The 'Something For Nothing' Brigade...

[Vectis]

I can't see the problem with asking for a discount, it just depends how it's done. Just has to be done without rudeness etc. The same goes for the shopkeeper. Doesn't need a rude or sarcastic reply, just a polite 'no' will do, if there's no discount on offer.

All these rants by shopkeepers about overheads, rent, rates etc aren't relevant to the customer. As a company, we don't work in retail, we're a service company. If we get asked for a discount, we'll consider it depending on what the customer is buying and whether they're likely to buy more in the future. Just like shopkeepers, we too have overheads, wages, rates etc etc. But I wouldn't be rude or sarcastic to anyone simply because they asked.

I don't actually understand why more people don't ask. We're all happy to negotiate a price for a car or a house or some other purchases, but reluctant (in this country at least) to talk to a shopkeeper about prices.

It doesn't hurt to ask, nicely, and it doesn't hurt to refuse, nicely.

 

[arcon5]

It's a little rich how a person in business whose job is to maximise their return is offended by a consumer who seeks to maximise the value they receive for their money.

So many independent retailers take their business personally and get upset when somebody negotiates a discount.

I can recall a couple of times I asked for a discount...

One in halfords, the box was damaged so I asked if they can knock a few quid off. The woman happily obliged, probably because it was the last one out and she knew she'd end up reducing it anyway and by giving me a few quid off would probably make more money than the reduced price.

Another on ebay, added an item to my watch list which encouraged offers... I made an offer and hoped to meet in the middle, the reply was "LOL".
Immediately I was glad I wasn't buying as if that's the level of professionalism they offer then god help me if something went wrong.
Killer is I was willing to pay the buy now price anyway so pretty much any counter offer would have got the sale. He got nothing.


The best point made so far is 'do you care about your customers outgoings/overheads when they give you their cash?' No you don't, because naturally you just want to run your business and make money. And it works the other way round.


I've owned a shop btw and offers was rife... Rather than jumping on the defensive I used it as an opportunity to try get them to spend more.

 

[deniser]

It depends how it's done. There are those that you gel with and who ask nicely and whom you might say yes to. There are others who accept no and buy it anyway. And then there are those who stomp off shouting a tirade of abuse when you say your polite no.

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

The best point made so far is 'do you care about your customers outgoings/overheads when they give you their cash?' No you don't, because naturally you just want to run your business and make money. And it works the other way round.

As a service provider and installer of security products, I have to disagree with you... Yes "WE" do care about our customers outgoings and overheads - We have always provided our services at a specific amount, however as and where possible when we attend a site and we can see that they're not going to be able to afford the recommended products, we'll always offer to install a product the same security level but at a much cheaper price. In some cases one of our own suppliers products are made by the same manufacturer just re-branded but is a lot cheaper than what we would normally install.

Part of our services is educational to the end user, again we've never charged for information. Even to the degree of a someone contacting me two weeks ago, they'd bought a house with a safe in it and they had no idea what the code was. When they sent me a picture of the safe in question I was able to explain to them how to change the code from the outside over the phone. Obviously checks were made to ensure that they were not "dodgy" in any way. and totally free to the customer.

 

[arcon5]

As a service provider and installer of security products, I have to disagree with you... Yes "WE" do care about our customers outgoings and overheads - We have always provided our services at a specific amount, however as and where possible when we attend a site and we can see that they're not going to be able to afford the recommended products, we'll always offer to install a product the same security level but at a much cheaper price. In some cases one of our own suppliers products are made by the same manufacturer just re-branded but is a lot cheaper than what we would normally install.

Then that's not really caring about their overheads, its just offering a different product to the customer to win the sale.
If they are well off you try sell them the higher priced product which you admit is the same quality - so you are trying to maximise your return, naturally of course. But you can't be offended if the customer wants to try buy the more expensive product with a perceived higher quality at a lesser price, they are doing their job as a consumer (maximise their value) in the same way your doing your job as a businessman.

Not saying you personally get offended by hagglers btw, but it seems many here do.

 

[scm5436]

Another on ebay, added an item to my watch list which encouraged offers... I made an offer and hoped to meet in the middle, the reply was "LOL"... Killer is I was willing to pay the buy now price anyway so pretty much any counter offer would have got the sale. He got nothing.

