That's the clear difference, because you know your subject well and hopefully you have mentally used the four magic words "How would I feel?" before you even picked the phone up and dialled, hence you treat the person you are calling with respect, mindful of their point of view and business requirements. It aint rocket science is it?
Upvote
0
Sorry Bri
But these threads are always usually started by people who are on TPS or who should be, and then they gather momentum by all the other people who are on TPS or who should be.
In the amount of time it has taken to post a comment on this thread it could have taken less time to report a breach and do your bit for business.
Like it or not cold calling is very beneficial for winning new business but it varies a lot by industry and other things and is not the most cost effective option for some services and products.
For consumers around 60% of any given list are on TPS and for businesses it is usually between 25-30% so that still means there is usually around 70% of a target market that can be contacted in this way.
All the comments about style, approach, relevance etc on this thread don't make much sense really until you group the comments into a)on TPS and b) not on TPS as all the comments are biased around whether someone is on TPS or not.
I have said it before and I will say it again, it's not usually the telemarketing agencies or freelancers who breach TPS rules. It is usually businesses with telemarketing activity as a job role that don't bother, or the big traditional firms who are blissfully still unaware of TPS.
I absolutely agree with more enforcement of TPS breaches but it has to start with reporting instances first. I believe there are two sides to this. People should make an effort. And, the system should be easier to report in cases where number with held or outside of UK.
Upvote
0
E
Ernest Andy
- Original Poster
- #44
This is the kind of attitude that annoys me. I am entitled to have a phone, phones are useful for helping people/potential customers with enquiries, calling people etc. It's absolutely outrageous to tell people to throw it away if they hate cold calls. Surely if anyone should throw their phone away, it's the intrusive cold callers.
Upvote
0
Intresting reading.
Ive worked in Telesales for 8 years now. I know my product, my market, my calls are specific to my target audience, Im direct and im successful. Cold calling is an artform spoiled by the majority who create bad press by being bad at it.
Every industry has its cowboys, unfortunately telesales requires no formal experience for you to aimlessly pitch.
Ive worked in Telesales for 8 years now. I know my product, my market, my calls are specific to my target audience, Im direct and im successful. Cold calling is an artform spoiled by the majority who create bad press by being bad at it.
Every industry has its cowboys, unfortunately telesales requires no formal experience for you to aimlessly pitch.
Upvote
0
E
Ernest Andy
- Original Poster
- #48
Fair enough. I wasn't meaning to direct my comment at you personally, but at the general attitude of people that you seemed to be illustrating. Some people actually have those kinds of attitudes, and they should not go unchallenged IMO, otherwise they and people who hear or read them may think they are correct.
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #49
Do you think so? Have you ever tried it? Reporting breaches is impossible in many cases. How long you think it would take to do this?
http://complaints.tpsonline.org.uk/Consumer/
This complaint form looks to me like it was actually designed to discourage people from submitting it. Many of form fields are validated such that it cannot be submitted until they are appropriately completed. For example if you put a space in the telephone number it is rejected.
Many cold callers do not provide valid information unless you want to do business with them. Many of them are displayed as "unknown numbers" and "private numbers" and I cannot block or ignore these numbers because they could be valid business calls.
When you ask them for the details required to report them they don't hang around for long so no, I am afraid the TPS is not the answer.
Upvote
0
E
Ernest Andy
- Original Poster
- #50
Just out of interest, are there any companies out there who would rather not do telesales, but employ telesales because their competitors do and they feel pressurised to compete. Do they feel enslaved by the telesales industry in that sense.
In other words, if no one else was doing it, would it really bother them that they weren't doing it? Would they be happy to be able to focus on other routes to market instead under these circumstances? It's not a trick or leading question, I'm genuinely curious.
In other words, if no one else was doing it, would it really bother them that they weren't doing it? Would they be happy to be able to focus on other routes to market instead under these circumstances? It's not a trick or leading question, I'm genuinely curious.
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
C
Craig HelpTrainingCourses
- Original Poster
- #51
Hi
I use cold calling as part of my marketing for a First Aid Training business. I also do online marketing and postal marketing but I find that I get a much better conversion rate calling a targeted market and offering my business services.
I agree there is nothing worse than a telesales person who will not take no for an answer however we find that if we are polite and ask if we can call again in the future 70% of companies are happy with this. This is all backed up by our small telesales team knowing the product and not being driven by comission.
I use cold calling as part of my marketing for a First Aid Training business. I also do online marketing and postal marketing but I find that I get a much better conversion rate calling a targeted market and offering my business services.
I agree there is nothing worse than a telesales person who will not take no for an answer however we find that if we are polite and ask if we can call again in the future 70% of companies are happy with this. This is all backed up by our small telesales team knowing the product and not being driven by comission.
