Acquiring the first few customers

[pixelo]

Im trying to set up a PPC management agency for small businesses. I currently work for a large and successful PPC agency who focus on bigger clients.


I personally manage about 100k of PPC spend a month and do about a million in sales in my day job so I know what Im doing (more than most other online marketing agencies trying to flog their services at the very least). But I'm unsure what the best approach to approaching/acquiring customers is. I've got a spreadsheet of 500 small businesses I want to target, do you think I should just start cold calling and pitching my services to them? Or is there a subtler/smarter way to do this?

I figured that even if I only manage to persuade and sign up 3-4 our of the 500 I have in my list, that would be a start!

 

[ethical PR]

Why not use your PPC talents to drive potential clients to your website?

 

[sysops]

Why not use your PPC talents to drive potential clients to your website?

Genius.

...

 

[pixelo]

Very good

PPC related PPC keywords are obviously some of the most competitive there are, it's not really feasible with my startup budget...

 

[sysops]

Very good

PPC related PPC keywords are obviously some of the most competitive there are, it's not really feasible with my startup budget...

Are you saying that even with your skills, you can't get PPC to pay for itself in that sector?

 

[pixelo]

Are you saying that even with your skills, you can't get PPC to pay for itself in that sector?

Yes...

I'm targeting small businesses who spend 500-1500 a month and I'm starting out alone.

PPC related PPC keywords are dominated by large agencies who target businesses who spend 5k-100k a month (I know, I work for one of those agencies).

 

[Fergal Crawley]

Sorry but I'm not sure that I understand what a "PPC management agency" does. If I was going to run a PPC campaign using Google Adwords, would you select the keywords, write the ads and then implement the campaign, or is it something different?

 

[pixelo]

I manage clients ppc budgets and make them
more money from ppc is the very short answer.

 

[pixelo]

And yes I do all of that...

 

[Deleted member 9840]

But I'm unsure what the best approach to approaching/acquiring customers is.

It is certainly not ringing them up claiming to be in partnership with Google. If I get one more phone call from a spotty yoof telling me "I can get you top of page one mate" I will scream.

Why not cut through the bull and offer your services on a pay per result basis. Would this not be revolutionary in your industry?
Most small business owners would be more prepared to listen to you if you offered a no risk, performance based fee.

Come on, break the mould. Most mature industries work on the basis of, a) receive order, b) deliver quality product/service, c) get paid.

Steve

 

[pixelo]

It is certainly not ringing them up claiming to be in partnership with Google. If I get one more phone call from a spotty yoof telling me "I can get you top of page one mate" I will scream.

Why not cut through the bull and offer your services on a pay per result basis. Would this not be revolutionary in your industry?
Most small business owners would be more prepared to listen to you if you offered a no risk, performance based fee.

Come on, break the mould. Most mature industries work on the basis of, a) receive order, b) deliver quality product/service, c) get paid.

Steve

This is exactly what I'm going to do, some people are already doing it so it's not entirely new but it's definitely not the norm.

I guess I just need to figure out the clearest way to articulate the offer on the phone. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to tell me to get lost though!

 

[Tej]

This is exactly what I'm going to do, some people are already doing it so it's not entirely new but it's definitely not the norm.

I guess I just need to figure out the clearest way to articulate the offer on the phone. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to tell me to get lost though![/quote]

Steve Cool's suggestion is a good one... try it

Right now.. your posts suggest you are already thinking ... "loser"

sorry if that sounds harsh

 

[Deleted member 9840]

I guess I just need to figure out the clearest way to articulate the offer on the phone. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to tell me to get lost though!

I think If you were to contact your target businesses by telephone you should cut all the bull that the usual SEO/PPC telesales bods use and just be yourself, talk businessman to businessman.
There are so many calls from these sharks every day that, most people are probably regarding this service with the same apathy as they now do with charity diary advertising.

Explain that you have just set up on your own and you would like to offer your services.
Don't rehearse it, just chat and build up a rapport, see where the conversation goes.

Good luck

Steve

 

[Bigbmxdave]

I personally manage about 100k of PPC spend a month and do about a million in sales in my day job so I know what Im doing (more than most other online marketing agencies trying to flog their services at the very least).

