The eternal cold calling debate

[Bri]

Another member suggested that I copy my post from another thread in to a new one, quite why I dont know.

Cold Calling is what I do myself which is relevant to my business, telesales is employing an external body to sell my business for me, and the latter are the ones we dont like as they tend to lack the passion and drive that I have for my business.............Discuss?

As we all experience such telesales canvassers and have come across horror stories, what benefits to your business has telesales had for you. What businesses does it fit.

Mine is quite a niche market and highly specialised so it would be short lived and an unecessary expense.

 

[business23]

Yeah, Cold Calling is always not the best. I rate cold calling works bestif you enjoy what you do. It makes talking to ptential clients that much better.
because you like what you do?
I myself am a Internet researcher and i work from home. I like what i do so i sell my service the best that i can. If youwould be interested in anythng. get me on skype: Jaime Pentz. i can get you International contacts

 

[bdw]

Your definition above is from your own perspective. The person receiving the calls may have a different view of this. Personally I consider that anyone who makes an unsolicited call to me is a cold caller and very likely to get short thrift.

I don't think I am alone in believing that I am perfectly capable of deciding for myself at any given time what products and services I require and finding them.

.

 

[MH1]

From a sales point of view, cold calling has always been a necessary evil to help generate new business, along with the hundreds of other methods available.

For most companies cold calling will work if done well but can also be damaging if done badly, the same applies to other methods. I cannot understand why people get so hung up on cold calling, maybe it's because most people are uncomfortable about cold calling and normally do not enjoy the use of it because of that.

 

[bdw]

I cannot understand why people get so hung up on cold calling...

It's quite simple really. Cold calling is intrusive, it interrupts people from what they are doing, wastes their time and the chances of it offering anything of interest are very slim indeed.

Thats the reason!

 

[Bri]

I cannot understand why people get so hung up on cold calling

BDW is absoultely right, I cannot abide cold calls from telesales, if it be for stationery, advertising space the most common, directory listings the latest favourite. Walk past any recruitment agency window and vacancies for call centre operatives and telesales fill the window. Then them being taught the techniques of holding a caller to closing the sale, handling objections, but not the technical details of the product, please dont go on and tell me thats up to the client to provide all the necessary information, because it doesnt transfer down to the call centre operators who only last a month or two before a new crowd come in to replace them.

Cold calling for me is actually seeing something on your premises that I can offer a service for, which is directly linked to what you need by law.

 

[Doug]

i agree with some of the sentiment above, but a lot of people are unaware of the tools out there that can go a long way to improving their business.

One of our clients we got from cold calls was totally unaware of what we offered, since going ahead he has saved time and money he would likely not have saved had he not been cold called.

The trouble with cold calling as i see it is, most businesses struggle to effectively target their calls which leads to a lot of wasted time, not just on the cold callers side but also the person being called.

There are opportunities out there from cold calling but the difficulty comes trying to find the right people, you never know who you are going to speak with and what sort of company they are from a CRM record, and that for me seems to be the problem. This then leads to a "throw as much mud as you can" mentality

Would be interested to know if so many of you are against receiving cold calls, how then do you market your business?

 

[Bri]

Would be interested to know if so many of you are against receiving cold calls, how then do you market your business?

Ours is quite simple, recommendation, education and persuasion.

As we are on the road a lot its easy for us to identify our potential customers by the big silver coloured aluminium water tank they have in their compound, and because we sell mainly service and its a legal obligation we let our hands do the talking. If you dont like what we do then we thank you and walk away.

 

[bdw]

i agree with some of the sentiment above, but a lot of people are unaware of the tools out there that can go a long way to improving their business.

This is the common case for the defence isn't it? Actually AFAIC it's a load of cr@p. It is incredibly presumptious for anyone to call a business they know nothing about and tell them that they know how to help them.

Would be interested to know if so many of you are against receiving cold calls, how then do you market your business?

I do all of my marketing through my websites. There is no need for anything else. I regularly get cold callers trying to sell me web design services and Internet marketing. Can you believe how angry that makes me when they disturb me from my work?

 

[Kernowman]

This is the common case for the defence isn't it? Actually AFAIC it's a load of cr@p. It is incredibly presumptious for anyone to call a business they know nothing about and tell them that they know how to help them.


I do all of my marketing through my websites. There is no need for anything else. I regularly get cold callers trying to sell me web design services and Internet marketing. Can you believe how angry that makes me when they disturb me from my work?

Please don't take offence at what I am about to say BDW but I am getting the perception that you are perfectly content in your little comfort zone of not talking to anybody. That's one of the biggest crimes the internet has created and it has drifted off into this cyber world where people have become almost entirely secondary. If picking the phone up and speaking to someone disrupts you THAT much, then take it away and chuck it in the skip.

