Would you buy it?

[cjd]

We’re considering a new service – Voipfone Mobile.

It’s something we’ve wanted to do for 20 years but it’s never been commercially possible and we’ve never found a convincing business model for it; after all, everybody already has a mobile phone and we’re not interested in simply re-selling someone else’s vanilla service in a supersaturated market.

Instead, ours would be a secondary service delivered via an eSIM on your existing phone that’s integrated with our VoIP platform. If you run a business this means that you can separate the personal use of your phone from your business use.

The geographic number you use for your business will ring your mobile (as well as your office desk phone if you wish and if you have one), using the mobile network. It will be a free call. If you call your customer back, your calling identity (CLI) will be shown as the geographic number of your business (or your new 07 number if you prefer.)

Because the new mobile number is fully integrated with Voipfone – in the jargon it’s called fixed to mobile conversion, FMC – all the smart stuff we do with our cloud PBX becomes available to the mobile just as it has always been with desk phones and apps. Things like call recording, call queues, voice response systems (press one for sales etc), extensions and extension dialling, music on hold, voicemail to email, Personal Assistant etc all become available on your mobile.

And of course, it’s a full mobile service so it can send and receive texts and make calls in the usual way. You’ve already got a primary SIM, so you don’t have to pay for a second data package.

It can replace the fixed phone entirely – for both business and residential users. This means that as BT converts to VoIP and switches off its old network there’s no need to lose your landline number or take their expensive ‘digital voice’ product.

Adding our eSIM to your mobile would be easy – just scan a QR code and the eSIM connects to our platform instantly.


Do you want it? What would you pay?

 

[japancool]

@cjd - I can see a use for it, but a lot of our clients already use Teams calling on their mobile devices, so they already have a single "landline" number with which to contact clients. What would be the advantage of using this over whichever provider they are using for the Teams calls?

In our case, we're talking about corporate fleets with 50-500 devices.

 

[StevensOnln1]

Would you be able to provide a physical SIM for phones that aren't compatible with eSIM?

 

[cjd]

We're not in the corporate game - though we do have a few customers with a 100+ extensions - this would be predominantly for micro businesses and some residential use.

 

[japancool]

We're not in the corporate game - though we do have a few customers with a 100+ extensions - this would be predominantly for micro businesses and some residential use.

That makes sense, thanks.

 

[cjd]

Would you be able to provide a physical SIM for phones that aren't compatible with eSIM?

We could but I don't think we would - initially at least. There's a stack of costs and inconvenience associated with physical SIMs

 

[KM-Tiger]

Adding our eSIM to your mobile would be easy

Could the eSIM be added to more than one mobile?

I have been wondering what to do about our landline number here at home. For it to ring both my mobile and my wife's would be perfect for us.

 

[cjd]

Could the eSIM be added to more than one mobile?

I have been wondering what to do about our landline number here at home. For it to ring both my mobile and my wife's would be perfect for us.

The answer to that is yes, there are a few ways of doing it but I don't think one of them is using the same SIM on two mobiles ;-). But I'll find out.

 

[cjd]

One eSIM on two mobiles is verboten - by the MNO - for pretty obvious reasons.

But what you want can be done by having two extensions and putting them in the same group. Both phones will then ring. It can be done as a straightforward call divert in which case you don't need an eSIM. One divert would be chargeable though.

With one phone using an eSIM and the other not, answering with the eSIM is free call but answering with the other is chargeable.

Another way would be to use the soft phone app - then both calls are free as it uses your data.

Choices, choices.

 

[Kerwin]

I'd be interested in this. I've been on the look out for a decent eSIM plan and all the major networks seem to require you to subscribe for high cost 18 month plan as far as I have seen.

What kind of prices are you looking at?

 

[cjd]

It'll be our usual no contract, 30 day rolling deal.

As for pricing, dunno yet, what would you think fair?

 

[Kerwin]

It'll be our usual no contract, 30 day rolling deal.

As for pricing, dunno yet, what would you think fair?

Assuming I can use my phone number I already have with you I'd say somewhere between £5 and £10 but that depends on things like data amounts. I tend to go with deals with lots of data incase my broadband goes down.

 

[bovine]

Absolutely yes. Have been with you for a very long time and this is exactly what I want. The geographic number diverts to our mobiles and to have it go to a dedicated eSIM would be great. When I had android phone I had 2 separate sims but after switching back to iPhone i just had one . Do miss being able to see if someone’s calling my mobile or the landline. I’m not sure what I would consider a reasonable cost per month, would need to have a look at that.