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #52
Here's a thought ... can I ask all of you who do cold calling and promote its use if you listen patiently to all cold calls that you receive yourselves?
http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/watch?v=-7OgWcwgB50&feature=related
http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/watch?v=-7OgWcwgB50&feature=related
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
Here's a thought ... can I ask all of you who do cold calling and promote its use if you listen patiently to all cold calls that you receive yourselves?
http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/watch?v=-7OgWcwgB50&feature=related
Yes I do and then I may or may not wind them up if the service product is of no interest to me.
Upvote
0
Yes, I have used it. I have it saved as a bookmark
And you are right, there are too many circumstances where you cannot report someone such as number with held etc but for the ones that you can report then I do still think it's worth doing as it's not that bad after you have done the first one. It really does take less than a minute.
I suppose put it this way... there are too many obstacles and challenges for small businesses trying to sell their products and services as it is and a complete ban or opt-in to cold calls would not only be ineffective as it would get ignored but it would also seriously hurt a lot of businesses.
Unsolicited calls in line with the definition within the Privacy of Electronic Communications Act doesn't just cover Telesales/do-you-want-a-new-conservatory-even-though-you-live-in-a-flat type calls, it also covers any type of call that is unsolicited ie; asking if you can send an email, or asking who the relevant person to contact about something might be, or giving something away for free as part of a sales offer, or asking for a referral, or data cleansing, or any of the other telemarketing style calls that help businesses to build up pipeline in a non threatening or lower intrusive way than traditional telesales.
Even if you are connected with someone via forum, twitter, linked in, etc you still are not allowed under TPS rules to call them in an unsolicited manner and people don't realise this either. How frustrating that you can have built up a connection, identified a need, yet not pick up the phone.
TPS enforcement is the thing that does need to improve in my opinion and I whole heartedly support that (I did set up a No 10 petition a while ago and funnily enough it didn't get much support so perhaps I will try again).
Even though fines are not dished out, prohibition notices are, and the companies do not go on an re-offend so it is effective from that perspective.
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #55
There is a device available for £100 caled Truecall, which can apparenty eliminate all nuisance calls. On their website they offer advice on what you can do to stop cold callers. This includes advising people to register with the TPS. Now if the TPS was effective this would surely put Truecall out of business.
Upvote
0
Here's a thought ... can I ask all of you who do cold calling and promote its use if you listen patiently to all cold calls that you receive yourselves?
http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/watch?v=-7OgWcwgB50&feature=related
I admire your one-man campaign against calling ! There are plenty of positive answers to your question in this thread.
Question for you. I've heard that call centres / contact centres/ telemarketing et al is one of the largest sectors in the UK now, about 800,000 people (I'm sure someone will have the correct number). What you're suggesting is that all of these businesses can't possibly work and must be running at continual losses. This obviously isn't the case and you're swimming against the tide.
Upvote
0
I have read the whole thread and you Mr BDW are way in front on posts.
If you are a web designer as seems clear from your byline then are you aware that the largest sector of recruitment ads for telesales agents on Gumtree and Peopleperhour are from web designers. Have you thought of cold calling all these ads and selling your way of getting business that does not involve cold calling ? You seem to be the only Webman in Britain not on the blower all day to drum up clients... Make some cold calls and get rich ! Sell your secret...to all your competitors....check Peopleperhour and Gumtree..choc full of 'web design co need BDM to make calls and introduce the best...'
Also to all those who moan about TPS I will say this once only. It does not work, it has never worked and probably will never work. Its for those who want to participate only.
I was around my fathers office when people were calling in attempting to sell truck loads of carbon paper over the phone in the 1960's to unsuspecting secretaries etc. Everything that goes on now on the phone has been going on since the phone was invented and will continue to go on until something replaces the phone. Nothing is new, human nature is not new.If cold calling really benefited YOUR business you would be doing it.
What most of you naysayers need is a good woman to teach you how to disengage from unwanted attention...which includes stupid calls from halfwit telesales people and if you seriously cannot deal with them quickly you deserve them.
When I get a dumb call I inform the caller that if he worked for me and was so ignorant of his own company and my business it would be his last day.It has a striking effect.
Oh and by the way, yes, I have made a very good living simply using the phone for a very long time. I can count on one hand the number of 'difficult' calls in a lifetime of making them. You can always tell the ones to get off the line from..they sit in ambush mode by the phone.The breathing gives them away. Ring any bells with you posters on here ? Just waiting for the cold caller to drop by on your desk phone...