You say that if you need something then you will go and find it yourself. I pretty much do that too, because if I sat here waiting and waiting for a telesales call because I need to buy a new lawn mower I could be waiting for ever, BUT let me present you with this scenario:

Two young lads from the University of Chipping Sodbury by accident have created a fresh set of machine code that makes computers run five times faster and nobody else yet has it. Anyone in the software world would sell their conjugal rights for the next 20 years to get their hands on it, it's that hot. They have empty pockets and cant even afford to buy a domain name, let alone pay for any advertising. So, using mum and dad's free daytime phone calls package they ring your number because you a re local to where they live and you tell them to fffffloat off. This cold phone call could have earned you squillions, but you dismissed it out of hand because all cold calls are a complete waste of time aren't they?

Again, no offence, but I can agree with you 100% that a poorly researched cold call is soooooooooo irritating, frustrating, pointless and unnecessary. My philosophy is to answer that phone call and then make the judgement. If it is a scripted mechanical drivel, I tell them to go away and come back when they can treat me as a person and not a victim of their system. If their call is for something way off beam that I would ever consider buying because I have no use for it, I tell them to look up the word "Marketing" in a dictionary. If they are polite and courteous, they actually bother to LISTEN to my point of view, maybe share a joke or a life experience and react accordingly, it can be a pleasant interlude to the day. If you can sell them something, then you really have hit the jackpot

If I was running a telesales operation, my targets per operator would be 2 - 5 confirmed sales and 20 - 25 new friendly business contacts that have not been terrified by the way the company does business. You never know it may prompt them to call YOU for a change one day because you acted the professional. Isn't that a better target than annoying 200+ people a day with a 2% sales conversion?

 

[Bri]

Two young lads from the University of Chipping Sodbury by accident have created a fresh set of machine code that makes computers run five times faster and nobody else yet has it. Anyone in the software world would sell their conjugal rights for the next 20 years to get their hands on it, it's that hot. They have empty pockets and cant even afford to buy a domain name, let alone pay for any advertising. So, using mum and dad's free daytime phone calls package they ring your number because you a re local to where they live and you tell them to fffffloat off. This cold phone call could have earned you squillions, but you dismissed it out of hand because all cold calls are a complete waste of time aren't they?

A directed to the point cold call to a specific and related customer who may or may not be interested in the product.

Again, no offence, but I can agree with you 100% that a poorly researched cold call is soooooooooo irritating, frustrating, pointless and unnecessary. My philosophy is to answer that phone call and then make the judgement. If it is a scripted mechanical drivel, I tell them to go away and come back when they can treat me as a person and not a victim of their system. If their call is for something way off beam that I would ever consider buying because I have no use for it, I tell them to look up the word "Marketing" in a dictionary. If they are polite and courteous, they actually bother to LISTEN to my point of view, maybe share a joke or a life experience and react accordingly, it can be a pleasant interlude to the day. If you can sell them something, then you really have hit the jackpot

An accurate description of what we as business people dont want to recieve from telemarketers.

How many times has the response been to a cold call, just send your details in and I'll look at them, then how the telesales persons eyes light up when they have to hand their daily report in unaware that the details will be put straight into the circular filing cabinet under my desk.

 

[bdw]

Please don't take offence at what I am about to say BDW but I am getting the perception that you are perfectly content in your little comfort zone of not talking to anybody.

I won't take offence but I will take you to task. Making judgements like that about people you don't know makes you sound exactly like a telemarketer.

They have empty pockets and cant even afford to buy a domain name, let alone pay for any advertising.

Not a good analogy. I cannot think of any situation where this could possibly happen.

My philosophy is to answer that phone call and then make the judgement. If it is a scripted mechanical drivel...

Please don't take offence at what I am about to say Kernowman but I am getting the perception that you are sitting there making this up as you go along. Anyone who considers calls from telesales people to be a "pleasant interlude to the day" needs to get out a bit more.

 

[Kernowman]

I won't take offence but I will take you to task. Making judgements like that about people you don't know makes you sound exactly like a telemarketer.


Not a good analogy. I cannot think of any situation where this could possibly happen.


Please don't take offence at what I am about to say Kernowman but I am getting the perception that you are sitting there making this up as you go along. Anyone who considers calls from telesales people to be a "pleasant interlude to the day" needs to get out a bit more.

I really am not offended at all BDW as your opinion is always valid. It may be the wrong opinion but it is still valid. As for me being a TELESALES person, not a chance!

You find a phone call intrusive and it breaks your concentration, yet you can obviously break your concentration to participate on this forum.

I get out plenty thank you. I also LIKE talking to real people who understand and respect me, I reciprocate likewise and it's what makes the world go round. Has it's business paybacks too, done properly.

I'm not going to squabble over it as life is too short for that

 

[David Griffiths]

If picking the phone up and speaking to someone disrupts you THAT much, then take it away and chuck it in the skip.

There was a post in another thread, from a telemarketer of course, who put forward the opinion that people who didn't like to take marketing calls should not only be banned from being in business but shouldn't be allowed to waste oxygen in an office. Your post is in much the same arrogant vein.

Why shouldn't people be free to decide if they do or do not want to take marketing calls? It's a valid choice, but doesn't make them an inadequate person. It seems to me that the telemarketing proponents have little or no response to reason rejection of their product and descend into insults all too readily. It's seen in telemarketing calls, where the caller implies that the victim is thick for not wanting to buy their wonderful product or service. It's seen in telemarketing calls where the caller can't even be bothered to check Telephone Preference Listings, and calls anyway.

Of course cold calling is a valid way to market a product. That's in the same way that declining to take telemarketing calls is a valid way to avoid speaking to timewasters peddlling a product that is of no possible interest.

And the chance of two penniless inventors phoning up and making my fortune with a wonderful new product is about the same as Chipping Sodbury actually getting a university in the first place. I'm quite happy to turn down the chance of the next to impossible to avoid the certainty of the irrelevant, annoying and plain stupid. One of those business decision that even inadequate people make from time to time.

 

[Kernowman]

There was a post in another thread, from a telemarketer of course, who put forward the opinion that people who didn't like to take marketing calls should not only be banned from being in business but shouldn't be allowed to waste oxygen in an office. Your post is in much the same arrogant vein.

Why shouldn't people be free to decide if they do or do not want to take marketing calls? It's a valid choice, but doesn't make them an inadequate person. It seems to me that the telemarketing proponents have little or no response to reason rejection of their product and descend into insults all too readily. It's seen in telemarketing calls, where the caller implies that the victim is thick for not wanting to buy their wonderful product or service. It's seen in telemarketing calls where the caller can't even be bothered to check Telephone Preference Listings, and calls anyway.

Of course cold calling is a valid way to market a product. That's in the same way that declining to take telemarketing calls is a valid way to avoid speaking to timewasters peddlling a product that is of no possible interest.

And the chance of two penniless inventors phoning up and making my fortune with a wonderful new product is about the same as Chipping Sodbury actually getting a university in the first place. I'm quite happy to turn down the chance of the next to impossible to avoid the certainty of the irrelevant, annoying and plain stupid. One of those business decision that even inadequate people make from time to time.

Good heavens no, I would not dream of insulting anyone for doing what they consider is right for them. None of us are mind readers for sure and if you really are a busy person who has no wish to be disturbed then that's fine with me too. It is your choice.

It was a tongue in cheek comment about the Chipping Sodbury students, but beneath all that I am sure though that there at times the genuine callers who are offering a truly beneficial product or service, are being comprehensively drowned under the sea of uneducated dipsticks perpetually and relentlessly calling to sell something that isn't. It is the attitude and outright prejudice being shown by some that perturbs me.

 

[bdw]

None of us are mind readers for sure and if you really are a busy person who has no wish to be disturbed then that's fine with me too. It is your choice.

That is not what I took from your earlier post, which implied that I did not like talking to people. That is totally wrong. I talk to the people I chose to talk to. I also talk at length to prospective clients who call me because they find my details where I have marketed them on the Internet.

If one of them calls me when my line is busy while I am trying to fend off a persistent telemarketer trying to sell me a water cooler or an insurance policy then I could potentially lose a job because of this. That is why I generally do not give them any more than about ten seconds of my time.

 

[Kernowman]

That is not what I took from your earlier post, which implied that I did not like talking to people. That is totally wrong. I talk to the people I chose to talk to. I also talk at length to prospective clients who call me because they find my details where I have marketed them on the Internet.

That is fine because that is your choice and it works well for you. I have no problems with that and my apologies if I misconstrued.

If one of them calls me when my line is busy while I am trying to fend off a persistent telemarketer trying to sell me a water cooler or an insurance policy then I could potentially lose a job because of this. That is why I generally do not give them any more than about ten seconds of my time.

That would make me livid as well. 10 seconds is more than enough time to decode if that call has any worth to you or not. I hope when the scripted goons call you that you match their disrespect by putting the phone down smartish - I certainly do.

 

[bdw]

Just this minute I got a cold call from someone.

HE, "Can I speak to the managing director please?"

ME, "Sorry, we don't reveal any company information to cold callers."

