Brexit negotiations

[Deleted member 59730]

But we DON'T WANT THEM. They don't have white skins. They are not welcome in England except as servants. Why doe no-one understand this fundamental issue?

This is exactly the argument I had with a neighbour in 2016. He voted to leave to "stop these Pakistani and Afghan rapists coming here.

Haven't spoken to him since.

 

[Newchodge]

This is exactly the argument I had with a neighbour in 2016. He voted to leave to "stop these Pakistani and Afghan rapists coming here.

Haven't spoken to him since.

It is similar to those who voted leave and did not understand why that would have any effect on their next door neighbour who is Italian, much-liked and welcome to be here.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

It is similar to those who voted leave and did not understand why that would have any effect on their next door neighbour who is Italian, much-liked and welcome to be here.

What real effect will it have had, apart from a small amount of form filling to be done, I agree there was some worry i guess, until we confirmed the future of existing EU citizens but that was very early solved

 

[Ian J]

It is similar to those who voted leave and did not understand why that would have any effect on their next door neighbour who is Italian, much-liked and welcome to be here.

Why are we still harping on about why people voted either to leave or remain as we have left and people should be discussing ways to make the most of the opportunity and not continually harping back to the past

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Why are we still harping on about why people voted either to leave or remain as we have left and people should be discussing ways to make the most of the opportunity and not continually harping back to the past

Because, sadly, its an indicator of what sort of country we have become.

 

[Mr D]

Some have a rather strange idea of what year they are in.

 

[thetiger2015]

Why are we still harping on about why people voted either to leave or remain as we have left and people should be discussing ways to make the most of the opportunity and not continually harping back to the past

You...don't see...the irony in that statement?

Harping back to the past is exactly the point of Brexit. To go back to a time before we joined the EU, is it not?

As for making the most of opportunities, that completely depends on where the opportunity lies. Is it much easier to export to the EU now? Is it much easier to import from the EU? I'm talking about SME size, where you rely on couriers and small haulage firms to ship goods and components. Brexit has made it easier.....right?

Also, I see a lot of people saying 'we can trade with the rest of the world, you can buy from somewhere else now' - pray tell, which countries were we not able to trade with before this? I could buy from China, Indonesia, US, EU members......I don't remember seeing any bans in place?

Also, the buying from other countries thing kinda doesn't hold water geographically. I can get stuff from the EU within 2 or 3 days. It's a considerably longer lead time shipping from China/US/Indonesia and the costs have gone up, because of the extra paperwork to get stuff through. How did this solve the red tape problem? We have more red tape?

So, it's all very well saying we should be positive and pro active, we should just sell lots and lots because we now have the whole world to sell to. Well, we were already doing that, without any issues. I can't think of many countries we couldn't sell to....maybe Iran?

 

[Ian J]

You...don't see...the irony in that statement?

Harping back to the past is exactly the point of Brexit. To go back to a time before we joined the EU, is it not?

No irony at all but we should all be looking forward not bleating about what might have been as it's pointless just going over the same old arguments forever and a day

 

[Mr D]

You...don't see...the irony in that statement?

Harping back to the past is exactly the point of Brexit. To go back to a time before we joined the EU, is it not?

As for making the most of opportunities, that completely depends on where the opportunity lies. Is it much easier to export to the EU now? Is it much easier to import from the EU? I'm talking about SME size, where you rely on couriers and small haulage firms to ship goods and components. Brexit has made it easier.....right?

Also, I see a lot of people saying 'we can trade with the rest of the world, you can buy from somewhere else now' - pray tell, which countries were we not able to trade with before this? I could buy from China, Indonesia, US, EU members......I don't remember seeing any bans in place?

Also, the buying from other countries thing kinda doesn't hold water geographically. I can get stuff from the EU within 2 or 3 days. It's a considerably longer lead time shipping from China/US/Indonesia and the costs have gone up, because of the extra paperwork to get stuff through. How did this solve the red tape problem? We have more red tape?