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #61
:|:|:| The above takes a bit of parsing but if it means what I think it does I have nothing I need to sell this way. I get all the business I need without having to cold call because I offer a service to people who largely know what they need and they also know where to go to find someone to provide it.
.
Upvote
0
E
Ernest Andy
- Original Poster
- #62
Sorry not interested. *puts phone down*
See? It's easy to deal with, if you have a mouth and an arm, but in order to deal with it you have to stop what you are doing, which, depending on what you are doing, can be very irritating. If the pro cold callers on this forum really can't understand that then there is something very, and I mean very, wrong with them.
It's not surprising that a business forum would have a lot of support for cold calling, especially if the 800,000 number is correct, but why can't you just be honest and admit that you have an annoying job, and you know you do? Once you, as an industry, have accepted it is annoying and is a growing problem, perhaps you will be more interested in considering possible solutions before there is some kind of backlash from the majority of represented people in this country. It's for your own good in the long run.
See? It's easy to deal with, if you have a mouth and an arm, but in order to deal with it you have to stop what you are doing, which, depending on what you are doing, can be very irritating. If the pro cold callers on this forum really can't understand that then there is something very, and I mean very, wrong with them.
It's not surprising that a business forum would have a lot of support for cold calling, especially if the 800,000 number is correct, but why can't you just be honest and admit that you have an annoying job, and you know you do? Once you, as an industry, have accepted it is annoying and is a growing problem, perhaps you will be more interested in considering possible solutions before there is some kind of backlash from the majority of represented people in this country. It's for your own good in the long run.
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
My argument here is as a potential BUYER, not sales. I admit that a lot of calls I get are irrelevant but mostly I find the salesman/caller has done a bit of research. I never just hang up and will always give them a minute to expalin the who/what/wheres.
Why ? Because I'm in business. I don't just look at the top line all the time, I know that 60% of my top line sales is swallowed up by costs. If someone can save me 2-5% and/or provide a better product/service then I'm interested.
I spend quite a bit of time re-evaluating my suppliers and costs but even so I don't pretend that I've nailed it and can put my hand on my heart and say my current suppliers are giving me the best deals. Speaking to someone for two or three minutes might just save me £000s.
Where bdw (and others) are coming from is that they're very happy with their suppliers and are happy to do their own research. That's fine, but I think 95% of most businesses are looking at cost savings and other benefits from changing suppliers or getting new products.
The other thing that seems apparent on this thread is that it's the one-man bands who have the greatest difficulty in coping with interuptions with unwanted calls. No-one can argue with that. Larger businesses normally have one or more gate-keepers who filter out the calls.
On the sales side of things, I get most of my business by picking up the phone, speaking to the right person and asking if I can come down for a meeting. There seem to be so hundreds of threads on this forum about 'how do I get new business' and yet everyone ignores the simplest method : pick up the phone, speak to potential buyers and find out whether you have the right product/service and a viable business.
Sorry for the long post.
Why ? Because I'm in business. I don't just look at the top line all the time, I know that 60% of my top line sales is swallowed up by costs. If someone can save me 2-5% and/or provide a better product/service then I'm interested.
I spend quite a bit of time re-evaluating my suppliers and costs but even so I don't pretend that I've nailed it and can put my hand on my heart and say my current suppliers are giving me the best deals. Speaking to someone for two or three minutes might just save me £000s.
Where bdw (and others) are coming from is that they're very happy with their suppliers and are happy to do their own research. That's fine, but I think 95% of most businesses are looking at cost savings and other benefits from changing suppliers or getting new products.
The other thing that seems apparent on this thread is that it's the one-man bands who have the greatest difficulty in coping with interuptions with unwanted calls. No-one can argue with that. Larger businesses normally have one or more gate-keepers who filter out the calls.
On the sales side of things, I get most of my business by picking up the phone, speaking to the right person and asking if I can come down for a meeting. There seem to be so hundreds of threads on this forum about 'how do I get new business' and yet everyone ignores the simplest method : pick up the phone, speak to potential buyers and find out whether you have the right product/service and a viable business.
Sorry for the long post.
Upvote
0
:|:|:| The above takes a bit of parsing but if it means what I think it does I have nothing I need to sell this way. I get all the business I need without having to cold call because I offer a service to people who largely know what they need and they also know where to go to find someone to provide it.
.
Is the
symbol a term of endearment to me or an indication of your classroom level up there in Glasgow ? How rude can you get ?
Upvote
0
Noticabley you seem to have more time on your hands to dream up witty comments, then you should - maybe a reflection of the amount of "business" you actually carry out.... (Not a term of endearment )
PS: Interesting enough, its not really about which town you are from that determines the amount, of lack of as it may be, intelligence that someone has - but with that in mind GOOOOO GLASGOW. :|
(Not a term of endearment ) PS: Interesting enough, its not really about which town you are from that determines the amount, of lack of as it may be, intelligence that someone has - but with that in mind GOOOOO GLASGOW. :|
Oh and I am not in Glasgow but despite the overtones of your comment Glasgow people in general are very intelligent.