Why are you asking people with less experience than you for advice? Your post seems as pointless as that guy who was asking for advice over whether to start a limo or a hotel business yesterday.

Your post seems about as useless as Warren Buffet asking us all for stock tips.

 

[Deleted member 9840]

Why are you asking people with less experience than you for advice? Your post seems as pointless as that guy who was asking for advice over whether to start a limo or a hotel business yesterday.

Your post seems about as useless as Warren Buffet asking us all for stock tips.

The thread is in the "General Business" section. The OP is asking for general business advice.
Just because a person is a master of their trade does not make them a master businessman.
You can be the best bricklayer in the world, but you might still need help selling yourself and laying the foundation of your business before you build the wall.

Steve

 

[Bigbmxdave]

to me the original post read "I'm amazing and making a full time living from my experience, but you plebs may give me your advice if you wish."

the OP claims to handle accounts worth millions. This seems to me like David Beckham asking us for football tips.

 

[Deleted member 9840]

to me the original post read "I'm amazing and making a full time living from my experience, but you plebs may give me your advice if you wish."

the OP claims to handle accounts worth millions. This seems to me like David Beckham asking us for football tips.

That's an interesting deduction seeing as the premise states

Im trying to set up a PPC management agency for small businesses.

AND

But I'm unsure what the best approach to approaching/acquiring customers is.

The guy has qualified the reason why he thinks he has a service to offer in explaining his current employed duties, yet is humble enough to recognise his skill set is not yet all it could be to start up a business of his own.

To me this is a person asking for help :|

Cheers

Steve

 

[Connections_Media]

If your going to sell over the phone then, be completely straight with people I find this works cut all the crap out as this just sends people to sleep and makes it another one of those sales calls.

Jargon does peoples nut in as well so just try and be as simple as possible and cut the first question when ringing someone of how are you today because neither you or they care, I ask for 30 seconds to quickly say what I am calling about and then after that I see if they are interested in my product if not then I ask for an email to send them some information to keep for later date and then move on it saves your time and theirs.

Alot of sales people talk themselves out of a sale I was told a great thing 3 years ago when I was still employed being only 18 I thought you needed to talk and talk to get a sale but I was told you have 2 ears and one mouth use them in that order.

 

[pixelo]

That's an interesting deduction seeing as the premise states




The guy has qualified the reason why he thinks he has a service to offer in explaining his current employed duties, yet is humble enough to recognise his skill set is not yet all it could be to start up a business of his own.

To me this is a person asking for help :|

Cheers

Steve

Exactly, thanks steve. I'm not currently running my own business, Thats why I'm asking for advice!

So I think the consensus seems to be :
1. No jargon
2. Don't talk without listening.
3. Offer something unique.
4. Offer a paid on results option


So my question would be, do you think a result should be a phone call, a sale, someone filling out a form asking for more info? It depends on the business I suppose but what are your thoughts steve?

Thanks

 

[pixelo]

So my question would be, do you think a result should be a phone call, a sale, someone filling out a form asking for more info? It depends on the business I suppose but what are your thoughts steve?

Thanks

Sorry that's actually not clear now that I've re read it.

The question was, when do you think a client should pay? When I generate them a sale through PPC? Or a phone call?

I imagine most small businesses who aren't selling directly online would be interested in paying for every phone call that we generated for them. As long as the quality of the phone calls and customers was good.

 

[bridges]

How about offering to do the first 1-2 for free? This way they wont be able to say no! Then once you have figures showing what you can do, this can be your example. Also, if you select the companies carefully, it may benefit you, for example, you could do this for an accountancy firm, and get your books looked after or whatever for free for 6 months, or whatever you can get!

Just a thought!?!

B x

 

[pixelo]

How about offering to do the first 1-2 for free? This way they wont be able to say no! Then once you have figures showing what you can do, this can be your example. Also, if you select the companies carefully, it may benefit you, for example, you could do this for an accountancy firm, and get your books looked after or whatever for free for 6 months, or whatever you can get!

Just a thought!?!

B x

Great idea, I'm thinking maybe I could get some office space for free this way...

 

[bridges]

That'd be amazing if you could swing that! Good luck

 

[pixelo]

That'd be amazing if you could swing that! Good luck

Thanks, fingers crossed.

