Is Dreamweaver old hat or is it still on top?

[J Binder Design]

Hi everyone.

I just wanted an opinion on this. A lot of people are using WordPress now and rave about it. What is your favourite programme to use for web design/makeup, whether for content management or just basic site?

Is Dreamweaver still good or is WordPress, Joomla and Drupal the best ones now to use?

Still loving Dreamweaver myself and add in content management coding. Always good to learn new things if it's better!!

Looking forward to hearing your views on this.

Julie

 

[DavidHorn]

Well, they're very different tools. Dreamweaver is a web design / coding tool ... Wordpress / Joomla / Drupal et al. are very powerful content management systems.

I don't use Dreamweaver any more - but not through any problem with it, I've just found other coding tools to be more efficient for my workflow (I use Coda now - www.panic.com/coda, but have also used TextMate - www.macromates.com in the past).

But that doesn't mean I don't develop client sites using Wordpress or another CMS (expressionengine.com for really powerful client sites, or Perch - grabaperch.com for smaller sites sometimes).

So I think you're asking a mixed question really - the systems you mention don't really compare; all are good when used in the appropriate context,

David

 

[RadiusBPO]

I hate dreamweaver... It's just too heavy and doesn't open .phtml files.

I love coda but at the moment I'm using TextWrangler... But with those tools I am editing theme files of a wordpress or magento site!

 

[LicensedToTrade]

I'm not sure that you could really say that Dreamweaver was ever 'on top'. As a WYSIWYG tool is has been commercially very successful for Macromedia and then for Adobe when they bought the company over. Historically is has been pretty dreadful for W3C compliance, but as I haven't ever played with any versions in the last 5 years I couldn't say if that problem has been corrected or not.

One of the real positives that could be said about Dreamweaver in the past is that it allowed you to preview your rendered code cross browser at the touch of the F12 key, but that isn't a unique feature any more. Even thirdparty notepad style editors like notepad+ have similar features and allow for line references and annotation.

So while it is debatable as to whether dreamweaver has historically been 'on top', it certainly isn't today.

 

[fisicx]

I still use a $10 copy of Dreamweaver 4. It does everything I need it to do.

On the other hand, you can edit just about everything from within wordpress so your average punter doesn't need DW, they certainly don't need all the flummery that comes with the latest versions.

 

[Optegris]

I've used DW for a number of years as well as other editors and there still isn't an editor that I would switch to. I hand code so I don't use all the snippet gumph but for speed and site management it's excellent.

BTW comparing DW to say WordPress is like comparing a walnut to a Bugatti Veyron, they are two completely different tools.

 

[LicensedToTrade]

BTW comparing DW to say WordPress is like comparing a walnut to a Bugatti Veyron, they are two completely different tools.

You would also be pretty disappointed if you were on a 6 month waiting list, paid over the odds and at the end of all that a walnut was delivered to your doorstep.

 

[Optegris]

Very true but I would still buy one in a heartbeat. ( A Bugatti that is not a walnut)

 

[J Binder Design]

Good points! Yes true, would much rather have a Bugatti or anything that has more oomph than a walnut !!

Cheers for the feedback!!

Julie

 

[estwig]

I have reported this thread for being 'nutist' towards Walnuts.

Please adjust your attitude.

 

[Faevilangel]

Dreamweaver is as old as Estwig (and he is past his best).

Dreamweaver is still used by a lot of developers as it has a great code platform (code highlighting, built in snippets etc). It's still a worthy piece of software if used properly.

I have never really used DW as I taught myself using Notepad so that is what I use (Notepad2 to be specific), it gives me the best bit about DW (code highlighting) but without the other crap in DW and without the bloated software.

 

[DesignerNick]

I still like DW, it gives you code highlighting as well as a good live preview (although not 100% of how it is going to look).

If you have a huge screen or multi screen then you can have code view open on one, live view open on the other and work quickly.

Dreamweaver is great and very powerful if used properly It isn't really that old and it is updated all the time!

 

[localmarketing]

Use whatever works best for you and your clients, not really seen the kind of CMS Dreamweaver can produce but if you can produce a quick fast loading system it's probably better for a simple website than WP, Joomla or Drupal.

As for which of them is the best to use it all depends on the kind of site you're building they all have advantages and disadvantages. You can still use DW to make templates for any of them though. Personally I just use a text editor and a grid system like 960.gs which makes coding up a design a lot quicker, then when it's ready to go I clean up the CSS. At the end of the day as long as you get a page of code thats reasonably efficient it doesn't matter what you use to make it.

