Business is an opportunity
https://www.google.com/business

Sign your clients up to Google My Business and add their website link

Google My Business will win anyway because it's top and it's daddy is the boss

If you can't beat them join them

Sorry, I'm confused and really can't see how sharing our business with Google would help us?

Clubs that feature on our search engine receive membership enquiries as a result of their inclusion within the parts of our service that they currently pay for. Most don't put two and two together so by pointing out this additional benefit it secures their loyalty and could be brought into discussions should we ever choose to increase prices.
We could also demonstrate to potential new corporate customers - the benefits of inclusion within the broader offer. One club received 220 enquiries across 2 years which, in the unlikely event that they all joined and became paying members for 26 weeks would have realised around £38-£58k. Others received none.

We have spoken to clubs about reducing their web presence to allow our system to work better for them, but even those who's websites are dead, and in at least one case on Facebook the admin passed away 4 years ago, they still feature.

If this is an SEO problem, i'm not seeing it? Should we create a separate Trip Advisor type search engine and pay to keep it top of the rankings? I'm not sure we can at this stage. Should we stick to our guns and direct potential 'searchees' to our site via radio and specialist media?

 

[SEODEV#338055]

I'm just saying that Google My Business will rank top of Google for local business searches

A Google search search for 'gold clubs in telford' returns

1. The Shropshire Golf Course
2. Golf at Telford Hotel
3. Horsehay Village Golf Centre

All are Google for Business results

I better not say any more about Google, @Opinion87 might hear us

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

I'm just saying that Google My Business will rank top of Google for local business searches

A Google search search for 'gold clubs in telford' returns

1. The Shropshire Golf Course
2. Golf at Telford Hotel
3. Horsehay Village Golf Centre

All are Google for Business results

I better not say any more about Google, @Opinion87 might hear us

Effectively our competition then, although many of our customer clubs are voluntary led organisations with very little business structure.

 

[SEODEV#338055]

Sorry, I misread your o/p
Is your search engine similar to https://www.yell.com?

 

[Ozzy]

create a site that starts 'xyz clubs in' and hope that gives us a higher ranking up there

This would be the way I'd think of going in your shoes, but to clarify what SEO Dev was referring to is if I search "rugby club in northampton" and we ignore all the Saints listings COYS, a map does come up with a few local club listings from data in their My Business service. He's referring to you add listings there for all your clients, and in the website details of those listings you put the URL of their listing your site. That way people find the club they want and come to your site.

Personally I wouldn't do that, to give another perspective. You are not the club so I'm not sure you could do this really but also you'd need to maintain that listing and I think you want people to come to your site for the club info (which they'd get from the My Business listing without clicking the link to your site).

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Sorry, I misread your o/p
Is your search engine similar to https://www.yell.com?

Pretty close to that yes, but the type of service would be fixed, no drop down list, primarily as there are so many search engines that try to corral everything and end up with a small percentage of each rather than a comprehensive list.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

This would be the way I'd think of going in your shoes, but to clarify what SEO Dev was referring to is if I search "rugby club in northampton" and we ignore all the Saints listings COYS, a map does come up with a few local club listings from data in their My Business service. He's referring to you add listings there for all your clients, and in the website details of those listings you put the URL of their listing your site. That way people find the club they want and come to your site.

Personally I wouldn't do that, to give another perspective. You are not the club so I'm not sure you could do this really but also you'd need to maintain that listing and I think you want people to come to your site for the club info (which they'd get from the My Business listing without clicking the link to your site).

Thanks, I get it now but as per your second paragraph it could put us in uncertain territory and would only need a handful of clubs to go it alone and do their own to kaibosh our coverage.

 

[SEODEV#338055]

To quote your question:

Thinking this through, the only way I can see how our service could come up first on Google is to create a site that starts 'xyz clubs in' and hope that gives us a higher ranking up there with the clubs own presence.

The only way to guarantee first place on Google is through paid advertising

Indeed, the first result for the search 'telford golf club' is a Google advert for Telford Golf Club

Beneath the paid listings is the "Find results on" widget containing links to several directories, which are Facebook, Booking, Trip Advisor, Cyclex UK and Spa Breaks

From the sounds of it your directory is very similar to https://www.cylex-uk.co.uk/ therefore I see no reason why your search engine couldn't appear in these results, subject to meeting all the necessary criteria

Your search engine is highly unlikely to outrank the next section of search results, Google My Business, for local sports club listings

Why?

The whole purpose of Google My Business is to replace the untidiness of what you describe below, with streamlined information in a directory format so that customers can quickly find essential business information such as

Additionally, Telford Hotel And Golf Resort is a paid ad which appears at the top of the Google My Business listings

Some clubs appear first on Google, get dozens of enquiries, others less so, some zero, and this seems to be dependant on their own web presence, website, Facebook etc., Whilst that's understandable in some cases the sites and FB pages are seriously outdated, wrong phone numbers etc.,

Then we move to Google's organic search results which appear beneath the Google My Business listings

This is where your search engine finally has a realistic opportunity to rank, however you then come up against the official websites of your clients, which will undoubtedly improve over time because building websites is so easy now

I cannot see your search engine ranking above an optimised official website for singular searches 'golf club in telford' however it might rank for plural searches 'golf clubs in telford'

It's just not the same landscape for independent search engines as it was 5 or 10 years ago

Your search engine could offer clubs with either no website or a very badly designed website a page or mini site listing on your search engine, for a fee, and register a domain name for their listing

 

[SEODEV#338055]

He's referring to you add listings there for all your clients, and in the website details of those listings you put the URL of their listing your site. That way people find the club they want and come to your site.

Just to be clear @Ozzy is correct in what I was suggesting

However I would only recommend doing this with the express permission of your clients

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Your search engine could offer clubs with either no website or a very badly designed website a page or mini site listing on your search engine, for a fee, and register a domain name for their listing

We already do this, although the take up without huge investment in time and money to get the message across makes it unviable so we've created some free of charge test pages for a couple of our (very few) commercially minded clients. Being commercially minded they have good representation online, but only one or two enquiries via our search facility. That's the nub of our problem.
This prevents us from moving forward and engaging with more astute customers, as any claims we make as to enquiries made, and the numbers are very, very good, but vary greatly across our entire customer base. The reason we do very well in some instances is because our customers don't feature on Google, Cyclex etc.,

 

[SEODEV#338055]

Could you offer website design as an additional income stream for your business?

There are plenty of other related income streams such as corporate photography, drone videography, logo design, PPC, setting up Google My Business, copywriting

If you already have the clients, which is more than half the battle

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Could you offer website design as an additional income stream for your business?

There are plenty of other related income streams such as corporate photography, drone videography, logo design, PPC, setting up Google My Business, copywriting

If you already have the clients, which is more than half the battle

We could, but that's not what we do, or wish to do.

Our web guy is looking at capturing some additional search information that should allow us to determine whether club pages have been clicked on, even if formal enquiries have not been completed. If positive we can spin the results to our advantage.

 

[SEODEV#338055]

Please share what happens

I'm very interested to learn your general strategy for outwitting Google's own-brand monopoly of the search engine results pages

Of course there are other search engines

Bing and Yahoo! can send you a significant amount of traffic

To a lesser extent Duck Duck Go and others like Ecosia and Ask