 

[cjd]

Initially it will be a secondary SIM, you already have a mobile contract with data so you don't need another data package. I think you're in the right area, but we need more work to know.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

I have a similar thing with Vonage where the voip signal is carried on 4 and 5 g or wifi

Vonage customer services have become a bot or something and has limited phone support
This would migrate my business to yours if your people can help with a problem on the phone

 

[cjd]

I have a similar thing with Vonage where the voip signal is carried on 4 and 5 g or wifi.

That uses a softphone app on your mobile. We've been doing that for 15 years ;-)

Vonage customer services have become a bot or something and has limited phone support
This would migrate my business to yours if your people can help with a problem on the phone

We have real people providing support 9-5, Monday to Friday by phone, chat and email and 24x7 email support. 95% of calls are answered in under 30 seconds. Try it, 0207 043 5555

 

[Ozzy]

Picking up on @japancool first comment, as we use Teams as and the mobile app as a small business, do you have what is effectively a competitor comparison of this compared to app options?

I like the idea and see little difference from the outside so think it would be good to see a comparison table.

 

[cjd]

The differences between diverts, apps and a native eSIM are:

1. The app uses your phone's data so it's dependent on a decent data connection. It needs to be selected to make a call and woken up when a new call arrives. The eSIM is a native mobile so will often have voice coverage when the data signal is poor. It's far more reliable.

2. Apps works with both WiFi and mobile data so they will work even with no mobile signal if you're connected to a WiFi point. You can display an outbound CLI for a landline using an app.

3. Our app also has Geodivert(R) - it switches automatically from office desk phone to mobile when you leave your fixed location and back again when you return. eSIMs don't really need this function.

4. Calls to your landline number can be simply diverted to your mobile without apps or SIMs, this is simple to set-up and manage and very reliable but each call is chargeable as it's essentially a new call from us to your mobile. Of course, if you're using an unlimited calling package you don't care. Diverted calls are only dependent on your mobile being switched on and having a signal. They are inbound only. You have to make outbound calls using your mobile package and your 07 number will be displayed.

5. The new eSIM service is a real ‘converged' service, it can make outbound calls from your mobile showing your landline number using a native mobile service - not an app. It is therefore far more reliable and simpler to use. It also integrates with all the VoIP desk phone stuff - call recording, extension dialling, IVR, call queues etc. It can replace the desk phone as the office phone. Or even the home phone. If used as a home phone - ie landline - you get call to your home wherever you are.

Teams uses the app method, not a full fixed to mobile converged (FMC) solution, it's reliant on a data connection of some kind.

At some point,"when we get around to it", we'll integrate everything with Teams anyway. We're far better at the telephony aspect of Teams than Microsoft.

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

It seems like a good idea, but, as you know, the competition is rife!

I would approach it as a need with a solution rather than a solution to a need. The technology is irrelevant and all of the techie mumbo jumbo means nothing to your target market.

Put your proposition in one sentence (two max) (not even an elevator pitch - too long) and sell the sizzle, not the sausage.

 

[cjd]

Sure, I'm aware of the aphorism

But we're not selling simple products; they can be complex services and are often sold to the technically savvy - comms managers and IT guys who can be expert buyers. So that's one set of potential customers where the "sizzle" is (almost) irrelevant. They do like new toys though.

To the micro business and home user the message is probably something like "your landline on your mobile."

 

[NickGrogan]

I use Groundwire as a VoIP app, recording calls and all the other bits and pieces, and it looks/feels like a landline. The VoIP lines ring on the desk phones as well, so mobile can be on/off/have no signal and everything works fine.

I know it uses data rather than voice, but I don't remember the last time I had a voice signal but not a data signal, so I am not really convinced that's a big selling point.

I have a sim and esim and 3 VoIP lines on my mobile

 

[japancool]

They do like new toys though.

This +1.

 

[cjd]

I use Groundwire as a VoIP app, recording calls and all the other bits and pieces, and it looks/feels like a landline. The VoIP lines ring on the desk phones as well, so mobile can be on/off/have no signal and everything works fine.

I know it uses data rather than voice, but I don't remember the last time I had a voice signal but not a data signal, so I am not really convinced that's a big selling point.

I have a sim and esim and 3 VoIP lines on my mobile

That would confuse the life out of me!

 

[NickGrogan]

That would confuse the life out of me!

Each one has different ringtones, and it displays the company they've called and the number calling - if they're a contact it'll show their name.

 

[DanteMosley]

Well, since Voipfone Mobile is a second service, how well it works might rely on how good the main phone service is. But it seems like it could be really helpful for businesses that want their communication to work together smoothly.

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

If I have one of your existing numbers and a (SIP) client on my phone, why would I need an esim - wouldn't I have the same functionality?

