2.64 Million people in the UK unable to work!!!

[An Oasis]

Astonishing, absolutely bloody astonishing. Some of these people are claiming invalidity benefits for seriously spurious reasons including acne, obesity... can you believe it? And this is before we talk about the lazy scum suckers who just use it as a supplement to their cash wages.

Damn is it only me that wants to publicly flog some of these people?

 

[Songbird]

Meh. I've always thought fair enough. If they're going to bed happy every day then that's something a lot of people don't have. Working for working's sake is stupid; if it doesn't make you happier then why not just kick back and claim whatever the state will give you?

(If anyone's interested, I've never claimed income support or jobseekers' allowance and am currently too lazy to bother filling in the housing benefit form on my coffee table)

 

[Richie N]

Doesn't surprise me at all, some are even told they are better off on benefits by Social Security and to cut their working hours!!

 

[Alice3537]

I get annoyed by it - but many employed people get annoyed by the self employed people who don't declare all of their earnings!


(shall I put the spoon away now???)


(ooops, better add that the comment was in no way a slur on anyone here!!)

 

[INDIZINE]

Yes there are thousands of ebayers not declaring their earnings from sales. Last I heard from a person working at HMRC, it was 40 sales and over you needed to declare (apparently regardless of cost per sale). Im not sure what the position is on it these days.

 

[dave_n]

It doesn't help when the benefit system encourages people not to work. We all know people who bend the system to their advantage.
There's no skill in getting pregnant to different partners but the state seems to encourage young gilrs to do it!

Benefits should be like any other system..if you put nothing in you get nothing out.

When my wife asked for maternity benefit 12 years ago with our first child she was told she couldn't have it because she had missed 2 self employment contributions. We offered to back pay but they wouldn't do it.

I now owe the nat ins a lot of money...and when they ring me up or send letters I tell them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine.

rant over!

 

[Blush]

Astonishing, absolutely bloody astonishing. Some of these people are claiming invalidity benefits for seriously spurious reasons including acne, obesity... can you believe it? And this is before we talk about the lazy scum suckers who just use it as a supplement to their cash wages.

Damn is it only me that wants to publicly flog some of these people?

Yes, sorry but my part time job is to help these customers, I se first hand what the majority are actually going through.
I have not come across one single person claiming incapacity benefit this month with acne or obesity. No, I have several with cancer, a few severe alcoholics with liver failure, a recovering drugaddict trying to put his life back together, quite a few under our local mental health team as suicide has been attempted, severe degenerative diseases, learning difficulties,
paranoid schizophrenics, bipolar, severe arthrits , two customers who havelost theri eyesight, and the number of young people with severe mental health conditions who are terrified to even leave the house is scary.Then try sitting watching someone taking a genuine panic attack.
So please don't stereoptype these people and don't believe the hype.To become a useful part of society again they need help and support to get there not flogging.

 

[KM-Tiger]

Astonishing, absolutely bloody astonishing.

Not astonishing at all. NuLab's policy has been to move the unemployed into invalidity to make the unemployment figures look better.

Checked the real rate of inflation lately?

Lies, damned lies, and NuLab spin.

 

[Alice3537]

Yes, sorry but my part time job is to help these customers, I se first hand what the majority are actually going through.
I have not come across one single person claiming incapacity benefit this month with acne or obesity. No, I have several with cancer, a few severe alcoholics with liver failure, a recovering drugaddict trying to put his life back together, quite a few under our local mental health team as suicide has been attempted, severe degenerative diseases, learning difficulties,
paranoid schizophrenics, bipolar, severe arthrits , two customers who havelost theri eyesight, and the number of young people with severe mental health conditions who are terrified to even leave the house is scary.Then try sitting watching someone taking a genuine panic attack.
So please don't stereoptype these people and don't believe the hype.To become a useful part of society again they need help and support to get there not flogging.

I think the clue in the message was when the OP said "Some of these people".