So, it's all very well saying we should be positive and pro active, we should just sell lots and lots because we now have the whole world to sell to. Well, we were already doing that, without any issues. I can't think of many countries we couldn't sell to....maybe Iran?

Doesn't matter if its easier or harder now.
We left.

By our own choice.

Now having left we have to deal with the opportunities and problems we see. This trade deal is what we have. We either stick with it or move business to somewhere we don't have to deal with it.

Most of us one way or another chose to stick with it. So far.

Those as want the old system back of easy movement of goods and services can move into the EU and carry on getting all those. Though perhaps could have moved years ago... would have been easier.

 

[Clodbuster]

I'm a glass full kind of guy and struggling to see why everything is going to be so much more expensive. I do export to Canada, Russia, Congo, South Africa, Kenya, Australia - so a reasonable range of countries and all we do is supply an invoice to the courier and off it goes. Click a button, print it, sign it - perhaps 30 seconds. I will simply have to do that for EU sales now, and I guess the other way in - no biggie. Boss of Tesco has stated that the cost of importing should not be noticeable
I read somewhere that we did 65% of out exports to the EU and is now about 40% - not such a great market then.

 

[Mr D]

I'm a glass full kind of guy and struggling to see why everything is going to be so much more expensive. I do export to Canada, Russia, Congo, South Africa, Kenya, Australia - so a reasonable range of countries and all we do is supply an invoice to the courier and off it goes. Click a button, print it, sign it - perhaps 30 seconds. I will simply have to do that for EU sales now, and I guess the other way in - no biggie. Boss of Tesco has stated that the cost of importing should not be noticeable
I read somewhere that we did 65% of out exports to the EU and is now about 40% - not such a great market then.

We will still buy and sell with EU - we were going to even with WTO deal never mind this one.

Adding a percentage to the import price or not (with UK setting the percentage) is no different than when EU set the percentage.

The media make it sound like a bit of extra paperwork or adding 10 percent for example to import cost will massively increase retail price.
As business owners we should know different.

Heck, biggest difference at the moment I can see is the shipping cost increase from overseas. Far more impact than the trade deal on retail pricing.

 

[The Byre]

Remember how @Clinton and others said the EU would not be able to live without London's finance industry?

you people said there'd be a disaster for our financial services. Now that it's been predicted that our financial services will boom you're trying to argue that this boom is a disaster because it could have been a bigger boom if we Remained?!

On Monday, the first trading day of 2021, public data on exchanges pointed to London having lost 45% of the volume of stock that would have gone through the City at the end of last year. About 6.3 billion euros ($7.7 billion) of shares that would have traded in London changed hands in the EU.

Taking other financial business of even greater economic significance will be next on Europe’s agenda.

The departure of EU stock trading from the British capital wasn’t unexpected. Soon after the 2016 U.K. vote to leave the single market, the financial services industry started preparing for the worst. Sidelined in the trade discussions, it quickly became apparent that finance would lose unfettered access to the bloc, leaving firms with little choice but to set up EU bases to serve the region’s clients. Late last year, some big banks shifted large chunks of their balance sheets across the Channel.

Trading will inevitably migrate to where investors can get the best deal. If EU clients had to move their business, it was inevitable that their financiers would follow. Why would a US or Chinese investor keep trading EU stocks in London if that’s not where they’d be getting the best price?

The ease with which the EU has been able to take control of share trading will encourage Europe to pursue yet more business and not feel obliged to do a deal with London for the March deadline.

OK - that was just one day. But everyone I talk to is telling me that trading business is fleeing the City without great difficulty.

We'll see what happens next!

 

[MBE2017]

The City is going to thrive IMO, both the Eu and other markets grew year on year, the EU portion grew the slowest. Naturally the EU want this business, but much will be by UK operations simply opening offices in the EU.

Meanwhile, the City can forge ahead as they see fit, and with the products and services they offer already in high demand they will probably replace that lost business within a year or so, if not earlier.

If it was terribly bad, don’t you think they would have factored into account regarding share prices and exchange rates considering this is their market? Yet the FTSE and exchange rate have both risen, when both were supposed to plummet according to remoaners.

