Customer threatening to leave all the time

[Ben Anderson]

I run a web design/seo business. I currently have a customer who usually threatens to leave at least every month at some point. We currently charge them £299 a month to host both websites, provide SEO for the two websites and provide technical support.

I would say there 'niche' is very highly competitive. I have explained on numerous occasions, that SEO takes times. They have been with us for a year, and their main website is in the top 3 local listings and always in the top 5 on around 3 highly competitive keywords. The other website in fairness is still taking some time (this one we have run for about 7 months) but we will get it to page 1 under highly competitive keywords I reckon in a month or two.

Throughout the first year the person at least threatened to quit (and did twice and didn't pay the full amount and quit on months we carried out the SEO). I created a new contract for them this year, so they would have to at least give me 1 months full notice to quit (because they always quit near the end of the month, so they didn't have to pay for the SEO). Yes, it did take nearly a year to get the main website stable on page 1, but these are highly competitive keywords in a large city.

Yes, they can be a bit of a nightmare, but £299 would be a fair chunk to take out my monthly wage suddenly. I am just wondering if you think we have offered a fair deal, and how we should deal with this situation as they are threatening to quit once again!

 

[Mr D]

Why hold them with you if they want to leave?
Is the hassle you have with them worth that much? Can you not get more customers to replace them?

 

[Socio South West]

......in a large city......

As much as a Customer is entitled to take his business elsewhere, a Supplier is quite entitled not to supply a Customer.

You say you are in a large city... I'm sure there are other businesses around that would spend the relatively modest amounts you mention for these popular services, and it wouldn't take a lot of marketing effort to replace the £300/month in all probability if the hassle they are causing is too stressful

The very fact the customer hasn't gone away, and has accepted the new contract with you says that they are happy with what you are doing, and are just grumbling for the sake of grumbling which is sadly the nature of some customers.
It sounds as if the customer's business relies quite heavily on the website, so as long as the contract says that non payment will lead to withdrawal of services... ie website hosting..... you effectively have them between a rock and a hard place, so as to speak.

 

[fisicx]

Let them go. It’s not worth all the hassle. A couple of weeks of adwords will easily find you a new client to fill the gap.

 

[Annoying Donkey]

Ben, you seem to be attracting the worst of the worst... probably something to do with your price point.
Try creating a premium brand. And get yourself away from the bottom feeders. Life is short... they're really not worth it.

 

[tony84]

I would personally sit down with them, show them what you have done with the first site and the more recent sites.

Put in plan some sort of time frame, give yourself a month or two buffer.

If they are happy with that, tell them that you do not want to hear them threatening to quit every month prior to that date because it does nobody any good.

Personally, if I had a customer threatening to leave I would drop them like a hot potato because I life is too short to be stressing but at the same time, I also remember when I started out and £300 was a decent chunk of money - it still is. This month I have turned away 2 customers and over £2k in income because one I would not trust as far as I could throw and the other spoke to us like something on his shoe. Part of business (once you are up and running) is not being afraid to turn away customers you do not want.

There is obviously a risk you will lose them, so you would need to be prepared for that. To be fair if a company is happy for you to do 2 months work and walk away from paying you - do you really want them as a customer?

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Why are you not offering PPC services to them if they really want quick results. Its of little use telling someone out of the industry that SEO is a long term thing when they probably think a long term thing is 2-3 months

Put it to them than maybe holding back on SEO for two months and spending the money on local PPC would be worth trying

 

[FutureM]

Agree with others, not worth working with customers like that. I'd say get rid of them when you can..and then rethink your price point. If an SEO told me they would work on 2 competitive market websites for £299 a month I wouldn't hire them. Not saying you should artificially inflate your prices but think what your time is worth, for £299 id assume you would be giving me maybe half a day to a day of work a month.

 

[STDFR33]

It's difficult to find better work for better clients when knobbers like this sap all of your time and energy.

I'd get rid.

 

[Mitch3473]

Get rid...He's either genuinely not happy with your work ( why is he still with you ?? ) or he's trying it on. I think the latter. It's not an easy decision to make in your early days but you have set a benchmark. Yes, it's a fair chunk out of your earning but he will cause you more hassle than it's worth when you can be spending better time and earning more with other clients.

 

[DavidWH]

(because they always quit near the end of the month, so they didn't have to pay for the SEO).

Charge them a month in advance. No point doing the work, and not getting paid.

Take a look at GoCardless to take the payment from the customer each month.

In this instance... sack them off. It'll feel amazing

 

[ethical PR]

I agree you should have payment terms where your clients pay monthly in advance.

And that you should let this client go. Use your SEO and other marketing skills to bag yourself a better client.

 

[Talay]

Agree with others, not worth working with customers like that. I'd say get rid of them when you can..and then rethink your price point. If an SEO told me they would work on 2 competitive market websites for £299 a month I wouldn't hire them. Not saying you should artificially inflate your prices but think what your time is worth, for £299 id assume you would be giving me maybe half a day to a day of work a month.

Really ? £3600 a year for what should be a few hours work here and there but not every week or month. 2 hours a month would be 24 hours a year at £150 an hour. Multiple by 100 and you are getting somewhere.

I don't think you could sell me a SEO idea which would get me to pay £1k plus a month without actually being willing to be paid upon results.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Its strange that so many well earning seo experts state get rid of him yet have nothing to help address the person paying the bill not getting satisfaction

Are his expectations to high, and who advised him to go this route and was it the best route to his needs, Is his site crap at selling?

SEO in itself is not that skilled a job for most small companies(i.e. Not degree level) , but very time consuming and learning from help available online so can be done inhouse by most people with a little common sense

I appreciate that some people are excellent at their job and can demand very high prices, but there are also a hell of a lot of cowboys who see it as easy money for little if any real work

 

[Annoying Donkey]

SEO in itself is not that skilled a job for most small companies(i.e. Not degree level) , but very time consuming and learning from help available online so can be done inhouse by most people with a little common sense

So why did your business close...?

 

[FutureM]

Really ? £3600 a year for what should be a few hours work here and there but not every week or month. 2 hours a month would be 24 hours a year at £150 an hour. Multiple by 100 and you are getting somewhere.

I don't think you could sell me a SEO idea which would get me to pay £1k plus a month without actually being willing to be paid upon results.

Im not sure i quite understand your angle, do you mean an seo should charge £299 a month for 24 hours work over the course of a year? I agree that's great earning for the SEO but terrible for the client. I would go with an SEO that presents a clear strategy and their day rate.

 

[Nathan Hill-Haimes]

Always best to chat things through. Get their viewpoint and take the feedback into your business and act on it

 

[Chris Ashdown]

So why did your business close...?

Expanding into a large building that did not bring the sales we expected but drained cashflow

 

[TODonnell]

...

Throughout the first year the person at least threatened to quit (and did twice and didn't pay the full amount and quit on months we carried out the SEO). ... (because they always quit near the end of the month, so they didn't have to pay for the SEO). ....

You already have your answer.

- Find other client's to take this one's place, then let him go, politely, and/OR charge him double the amount if he wants to stay with you.

 

[G7VIX]

I'll give you more than £300 p/m....

But tell me this can you do online advertising - facebook / search engine marketing etc and make me profits?

I can set up online retail websites dropshipping from China in nearly every retail category makeup / clothes / watches / snartphones etc

The marketing is what I need to study yet but I'm looking for a 10/10 marketing guru to take care of it all for me.

 

[Andrew_P]

Why hold them with you if they want to leave?
Is the hassle you have with them worth that much? Can you not get more customers to replace them?

Agree

 

[jamesandjanie]

Sorry to hear, sometimes the client does that to get a better deal or to make us work harder. But they're your bread and butter client so try to keep them. For SMEs we usually don't have much choice.

 

[paulears]

I'd also consider ways to prevent any material that is 'yours' being appropriated if it's your IP, and not theirs - it's bound to go badly, so if they owe you, you need to retain control of the site until your outstanding dues are paid and you are happy to pass it all over. In essence you need to retain power until you are happy - and then you can hand over any code and access facilities - don't let them reverse this and lock you out.

 

[Mr D]

Sorry to hear, sometimes the client does that to get a better deal or to make us work harder. But they're your bread and butter client so try to keep them. For SMEs we usually don't have much choice.

We have choices, sometimes the choices are sub optimal no matter what we try.
Not spending a load on time and effort on one client leaves time to get new, better clients. Keeping problem client regardless is asking to waste time and effort.
At some point they may indeed leave of their own choice and the OP is back to seeking new, better clients.
Do that by the OPs own timing or the client's timing? That's basically what it boils down to.

 

[KarenBridges]

That's a very fair deal, and if you can stay on top for a very competitive kw in a big city, you'll easily find someone who pays you way more than 300.

 

[Ashley_Price]

The problem is some clients think if they keep complaining they will get ever cheaper fees, etc. "They dropped their fees by 20% last time, if we complain again and threaten to quit, they might drop them even more".

If this is really causing you stress then, as others have said, let them go. I understand £299 a month is a lot of money, but what is that compared to the pressure you are always under having to deal with him.

Back in my Call Answering days we had one client who owed quite a bit of money, but when the month was up, he said he had been very unhappy with the service (listing a whole load of supposed problems) that in the end, I told him he didn't have to pay and we'd cancel the contract.

Twenty-four hours later the same client rang up and said he wanted to sign up with us again, but his caveat was, if he wasn't happy with the service, he wouldn't pay. This smelt fishy to me and I felt he was probably going to be away for a few weeks, needed his phones answered, would run up another large bill, then say he wasn't happy.