You say that like he 'lost out', but in reality he was probably glad you went elsewhere - I know I would be. If he's selling on ebay he's probably already making tiny margins and there was probably no room to 'meet in the middle'.

We run a lot of internet stores, as well as a shop, and the types of people that ask for discounts are usually one's that turn into problem customers. They're always unhappy about something, or they decide they don't like the colour, or they've changed their minds, or they bought the wrong type. Compare that to all the customers we never talk to, who just go to our website, buy it at the advertised price, and then we never hear from them until the next time they come back for more and I'm sure you can see why we're happy to 'encourage' certain types of people to buy elsewhere.

It doesn't hurt to ask.

Well you say that, but we've turned customers away for asking in a way we didn't like, or just generally for being a dick. And we've even had them then start pleading to let them buy the item (because it's a really good deal and no-one else has anything close to matching it), and us taking great delight in refusing.

So if you see a bargain, grab it, don't be a dick about it or the shop keeper might just go all Basil Faulty on you. (ah, my hero)

And why do people always say the same thing when you refuse to sell to them? "How rude, I'm going to take my business elsewhere!". uh yeah, that's what we just told you to do, why are you saying it like you're the one making the decision!

 

[Faevilangel]

Asking for a discount is ok (I never accept any) but there needs to be 2 steps:

1) Liaise with the shopkeeper, be friendly and make them want to serve you
2) Be polite about the discount e.g. would you be willing to take £x for this, not "I can get this for £x from Y, give me a price match

Most people who ask for a discount (as said above) are normally going to be the trouble makers, looking for the cheapest price and then throw a hissy fit on the smallest problem.

I have asked and got discounts, it's all about how you approach the subject, spending time to get to know the shopkeeper and being reasonable with your request, asking for a 50% discount will get you no where, where as 10% is more likely to be considered.

 

[scm5436]

1) Liaise with the shopkeeper, be friendly and make them want to serve you
2) Be polite about the discount e.g. would you be willing to take £x for this, not "I can get this for £x from Y, give me a price match

3) If it's the cheapest price you've found anywhere, even on the internet, just don't even ask for a discount...

 

[Faevilangel]

3) If it's the cheapest price you've found anywhere, even on the internet, just don't even ask for a discount...

but sometimes it's just worth asking... my dad asks for a discount on most things, if they refuse then he asks for their pen

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

Then that's not really caring about their overheads, its just offering a different product to the customer to win the sale.
If they are well off you try sell them the higher priced product which you admit is the same quality - so you are trying to maximise your return, naturally of course. But you can't be offended if the customer wants to try buy the more expensive product with a perceived higher quality at a lesser price, they are doing their job as a consumer (maximise their value) in the same way your doing your job as a businessman.

Not saying you personally get offended by hagglers btw, but it seems many here do.

OK, Firstly we do care about the customers overheads, it's not as if we're putting any old lock in for people... We have a specific quality of product and service that we "HAVE" to adhere too, we will only install British Standard locks under no circumstances do we ever install anything but British Standard products...

The Locksmith that sticks anything in such as a Non-BS lock on an external door is someone that is trying to maximise his sales and does not care about the clients well being.

Secondly, security products should never have a lesser value than what they're marketed at - The security of someones home and belongings should not be "discounted". Why would you want to pay less to secure something of value? The fact that companies can provide security services cheaper than other companies (no names mentioned) I believe has no warrant.

As the saying goes, you get what you pay for.

Thirdly, I never get offended by anything... takes a lot to offend me as it goes... with regards to comments here though I haven't seen anyone saying that they were offended (perhaps I've missed some? ) I believe in order to be offending something or someone has to say something about me personally, asking for a discount on say a £1000 camera system hardly offends me, no it makes me laugh...

Why ask for that particular system if you don't want or can't afford to pay for the asking price... The price is there clear as day it doesn't have any other sign on it saying MAKE ME AN OFFER! The prices were not put there by me nor my company but by the manufacturer, why would I want to suggest something of a higher quality is cheap?

Let's look at the likes of Tesco's for instance...