I honestly don't think it was intended to be a diatribe upon those who genuinely claim. As a partner of someone on disability benefit, I can certainly state that stories of this nature make me mad - about the people who do play the system.

 

[INDIZINE]

I worked in JC+signing on long term (2yr+) unemployed including incap claimants, and whilst there were some very genuine incaps, the JSA claimants were more than fit though many did lack self confidence and motivation to get themselves out of the rut of watching Trisha (now replaced with Jeremy Kyle for those of you that work!)

The irony is that the real scammers are actually working and blatantly sign on wearing their work boots!

 

[Mrs Malapup]

I get annoyed by it - but many employed people get annoyed by the self employed people who don't declare all of their earnings!

People dont do that..do they???

 

[Blush]

I know, I just get sick sometimes when they are constantly attacked thats all. It does get to you after a while when you working with these type of customers and you are listening to all their problems .Especially when they are desperate fro help and our mental health teams tell you ther eis a year long waiting list unless they decide to try and top themselves!
Just got on my high horse for a bit sorry

 

Hi Blush,

I very much admire your commitment and passion.

That's all I've got to say...

 

[saracen]

There is a person living near me, he is on invalid benefits - why? Because he has an ingrown toe nail ! I kid you not. like WTF

Thats just one person i know in my area, there are loads with all reasons you'd never believe. Sickening.

Damn "wenny works".

If they were truely in need of government financial assistance then fair doo's. One of my relations is riddled with arthritis, he gets plenty benefits -thats fine cause he's a genuine case, but deary me -some of the folk who milk the system. Unbelieveable so it is.

 

[Alice3537]

People dont do that..do they???

Of course not!

 

[Cornish Steve]

Working for working's sake is stupid; if it doesn't make you happier then why not just kick back and claim whatever the state will give you?

Because we forget that 'from the state' means money stolen by the government in the form of taxes. Why should hard-working people lose 50% or more of their money in taxes of various types so that those not willing to work can get away with it?

Let's put a limit on the number of years in a lifetime (e.g., three years) that someone can claim benefits. After that, they're on their own. Yes, there must be exceptions for those really in need, and there are many such people, but laws against discrimination are supposed to bring them back to the workforce. It should be hard to grant an exception that permanently keeps someone out of work.

 

[Alice3537]

I know, I just get sick sometimes when they are constantly attacked thats all. It does get to you after a while when you working with these type of customers and you are listening to all their problems .Especially when they are desperate fro help and our mental health teams tell you ther eis a year long waiting list unless they decide to try and top themselves!
Just got on my high horse for a bit sorry

So am I,and I live WITH one of "these type of customers"

 

[business123]

Remember because of this, Labour have almost 2.64m ready to vote for them in any election, the slackers are not likely to vote Conservative are they!?

 

[An Oasis]

Not astonishing at all. NuLab's policy has been to move the unemployed into invalidity to make the unemployment figures look better.

Checked the real rate of inflation lately?

Lies, damned lies, and NuLab spin.

Yar I hear that but is there a credible political alternative? Oh if there were, damn I'd be first out of the trap!

I think the clue in the message was when the OP said "Some of these people".

I honestly don't think it was intended to be a diatribe upon those who genuinely claim. As a partner of someone on disability benefit, I can certainly state that stories of this nature make me mad - about the people who do play the system.

Thanks for backing that up Alice3537, my company provides work for sheltered placements, so I'm way ahead of some of you! And no it's is not an easy option it costs us more than the fees that we charge, e.g. every placement has to be monitored full time.

And just to reiterate just in case someone misses is again! No it's not aimed at everyone, just the shirkers!!!!! This country really needs to get a grip.

 

[marchog]

They're very naughty yes but they still live on less than a business lunch a week and it's not as if they keep it - it's all spent on special brew and pot noodles. Cut them off and half a million corner shops will go bust! Plenty of shirkers in work and certainly more fraudsters, just more sophisticated. I know dole cheats and I know "legitimate" buy-to-let landlords with 20 properties housing them (paid for by tax). Who's the bigger c*nt?