People have to stop trying to use every single news story to run this country down, it will take months, possibly years before anyone can claim true credit one way or the other with their predictions. Even the EU calculate their GDP share of the world market is going to reduce significantly, so allying ourselves with newer emerging markets which are set to boom in comparison might make very good economic sense long term. If we grab the opportunity.

 

[Clinton]

Remember how @Clinton and others said the EU would not be able to live without London's finance industry?

They can't

On Monday, the first trading day of 2021, public data on exchanges pointed to London having lost 45% of the volume of stock that would have gone through the City at the end of last year. About 6.3 billion euros ($7.7 billion) of shares that would have traded in London changed hands in the EU.

You are probably referring to this FT article. Note that the FT is and always has been hard-core Remainer! They are always moaning and they have consistently been wrong (like the IMF).

But, yes, trading in Euro shares moved to the EU. What did you expect? Euro share trading is a tiny, tiny part of what the city does, and I don't believe anyone here predicted that euro share trading won't move. There's also been movement in assets. It'll take a year or two before things settle down (irrespective of any equivalence negotiations going on).

Remember all the big banks and financial institutions that gave us so much BS about jobs moving to the continent etc etc? Read this: London retains finance jobs as Brexit fails to deliver blow to the City

Why do you think they haven't moved jobs?

Now the FT agrees ...though they still find the black lining to the silver cloud: the job losses will still come ...in the future! Yeah, right, we remember all their predictions about what would happen on the day after a Yes vote in the referendum! They were wrong then. We remember all the job losses they predicted in the months AFTER the referendum. They were wrong then, too.

So they've learned to hedge their bets. Now they're finally admitting that London could still thrive and do even better than before now that the finance sector is not shackled by EU rules. Duh! A great thinker and sage predicted this years ago. You'll find his predictions in a forum called UKBF if you search for the name Clinton.

Bear in mind that over the years the EU played dirty in many ways to cobble London and to move business to places like Paris and Frankfurt. London is now free to innovate and become even more successful. Ride that train instead of standing on the track waving a red flag! That's futile.

 

[The Byre]

You are probably referring to this FT article.

Bloomberg had a longer and fuller article on this subject. Same difference though.

A great thinker and sage predicted this years ago.

Ah yes, that sage.

Well, we all know where the sage goes! (With the onions of course!)

We could quote articles back and forth until the cows toddle back to the barn, but only time will tell whether some impecunious hack at City-AM, Bloomberg, or the FT is right or if the gloom and doom-sayers like Peter Schiff, Ray Dalio, Jim Chanos and Caren Reinhardt - who predict the collapse of the US money system - are to be believed.

e.g. https://www.cityam.com/city-set-for-minimalistic-agreement-in-crunch-uk-eu-financial-services-talks/

What cannot be denied is the ever-growing importance of the Euro. Five years ago, all gas and oil exports from Russia to China were done in Dollars. Today just 30% are dollars and 60% are Euros - the rest in a mixed bag of currencies. Them's those petro-dollars (aka Euro-Dollars) that we kept hearing about. They are all drifting back into the US, looking for value. Hence the absurd US asset-inflation we are seeing right now.

My take on that here - https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/byretorial-think-of-a-country.410300/

First houses, then bonds, then stocks, then commodities, then (surprise, surprise!) general inflation.

House prices go through the roof - but the Fed says there is no inflation.
Share prices go through the roof - but the Fed says there is no inflation.
Commodity prices go through the roof - but the Fed says there is no inflation.
Food prices go through the roof - but the Fed says there is no inflation.
In 2007 the Fed said that sub-prime mortgage bundles (CDOs) were stable. Later chairman Ben Bernanke (CNBC interview) admitted that they only said that to keep a lid on the coming disaster.

i.e. they were lying.

MMT (Modern Monetary Theory - or More Money Today! Take your pick!) is a myth and a dangerous one at that. And this government, the BoE and the Fed are wedded to MMT like it was a liferaft. Printing money can only go one way. There is no magic that keeps a lid on an over-supply indefinitely.