So, I turned him down. At this point he going very irate, demanding that we take him back, calling me unprofessional, etc.. I still refused, so he started putting up negative reviews about the service on Google, FreeIndex etc. Fortunately, I had enough very happy clients who were only too willing to write a true testimonial of our service, meaning the "fake" one was buried somewhere on page 3 of the reviews.

Nowadays, I do still have one typing client, who is quite demanding, often when she is in the wrong. For example, just yesterday she called saying she hadn't received some of her work - which we had completed and sent to her by post three weeks ago. She was very unhappy that we hadn't got the work to her... however, what she forgot was she must have received the work, because in the meantime, she had paid the outstanding amount on the invoice that was enclosed with the work!

However, I keep her on, because she pays a very high rate for her typing (she has been our highest-value client for "per hour" rate).

 

[Scribe Copywriting]

It sounds like it's not a happy relationship for either side. They might look like a £299 a month client, but if they're late/unreliable payers and if you're spending lots of your time trying to fire-fight with them and justify your costs all the time, then they're probably worth much less than this to you.

Spend your precious time and energy helping clients that actually value what you do, and don't let clients like this drag you down to their level. Ogilvy was famous for firing any client that threatened staff morale, and he did just fine!

 

[Agarwood]

Like it or not the £300 you do each month is at risk - and it will bug you.

Use that to motivate you to replace their business.

Because the month he doesnt pay will almost certainly be a month you need it.

Most marketing is a gamble.

SEO is more quantifiable in its results that a lot of other forms.

And its probably galling because you've done the hard yards.

So you need to work out what the value of your work is worth to him against his spend.

Personally id always buy a tenner for a fiver.

Then as someone has said move them onto advance payment and a longer contract or let them go.

 

[aaron web designer]

£299 for maintenance and SEO for two websites is a good price for the client! Although depends on what keywords you got them ranking for. Tell them to find some quotes from other SEO EXPERTS and they will realise the true cost!

 

[aaron web designer]

Also, just want to point out that clients like this come and go. Never rely on the monthly income received from a client and don't get disheartened if they leave. It happens in this business! I've had clients close their business or retire that paid around £900 a month!

 

[roxanneus]

I wouldn't keep them as my customer anymore, obviously they will never be happy. You know how hard you work for SEO so why should you have the hassle?

 

[HostXNow]

Yes, £300/month can be a lot to SMEs.

Either way, the client is genuinely not happy with your work or they're trying it. You should know after some time which one it is.

Were you upfront about the work you would be doing and how long it would take? But if it is taking longer than expected then the customer has a right to be a little upset and they are free to threaten as much as they like.

If they are just trying it and they are getting what they paid for and the constant back and forth of it all with constant threats is getting to you then it is up to you to cancel the contract with them.

You may also suggest PPC to get them results quicker for an additional cost. Also, maybe there is a communication issue? Maybe they genuinely don't understand what you are telling them and you need to communicate that better to them?

Personally, I really don't get SEO and it seems to be hit and miss. I haven't done any major SEO or paid anyone to do SEO for us, yet we rank good for many keywords. There has been a time I tried to rank for certain keywords but only managed to get shown after first 2 pages. I'm still surprised a lot of people pay for SEO because there is no guarantee that can get you ranked for a keyword on the 1st page of Google, right? How to know who the real SEO gurus are? There are too many claiming they can work magic but they are shady. I'm also interested to know of SEO experts at UKBH...

To me, it sounds like a lot of that £299/month is being spent on the hosting and you aren't charging much for the SEO itself if you truly are spending many hours doing on/off site SEO, etc.

In short, maybe you just need to charge a little more?

 

[Mitch3473]

Look at it another way....I dont know what your margins are but lets say 30% net profit. Is this client worth £100 a month, £25 a week in grief. Take the high ground, it's a great feeling.

 

[estwig]

Take the high ground, it's a great feeling.

Certainly is, a real buzz sacking a client, then an even bigger buzz by spending the time you would have wasted on some loser client, by finding a new happy client.

 

[MBE2017]

Had a similar situation today myself, client threatened to leave for the second time in two weeks. I simply offered to sort out the problem once he told myself what it was by email, or he could go. I also mentioned I was dealing with a family emergency and had no further time to talk, needless to say he sent an email, which I will deal with tommorow.

 

[Anderz]

It seems like your customer has a problem understanding what you do and how it benefits.

That is like a computer tech making sure a company never has any data loss and charge for the service. Or motor oil in your car. Why do I need it? Why am I paying this? And what for?

As a SEO service you can explain that their amount of visitors from Google is due to your service and if their website is not converting to sales enough then it would be hard to see the effect you do. That is properly the reason here. Or the wrong keywords to use in SEO.