 

[Cornish Steve]

So lesser guilt is justified because of greater guilt? Whatever happened to conscience?

While it grates me to say this, economies are successful when individuals behave selfishly in ways that expand the economy. If the government can align our selfish goals with the needs of the country, then we all win. In the area of discussion, this means giving the 'lazy' a reason to work - either a carrot or a stick. Right now, many are incented to do absolutely nothing. Give them a reason to be selfish that means they want to work.

 

[Dawg]

a level headed analysis of the problem here.

 

[Alice3537]

a level headed analysis of the problem here.

Personally, I feel you have posted a blog that trivialises the wider issue, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Blush]

a level headed analysis of the problem here.

I don't have a weight problem, but if I did I would be deeply offended by that to be quite honest.

 

[Jayne]

I know someone who is claiming for acne and us the tax payer pays him to go for face peels too! I think it's disgusting and if I knew his last name or address, I'd grass him up for working on the side too.

Jayne

 

[Alice3537]

I know someone who is claiming for acne and us the tax payer pays him to go for face peels too! I think it's disgusting and if I knew his last name or address, I'd grass him up for working on the side too.

Jayne

Out of interest, HOW do people claim for this - is it some kind of mental health claim?

 

[Jayne]

I don't know how he managed it, he's been claiming it for years and there isn't anything wrong with him. He brags about it to people my hubby knows. I guess it maybe a stress thing? My Mam once was on it after she had a nervous break down and that came under the mental heath thing.

 

[Alice3537]

I don't know how he managed it, he's been claiming it for years and there isn't anything wrong with him. He brags about it to people my hubby knows.

Oh.

Oh dear.

 

[saracen]

I know someone who is claiming for acne and us the tax payer pays him to go for face peels too! I think it's disgusting and if I knew his last name or address, I'd grass him up for working on the side too.

Jayne

"spot" on there mefinks

 

[Dawg]

Personally, I feel you have posted a blog that trivialises the wider issue, but that's just my opinion.

Well I'm sorry. If you go back to the blog, and click the link to the book you'll be able to order it. Chapters 4 & 5 deal with the tradeoffs between different sorts of income support and working for low incomes. He writes very interestingly, as befits someone who writes for a major financial magazine, and whilst his economic arguments can be a bit obscure to a lay reader, they are worth the effort.
A tongue in cheek article is no more offensive than some of the crass ideas expressed about welfare and state help, (not necessarily here), and might actually make some people , gasp, think.

 

[ken_uk]

Getting incapacity is not easy these days, 15 points needed on the mental health test, 10 on the physical.

Having been through the mental one a couple of times (depression/anxiety etc) I can testify that its not a pleasant process, and usually ends up in a automatic fail for the majority of people, who then have to appeal, wait ages on even less money, then 60% (may be higher cant recall) at the least win the appeal.....

It isnt a easy process, nor a pleasant one and I seriously think the ingrown toenail person is pulling your leg, there will be other reasons he is on incap, or he is getting the money some other way....

Most people would rather work than suffer with a mental health or physical problem, there obviously will always be the scammers, but its not going to be rampant as the tests are quite thorough, and after my last experience I found out even a Doctor working on behalf of the dwp can lie through his teeth to get people off incap and into the workplace (complained to a mp about that, but got a stupid reply from the company that 'owns' the doctors) - did you know its also usually done by software these days, which makes matters even worse......

 

[Alice3537]

Well I'm sorry. If you go back to the blog, and click the link to the book you'll be able to order it. Chapters 4 & 5 deal with the tradeoffs between different sorts of income support and working for low incomes. He writes very interestingly, as befits someone who writes for a major financial magazine, and whilst his economic arguments can be a bit obscure to a lay reader, they are worth the effort.
A tongue in cheek article is no more offensive than some of the crass ideas expressed about welfare and state help, (not necessarily here), and might actually make some people , gasp, think.