London/The City exists on the coattails of the dollar. i.e. Fugazi. Pixidust.

Fiat currencies are not the economy. They are a human construct. A mathematical calculation, like derivatives and synthetic CDOs and MBSs. Fugazi! Pure Fugazi.

And that goes for the Euro and that fancy new Chinese digital wallet, the DCEP, as well.

You write a number. I wite a number. You write a bigger number. So I write an even bigger number. So you write just as big a number. Now we go and find some sucker who will exchange our numbers for something real. One day, he gets some smarts, looks at our numbers and says "Gentlemen, those are just numbers!"

That day is coming fast! And when it does, all this squabbling about Brexit will be irrelevant. Brexit, along with government ineptitude and the lies of central banks, combined with falling productivity and the C19 hysteria will be just another factor in the destruction of the UK economy.

That's the REAL UK economy. Uncle Joe's corner shop and Aunty Floe's B&B. The butcher, the baker, the candlestick maker.

Banking is just rhyming-slang for what them City Boys are really doing.

 

[Clinton]

You won't get any argument from me on fiat money, CDOs, QE, meaningless numbers, the coming disaster!

Today the S&P hit a new all time high. The FT100 is going gang busters as well. It's like coronavirus and lockdowns and major chains going bust and the whole country coming to a standstill ...never actually happened.

But those matters fall outside of the Brexit discussion.

 

[The Byre]

You agree with me! Me agree with you! We even exchange 'likes'! This is turning into an insidious lovefest!

Time for some robust criticism of Brexiteers. I shall follow the advice and example of PG Wodehouse and resist (in his essay 'Critics and the Criticised') and not call a Brexiteer 'You potbellied louse.' or even ''You piefaced child of unmarried parents.' - tempting as that may be.

He does however recommend taking a robust and even belligerent approach -

"Your opinion, let me add, would carry greater authority with me, did I not know, having met people who (with difficulty) tolerate your society, that you still owe Moss Bros. for a pair of trousers they sold you in 1946 and that the lady who presides over the boarding-house which you infest is threatening if you don't pay five weeks' back rent soon, to throw you out by the seat of them. May I be there to see it. That you land on something hard and sharp and dislocate your pelvis is the sincere hope of
Yours faithfully, Clyde Weatherbee."

Heartwarming as that might be, the whole thrust fails to meet (in my opinion) the needs of this discussion. Too much invective and emotion, if you ask me.

And people get upset about some of the most absurd things - you should read the more unrestrained comments coming from 'The League for the Protection of Bearded Swimming-Pool Attendants' to realise how emotion can cloud judgment.

One only has to write something slightly witty about an animal and soon forums and blogs everywhere are filled with stuff like "I was shocked and horrified by your recent, uncalled-for and thoroughly tasteless comments on the porcupine!"

Wodehouse once wrote an article comparing the intellect of wallabies with that of tennis players and was immediately attacked by 'Friends of the Wallaby' and by tennis fans.

He replied, "I have never met a wallaby, so cannot say from personal knowledge how abundantly or poorly equipped such animals are intellectually. While the average run-of-the-mill wallaby is perhaps not an Einstein, it would never dream of bounding about the place shouting 'Forty love' and similar ill-balanced observations."

I did meet a wallaby once at Whipsnade Zoo when quite young. I was young. The age of the wallaby remains uncertain. The wallaby stole my cucumber sandwich.

 

[simon field]

Oh please - get a room you two!

 

[Deleted member 59730]

“We bought a €47 [£42] shelf from Next for our bathroom,” said Thom Basely, who lives in Marseille. “On the morning it was supposed to be delivered we received an ‘import duty/tax’ demand for over €30, like a ransom note. It came as a complete surprise.”

How many people not reading a newspaper out there?

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ope-hit-by-post-brexit-charges-buying-from-uk

 

[Newchodge]

“We bought a €47 [£42] shelf from Next for our bathroom,” said Thom Basely, who lives in Marseille. “On the morning it was supposed to be delivered we received an ‘import duty/tax’ demand for over €30, like a ransom note. It came as a complete surprise.”

