Fish and chips in Manchester.

[allanwhyte77]

Hi Everyone, and thank you in advance for any advice offered. I currently work as a manager in a bar so have experience in a customer facing industy but am a complete novice to the frying trade.

I hopefully plan to start my own business soon and have about 40k of savings to invest. As the licensed trade is on it's knees due to cheap supermarket booze, the smoking ban and the recession I think another, hopefully more resilient sector would be my best way forward.

I'm sure making a successful go at a fish and chip shop would be hard work and a gamble to a newbie but I have thought it maybe a less risky venture than taking over a pub. Can anyone offer any advice of the best way forward? Is it best to take over an existing business or start from scratch? If buying an existing business what should I be looking for and what warning signs would suggest a business best avoided? Will 40k be enough money or should I consider extra funding? and finally I'm based in Manchester does anyone know of any potential openings in my area?

Thank you.

 

[Wallpaper]

Hi Everyone, and thank you in advance for any advice offered. I currently work as a manager in a bar so have experience in a customer facing industy but am a complete novice to the frying trade.

I hopefully plan to start my own business soon and have about 40k of savings to invest. As the licensed trade is on it's knees due to cheap supermarket booze, the smoking ban and the recession I think another, hopefully more resilient sector would be my best way forward.

I'm sure making a successful go at a fish and chip shop would be hard work and a gamble to a newbie but I have thought it maybe a less risky venture than taking over a pub. Can anyone offer any advice of the best way forward? Is it best to take over an existing business or start from scratch? If buying an existing business what should I be looking for and what warning signs would suggest a business best avoided? Will 40k be enough money or should I consider extra funding? and finally I'm based in Manchester does anyone know of any potential openings in my area?

Thank you.

try www.chippy-chat.co.uk

 

[Richie N]

I have sent you a PM. Where in Manchester were you thinking?

 

[tony84]

Hi,

Chippies are one of those things theyre hit and miss.

I used to work on great ancoats street and a few people from our office would go to a chippy on tibb street, served by a greek family, always happy busy nice and friendly.
We have moved offices now and the nearest one is piccadilly bus station, but none of us ever go.

Are you looking for manchester city centre or suburb?

If its a suburb where do you live, look around that area.
I cant think of many chippys now a days theyre all pizza and kebab shops, so i reckon a decent chippy somewhere could go down pretty well.

Not a great help but hopefully some inspiration and ideas will come from it.

 

[Richie N]

Hi,

Chippies are one of those things theyre hit and miss.

I used to work on great ancoats street and a few people from our office would go to a chippy on tibb street, served by a greek family, always happy busy nice and friendly.
We have moved offices now and the nearest one is piccadilly bus station, but none of us ever go.

Are you looking for manchester city centre or suburb?

If its a suburb where do you live, look around that area.
I cant think of many chippys now a days theyre all pizza and kebab shops, so i reckon a decent chippy somewhere could go down pretty well.

Not a great help but hopefully some inspiration and ideas will come from it.

Yeah I mentioned the one on Tib street in my message.
They do well there, been established for a while, general portions and tastes nice.

 

[tony84]

exactly, and they have the radio on with a non offensive station - it covers young and old.

 

[Esk247]

from the chip shops we have here on the yorkshire coast you won't struggle until the weather turns cold and even then you'll get locals wanting to get something warm and quick.

not sure about supplies for this kind of thing and i always would have thought its best to take over a business than start from scratch.

 

[allanwhyte77]

Thanks for the feedback. I've registered with chippy chat forum and read the book on ebay about running a fish and chip shop. I'm currently trawling round the business for sale on various websites trying out their fare, although this kind of research is a hazard to the waistline.

I haven't narrowed my search to a specific location within Manchester. I think it would be unwise at this stage. It was after a visit to the one in Tibb street that I thought it a possible direction for a good business.

I

 

[Psl]

I occasionally use a chippy in Trafford Park, near my offices. It is laways busy and is staffed by bubbly happy staff that greet you with "hello love, how are you, what can I get you?"
The food is always spot on and the place is busy form 12ish through untill 1.30 ish.
There are four women serving an two frying nd two in the back doing prep. If you offer quality cooked food, generous portions at an affordable price and have happy staff,you will be onto a winner.
Location is another matter! what about on the edge of council estate?

 

[MASSEY]

mmmmmmm chips,


Its obviously all that location location stuff, i think myself that there are too many chippies and takeaways around.

