Hello! My idea, your thoughts?

[Daniel Clifton]

Good evening,

I have an idea that is currently just that, and would appreciate your thoughts!

About me, I am a 38 year old painter and decorator, working for the family business full time for the last 12 years, but on and off since school holidays, in other words, a long time!

It is a well paid job if you are at the top of your game, a lot more difficult than many believe, especially in the construction industry where multiple trades are working alongside you. As a business, we mainly deal with commercial/retail/public service sectors, but as an individual, I have worked in many residential properties.

I am aware that as one of the unregulated trades, painting and decorating is something that can be, and often is, carried out by individuals and business owners themselves as a means to save money on a build or refurbishment, and sometimes because they actually enjoy it!

This is something I feel I could capitalise on, as it never ceases to amaze me as the tools these individuals purchase from the big name diy sheds, are, quite frankly terrible. As well as being difficult to use, the low cost usually results in tools being discarded once the project has ended, or instead stuck in a garage or shed never to see the light of day again, taking up valuable storage space.

My idea in a nutshell is a decorating tool hire service, providing the tools I swear by. The hire would include a drop off and pick up service, which even goes to the extent of washing the tools after use, so the hirer would only need to pack the tools away. The tools would be cleaned and checked on return and packaged for the next hirer. I would like to package this up so every tool required to redecorate a room of a residential property would be supplied.

The boxes would have a value of around £200, I was thinking of a hire price of around £40 per week.

This is something I feel I could do alongside my full time day job.

The positives to me with this idea would be the low start up cost, low risk, and is something I have plenty of knowledge for.

The positive to the potential customer would include the use of high quality tools that would almost certainly make the task easier, with a better quality outcome, the simplifying of an otherwise daunting diy project, and obvious eco benefits.

I would love to know what you think!

 

[Mr D]

Equipment hire - yes it works.
Worth looking what competitors charge and figure out what it would cost someone to buy all that stuff themselves - to show as comparison in your marketing.

Disadvantage - when stuff goes missing / person no longer answers door or phone.

 

[Mark T Jones]

What you are looking at here is an admin and distribution business. And there will be lots of both. losses, breakages, claims of 'it wasn't included'. Non-returns. ~On-site replacements.

Have you done research to see what segment of the DIY market appreciates the value of quality tools?

 

[BusterBloodvessel]

Sounds like a lot of work for little reward - when you factor in all the problems Mark mentions above.

Even without breakages/losses etc, just for the time alone of driving to someones house to deliver, driving back to collect, then cleaning everything up and reboxing it, it's a lot of work for £40.

I think it would generally fall inbetween the gap - i.e. if people want professional, they will pay a professional to do it. If they want it cheap, then they do it themselves and buy cheap stuff for exactly that reason. Not many people (IMO) actually enjoy decorating and would appreciate the value of good tools.

On top of that, some of the supermarket/Range/B&Q own brand stuff is just so cheap that it's disposable. If I'm flicking on a coat of magnolia and doing the woodwork in the spare room, I know that there's a reason I'm buying a paintbrush for 99p or whatever it is....and I know it'll probably just about get me through that job. You can get a pack of cheap brushes and roller set for what...£12 all in? I'll happily buy that, use it, and lob it in the bin at the end of the job, it's not even worth the hassle of trying to clean it (although not very environmentally friendly I admit).

 

[Deleted member 319791]

I'm a joiner and painted bedroom using bandm rollers and brushes. The whole lot got launched after I finished. Take that how you will.

 

[Financial-Modeller]

As cautioned previously, assume everything that you rent out will be lost, broken, or returned in a condition ("I'll be finished in 15 minutes guv - sorry its all covered in wet paint") that requires heavy cleaning and so will not be immediately available to hire to the next customer.

The time and effort to buy and replenish your stock, and travel to the customer's premises twice will not leave much profit from your £40 hire charge.

But if you're going to the trouble of finding a customer who is happy to pay for you to bring them the tools, why not sell them paint, brushes, cleaning materials, masking tape and other consumables too? A £40 profit on paint etc in addition to the hire charge of £40 might make it more worthwhile,

 

[Mark T Jones]

Sounds like a lot of work for little reward - when you factor in all the problems Mark mentions above.

Even without breakages/losses etc, just for the time alone of driving to someones house to deliver, driving back to collect, then cleaning everything up and reboxing it, it's a lot of work for £40.

I think it would generally fall inbetween the gap - i.e. if people want professional, they will pay a professional to do it. If they want it cheap, then they do it themselves and buy cheap stuff for exactly that reason. Not many people (IMO) actually enjoy decorating and would appreciate the value of good tools.

On top of that, some of the supermarket/Range/B&Q own brand stuff is just so cheap that it's disposable. If I'm flicking on a coat of magnolia and doing the woodwork in the spare room, I know that there's a reason I'm buying a paintbrush for 99p or whatever it is....and I know it'll probably just about get me through that job. You can get a pack of cheap brushes and roller set for what...£12 all in? I'll happily buy that, use it, and lob it in the bin at the end of the job, it's not even worth the hassle of trying to clean it (although not very environmentally friendly I admit).

funnily enough this very topic came up in a recent discussion on perceived value

on the odd occasion I have to decorate a view I tend to buy the cheapest of everything - with the exception of paint and cutting-in brush, where I go for high-mid market

I’d far rather throw away a brush/roller than clean one.

others will see things differently.

of course, with ‘single use’ becoming outlawed this might change.

 

[Chawton]

Upselling with a secondary product may well be where the margin is, longterm. Unlikely to be paint though unless you're prepared to offer a very extensive range. Unless people are going with magnolia or white they're likely to want what they've seen online on the F&B site/some glossy magazine/one of a dozen swatches from B&Q they're clutching and waving at you.

The single use/environmental angle might be where you slowly gain traction if thats how you position it though. Allied to a secondary product with margin that could be the basis of a business.

 

[Mr Monday]

You know your industry better than any of us, so you will know of the issues painters + decorators face. If this is a real big issue as you say, then you should have no issues getting customers as painters are all over the net. Maybe conduct some market research and find out if other painters face the same issue.

I would say take the problems mentioned above by the other members and figure your way around them (that's if it's worth it).

Breakages/lost items -Maybe take a deposit (again, if it's worth it).

Drop offs pick ups - Have you considered your distance? Are you local only? Deliveries maybe? Factor in the price can it work?

Is £40 enough? Will people pay £40? Make it worth the price provide different packages as different painters may require different items for different jobs.

But as you said low risk, so give it a shot but consider all possible issues and find solutions, again if it's worth it

 

[The Byre]

It's not a starter because there are whole brush and roller kits for less than £40 that the punter can just buy and then file under 'bin'.

BUT

I can tell you where there is untapped hire potential in your game - hi-tech machinery. Having spent most of my working life in Germany where labour costs are high (it costs about €50k to put just €20k in a man's pocket - and €20k will not be nearly enough!) everything that can be automated is automated. On coming to the UK, I was horrified to see people plastering and painting by hand! I could hardly believe the builder when he said it is cheaper to build a scaffold and paster and paint the walls by hand, than to use a remote machine!

In the UK we still have guys crawling into roof spaces dragging rolls of Rockwool behind them, instead of just blowing insulation chips into the roof spaces using large machines. The chippy hand-built the door frames and had to cut out all the holes for handles and locks! If that man were to cost £500+ a day, a ready-made and pre-hung door with frame that installs in a few minutes for £120 looks mighty attractive!

Wage costs are rising steadily and will rise even faster, so anything that saves a building company on labour costs (remember insurance, holidays, time spent/wasted on H&S routines, sickies, admin, etc., etc.) has a future, particularly if it is expensive and used seldom.

 

[Chawton]

It's not a starter because there are whole brush and roller kits for less than £40 that the punter can just buy and then file under 'bin'.

BUT

I can tell you where there is untapped hire potential in your game - hi-tech machinery. Having spent most of my working life in Germany where labour costs are high (it costs about €50k to put just €20k in a man's pocket - and €20k will not be nearly enough!) everything that can be automated is automated. On coming to the UK, I was horrified to see people plastering and painting by hand! I could hardly believe the builder when he said it is cheaper to build a scaffold and paster and paint the walls by hand, than to use a remote machine!

In the UK we still have guys crawling into roof spaces dragging rolls of Rockwool behind them, instead of just blowing insulation chips into the roof spaces using large machines. The chippy hand-built the door frames and had to cut out all the holes for handles and locks! If that man were to cost £500+ a day, a ready-made and pre-hung door with frame that installs in a few minutes for £120 looks mighty attractive!

Wage costs are rising steadily and will rise even faster, so anything that saves a building company on labour costs (remember insurance, holidays, time spent/wasted on H&S routines, sickies, admin, etc., etc.) has a future, particularly if it is expensive and used seldom.

Granted Dragon's Den is principally entertainment, but this seems to be the one sector where-even where a problem and solution is identified-nobody seems to have the stomach for investment. Thinking seems to be there is just too much resistance to any sort of change in the construction industry.

No doubt someone will crack it one day but it'll probably be more down to luck/favourable timing than anything else because as you say, the tech is already out there.

 

[The Byre]

there is just too much resistance to any sort of change in the construction industry.

On our last build, I was amazed to see plasterers still mixing plaster and spreading the stuff by hand on the walls and then a team of P&D came to paint it white. Time was wasted building scaffolding instead of just using a cherry-picker. The chippy used a hand-saw to cut the roof beams. The pipes were hand-soldered and copper instead of plastic self-locking. Every electric junction box used grub-screws instead of push-n-tug self-locking connectors. The wires were stripped with a Stanley knife instead of using automatic wire-stripper. Every door and frame was hand-built. The outside render was mixed on-site with stones and thrown onto the walls with a trowel.

The only real difference to an Elizabethan building site was the presence of a few power tools, breeze-blocks and a cement mixer! Plumb-lines, string, buckets and trowels - all that was missing was deliveries being made by yoked oxen pulling wooden carts and even the builders of the pyramids would have felt right at home!

But I have learned that it is pointless to criticise. If you say "But why don't you use ready-made white render and blow it on with a machine?" you can end up with an enemy for life and a whole building site full of people muttering under their breath about 'fancy ideas'.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

I learnt a lon g time ago that a house takes 2 men to build in Cornwall but 27 in France. The 27 in France all have different trades, machinery and skills and everything takes less time & money.

 

[GolHiii]

The idea is quite interesting, because if repairs are carried out and people want to save money, then it is probably more profitable to rent individual tools than to buy.

But there are questions of this kind:

• a separate tool or several will go on rent for $ 40
• what will be more profitable for the client to buy these tools or rent - here you need to look at the cost and study the market

 

[Daniel Clifton]

Thank you all for taking the time to reply.

I had an idea the general consensus would be that it is difficult to look past the cheap tools available in places like B&M and Wilkos etc, thus rendering them virtually disposable. As I mentioned in my opening post, even the most eco conscious of us would put these tools away with the INTENTION of using again, only to discover they hadn’t been stored / cleaned properly, therefore only being good for the bin anyway!

What I am thinking of offering is ALL the tools required to complete the redecoration of a room, this includes things like filling blades, dusting brush, caulk gun and more, the hirer would only need to think about materials.

Regarding a secondary product which would provide a larger margin, I have access to what we call mis-tints, paint ordered incorrectly or simply over ordered. This could be made available alongside the hire of the box of tools, as long as the customer isn’t too fussy, they would receive trade quality paint at a fraction of the cost. This would strengthen the eco angle, which plays a large part in this whole idea.

This idea was born whilst thinking about all the power tools I have in my garage but use rarely, as I believe there may be rental possibilities with those too. It is however, just an idea which I believe could supplement my income at the beginning (thinking purely local for the time being), with the opportunity to scale it up if it proves popular.

As far as I am aware, there is nobody currently offering anything remotely close to what I have proposed. There may be a reason for that obviously!

 

[MBE2017]

I worked with a paint wholesaler for a year recently, personally I don’t think this would work. Most tools for painting are very cheap, even professional quality, many pros just bin rollers and brushes these days rather than clean them.

As you say, you know no-one else offering this, and I think I know why. With roller sets available from under £5, sets of brushes under £15, even paint is relatively cheap, though the trade deals in high quality paint for the finish and time saving element.

Basically £40 would be enough for most people to do two rooms buying and throwing the tools away.

 

[brianj_hill]

Good evening,

I have an idea that is currently just that, and would appreciate your thoughts!

About me, I am a 38 year old painter and decorator, working for the family business full time for the last 12 years, but on and off since school holidays, in other words, a long time!

It is a well paid job if you are at the top of your game, a lot more difficult than many believe, especially in the construction industry where multiple trades are working alongside you. As a business, we mainly deal with commercial/retail/public service sectors, but as an individual, I have worked in many residential properties.

I am aware that as one of the unregulated trades, painting and decorating is something that can be, and often is, carried out by individuals and business owners themselves as a means to save money on a build or refurbishment, and sometimes because they actually enjoy it!

This is something I feel I could capitalise on, as it never ceases to amaze me as the tools these individuals purchase from the big name diy sheds, are, quite frankly terrible. As well as being difficult to use, the low cost usually results in tools being discarded once the project has ended, or instead stuck in a garage or shed never to see the light of day again, taking up valuable storage space.

My idea in a nutshell is a decorating tool hire service, providing the tools I swear by. The hire would include a drop off and pick up service, which even goes to the extent of washing the tools after use, so the hirer would only need to pack the tools away. The tools would be cleaned and checked on return and packaged for the next hirer. I would like to package this up so every tool required to redecorate a room of a residential property would be supplied.

The boxes would have a value of around £200, I was thinking of a hire price of around £40 per week.

This is something I feel I could do alongside my full time day job.

The positives to me with this idea would be the low start up cost, low risk, and is something I have plenty of knowledge for.

The positive to the potential customer would include the use of high quality tools that would almost certainly make the task easier, with a better quality outcome, the simplifying of an otherwise daunting diy project, and obvious eco benefits.

I would love to know what you think!

How would you position yourself against other tool hire companies? There are some big names out there. What about actually providing an education / consultancy service and show people the tricks of the trade? You could add tool hire and to this as an option. You could also do a phone service where you could field questions when people have problems.

 

[estwig]

What would happen when a client uses your best badger hair gloss brush for acrylic primer, outside in the sun and dirt.

The bristles dry out, the brush splays, even though it can be cleaned it won't cut in and it won't give a level gloss finish again.

The punters will kill your kit and they won't even know they are doing it!

 

[Darren_Ssc]

As others have pointed out, a bloke doing his own decorating rarely appreciates the value in proper tools. He'll do a fairly poor job with very cheap tools and then pat himself on the back because he's saved paying some other bloke a few hundred quid to push a roller up and down.

On the other hand, that same bloke will pay someone £150 to fit an outside tap and think nothing of it.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

I learnt a lon g time ago that a house takes 2 men to build in Cornwall but 27 in France. The 27 in France all have different trades, machinery and skills and everything takes less time & money.

In Spain it takes 3 men and 1 dog. One to keep the angle grinder going, spewing out as much dust and noise as possible; another to bang something with a big hammer (for no particular reason), and a jefa to tell the client it will be finished in 2 weeks. The dog will just sit in the van barking.

 

[Mitch3473]

I learnt a lon g time ago that a house takes 2 men to build in Cornwall but 27 in France. The 27 in France all have different trades, machinery and skills and everything takes less time & money.

It would have to take less time....start, 09.59...dinner 11.59 - 14.01, home 15.59 (exactly)

 

[ExoPaul]

Crazy idea, but why hire it and not sell it?
Create a box that contains all the necessary equipment you know will be needed and is good, and a manual on tips, tricks, maybe a link to a video course on Youtube on how to paint/decorate using the equipment (people love to Youtube how to do it), and sell the entire box rather than hire it.

If you can get the price for the stuff right down to say £99/box I am sure people would rather buy an all-in-one box that has everything in it, in good quality, ready to go and only need to buy paint.

Of course, the hardest part is sourcing the stuff cheap enough to profit of the box, but people do like an "all in one" box they just buy and use. It doesn't need to be just a box of tools and supplies, but the best paints you recommend you could sell, basically position yourself as an expert that can provide all the stuff required for a simple one-off price.

Who wants to socially distance and queue outside B&Q for half an hour, to try and buy a load of cheap brushes, rollers, masking tape, etc, only to forget half of what you need, and find the brushes are a bag of rubbish, when you can spend £99 or so, and have everything you need delivered to your door.

 

[Gary Howard]

That's a great idea, get all the kit you need, doesn't have to be pro quality, Brush, roller, masking tape, brush cleaner, maybe even filler. Box it all up in professional packaging and sell it as a kit. QR code the packaging with a link to a web site or your you tube channel, an hey presto. I'd buy one all day long instead of looking for tape, cleaner, a decent brush ect. The DIY enthusiast will love it.