How many people not reading a newspaper out there?

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ope-hit-by-post-brexit-charges-buying-from-uk

Unless they red them online, the newspapers will be in French, which may be an issue.

 

[Clinton]

we received an ‘import duty/tax’ demand for over €30

Oh, no, Thom from Marseille had to pay over 30 yourows? We better cancel this whole Brexit thing!

I saw that piece in the Gaurdian yesterday morning and was wondering how long it would be before someone grabbed at that straw It took you till 2.34 PM? You're slower than usual @atmosbob. Is that one of the side effects of Brexit?

You should trawl through today's articles, there's stuff there about some lorries queuing, about DPD cancelling deliveries to the EU (well, it's only till 13/01, but some cancelling is better than none, right?), about perishable goods going off, about the UK seeing a 10% drop in notifications about EU criminals.... lots of really serious stuff!!

Oh, one more thing. Andrew in Aberdeen is really unhappy that he has to convert pounds to euros when he makes his first visit to Spain this summer. He blames it on the English who voted for Brexit. "Why can't I use my pounds in Spain?" he demands to know. And he adds, "it's breaching my human rights!"

 

[simon field]

In other news, the potholes near my village have gotten worse, which must also be the impact of Brexit?

 

[Scalloway]

The Scottish fishing fleet are discovering the sunlit uplands of Brexit are farther away that they thought.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55583244

Scottish seafood exporters say they have been hit by a "perfect storm" of Brexit disruption, which could sink a centuries-old industry.

"These businesses are not transporting toilet rolls or widgets. They are exporting the highest quality, perishable seafood which has a finite window to get to markets in peak condition," said Donna Fordyce, chief executive of Seafood Scotland.

"If the window closes these consignments go to landfill."

She said the sector has already been weakened by Covid-19, the closure of the French border before Christmas as well as "layer upon layer" of problems associated with Brexit.

The group fears that without exports, the fishing fleet will have little reason to go out.

"In a very short time we could see the destruction of a centuries-old market which contributes significantly to the Scottish economy," added Ms Fordyce.

 

[Mr D]

The Scottish fishing fleet are discovering the sunlit uplands of Brexit are farther away that they thought.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55583244

Scottish seafood exporters say they have been hit by a "perfect storm" of Brexit disruption, which could sink a centuries-old industry.

"These businesses are not transporting toilet rolls or widgets. They are exporting the highest quality, perishable seafood which has a finite window to get to markets in peak condition," said Donna Fordyce, chief executive of Seafood Scotland.

"If the window closes these consignments go to landfill."

She said the sector has already been weakened by Covid-19, the closure of the French border before Christmas as well as "layer upon layer" of problems associated with Brexit.

The group fears that without exports, the fishing fleet will have little reason to go out.

"In a very short time we could see the destruction of a centuries-old market which contributes significantly to the Scottish economy," added Ms Fordyce.

Of course having a WTO deal would have produced - worse results for them?

Or are they wanting to influence the 2016 Brexit referendum over 4 years after it took place?

 

[Scalloway]

The fishing industry was comprehensively conned into thinking that Brexit would stop boats from other EU countries fishing in UK waters while everything else would continue as before. Nobody considered what the other effects would be in reality.

 

[Newchodge]

The fishing industry was comprehensively conned into thinking that Brexit would stop boats from other EU countries fishing in UK waters while everything else would continue as before. Nobody considered what the other effects would be in reality.

I think everyone was comprehensively conned over Brexit.

 

[Mr D]

I think everyone was comprehensively conned over Brexit.

You mean you voted the way you did based on someone lying to you????

Perhaps next time don't get conned. Figure out the questions and the answers yourself based on facts.

 

[MBE2017]

Inward investment last year, more investment from foreign companies in the UK, than the rest of the EU put together. It would appear foreign companies have a lot more faith in the UK than some forum members do.