They sell Ipad's for £499 samsung notes (or whatever they're called ) for £389 they then bring out a much cheaper version of a Ipad and Samsung call it something completely different (obviously) and sell it for £119 - Do they reduce the price of the Ipad or samsung product because they have a cheaper option? No... why would they... it's the brand the consumer wants after all.

For my company we only sell specific products/brands We stick to products we know and we can invest in. If the product fails we can very quickly get it repaired or replaced, there is no point at all in having more than one locking product on sale simply because of the brands.

We stick to specific products because they're the best on the market... if you can buy them cheaper online fine go and buy it online, we're happy for you... but when you've installed it incorrectly or broken something we know that the customer will come back to us.

All our cylinders are Eurospec and all our mortise locks are Union Strongbolt. Its all we need.

 

[warnie]

I've owned a shop btw and offers was rife... Rather than jumping on the defensive I used it as an opportunity to try get them to spend more.

This.

Ask them to buy more and then you can work with them on price. We have a long standing promotion which we have kept in place since we started. When the customer spends £5 or more we give them a free 100g of jarred sweets upto the value of 95p. Anyone in this game knows that were not making a massive gesture here, but to the customer it is. It works really well as an upsell tool as well as keeping the discount hunters happy.

Many of our customers come in armed with a £5 note to get the free sweets, instead of just spending a couple of quid.

 

[Mainland]

My favourite is when a customer calls for a price on something, which I give. They then ask 'is that your best price?' The amount of times I have felt like sarcastically saying 'oh sorry, I didn't realise you wanted my best price, allow me to knock 50% off' But you have to forgive them as I always say 'if you don't ask you don't get'

 

[Lunazzurra]

As much as I would like to give a sarcastic reply (see below) sometimes when asked for a discount, we've found it's best to give a polite but firm reply of "No, I'm sorry, but that is our best price and I'll think you'll find our prices fair and competitive as they are." Nine times out of ten they will pay the marked price after saying "Worth asking anyway" or something similar.

(What I would actually like to say sometimes when asked is (Basil Fawlty mode):- "Well, since you had the audacity to ask in the first place, the price has just gone UP by 10% and every time you remonstrate it will keep going UP by a further 10%. Okay?)

The other approach which works quite well is to pretend to check the stock sheets on the computer momentarily and press a few buttons on the old calculator. Grimace slightly and then say: "No, sorry, I can't go any lower than that I'm afraid." This way at least LOOKS as if you've reasonably considered their offer!

The thing is, it can also depend on which item they are asking for a discount on. I'm very unlikely indeed to consider giving ANY discount on top sellers, brand new stock or anything that's unique to us. But, if on the other hand, it's something that's been on the shelf for far too long as far as I'm concerned - I might be doing myself a favour by offering a discount, mentally wiping my forehead saying, "Thank heavens we're going to get rid of that at last."

As a side point we've just put our (single) Christmas cards out on the rack. They are on for £1.85 each OR 3 for £5 (= £1.67ea) or 5 for £7.50 ( = £1.50ea). This sounds to the customer as if we are offering a good discount even though we've upped our prices to give us the margins we want based on the lower price. They've only been on the rack since yesterday pm and already we are seeing some good results.

So, there are many ways to approach discounting, but I must say that customer attitude can swing my decision as to whether I even consider a discount or not in the first place - if they put my back up at all then no way ......

 

[Mayor]

My favourite is when a customer calls for a price on something, which I give. They then ask 'is that your best price?' The amount of times I have felt like sarcastically saying 'oh sorry, I didn't realise you wanted my best price, allow me to knock 50% off' But you have to forgive them as I always say 'if you don't ask you don't get'

I quoted £12 for an item. When asked what my "best" price was, I quoted £15. I laughed, relented, and said that "as it is you, it is Tuesday, and you made me laugh, you can have it for £13, with a free bag.! or £12 for cash...."

They bought it. A nice day.

 

[PrestonLad]

Well that thread took some reading. Started off quite entertaining , but got bogged down in something akin to trench warfare in the latter stages!

 

[arcon5]

You say that like he 'lost out', but in reality he was probably glad you went elsewhere - I know I would be. If he's selling on ebay he's probably already making tiny margins and there was probably no room to 'meet in the middle'.