I'm going to hit the phones in my lunch breaks starting tomorrow!

 

[Hillyer]

Exactly, thanks steve. I'm not currently running my own business, Thats why I'm asking for advice!

So I think the consensus seems to be :
1. No jargon
2. Don't talk without listening.
3. Offer something unique.
4. Offer a paid on results option


So my question would be, do you think a result should be a phone call, a sale, someone filling out a form asking for more info? It depends on the business I suppose but what are your thoughts steve?

Thanks

One thing I would suggest is asking if the potential customer has used a PPC or SEO company in the past and how it went. This may open up an opportunity to say how you can differentiate from them. Just a suggestion. Best of luck with the PPC agency - it sounds like you know what you are doing! ;-)

- Hillyer

 

[Marzipan]

Why would you need office space for this? If you're going to trade services, at least trade for something that saves you money you can't avoid spending - like an accountant, as mentioned by someone earlier. No point getting things you can manage without, especially in the early days.

As for charging, the pay on results thing sounds like a good tactic, never had anyone yet offer that in their sales pitch. The ones that do offer it already are probably in the big league, not small businesses whose monthly spend doesn't even make four figures, so you could have a strong edge there.

From your point of view however, the what-you-get-paid-on surely has to be on click-throughs as that's as far as you can track them yourself isn't it? To be paid on anything else such as an actual sale or a phone call generated is a bit dodgy for you because you're not in control of that data.

 

[pixelo]

Why would you need office space for this? If you're going to trade services, at least trade for something that saves you money you can't avoid spending - like an accountant, as mentioned by someone earlier. No point getting things you can manage without, especially in the early days.

As for charging, the pay on results thing sounds like a good tactic, never had anyone yet offer that in their sales pitch. The ones that do offer it already are probably in the big league, not small businesses whose monthly spend doesn't even make four figures, so you could have a strong edge there.

From your point of view however, the what-you-get-paid-on surely has to be on click-throughs as that's as far as you can track them yourself isn't it? To be paid on anything else such as an actual sale or a phone call generated is a bit dodgy for you because you're not in control of that data.

Makes sense, but I'm serious about this and want to scale it up to the next level as soon as possible, so I think office space is something I'd need fairly soon.

In terms of the paid on results data, I'm going to setup various ways of tracking results for clients, one will be allocating them a phone number that's only seen by PPC visitors to their site and I could also put conversion tracking on their site's contact form/checkout processes.

This obviously needs the client to trust me enough to have access to their site's code, which I think would only happen if I met them in person. Another option is for me to create landing pages of my own and then pass the leads on to the client. Quite a lot of options - I need to figure out what clients are most receptive to!

Cheers for all the great advice and help.

 

[pixelo]

One thing I would suggest is asking if the potential customer has used a PPC or SEO company in the past and how it went. This may open up an opportunity to say how you can differentiate from them. Just a suggestion. Best of luck with the PPC agency - it sounds like you know what you are doing! ;-)

- Hillyer

Thanks, I'm going to try this route, assuming they've had a bad experience (as most SMEs do) from their PPC agency then I can explain how different my service is.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Pixelo have pm you

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Why not cut through the bull and offer your services on a pay per result basis. Would this not be revolutionary in your industry?

It's incredibly difficult to do with PPC.

I've been trying to figure out how to do this for around 6 months - because I'd love to offer a profit-share service (it would take away the risk from the customer and I'd make a lot more money).

However, every way of counting results seems to be flawed.

There are companies that promise to increase ctr% or increase clicks. Both of things are a nonsense. In the first instance, just pause the low ctr keywords. In the second, just bid higher or on more keywords.

Others promise to lower cost per click (just lower bids). Some even offer to increase %ROI (dump the stuff making the lowest profit).

The problem with all 4 of these metrics is that they can be "improved" while reducing overall profit.

So, that leaves you with "profit" as the only sensible measurement for "pay on results".

There are problems with that.

(1) Seasonality. Comparing month by month can be a nonsense.

(2) Market conditions - shrinking/expanding markets. Outside factors having a large say in results.

(3) It discourages testing. Businesses should be testing things that are more likely to fail than succeed. This is because failures are identified quickly and then stopped. Successes can be repeated over and over again.