In the news, the French are trumpeting about their new computerised customs system, which the guy running the port of Calais says can easily handle 10,000 vehicles per day, something the French and EU claimed was impossible during project fear in the run up to Brexit.

As usual, where there is a will, you can find a way.

 

[RobinBHM]

Inward investment last year, more investment from foreign companies in the UK, than the rest of the EU put together. It would appear foreign companies have a lot more faith in the UK than some forum members do.

In the news, the French are trumpeting about their new computerised customs system, which the guy running the port of Calais says can easily handle 10,000 vehicles per day, something the French and EU claimed was impossible during project fear in the run up to Brexit.

As usual, where there is a will, you can find a way.

FDI to UK down 19% since 2016
Forecast to drop 36% this year.

UKs frictionless marketplace has shrunk from $19trillion to $2.5trillion.

It seems if you put up significant trade barriers....you become less attractive to business.

Who,d a thunk it

 

[RobinBHM]

Oh, no, Thom from Marseille had to pay over 30 yourows? We better cancel this whole Brexit thing!

I saw that piece in the Gaurdian yesterday morning and was wondering how long it would be before someone grabbed at that straw It took you till 2.34 PM? You're slower than usual @atmosbob. Is that one of the side effects of Brexit?

You should trawl through today's articles, there's stuff there about some lorries queuing, about DPD cancelling deliveries to the EU (well, it's only till 13/01, but some cancelling is better than none, right?), about perishable goods going off, about the UK seeing a 10% drop in notifications about EU criminals.... lots of really serious stuff!!

Oh, one more thing. Andrew in Aberdeen is really unhappy that he has to convert pounds to euros when he makes his first visit to Spain this summer. He blames it on the English who voted for Brexit. "Why can't I use my pounds in Spain?" he demands to know. And he adds, "it's breaching my human rights!"

Oh dear, Clinton is looking rather desperate these days

It just goes to show....there really is no good way out of a rabbit hole.

 

[RobinBHM]

I am very disappointed, it hasn't been at all Sunny today, nothing has been lit up at all.

Kind regards
Robin from Uplands

 

[DontAsk]

FDI to UK down 19% since 2016
Forecast to drop 36% this year.

Lies, damn lies and statistics.

A cynic would say you cherry picked the 2016 figure due to the massive increase over 2015. If you take anything between 2010 and 2015 as the baseline then things look very different.

I will even give you the source for the data https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/foreign-direct-investment

Nice try, but no prizes.

 

[The Byre]

It seems if you put up significant trade barriers....you become less attractive to business.

According to an article in the Telegraph (hardly a bastion of rabid 'Remain' sentiments) the Road Haulage Association has told them that trucks that formerly charged €1.50 a km per load now are charging €10 (as they don't expect to get a return load and must cope with border delays) and expect the load to have all relevant paperwork completed.

Richard Burnett, RHA chief executive, added: “Hauliers are raising their prices for trips to the UK because of fears about disruption, getting held up by new paperwork and a lack of certainty that they can get ‘backloads’ for the return journey to make it worthwhile.”

Further underlining exporters' frustrations, he said his own organisation’s customs brokerage has been “inundated by traders and hauliers who haven’t been able to get customs brokers to do their paperwork”.

Exporters desperate for the forms to be completed but lacking the necessary expertise have been offered four times the normal rate, Mr Burnett said.

However, he warned the customs brokerage industry did not have the capacity to meet demand needed despite the premiums being offered, meaning this would “reduce trade”.

The RHA said it had been told by its European peers, including those in Poland and Romania, that “traders in their countries are not supplying the UK as they cannot understand what, where, or how to arrange export or import paperwork”.

Mr Burnett said: "If British companies can't work out the paperwork, what hope have foreign firms got?"

The warnings come amid reports of supermarkets beginning to run out of some imported fresh foods, and empty shelves in some Irish stores which rely on goods transiting through the UK.

Ireland and NI can always get stuff via Cherbourg.