But even throughout the recession food did well, maybe its a case of good management and you will be able to compete.

But hey, how hard could managing a chippy be

 

[Richie N]

But hey, how hard could managing a chippy be

You would be surprised....
We've just recently opened the eatery and I can tell ya its harder than most think. Defo more stressful than opening an agency and that's challenging enough.

 

[allanwhyte77]

I think it would be naive to think it would be easy. In fact, thats probably why those that fail do so. I work, at the moment in the pub game and it surprises me how many think this an easy sector, it's not.

Can selling chips be much different from selling beer?

 

[allanwhyte77]

Hi again folks, I've been to view a few chippies last night and today and to be honest, the ones I've looked at haven't impressed me. A couple of them had another, better looking chippy yards away on the same street. One of them was that filthy that my partner declined to eat anything out of it, which is bad because we were visiting to view the place and try the food.

I get the impression that any decent business worth it's salt will not be up for sale only the failing ones that have no potential are. I guess if you have a successful business, that makes you a decent income you'll hang on to it.

I was wondering if it would be better going down the starting from scratch route? Would this be a recipe for disaster for a newbie? How difficult would it be to turn a fast food place into a chippie? and would I need to apply for change of use planning permission even thought they are basically the same thing just different types of fast food?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[tony84]

Just going back to the chipy on tib street. Its not the cleanest...far from it. But we still went in.

You could quite easily go into a chippy and clean it up. It puts you in a good light?

Are you looking for a chippy that does sit in and take away or take away only?

My theory is that a good chippy will always do well. For £3-4 you get a nice meal, theres no reason why a decent chippy wont do well.

Something to think about is do you want day time trade, night time trade or both.

 

[FaerieB]

The chippies in Yorkshire all seem to cook in dripping .... Mmmmmmmm ...

I think keeping it traditional chippy is great but I'd also sell hot pots and home made meat and tata pie etc ... kind of like good honest home made jankers ...

 

[Esk247]

take not of the indian take aways and such..they seem to be raking it in..when do they open? oh yeah, friday and saturday nights, open till 2am and they do free local delivery for orders over £10.

being accessible and open longer than competitive fish and chip shops might give you the edge.

it's very very hard work though, it's not easy, you can go hours without a sale and you can end up throwing lots of stock away but alas..if business were easy..everyone would be doing it

 

[Psl]

We could do with a decent English chippy in Whitefield There is everything else, takeaways wise,dominos, Indian, Chinese, Thai,burgers and kebabs, Subway. Italian etc but no bloody English chippy!!
Every now and again you just want fish and chips, eaten out of the paper,yummy

 

[allanwhyte77]

There is a chippy for sale in Whitefield called Mr Chips it's pretty near the Metro which was the North West winner in the best fish and chip shop in the country.

 

[Psl]

There is a chippy for sale in Whitefield called Mr Chips it's pretty near the Metro which was the North West winner in the best fish and chip shop in the country.

That particular chippy is in an ideal place, in a parade of shops, Indian takeaway and a minimart and it is on a mixed council estate, but the food is and always has been average at best, and the customer service is terrible, yet it is a busy chippy because it is the only one around there. I don't think the shop has been open for more thn 12 months and all the fittings were brand new.
I live about 1/4 mile from the location and the shop is about 10 min walk from the metro station. A very good prospect for the OP IMHO.

 

[oldeagleeye]

Hi Alan. I must admit that when it comes to retail I am slightly biased because there are few businesses that come along where genuine retirement is the reason for selling and the whole industry is practically run by a few really big selling agents who keep prices high. I am not going to name them but you only have to look in Daltons Weekly.

You see newsagents going for 90K just for a lease and for what. The business wouldn't make a penny if run under management. It is the same as you know with pubs. At best there is a living for a husband and wife team

My advice then would be to

1) find an empty shop with A3 use and fit out yourself. At worse your get your money back in a year if you decide to quit. This would also leave you with about £10K working capital. That as oposed to borrowing another £40K-£50 K to p;ay a typical lease on a shop turnover £3,000 a week which is what you will need.

2) Better Option. You be working 6 days a week in a chippy and make no mistake it is a 12 - 14 hr day if you open lunchtime which you will prob ably have to do. Then an hour or so busy and waiting around till above 5 pm for the eveng trade to begin. At the end of it all after paying expenses your and the wife will be lucky tocome out with £600 quid a week. Whats the better option.