As I said, the seller was encouraging offers so his margins can't have been that low.

Why would any logical seller be pleased? Any logical seller would see it as an opportunity to make a sale... 'Sorry sir, that's too low, we'd accept £x though' is hardly strenuous and would have got the sale.

Maybe this thread also acts to highlight why small independents are still small independents.... Their lack of professionalism and the fact they seem to jump on the defensive hardly make people want to part with their cash.

There was many a times i had to turn down offers in store and in most cases if you deal with it correctly and friendly you can still win the sale.

 

[arcon5]

but sometimes it's just worth asking... my dad asks for a discount on most things, if they refuse then he asks for their pen

Bait and switch then

 

[David1962]

This.

Ask them to buy more and then you can work with them on price. We have a long standing promotion which we have kept in place since we started. When the customer spends £5 or more we give them a free 100g of jarred sweets upto the value of 95p. Anyone in this game knows that were not making a massive gesture here, but to the customer it is. It works really well as an upsell tool as well as keeping the discount hunters happy.

Many of our customers come in armed with a £5 note to get the free sweets, instead of just spending a couple of quid.

I'm sure you're aware, but it's worth remembering you are not giving away 26p or so worth of sweets. As it's coming off your net profit you have to account for how much you need to take to cover that 26p. So in your case I would imagine you need to take, roughly, another 80p to cover the freebee.

Just saying, as those new to retail may not be aware

 

[Miss Chris]

I love the ones who feel the need to tell you that it is cheaper elsewhere! I once had a customer telling me it was cheaper on ebay (I think they expect you to then go oh really well in that case let me do it cheaper) in this case I told them that wow for such a good price they should go to ebay there is noway I could do it for that price! - A week later they come back!! and purchase from me.

They were unhappy that on ebay they would not have got the free design, mock up personal touch and the price I gave was final price not hidden add ons. The first few times I felt bad like I should be cheaper but then got so used to it - you win some you lose some and by no means would I chase anybody.

Although If people find it cheaper elsewhere I rather they go there than feel the need to come back and tell you!!

 

[japancool]

A week later they come back!! and purchase from me.

But that's the whole point isn't it? You were (presumably) polite and amicable, and the customer didn't mind being politely told no, so you got the sale eventually, if not there and then. Whereas if you'd taken it as personally as some people have in this thread and given a sarky reply, that probably wouldn't have happened.

 

[MASSEY]

If i ever turned into someone who quibbled over the prices of sweets i would kill myself.

 

[scm5436]

If i ever turned into someone who quibbled over the prices of sweets i would kill myself.

If the shopkeeper didn't beat you to it!

 

[herewegoagain.]

If the shopkeeper didn't beat you to it!

meaning.....?

 

[japancool]

There are people out there to whom a few pence makes a lot of difference. A few pensioners near me who have nothing but their pension to live on, so yeah, it's understandable why they might ask for a discount. But if it's beneath some shopkeepers to deal with people like that, I guess that's their choice.

 

[Eurostick]

There are people out there to whom a few pence makes a lot of difference. A few pensioners near me who have nothing but their pension to live on, so yeah, it's understandable why they might ask for a discount. But if it's beneath some shopkeepers to deal with people like that, I guess that's their choice.

It still baffles me why anyone would turn down a sale even if they have to knock a really small % off the deal - A sale is better than no sale?

Alan

 

[kelvin1950]

It still baffles me why anyone would turn down a sale even if they have to knock a really small % off the deal - A sale is better than no sale?

Alan

In a word - no. If you don't understand why I said that then you don't understand the psychology of retail customers.

 

[scm5436]

meaning.....?

meaning... there seem to be a lot of angry sweet shop owners on here... I was implying arguing over a few pence could be hazardous to customers health... I was clearly joking...

 

[herewegoagain.]

meaning... there seem to be a lot of angry sweet shop owners on here... I was implying arguing over a few pence could be hazardous to customers health... I was clearly joking...

Customers health...? perhaps you have got this back to front !!

 

[japancool]

Coincidentally, or perhaps not, this story came up in the UKBF newsletter thing.
http://www.businesszone.co.uk/topic...ess-confectionary-entrepreneur/54244?ref=ukbf

Have you considered it as an option?