Well, I'm sorry too - I didn't realise I was not just meant to read the link and instead click on various links

 

[Songbird]

Because we forget that 'from the state' means money stolen by the government in the form of taxes. Why should hard-working people lose 50% or more of their money in taxes of various types so that those not willing to work can get away with it?

Because working minimum wage is horrific and I'd rather pay a proportion of my own (minimum wage at the moment) earnings every week than see others have to go through it. It's not as if most of the people claiming benefits are doing so to escape from a working market where they're respected and given the responsbility that their talents deserve.

 

[RayB]

This thread reminds of an old joke:

"How many people work here?"
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
"About half of them"........................

 

[directmarketingadvice]

£4.4 million spent on people who may or may not be unable to work...

Let's put this in perspective: our chancellor has just pissed billions down a big hole in the ground called "Northern Rock".

(a company that's so much in the crap they had to suspend trading on it today)

Personally, I'd rather he'd given that money to the tubbies and the spotties.

Steve

 

[Cornish Steve]

Because working minimum wage is horrific and I'd rather pay a proportion of my own (minimum wage at the moment) earnings every week than see others have to go through it.

If someone earns minimum wage, just maybe they should learn new skills or find a different job or move to another part of the country? Of course there must be a safety net to help the truly needy, but I really don't see the need for a minimum wage in a free society. If I have useful skills, employers will pay what my skills deserve. If they don't, I'll find other employers or start my own business. For sure, I'm not going to sit around and ask the government to help me. If you disagree, you're more than welcome to contribute voluntarily to the income of others you know. Just don't force me to do so by law.

It's not as if most of the people claiming benefits are doing so to escape from a working market where they're respected and given the responsbility that their talents deserve.

Sorry, but that's bunkum. If employers are willing to pay someone only minimum wage, then maybe their talents are worth only minimum wage. Depending on the situation, maybe minimum wage earners should consider learning a new trade or going back to school or, in some cases, working harder. The free market comes closest to ensuring we receive what we're worth. Government regulation, such as imposing a minimum wage, is a social policy, not an employment one. In fact, the law is anti-employment because companies think hard before employing someone.

The exception, of course, is to help those who are truly in need - the physically challenged, the blind, the deaf, the mentally challenged, the chronically sick, and so on. It's also OK to help those who've been discriminated against in the past, such as women and minorities. This is a sign of a compassionate and fair society. I don't see why the exception should extend to those who simply never bothered to learn when they had the chance - although we should provide the opportunity for them to catch up when they change their mind.

(Waiting for the comments of Comrade Earl. )

PS - note to Songbird. To some extent, I'm playing devil's advocate with my response, so please don't take my words personally. You note that you are earning a minimum wage right now; maybe it's by choice and maybe it isn't. I once earned much less than the minimum wage in Britain (when you take into account train fares, etc.), but it was by choice as I learned a new profession. Income size is not the ultimate criterion of success in life, I agree, and there are times when it's right to invest our time without "adequate" compensation. In the end, though, it's not for the government to tinker with our financial destinies. That right belongs to us.

 

Steve its 40 billion for the northern Rock

here,s the cost of all benifits per year.

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23380239-details/The%20REAL%20cost%20of%20unemployment%20is%20%C3%BD%C3%BD61%20billion%20per%20year/article.do

Earl

 

[Cornish Steve]

Steve its 40 billion for the northern Rock

Bingo! I knew you'd respond quickly, my friend.

 

[RayB]

Steve its 40 billion for the northern Rock

here,s the cost of all benifits per year.

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/...mployment is ýý61 billion per year/article.do

Earl

£61 billion - Yikes - that is almost as bad as the £167.5 BILLION wasted each year on government quangos

 

£61 billion - Yikes - that is almost as bad as the £167.5 BILLION wasted each year on government quangos

Puts it all a bit more in perspective Ray probably no more than 5 billion for diabled people.

your favourite subject quangos init peeps

Earl