We have just lost £40 trying to send goods to the EU (and I'm angry)

Discussion in 'International Business' started by Justin Smith, Mar 2, 2021.

  1. Justin Smith

    Justin Smith UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    2,018 255
    We do not send loads of stuff abroad, but most of it has always been to the EU because carriage further afield is obviously more expensive. We never had any problems whilst we were in the EU.
    However, since Jan two orders took weeks to get to the customers and the other two (=50% ! ) are being returned to us amidst arguments about whether the paperwork is in order and possible import duties payable.

    We have had to refund both orders (one to Belgium and one to Poland) even though we haven't even had them back yet. This is because one customer has already been waiting since the 12 Jan the other since the 4th Feb. Even if we do get the stock back (and it's in a saleable condition.....) we will have lost about £40 on the carriage. I doubt we will get that back, esp considering contacting the carrier agent is an absolute nightmare at the best of times.

    In my view the government should be refunding me that money as they lied to me and said "we have got a free trade deal when nobody said we would !".
    The govt should cease those adverts encouraging companies to export because they are arguably deceitful (implying it's going to be easy with all their "free trade deals") and they are a waste of money anyway. We have decided not to bother sending any more stuff to the EU, it's too much hassle.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Justin Smith Member since: Jun 6, 2012
    #1
  2. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! { Moderator }

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    Your problem is the carrier not the Government. The agreement with the EU is zero tariffs and zero quotas. Your carrier has got it wrong.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
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  3. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

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    A free trade deal is not a customs union.

    The government is not being deceitful. Its exactly the same as exporting anywhere else.

    @fisicx someone has to pay VAT at some point. I still think you are right the carrier messed up - unless customs at the other end are being really slow to process paperwork.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
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  4. Mike Foulds

    Mike Foulds UKBF Regular Free Member

    121 42
    Whilst I agree that the government is not being deceitful, I do believe that there was a major difference between what the public thought a free trade deal would entail, and what the goverment was actually negotiating.

    Because of the word "free", I have had alot of customers believe that whilst they may need an EORI number, they would not be paying duty or vat for shipments to/from Europe, and it's come as a shock to them that they now have to.

    For this particular situation, I agree that your carrier has messed up. The documents should have been checked and confirmed prior to collecting, BUT, alot of courier companies still arent doing this. They are collecting goods, trying to get them through customs with paperwork which is unsuitable, and then rejecting and returning at a cost.

    If you do look to export again, I would recommend reviewing your paperwork, and seeking help from a customs specialist, or finding an approved template online you can use. There now needs to be MUCH more information present on any invoices for export, and the smallest details can be the most important.

    Good luck when you do take the decision to start exporting again.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Mike Foulds Member since: Mar 21, 2018
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  5. Import Expert

    Import Expert UKBF Regular Free Member

    350 139
    A free trade deal does not mean no customs formalities, it means no duty payable if those goods are of UK/EU origin. Unfortunately from a customs point of view shipping something now from the UK to France for example is really no different to shipping something to the other side of the world.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Import Expert Member since: Feb 1, 2012
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  6. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

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    @Mike Foulds I can understand consumers not understanding, but businesses should know, and carriers, whose business this is, really should know.

    Its no different from exporting to non-EU countries always was, and they are not all on the otherwide of the world,. AFAIK exporting to European countries outside the EU customs union like Norway or Switzerland or Russia would always have required the paperwork.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
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  7. Justin Smith

    Justin Smith UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

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    We do not send that much stuff abroad, possible 2 or 3 a month, if that. Most was to the EU because the cost of carriage to places further away was prohibitive for most orders, That, BTW, was one of the reasons that I though all this crap about "we can now export all over the world (like we couldn't before.....) was rubbish, at least for traders dealing in orders straight to customers with single items.
    But we have never, as far as I can remember, ever had an order returned to us from anywhere because the paperwork was wrong. Never.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Justin Smith Member since: Jun 6, 2012
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  8. The Soup Dragon

    The Soup Dragon UKBF Regular Free Member

    200 7
    Who are you shipping with? We have been advised by our shipping consolidator to avoid UPS to Europe as they are in such a mess. They also said if you do have anything returned it may take weeks and weeks to come back.

    We ship stuff internationally and to US Canada down under etc its same as it ever was but to the EU it is fraught with issues when it neednt be
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: The Soup Dragon Member since: May 13, 2013
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  9. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! { Moderator }

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    But you have now. And it's not the fault of the government no matter how angry that makes you.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
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  10. atmosbob

    atmosbob UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: atmosbob Member since: Oct 26, 2009
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  11. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

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    @atmosbob project fear claims:

    1. The economy will collapse and there will be soaring unemployment if we even vote leave, even before we actually leave
    2. There will be food and medicine shortages if we leave and we should all stock up
    3. There will be lorries waiting for days to clear customs and Kent will be a big car park.

    reality:

    1. Some one had to pay £45 quid more to RMA a hard drive (your register aricle)
    2. A lorry driver was not allowed to take his sarnies into Holland.
    ... etc.

    Not really much conformation of the predictions, is it?

    The lack of disaster may disappoint EU nationalists, but the attempting to claim minor things like that confirm project fear was right is desperate barrel scraping.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
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  12. DontAsk

    DontAsk UKBF Ace Free Member

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    UPS stuff is delayed but nothing too serious and nowhere near as bad as Royal Mail. As soon as RM parcels are handed over to Deutsche Post you lose all tracking until delivered.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: DontAsk Member since: Jan 7, 2015
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  13. Ally Maxwell

    Ally Maxwell Guest

    0 0
    You think, seriously, that this is the extent of business difficulties caused by Brexit ??
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Ally Maxwell Member since: Jan 1, 1970
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  14. Justin Smith

    Justin Smith UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    2,018 255
    Not quite sure what your point is F. We don't send loads of stuff abroad, but it must be 100s over the years. We have never had an order sent back because of incorrect paperwork or problems with who is paying any extra tariffs of taxes.
    Since the Government's "free trade deal" came into force we have had 2 out of 4 returned.
    And if it isn't the government's fault (they negotiated the "free trade deal" after all, then told everyone we had a "free trade deal" so "export, because exporting is great") whose fault is it ?
    They are just facts.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: Justin Smith Member since: Jun 6, 2012
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  15. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

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    It seems to be the worst EU nationalists can come up with.

    The point is that the difficulties are nothing like those predicted. Not even close. Project fear was a con.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
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  16. The Soup Dragon

    The Soup Dragon UKBF Regular Free Member

    200 7
    As was all of the look how much money we will have to spend on this that and the other drivel....................... a con as well
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: The Soup Dragon Member since: May 13, 2013
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  17. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

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    Its the fault of either:

    1. Whoever did the paperwork
    2. Whoever failed to arrange to pay the VAT on import
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
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  18. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! { Moderator }

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    The couriers.

    The free trade deal is not a customs union. The gov had umpteen adverts on all sorts of media warning of this with links to a whole raft of advice on what you needed to do from 1 Jan.
     
    Posted: Mar 2, 2021 By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
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  19. Trevor Andrews

    Trevor Andrews UKBF Contributor Free Member

    98 27
    I sympathize Justin, we are in Spain and have same problems sending to U.K.

    The government has been deceitful in pretending it was all easy and going to be just the same as before- it’s not.

    The actual courier fees are much the same but now there are admin fees and in our case U.K. import tax (VAT).

    Couriers like UPS and DHL seem to have got their act together recently, the latter refunded us when they failed to collect due to paperwork issues. DHL were very effective in collecting fees for delivery from U.K. which only took a week from shipment to arrival.

    We are able to add a small increase in prices for auK products to cover fees but earnestly looking for EU alternatives or U.K. companies that have set up EU distribution.
     
    Posted: Mar 3, 2021 By: Trevor Andrews Member since: Feb 9, 2021
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  20. Justin Smith

    Justin Smith UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

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    Well that's one way of looking at it, but to a certain extent it's irrelevant. You cannot escape the facts of the, matter. We never had that problem before, now we have had it twice in a month.
    We have ceased sending stuff to the EU because I am not risking it again, it's not just cost of the carrier (assuming we get the goods back that is) it is the massive problems dealing with Parcels2Go who are the agent and the only way we can get the carriage at a reasonable price. Thus we have an extra link in the chain and it makes it even more problematic. Worse still, like a lot of businesses these days, they do not want to talk to their customers, the best you can easily get is to "talk" to an computer, then if you want ages you get an "online chat" with an agent, none of whom have been able to help us.
    The long and short of it is I wonder whether we'll ever bother sending stuff to any EU country again because sooner or later we'll have to think, are we going to risk it ? And the answer may well be, no I can't be arsed, my stress levels do not need it.
     
    Posted: Mar 3, 2021 By: Justin Smith Member since: Jun 6, 2012
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