 

[thetiger2015]

Inward investment last year, more investment from foreign companies in the UK, than the rest of the EU put together. It would appear foreign companies have a lot more faith in the UK than some forum members do.

In the news, the French are trumpeting about their new computerised customs system, which the guy running the port of Calais says can easily handle 10,000 vehicles per day, something the French and EU claimed was impossible during project fear in the run up to Brexit.

As usual, where there is a will, you can find a way.

See, this is also where Brexiteers get it wrong. When they say things like 'lot more faith in the UK than some forum members do' <<<< that's not the point. I don't have faith in the government. I don't think they're capable of making Brexit a good thing. I think almost everything they do is to the detriment of being successful. They can't even organise free school meals properly - have you seen what they've spent tax payers money on? A couple of spuds and a yoghurt for £30! The UK government are awful with taxpayer money, they don't know how to invest it properly, they spend too much on things that cost pennies. They're dreadful at managing our national finances.

Inward investment? Yeah, it's good. It's private investment from foreign sources though and there's been some movement from US companies buying in to the UK market, not out of the goodness of their hearts but because they're looking to replace EU 'stuff' with US 'stuff'. You don't invest in something to help someone else, you invest for your own profit. I'd rather see some data on the increase in exporting now. How well are we doing on that front? Are we now exporting to Indonesia, Brazil, India etc? That would be British companies expanding using British money and opening up new markets for on-going exports. That is what I want to see.

French Computerised System - 10k vehicles per day, yeah, it's good but is it actually working right now? Is it live? It was impossible at the start but they've had 4 years to build the system. 20 years ago, it was impossible to watch tv on your phone or have driverless cars.

Project Fear - no, that's a newspaper headline that Brexiteers grip hold of to shout at people who have questions. If the questions had been answered by the government with published answers and information, Project Fear would cease to exist. Lots of questions still remain unanswered - you can see this by trawling this forum. Lots of questions about NI, importing/exporting problems, things the government should have been responsible for sorting out but have failed to do so.

Lots of the problems we are seeing now will eventually be solved. It's just more proof that what the government say and do are two different things. They distract and deflect, they don't want to be blamed for anything, so they blame haulage companies or businesses for not being prepared. It's impossible to be prepared when you don't know what you're preparing for. The government advice has been mixed and everything is last minute, as per usual. They don't know what they're doing with COVID, they don't know what they're doing with Brexit, they don't know what's happening at the ports. They're too busy with car crash interviews and messing about with people drinking coffee in a park.

 

[Clinton]

Lots of the problems we are seeing now will eventually be solved.

So what the hell are you lot still whinging about? FFS!

 

[simon field]

See, this is also where Brexiteers get it wrong. When they say things like 'lot more faith in the UK than some forum members do' <<<< that's not the point. I don't have faith in the government. I don't think they're capable of making Brexit a good thing. I think almost everything they do is to the detriment of being successful. They can't even organise free school meals properly - have you seen what they've spent tax payers money on? A couple of spuds and a yoghurt for £30! The UK government are awful with taxpayer money, they don't know how to invest it properly, they spend too much on things that cost pennies. They're dreadful at managing our national finances.

Inward investment? Yeah, it's good. It's private investment from foreign sources though and there's been some movement from US companies buying in to the UK market, not out of the goodness of their hearts but because they're looking to replace EU 'stuff' with US 'stuff'. You don't invest in something to help someone else, you invest for your own profit. I'd rather see some data on the increase in exporting now. How well are we doing on that front? Are we now exporting to Indonesia, Brazil, India etc? That would be British companies expanding using British money and opening up new markets for on-going exports. That is what I want to see.

French Computerised System - 10k vehicles per day, yeah, it's good but is it actually working right now? Is it live? It was impossible at the start but they've had 4 years to build the system. 20 years ago, it was impossible to watch tv on your phone or have driverless cars.

Project Fear - no, that's a newspaper headline that Brexiteers grip hold of to shout at people who have questions. If the questions had been answered by the government with published answers and information, Project Fear would cease to exist. Lots of questions still remain unanswered - you can see this by trawling this forum. Lots of questions about NI, importing/exporting problems, things the government should have been responsible for sorting out but have failed to do so.