 

It still baffles me why anyone would turn down a sale even if they have to knock a really small % off the deal - A sale is better than no sale?

Alan

Absolutely the haggle is the basis of all business.

 

[MASSEY]

Absolutely the haggle is the basis of all business.

Maybe in India...

If you go to a shop and buy a bar of chocolate haggling is ridiculous.

 

[Eurostick]

In a word - no. If you don't understand why I said that then you don't understand the psychology of retail customers.

Not sure what you mean on this Kevin, considering I didn't quote your post?

I am a retail customer in most places I go too so I am sure I understand my own psychology?

Alan

 

[kelvin1950]

Not sure what you mean on this Kevin, considering I didn't quote your post?

I am a retail customer in most places I go too so I am sure I understand my own psychology?

Alan

Seemed very simple to me. Maybe I'm just too intelligent for this place.

 

[Gecko001]

In a word - no. If you don't understand why I said that then you don't understand the psychology of retail customers.

I agree. If the customer knows the price and also knows that that price is not negotiable then the customer is in control. He/she knows they either buys it there or goes elsewhere. The customer will also know that they are getting the goods at exactly the same price as every other customer entering that shop.

By the OP by knocking a bit off on occasions the customer may feel that they are losing control of exactly how much they pay.

 

[warnie]

God this thread is going around in circles

I hate it when people ask for discount on small ticket items, but funnily enough I don't seem to mind as much when their spending a fortune:redface:

I can't have it both ways though, so if I can do anything in both cases I will, if not then I'll just polity refuse. Yes it's bloody annoying at times, but I'd still rather have the money in my till.

As an aside, when I used to flog goods to convenience stores with my previous business, I would much rather deal with the Asian shop keepers. The reason? they loved to haggle, and when they started to haggle I knew I'd get the sale. A lot of British white shopkeepers weren't prepared to in a lot of cases and just said no, without even trying to get the price down.

Out of interest, to those on here who don't like people asking for discount, and as I've said I'm one of those on small ticket items, do you haggle with suppliers when they come to your shop?

I do, and I know from experience that they work on a far lower margin then what I do, low teens is the norm in some cases! (I used to work on 16%). That's not my problem though, I'm out to maximise my profit to support my wife and kids. The supplier can just say no, as I can when a customers asks for a bit off.

 

[Gecko001]

Warnie

Business to business is different. Haggling is the normal. it is what business is all about. When Joe Public does a hard week's work they are in no mood to have to negotiate for things they by. I bet most of the people who are haggling over a few pence are not working or not working full time.

 

[arcon5]

I agree. If the customer knows the price and also knows that that price is not negotiable then the customer is in control. He/she knows they either buys it there or goes elsewhere. The customer will also know that they are getting the goods at exactly the same price as every other customer entering that shop.

By the OP by knocking a bit off on occasions the customer may feel that they are losing control of exactly how much they pay.

Lol you can't be for real? I don't customers are bothered at all about 'control' when they are saving money

 

Warnie

Business to business is different. Haggling is the normal. it is what business is all about. When Joe Public does a hard week's work they are in no mood to have to negotiate for things they by. I bet most of the people who are haggling over a few pence are not working or not working full time.

Don't you believe it,the more dosh the more haggle IMHO.

 

[warnie]

Don't you believe it,the more dosh the more haggle IMHO.

True, it's always the more well to do that normally bother to haggle in my shop.

 

[warnie]

Warnie

Business to business is different. Haggling is the normal. it is what business is all about. When Joe Public does a hard week's work they are in no mood to have to negotiate for things they by. I bet most of the people who are haggling over a few pence are not working or not working full time.

But that wasn't my point nor the point of the thread. It's not about weather joe public can be arsed to ask for discount or not, its about those that actually do and on small priced items at that.

My point was that shopkeepers who don't like hagglers due to the customer not caring about their bottom line, and as I've said I'm one of those in certain cases. Then do they still have the same principles when dealing with some suppliers who normally operate on much lower margins then what we do.

That is all, I'm one who wants it both ways but unfortunately for us shop keepers business is not like that. So therefore if I choose to haggle hard with my suppliers then I can't complain when a customer tries it on, even if it does infuriate me at times