(4) The state of the client's business - if PPC is going well for them, would they be in the market for a new PPC person? They tend to come looking for PPC help when things are going wrong.

(5) Client having products out of stock. I've worked with businesses that had '000s of products, but a large amount of their profit came from just 10-20. When those products go out of stock, profits nosedive. Yet that problem has nothing to do with the PPC person.

(6) Adding more products to an ecommerce store (or changing prices). Again, nothing to do with the PPC person, but affect the overall profit (up or down).

I could go on, but I've made my point.

I like guaranteeing stuff that's easy to track and where results are 100% determined by my performance.

(which is why I guarantee my webpage split-testing service - it has none of these problems)

Unfortunately, PPC just doesn't seem to fit those criteria.

Steve

 

[pixelo]

I was thinking of doing it based on number of sales, a decrease in CPA or number of calls to the business (using a dedicated PPC number).

It's incredibly difficult to do with PPC.

I've been trying to figure out how to do this for around 6 months - because I'd love to offer a profit-share service (it would take away the risk from the customer and I'd make a lot more money).

However, every way of counting results seems to be flawed.

There are companies that promise to increase ctr% or increase clicks. Both of things are a nonsense. In the first instance, just pause the low ctr keywords. In the second, just bid higher or on more keywords.

Others promise to lower cost per click (just lower bids). Some even offer to increase %ROI (dump the stuff making the lowest profit).

The problem with all 4 of these metrics is that they can be "improved" while reducing overall profit.

So, that leaves you with "profit" as the only sensible measurement for "pay on results".

There are problems with that.

(1) Seasonality. Comparing month by month can be a nonsense.

(2) Market conditions - shrinking/expanding markets. Outside factors having a large say in results.

(3) It discourages testing. Businesses should be testing things that are more likely to fail than succeed. This is because failures are identified quickly and then stopped. Successes can be repeated over and over again.

(4) The state of the client's business - if PPC is going well for them, would they be in the market for a new PPC person? They tend to come looking for PPC help when things are going wrong.

(5) Client having products out of stock. I've worked with businesses that had '000s of products, but a large amount of their profit came from just 10-20. When those products go out of stock, profits nosedive. Yet that problem has nothing to do with the PPC person.

(6) Adding more products to an ecommerce store (or changing prices). Again, nothing to do with the PPC person, but affect the overall profit (up or down).

I could go on, but I've made my point.

I like guaranteeing stuff that's easy to track and where results are 100% determined by my performance.

(which is why I guarantee my webpage split-testing service - it has none of these problems)

Unfortunately, PPC just doesn't seem to fit those criteria.

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

I was thinking of doing it based on number of sales, a decrease in CPA or number of calls to the business (using a dedicated PPC number).

As I pointed out, it's easy to game those metrics while hurting the overall profit.

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

As I pointed out, it's easy to game those metrics while hurting the overall profit.

Steve

If you combine increase in number of sales/leads AND a reduction in CPA, you may have the start of something.

(something that can't be gamed so easily)

However, all the other factors - seasonality etc. - are still going to dirty up the numbers.

But at least it's a start.

I'll need to think about this some more.

Steve

 

[pixelo]

Im not sure how we'd game CPA, or number of sales. If we looked at average CPA over the year, or compared CPA against the same month last year and delivered a 10% decrease, I think that would be valuable to a client.

Or if we delivered 10% more sales than they had the month before, or the same month the previous year, I think that would be well received too and I don't think it's easily gamed (and Im not sure why you'd want to game it either).

If you look at the affiliate marketing model there have been loads of people making good money by sending PPC traffic through affiliate links, they only get paid if they actually deliver sales, I see it as the same principle.

As I pointed out, it's easy to game those metrics while hurting the overall profit.

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Im not sure how we'd game CPA, or number of sales.

Easy enough.

(1) Lower cpa by deleting the keywords with the highest cpa (even if they're profitable). Result: lower cpa, lower profits.

(2) Increase the number of sales by raising bids to unprofitable levels. Result: more clicks/sales, lower profit.

If we looked at average CPA over the year, or compared CPA against the same month last year and delivered a 10% decrease, I think that would be valuable to a client.