Mobile catrering unit and you can earn that in a day easily. Cost of a really nicely fitted out catering unit about £15K.

3) Best Option of all. Forget Fish @ Chips. Forget Pubs. You don't even need a shop nr the high street. No licence problems. No staffing problems and only about £1q0 investment which will earn you about £1,000 a week in you back pocket.

You would of course get bored only working one day a week so ok how about 4 and earn a net £100K a year.

What is the biz. A Function Room. Weddings. Theme Nights. Ladies Nights. Your local Rotrary & Lions club and not least of all the Take Wine at 9 riff-raff.

The mention of which an you would love this after being in a pub. With no tie we are talking 300% return on wine. 300% Bottled Beer. 300% pint of Carlsberg.

Leaving aside the profit from catering fom a wedding. When you get the father of the bride bung you £1500 quid to keep the bar going for the party afterwards I don't think your be thinking bag of chips mate and an OAP demanding a discount.

Rob

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[Richie N]

There was a nice chip shop and restaurant near Oldham, it closed down last year.
Catering is a tough game at the moment, we've just opened our Eatery and it's hard work.
Be prepared to put the hours in, do something different, maintain consistency and standards.

 

[max99]

go into fallowfield and check out 'battered cod' theres one on ladybarn lane, and then another just past fallowfield in withington. I know the one on ladybarn lane does well, always busy at lunch time due to it being so close to 2 big building merchants, and then in the eve its full of students and others.

They look great from the outside, are good value and good food

 

[allanwhyte77]

Thanks for all the advice folk. Thanks Oldeagleeye, the reason I've thought fish and chips is I need to find a new direction, The bar I work in is on it's knees, twelve bars in a half mile street. Most of the other bars are free trade or large brewery owned so they can buy their beer at the best rates. We're a tenancy so tied to the brewery who sell us the beer the same price the other bars sell the beer to customers almost.

The current tenants are pulling out after a year, the previous tenant had the place twenty four years but bought most of his beer in, which was against the rules, until they put a stop to it by putting in meters that record his beer sales against what he was purchasing from the brewery. I've been the manager for thirteen years. I could have gone for the place myself but I realise it's an impossible task against those odds, especially as the rents 70k a year and the business rates not reflective of the current situation.

I've recently inherited about 40k so I'm looking for a new direction, I don't see licenced retail as a direction where their is a future but as fish and chip shops tend not attract major players and be under threat from other markets, other than the fast food outlet selling the pizza, curry, burgers ect. I've thought that if done well, sell a quality product, in a clean welcoming shop, I should hopefully be able to match my current income 22k.I wouldn't be tied with my suppliers either which isn't the case in the pub trade with my level of investment.

I'm not looking to make a million just use the opportunity of my inheritance to secure me an income for my future. I already work unsocial hours, deal with difficult, often threatening customers, live with the daily stress of an unsure future. Surely, for someone in my situation, the direction I'm considering would be a reasonable one for me to contemplate. It would at least, allow me to use my own judgement for any direction I would like to take the business,especially as I'm at the coal face. Which is unfortuatelly not the position I find myself at present.

My biggest concern would be government legislation as in the way of a tax on fast food due to the obesity problem and the prospect of less disposible income of those that buy fish and chips,that might seem a bit paranoid but who would have predicted a smoking ban, supermarkets selling beer 50p a can and the people socialising online fifteen years ago. Having explained my situation I hope it gives a background as to why I am considering this direction. Although, if anyone can suggest another direction that maybe more suitable I'm all ears?

 

[Esk247]

just remember to plan plan plan plan plan! leave no stone un-turned with the planning of how your business will work.

fish and chip shops are not my area of expertise in any way but i personally always think it's worth buying up a business that is failing providing you can highlight obvious reasons for it losing trade e.g. tatty exterior, unpleasant staff, over priced products.

but remember to take your time, another business may become available that requires less investment and less effort to get off the ground.

 

[allanwhyte77]

I've seen one Im interested in but rang the agent today only to hear the owners taken it off the market and has decided not to sell.

 

[FKI]

Location is one the most fundamental contributions to the success of your business. You need to go over everything comprehensively I cant stress this enough. Along with prices, customer service and presentation. The presentation entices people in and the quality of the food, prices and customer service will keep them returning.

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