 

[cjd]

If I have one of your existing numbers and a (SIP) client on my phone, why would I need an esim - wouldn't I have the same functionality?

It's a reasonable point.

As I say above, the app performs all of the functions needed so long as you can get a good data connection and it has the advantage of working where there's no mobile signal at all using WiFi. It's also free. We have thousands of happy users of the app and we'll continue to offer and support it.

But it's still an app that relies on push notifications to wake it up when an inbound call arrives and you'll often have a voice connection when you have no data - it's just not as convenient and reliable as a native SIM.

It's a bit of a punt, but it provides a pathway into mobile. We'll see whether it appeals or not.

 

[NickGrogan]

"you'll often have a voice connection when you have no data"

Really? Any stats on this? I don't remember this happening. Maybe I'm just lucky in Edinburgh?

 

[cjd]

No stats, but experience with our app. We get complaints of missed calls and it's usually in poor data areas (but sometimes because the app failed to wake up). Where I live I have no data at all ever but I do have a weak phone signal. It not a problem for the majority of our users, it depends where you're trying to use it. My business partner in Kent hates the app but others love it.

 

[Deleted member 356896]

I'd be interested in this service. I currently use Tamar which diverts to mobiles. I'm looking for something that supports desktop handsets.

My concern looking at the post above is I'm reliant on mobile data and it's not great in our area.

Something that diverts incoming calls to mobiles would be better rather than an app with data.

 

[Kerwin]

@cjd Is there any news on this? I've recently come into a situation where I need to get an eSIM with a dedicated number for my business ASAP and was about to sign up with someone else but as I already use Voipfone I thought I'd ask if you had any news.

 

[cjd]

Hi Kerwin, the news is that we are now officially an MVNO and have the service up and running in Beta. It's working well but it won't be ready for the public for a couple of months - some billing and number porting tweeks to do.

Would the app do what you need in the meantime?

 

[Kerwin]

Hi Kerwin, the news is that we are now officially an MVNO and have the service up and running in Beta. It's working well but it won't be ready for the public for a couple of months - some billing and number porting tweeks to do.

Would the app do what you need in the meantime?

Thank you for the reply. I think what I'll do is get a temporary eSIM on a rolling 30 day contract and then when you are ready to launch I'll be able to compare the two. I am interested though as it would simply things in the long run.

 

[cjd]

Cheers Kerwin

 

[fantheflames]

There's great potential, definitely @cjd. The idea itself is intriguing once understood, and can see why it works for micro businesses looking to improve their communications.

The way I see it, making sure to differentiate yourself from services that micro businesses use, like Teams for example, particularly in terms of reliability and ease of use.

A comparison table highlighting these differences could provide potential customers with a clearer understanding of the advantages your service offers over competitors.

You'd need to get yourself ahead of any type of competitor, and positioning your technology as the best is where all your focus should go IMO.

And also focusing on the customer support element and responsiveness offered, attracting businesses that may be hesitant to switch from their usual tools may help those who are less tech savvy.

 

[Deleted member 356896]

Hi Kerwin, the news is that we are now officially an MVNO and have the service up and running in Beta. It's working well but it won't be ready for the public for a couple of months - some billing and number porting tweeks to do.

Would the app do what you need in the meantime?

Do you have any updates on pricing? I'm looking to get this if it's at a price point I can afford.

 

[cjd]

Yes, it'll be £10pm ex VAT - unless something changes.

Outbound calls come out of your existing calling plan. Texts (from the new 07 number) are free. It doesn't need data as you've already got it on your primary mobile.

There'll be later developments that mean that you can do away with your existing primary mobile service just by adding a data package and porting your number.

Target date is mid-November.

You need a reasonably modern phone that can use eSIMs

 

[Deleted member 356896]

Thanks

 

[Ivanzyt]

If I were a micro business I think this would be something I would buy.

It's a nice idea for anyone who is running their business via their mobile phone, which so many small businesses do. I think tradespeople who are out and about a lot would be a great target, that way they can have a geographic number on their literature, giving a more professional look, safe in the knowledge that they will always be able to answer and respond as if from that number. Plus, as you say, you can access all the smart stuff done on the PBX via your mobile.

 

[Nikhil.Singh]

@cjd Is there any news on this? I've recently come into a situation where I need to get an eSIM with a dedicated number for my business ASAP and was about to sign up with someone else but as I already use Voipfone I thought I'd ask if you had any news.

Hi Kerwin, Enreach has a very reliable MVNO service with an E-Sim capability. The technology we are discussing here is FMC- Fixed Mobile Convergence. Do feel free to discuss more about the technology and how it works, I could also let you know some cool pros & cons of this tech.