 

[estwig]

Dreamweaver is as old as Estwig (and he is past his best).

Your name has been added to 'the list'.

Come the day of the revolution, expect a knock on the door!!

 

[Faevilangel]

I still like DW, it gives you code highlighting as well as a good live preview (although not 100% of how it is going to look).

If you have a huge screen or multi screen then you can have code view open on one, live view open on the other and work quickly.

Dreamweaver is great and very powerful if used properly It isn't really that old and it is updated all the time!

Live Preview is pants, it's like using IE6 as your main browser. DW is bloated IMHO, 90% of the stuff isn't needed.

 

[Faevilangel]

Your name has been added to 'the list'.

Come the day of the revolution, expect a knock on the door!!

I don't answer the door to strange men

 

[LicensedToTrade]

I don't answer the door to strange men

I noticed that you didn't say anything about strange women though.

 

[Faevilangel]

I noticed that you didn't say anything about strange women though.

Are you saying Estwig is female ?

 

[fisicx]

Live Preview is pants, it's like using IE6 as your main browser. DW is bloated IMHO, 90% of the stuff isn't needed.

What LivePreview? F12 to view in the browser of choice.

I've never seen any code bloat either come to that. Use an older version of DW and it's no different to any other editor. If you go get the Adobe monster then it's your own fault, I'd suggest 99.9% of the stuff isn't needed.

 

[DesignerNick]

Live Preview is pants, it's like using IE6 as your main browser. DW is bloated IMHO, 90% of the stuff isn't needed.

What version did you use? I wouldn't say bloated, a lot of it is quite useful if you know what it does. It is like saying Photoshop is bloated when all you want to do is resize images.

Multiscreen Preview is quite useful too when designing for phones etc.

It is just a preference and what people are used to using. I like seeing what my code will look like as I do it on the other screen as it gives a general guide. When it comes to just PHP, I just use code view as it does point out those pesky errors!

I am not sure why the code would be bloated as it is still hand coding unless you want to sit and press Insert - Image rather than just typing the HTML?

 

[estwig]

Are you saying Estwig is female ?

Only on Sundays, then you can call me Sharon!!

It's my day off and I'll do what I like with it!!

 

[LicensedToTrade]

Only on Sundays, then you can call me Sharon!!

It's my day off and I'll do what I like with it!!

Now that would certainly count as a strange women, when Sharon turns up at your doorstep with a 5 o'clock shadow and an aroma of buckfast.

 

[estwig]

Now that would certainly count as a strange women, when Sharon turns up at your doorstep with a 5 o'clock shadow and an aroma of buckfast.

Your kinda cute, you can call me shazza!!

 

[CabinLIving]

I still use dreamweaver where possible. Ideally from an SEO point of view I'd prefer to work solely with html and attached css files in dreamweaver. If we start from scratch this is probably what we would choose depending on what the site has to do. Reality is though many use wordpress and the like so we have to work with a mix of ftp in dreamweaver and admin access (once the "designers" reluctantly give us the details.)

The constant need for plugins is annoying even for simple things like creating basic meta titles etc its just plain daft. Why these arent standard on Wordpress I dont know. Adding verification meta tags etc are also a pain through the admin panel.. so back to dreamweaver for ftp access to the header.php.

I dont get how the amateur copes with the famous five minute install most beginners I know dont know how to set up a database.

If you just want a blog use blogger.
If you need a simple website of a few pages that loads fast use html and a ccs file on dreamweaver.
If you're setting up a site for remote access by a second or third party then Wordpress or similar

 

[DesignerNick]

Or you could make your own CMS in Dreamweaver that is like a basic version of Wordpress with the Meta Info

 

[mit74]

Dreamweaver (WDA) and CMS are completely different surely? It's an odd question for a web developer to ask. Have you actually used Wordpress?

As for any coding I use DW but only because of the autocomplete/parser functions, any WYSIWYG editor makes code bloated and ugly and as a pro would never use it. There are probably better notepad html/php/css editors around but haven't had a good look. And yeh I do think DW has lost its way. Most developers I know use their own code and not the automated features in DW. I've not used 95% of the functions in DW cs4 I have and will not be upgrading it.