Not if you're lowering his profits.

Or if we delivered 10% more sales than they had the month before, or the same month the previous year, I think that would be well received too and I don't think it's easily gamed (and Im not sure why you'd want to game it either).

See above.

If you look at the affiliate marketing model there have been loads of people making good money by sending PPC traffic through affiliate links, they only get paid if they actually deliver sales, I see it as the same principle.

It's a poor analogy as, in affiliate marketing, the merchant only pays for sales. He doesn't pay for the clicks.

If you want that model, you could offer to pay for the clicks and then receive a commission for each sale.

Steve

 

[pixelo]

It's a poor analogy as, in affiliate marketing, the merchant only pays for sales. He doesn't pay for the clicks.

If you want that model, you could offer to pay for the clicks and then receive a commission for each sale.

Steve

We obviously work in different ways so I won't debate the points, but I think reducing CPA without decreasing sales volume is definitely something clients would pay for.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

We obviously work in different ways so I won't debate the points, but I think reducing CPA without decreasing sales volume is definitely something clients would pay for.

When did I say it wasn't? :|

Steve

 

[pixelo]

Thanks for your comments

When did I say it wasn't? :|

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

We obviously work in different ways so I won't debate the points, but I think reducing CPA without decreasing sales volume is definitely something clients would pay for.

I think reducing CPA without decreasing sales volume is definitely something clients would pay for.

A business has 3 products.

(a) Price £200, markup £120 cost per conversion £80.

(b) Price £100, markup £60 cost per conversion £40.

(c) Price £50, markup £30 cost per conversion £20.

Right now, the business is selling 20 of each per month via adwords. Therefore total net adwords sales are £4,200 per month.

Average cost per conversion is £46.67.

Let's say I'm able to double the number of conversions for product A and increase the conversions for products B and C by
25%. Pretty good, right?

Let's say I also cut the cost per conversion to £75, £35 and £15 respectively.

Also pretty good, right?

What are we left with:

Total net sales £7,050.

Average cost per conversion = £47.22 - that's higher than before!

So if I'm using the profit increases AND cpc goes down, I don't get paid.

Why? Because I did too well with the product that had the highest cost per conversion.

If I were cynical, I'd ignore that product and focus on growing the products that have the lowest cost per conversion.

This may seem like an extreme example, but it's fairly common for a business to sell different products and services at different prices. And, as soon as that's the case, the PPC person can do good work while shooting himself in the foot.

Anyway, good luck with that. Obviously, you know better than me:

I know what Im doing (more than most other online marketing agencies

Steve

 

[pixelo]

Sorry, I'm not interested in arguing about PPC with you. I manage a team of PPC analysts and £100k a month of PPC spend at very technical and results focussed PPC agency in my current job. I don't think I'm being unreasonable saying that I know my stuff!

Sorry if you feel threatened by that as this site's resident's PPC guy ( I think that's why you want to argue with me?), but all I wanted was some advice on starting up a company of my own - not a lesson in basic PPC P&L!

I'm sure you do a great job for your clients, I think there's room enough for both of us . I'm not planning on opening an office in Edinburgh yet.

A business has 3 products.

(a) Price £200, markup £120 cost per conversion £80.

(b) Price £100, markup £60 cost per conversion £40.

(c) Price £50, markup £30 cost per conversion £20.

Right now, the business is selling 20 of each per month via adwords. Therefore total net adwords sales are £4,200 per month.

Average cost per conversion is £46.67.

Let's say I'm able to double the number of conversions for product A and increase the conversions for products B and C by
25%. Pretty good, right?

Let's say I also cut the cost per conversion to £75, £35 and £15 respectively.

Also pretty good, right?

What are we left with:

Total net sales £7,050.

Average cost per conversion = £47.22 - that's higher than before!

So if I'm using the profit increases AND cpc goes down, I don't get paid.

Why? Because I did too well with the product that had the highest cost per conversion.

If I were cynical, I'd ignore that product and focus on growing the products that have the lowest cost per conversion.

This may seem like an extreme example, but it's fairly common for a business to sell different products and services at different prices. And, as soon as that's the case, the PPC person can do good work while shooting himself in the foot.

Anyway, good luck with that. Obviously, you know better than me:





Steve