Lots of the problems we are seeing now will eventually be solved. It's just more proof that what the government say and do are two different things. They distract and deflect, they don't want to be blamed for anything, so they blame haulage companies or businesses for not being prepared. It's impossible to be prepared when you don't know what you're preparing for. The government advice has been mixed and everything is last minute, as per usual. They don't know what they're doing with COVID, they don't know what they're doing with Brexit, they don't know what's happening at the ports. They're too busy with car crash interviews and messing about with people drinking coffee in a park.

Government bashing is SO easy, but you see - it’s not up to the government to make a success (or failure) of your business, it’s up to YOU!

The conditions are the conditions, and Johnson et al don’t trade, businesses do! If you want to sell stuff then sell it, and if you want to buy stuff then buy it. Don’t expect the government to hold your hand in everything you choose to do in life.

Try to adopt a ‘can do’ attitude, you’ll be amazed at what you can achieve

 

[The Byre]

Government bashing is SO easy,

Bashing this government is especially easy! I lived through Wilson and Callahan and Heath, so I know what inept and useless governments look like. I thought the tax policies of Wilson were the height of stupidity and foolish adherence to lunatic doctrine, I thought the arrogant bluster of Callahan and the vacillating ineptitude of Heath was about as bad as a leader gets, but this lot really do take all the prizes!

it’s not up to the government to make a success (or failure) of your business, it’s up to YOU!

This country was full of thriving industries that were making a success of their businesses. Governmental belligerence and sheer, undiluted inability to see the consequences of their multiple mistakes and lack of basic understanding of business and economics soon put a stop to all that.

May I remind you that Brexit was THEIR idea! THEY wanted it! But they said -

1. It will be easy.
2. The UK will easily get trade deals with the rest of the world (30 so far, so another 133 to go compared to what they had before).
3. No border in the Irish Sea.
4. Free and seamless trade with the EU.
5. Regain control of fishing.
6. Banking will be unaffected.
7. Parliament will have ample time to debate the deal (not the 13 hours that it got).
8. The UK will save £350m a week by not having to pay for free-market access.

The dweebs that Johnson sent to Brussels to negotiate a deal were out-maneuvered on every issue and had to roll over to get any sort of a deal - even to the point of giving EU citizens greater visiting rights to the UK than UK subjects get to the EU.

This whole farce has turned into a master-class in how to force an entire government into capitulating totally.

 

[thetiger2015]

Government bashing is SO easy, but you see - it’s not up to the government to make a success (or failure) of your business, it’s up to YOU!

The conditions are the conditions, and Johnson et al don’t trade, businesses do! If you want to sell stuff then sell it, and if you want to buy stuff then buy it. Don’t expect the government to hold your hand in everything you choose to do in life.

Try to adopt a ‘can do’ attitude, you’ll be amazed at what you can achieve

Hmmm...yeah...'can do' doesn't magically allow us to export/import through the EU/N Ireland without extra cost does it?

You're suggesting that it is completely the fault of UK businesses that they're struggling with import/export issues through the EU at the moment. I'm struggling to see where I was personally involved with negotiating the EU deal?

It seems as though you were personally involved in negotiating though, so I'd like to know why DPD are having problems with paperwork? We were told it would be frictionless trade? So, can you explain why you negotiated all of this extra red tape? I was told it would be as easy as pie, no issues, products would sail through customs and arrive at their destination. Can you clarify all of the extra documents now required?

 

[simon field]

Believing what you were told by a bunch of incompetent fibbers isn’t my problem!

 

[Deleted member 59730]

2. The UK will easily get trade deals with the rest of the world (30 so far, so another 133 to go compared to what they had before).

Actually you don't need a trade deal to trade with the whole world. I traded with Greece and Spain before they joined the EU. I've traded with Australia, Kuwait, Nigeria and others outside the EU.

I can say one thing. Trading inside the EU was a damn sight easier than trading outside it.