Upvote
0
Too much time... im sure the forum will forgive me for having little time to do that. Maybe the clients wont - thats why my time is spent there - probably a better avenue for time to be spent - me thinks.
:|:|
Yep, and I have time to write in English that people can understand without spelling mistakes.
Upvote
0
So BDW, what should businesses do rather than cold calling? You seem so against something that 90% of business have to do in order to survive yet you have no other suggestions. If we were all in your boat, i.e. didnt need to actively seek leads, then unemployment would be massive. Sales, ergo telesales make up a large proportion of jobs in this country.
Perhaps rather than disagreeing with everyone who has a different opinion, you could offer some suggestions, which would make this more of a discussion rather than an argument.
Perhaps rather than disagreeing with everyone who has a different opinion, you could offer some suggestions, which would make this more of a discussion rather than an argument.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #72
Get a decent website that works for them for them 24/7/365 perhaps?
Actually I don't know because I am not qualified to comment on the marketing requirements for businesses that I know nothing about. But that's not really my problem. If you read the thread and the others that have been raised on this subject it will be obvious that I am not unique in my contempt for cold callers and cold calling businesses who are often untrained and who have not taken the time to research their target market.
The fact remains that the only ones who generally support cold calling are those who do it and I don't.
Isn't that what we all do? Perhaps you can explain how I can agree with someone who has a different opinion? :|
Upvote
0
ok maybe i should have said, rather than arguing with everyone...
semantic/pedantic
Websites will not generate enough business for the majority of SMEs to use that as their sole method for attracting leads, it appears you are in an enviable position in that respect! Some SMEs can't afford a website so see the phone as a cheap and direct way to contact potential clients.
Yes fair point, it wouldn't make sense for them to be against it! However afaik most businesses will cold call. If we could all get our business from web enquries, LinkedIn, forums then there would be no need to cold call. It is and will be a necessary evil until all business have customers knocking their door down for their services.
semantic/pedantic
Websites will not generate enough business for the majority of SMEs to use that as their sole method for attracting leads, it appears you are in an enviable position in that respect! Some SMEs can't afford a website so see the phone as a cheap and direct way to contact potential clients.
Yes fair point, it wouldn't make sense for them to be against it! However afaik most businesses will cold call. If we could all get our business from web enquries, LinkedIn, forums then there would be no need to cold call. It is and will be a necessary evil until all business have customers knocking their door down for their services.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
B
bdw
- Original Poster
- #75
Let me assure you that in my 61 years I have been wrong and proved wrong on many occasions. That's the cost of being as opinionated as I am ... :redface:
... but I still don't know how I can possibly agree with someone who has a different opinion. :|
Gottit! Let's agree to disagree.
.
Upvote
0
And finally a once wise, old man hears a penny drop - and it makes him wiser than earlier but still annoying.
Get a decent website that works for them for them 24/7/365 perhaps?
Actually I don't know because I am not qualified to comment on the marketing requirements for businesses that I know nothing about. But that's not really my problem. If you read the thread and the others that have been raised on this subject it will be obvious that I am not unique in my contempt for cold callers and cold calling businesses who are often untrained and who have not taken the time to research their target market.
The fact remains that the only ones who generally support cold calling are those who do it and I don't.
Isn't that what we all do? Perhaps you can explain how I can agree with someone who has a different opinion? :|
Let me assure you that in my 61 years I have been wrong and proved wrong on many occasions. That's the cost of being as opinionated as I am ... :redface:
... but I still don't know how I can possibly agree with someone who has a different opinion. :|
Gottit! Let's agree to disagree.
.
Upvote
0
Latest Articles
-
Should you crowdfund? A framework for UK founders in 2026Three articles into a series on what crowdfunding actually costs, the...- Ozzy
- Updated:
-
The polls, the reframing, and the billion dollarsHow three letters from the early years of Star Citizen's development...
- Ozzy
- Updated:
-
The values trap: what the Punks actually ownedWhy BrewDog's Equity for Punks investors were structurally locked out...
- Ozzy
- Updated:
-
When belief is the business modelWhat BrewDog's collapse and Star Citizen's billion-dollar climb are...
- Ozzy
- Updated:
-
AI, Virtual Influencers and the Copyright Minefield: What Entrepreneurs Need to KnowI'll be upfront: this article was written with the assistance of an AI...
- Ozzy
- Updated: