Travellers

[japancool]

Since you asked.

The Color Pink Doesn't Exist, According To Science

Pink may be a scientific impossibility, but we are still tickled pink to have this color party crash the color spectrum.

historydaily.org

That's devastating news for the makers of My Little Pony.

 

[NickGrogan]

This is to clear the other thread of going off topic, which is not totally fair on the person who started it.

The topic has come up about Travellers. Now firstly, travellers are not really an ethnic group at all, but the government have decided to lump together Roma, boatlifers, van lifers showmen, and others, into one group.

It is for that reason alone that I ask the question using the terms.

Now, I am aware that not all Travellers are law abiding people. Just as not all white middle class people are, either.

But lets be blunt. Would you do business with a person knowing them to be a Traveller?

How would I know that they're a Traveller?

 

[Mark T Jones]

It still comes down somewhat to definitions.

If I was buying software I'd check out the company not the individuals.

In terms of "true" travellers we'd struggle, because we usually require home-owning guarantors. Of course if they owned a static home, that wouldn't be an issue.

I know a finance company who specialises in financing fairground rides. Their success lies entirely in knowing the right people to approach if things go wrong.

 

[Paul Norman]

How would I know that they're a Traveller?

Mostly, you would not.

 

[NickGrogan]

Mostly, you would not.

I can't see it being much of a problem then.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Why do TV programmes about Travellers always have somebody, often many, with their faces obscured?

 

[Paul Norman]

I can't see it being much of a problem then.

Who knows, we may all have unwittingly done so.

But of course, you are correct.

 

[Paul Norman]

Why do TV programmes about Travellers always have somebody, often many, with their faces obscured?

I don't know. Oddly enough, I don't watch those programs. Hopefully, someone here from within the TV sector can enlighten us.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

I don't know. Oddly enough, I don't watch those programs. Hopefully, someone here from within the TV sector can enlighten us.

The disclaimer attached to the programmes says it's to prevent future prejudice against them. The broader belief is that it's to *prevent those who've done something wrong from being identified. Doing so does little to help the portrayal of Travellers as honest.

*That's from folk in the community.

 

[Paul Norman]

'Broader belief' is prejudicial, and not necessarily accurate.

Indeed, those programmes do little to attempt an accurate portrayal of those groups - it would be very dull to film an hour of me sitting in my office doing the accounts, when outside someone is causing an affray.

Just as, I believe, Geordie Shore does little to accurately reflect the people of the North East, most of whom also are just getting on with their un TV worthy lives in a decent way.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

'Broader belief' is prejudicial, and not necessarily accurate.

I don't see how when it comes from travellers themselves?

 

[japancool]

Do we believe all Russians are Putin-supporting warmongers?

Or all Muslims (or even people with brown skin) are suicide bombers?

 

[NickGrogan]

Do we believe all Russians are Putin-supporting warmongers?

Or all Muslims (or even people with brown skin) are suicide bombers?

Growing up in the 80's and the cold war, that's pretty much what we were taught about Russia.

Not all Muslims are suicide bombers, but how many suicide bombers are not Muslim?

 

[japancool]

Not all Muslims are suicide bombers, but how many suicide bombers are not Muslim?

Well, back in the day, quite a lot of them were Japanese!

 

[NickGrogan]

Well, back in the day, quite a lot of them were Japanese!

And before that, they were Irish and Russian.

One of the earliest bombers was English. But we celebrate him, so I guess that's ok?

 

[japancool]

One of the earliest bombers was English. But we celebrate him, so I guess that's ok?

Guy Fawkes? But he wasn't exactly a suicide bomber though.

 

[simon field]

I guess there’s just a section of society who move about with caravans n stuff, who like the whole ‘gang’ thing, and actively intimidate and do lawless things, as a lifestyle.

I guess some of them might be polite, have ‘honour’, even be trustworthy. Much like any other group of people.

Back in the 80’s, I was friends with a few football hooligans. It wasn’t my bag, but some of them - well you’d never know! Professional, well turned out, always ready with a friendly smile! Salt of the earth types.

Just goes to show, you can’t judge a book by its cover.

To be sure!

 

[MOIC]

My tuppence worth…..don’t cross them.

 

[STDFR33]

We would, as a result of your honestly expressed answer, never do business.

Seems to work out well for both parties!

 

[fisicx]

One of the earliest bombers was English. But we celebrate him, so I guess that's ok?

I thought the celebration was because we defeated Fawkes.

 

[STDFR33]

Travellers took over my former employers car park.

The kids would take a dump outside the office windows 'for a laugh'. They'd throw stones at nearby cars. There was pretty much nothing anti-social that they wouldn't do.

£35k in legal fees and clear up costs.

Our local annual fair is run by travellers. Coincidentally, when they arrive, burglaries / dog thefts etc etc increase dramatically.

On the TV these types of travellers (transit van and a caravan) portray themselves as victims. Perhaps if they respected other people and things, they'd be more welcome to places.

The fact is that when they turn up on your local field or car park, they are nothing but a massive nuisance.

 

[simon field]

It seems odd to me that the OP has entitled the thread ‘Travellers’ when he also states that the phrase ‘annoys him the most’.

Hmmm.

 

[Paul Norman]

It seems odd to me that the OP has entitled the thread ‘Travellers’ when he also states that the phrase ‘annoys him the most’.

Hmmm.

1. I am trying to see where I said exactly that.

2. It is common usage. Most people seem to understand what I mean, and you understand it too. It is expedient.

 

[Paul Norman]

Seems to work out well for both parties!

I think it does. You would not want to business with me. And I would never want to force anyone!

 

[simon field]

1. I am trying to see where I said exactly that.

2. It is common usage. Most people seem to understand what I mean, and you understand it too. It is expedient.

Post #58 on the other thread:

‘I actually find the term traveller more annoying, simply because it is so meaningless.’

 

[Paul Norman]

Post #58 on the other thread:

‘I actually find the term traveller more annoying, simply because it is so meaningless.’

Thank you . That must have taken a bit of time to find.

I will stay with the expedient thing then. It is a commonly used phrase.

 

[simon field]

Thank you . That must have taken a bit of time to find.

I will stay with the expedient thing then. It is a commonly used phrase.

No longer than to type ‘you’re welcome’ ?

 

[Paul Norman]

Travellers took over my former employers car park.

The kids would take a dump outside the office windows 'for a laugh'. They'd throw stones at nearby cars. There was pretty much nothing anti-social that they wouldn't do.

£35k in legal fees and clear up costs.

Our local annual fair is run by travellers. Coincidentally, when they arrive, burglaries / dog thefts etc etc increase dramatically.

On the TV these types of travellers (transit van and a caravan) portray themselves as victims. Perhaps if they respected other people and things, they'd be more welcome to places.

The fact is that when they turn up on your local field or car park, they are nothing but a massive nuisance.

The law is weak currently on people doing this. The government are trying to amend it.


I must admit, though, I would not park my van in a supermarket carpark even as a solo unit - the one time I did that I was, as reported elsewhere, reported to the police, and decided it would be better to shop elsewhere.

 

[Paul Norman]

It still comes down somewhat to definitions.

If I was buying software I'd check out the company not the individuals.

In terms of "true" travellers we'd struggle, because we usually require home-owning guarantors. Of course if they owned a static home, that wouldn't be an issue.

I know a finance company who specialises in financing fairground rides. Their success lies entirely in knowing the right people to approach if things go wrong.

This seems a sensible approach.

The rules for loan given ought not to be suspended for certain people without compelling reason.

When I was seeking funding for our ecommerce business (some years ago now) the bank, of course, did not enquire into who I was - but they did, quite rightly, want to see my personal bank account, as I would be a guaruntor of the loan. This I complied with.

 

[NickGrogan]

Guy Fawkes? But he wasn't exactly a suicide bomber though.

How long do you think the fuse was? How reliable were fuses in those days?

 

[Paul Norman]

How long do you think the fuse was? How reliable were fuses in those days?

A longer fuse might have been a wise idea. And some kind of remote deployment mechanism.

 

[NickGrogan]

If living in a caravan makes you a traveller, and I lived in a caravan for 6 years, does that make me a traveller?

 

[Paul Norman]

If living in a caravan makes you a traveller, and I lived in a caravan for 6 years, does that make me a traveller?

I think it might depend on who you ask, going on the above!


I suspect, if we are using the term from an ethnic point of view, then the answer is no.

I do hope you enjoyed it, though.

 

[IanSuth]

If living in a caravan makes you a traveller, and I lived in a caravan for 6 years, does that make me a traveller?

I lived in a static one until the age of 2 1/2 as house prices went crazy around 1970 and my parents wanted to move out of family homes following marriage.

 

[japancool]

How long do you think the fuse was? How reliable were fuses in those days?

The plan was for him to make his escape across the Thames, so he apparently wasn't intending to commit suicide.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Back in the 80’s, I was friends with a few football hooligans. It wasn’t my bag, but some of them - well you’d never know! Professional, well turned out, always ready with a friendly smile! Salt of the earth types.

I knew a few myself. Most often trying to fill a void in there lives to give them kudos down the pub.

Our local annual fair is run by travellers. Coincidentally, when they arrive, burglaries / dog thefts etc etc increase dramatically.

Although marginal in some folks eyes, I believe most fairs to be run by showground folk who distance themselves from the behaviour and stereotype of the travellers under discussion?

Consider the facts. If a link can be drawn between the Fair and criminality their business would be dead in the water. Most half sensible criminals don't crap on their own doorstep.
You don't steal a dog and drop it off to somebody round the corner to hide and wouldn't take it to the Fair and hide it under the Dodgems!

Finally, if your running a Fair, when do you get the time to go 'on the rob'?

 

[NickGrogan]

I think it might depend on who you ask, going on the above!


I suspect, if we are using the term from an ethnic point of view, then the answer is no.

I do hope you enjoyed it, though.

What if my parents were Irish, does that help?

It was ok, they decided to build a house, it was supposed to take a year, it didn't.

I was in the caravan during the "great storm" in 1987. A branch came through the skylight and took off half the roof so it was raining inside.

It didn't wake me up, I'm a heavy sleeper.

 

[Fagin2021]

If you need a plumber do you call George or Zak ?
Would you rather Jack or Tristram fixed your car's electronics ?
Wayne or Stephen for a replacement roof tile ?

Fairly or unfairly, we all have pre-conceived notions about individuals or groups...

Irish humour
Scottish thrift
German efficiency
Italian flair
English batting collapse

and so on.

 

[Bob Morgan]

It seems as though 'Travellers' has become the 'New Covid Thread!' - Evidently and for some, the first stop after reading the Daily Fail over a morning cuppa!

 

[japancool]

English batting collapse

You were saying?