 

[smoothweb]

I still use Dreamweaver, i bought CS5 and i personally think its the best version to date. It has the "live view" function which shows what the site looks like when uploaded to the tinternet. I use it to do custom coding for all the normal stuff plus Wordpress and Joomla, so i think it will always be needed, especially with HTML5. Alot of the BIG boys in London still use it and i think its the big companies that will always drive sales of Dreamweaver.

 

[fisicx]

I still use Dreamweaver, i bought CS5 and i personally think its the best version to date.

So apart form a 'liveview' feature what can SCS do that DW4 can't?

If, as most people do, you use the codeview option then the version of DW is pretty much irrelevant.

 

[smoothweb]

So apart form a 'liveview' feature what can SCS do that DW4 can't?

If, as most people do, you use the codeview option then the version of DW is pretty much irrelevant.

Not sure, i have never used DW4 only CS3. There are alot more functions in CS5 than in CS3. I use codeview all the time, but for HTML sites its nice to see the site when its live. It is like the preview/debug button, opening in your chosen web browser.

It just makes things simpler, for the web designer.

 

[fisicx]

Not sure, i have never used DW4 only CS3. There are alot more functions in CS5 than in CS3. I use codeview all the time, but for HTML sites its nice to see the site when its live. It is like the preview/debug button, opening in your chosen web browser.

It just makes things simpler, for the web designer.

You can do exactly the same in DW4.

So $300 for CS5 with 'LiveView' or $10 for DW4 which does exactly the same using F12.

 

[smoothweb]

You can do exactly the same in DW4.

So $300 for CS5 with 'LiveView' or $10 for DW4 which does exactly the same using F12.

Yer good point, but i do like CS5

 

[Rags]

I've gone over to 100% Wordpress now.

Old DW looks like a dinosaur when I look at it now!

 

[LicensedToTrade]

I've gone over to 100% Wordpress now.

Old DW looks like a dinosaur when I look at it now!

What do you mean when you say you have gone over to 100% wordpress? Do you mean to say you are only developing for the wordpress platform? Whilst I've made my thoughts on DW clear (I think it's antiquated, overbearing and a validation nightmare) but at the same time, you cannot compare wordpress to a WYSIWYG editor like DW. It's apples and oranges.

 

[Rags]

I was simply answering the question asked by the OP

Now that WP is here I find no use for DW - one has simply replaced the other.
(I'm not trying to compare them, just stating my experience with the 2)

 

[DesignerNick]

I was simply answering the question asked by the OP

Now that WP is here I find no use for DW - one has simply replaced the other.
(I'm not trying to compare them, just stating my experience with the 2)

It is a bit random to say that Wordpress has replaced DW. What if you wanted to write a plugin or edit a template and needed to edit the HTML and used it to edit the code?

 

[Esk247]

I was simply answering the question asked by the OP

Now that WP is here I find no use for DW - one has simply replaced the other.
(I'm not trying to compare them, just stating my experience with the 2)

as others have said..how can wordpress replace dreamweaver? they're completely different packages.

Dreamweaver is used for FTP (not always great), coding, wysiwyg editor, server testing, demo site building, html/css/php, viewing and updating files on servers etc etc. That's totally different to wordpress.

I think you mean it's easier for you to use wordpress these days when building general websites.

Magento or Prestashop or Opencart...what about those? for me i class those above wordpress purely because i find them easier to use and a more dedicated ecommerce solution, but thats because i'm mucking around with ecommerce websites at the moment and wordpress just doesn't do it for me.

To be honest..notepad is the king if you're an accomplished coder.

 

[fisicx]

To be honest..notepad is the king if you're an accomplished coder.

Ha!

Real coders use vim.

Hard core linux geeks think even that's too mainstream and will only use vi.

 

[Rags]

I'm just saying that since Wordpress came along, I no longer have any use for Dreamweaver.

Sorry if you disagree, but it's actually true.

If I need to change the code in WP (which isn't very often), I just use Firebug and edit the WP code via ftp.

 

[Esk247]

Ha!

Real coders use vim.

Hard core linux geeks think even that's too mainstream and will only use vi.

sod you...i use 'v' because its twice the power of 'vi' and three times the power of 'vim'

swivel!

 

[localmarketing]

Wow, Vi, that takes me back. Possibly the most boring week of my life at the Sun training centre. I thought I had erased all memories of that. However it gave me my first certificate since the 200m backstroke. I must say the backstroke one has come to be far more useful though.