HE, "Is he in today?"

ME, "Thank you, bye."

Even if there was a managing director who do they think they are that I would just interrupt what he was doing and get him/her speak to someone who does not have the courtesy to tell me the purpose of his call? That is why most of us have no time for this form of marketing.

 

[Kernowman]

who do they think they are that I would just interrupt what he was doing and get him/her speak to someone who does not have the courtesy to tell me the purpose of his call? That is why most of us have no time for this form of marketing.

That IS rude and highly disrespectful, so you did the right thing.

 

[Dawg]

How cold does a call have to be to be a cold call?

We get mail through which has marketing bumpf in, and a few days later a follow up call. Is this a cold call? I really don't mind these too much, perhaps as I have actually found very good products this way, sold by good sales people.

This decent sales technique, which I think does have value, is what makes me worry about the blanket calls for banning a valuable route to market. But what is a Cold Call? What is acceptable?

I do object to the inane script readers, who are a waste of time. I had a woman call from The Friday Ad last week who after enquiring about my general wellbeing asked me to "tell me about yourself". This is a crassly effective way to lose a potential client, and her boss should be sacked for allowing it.

But again, what do we call a Cold Call, and are we in danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in calling for a ban?

Just my 2p.

 

[Psl]

I love cold calling and I also enjoy winding cold callers up.
Why do I love cold calling? Because it generates business, simple.
If undertaken in a professional manner cold calling can be very lucrative indeed.

If you don't like receiving cold calls then get a phone with caller ID, if you do not recognise the number then don't answer the phone, let it go to the answering service.But IF you do this you may never know if it was a cold caller or a potential new client on the phone.

 

[KM-Tiger]

How cold does a call have to be to be a cold call?

Not very, it could be from a regular supplier and yet still be intrusive and annoying.

In my manufacturing days the steel suppliers were the worst. When they were quiet they would annoy their regular customers with "Just thought I'd check if you had an enquiry for me".

There was some sport to be had by replying "You didn't answer the phone so I've placed the order with <insert name of rival>".

 

[Kernowman]

How cold does a call have to be to be a cold call?

We get mail through which has marketing bumpf in, and a few days later a follow up call. Is this a cold call? I really don't mind these too much, perhaps as I have actually found very good products this way, sold by good sales people.

I would personally describe that as a "warm" call whereby you have had a chance to read through the blurb but have taken no action. You might have forgotten to read it. If the caller states the purpose of their call to reception or yourself, they can politely ask if you have received the info and was it of any interest to you. Nothing wrong with that.

But what is a Cold Call? What is acceptable?

A cold call is when someone rings you uninvited and there has been no prior contact with literature or an introductory phone call without a sales process. They make plenty of incorrect assumptions about you and the company which means they are blanket calling anyone.

I do object to the inane script readers, who are a waste of time. I had a woman call from The Friday Ad last week who after enquiring about my general wellbeing asked me to "tell me about yourself". This is a crassly effective way to lose a potential client, and her boss should be sacked for allowing it.

Couldn't agree more Dawg and that numpty couldn't be bothered to put herself into your shoes and ask herself the simple question "How would I feel?". Using the words "Tell me about yourself" is a banal question usually asked by intellectually bankrupt buffoons during dreadful job interviews, not ingratiating yourself to a client or prospect.

 

[Doug]

so BDW, if you got a cold call what would they have to do to grab your attention and start a dialogue with you?

 

[Searcher]

I can't understand why anyone in business would object to a cold call, as long as it was relevant to their business, short and polite, not pushy and not the same person hassling.

Surely, we're all in business here aren't we ? Or aspiring to start one. If anyone in business is happy to sit on their backside and wait for a customer to ring them then good luck ! All businesses need to be proactive and there's nothing wrong in picking up the phone and making 'that' call. Sometimes, that's the hardest thing - having confidence in yourself to pick up the phone.

That's my 'sales' side ! (Which I love btw and I've never had a problem with knocking down doors)

I get sales calls too and always have. They're important to me because generally it helps me evaluate my current suppliers, see who else is out there and just be sure that I'm on top of my game. It costs me nothing but three or four minutes but can (has) either saved me money or opened new opportunties.

 

[bdw]

so BDW, if you got a cold call what would they have to do to grab your attention and start a dialogue with you?

As someone whose telephone number is listed online I have received all sorts of cold calls and I honestly cannot remember ever doing business with any of them in my nine years of self employment.

If someone who sounds intelligent and seems to have technical knowledge from a synergic company calls me I may just be interested enough to listen for a minute or two. If some numpty from a call centre calls me then I get rid of them tout de suite.

 

[David Griffiths]

If you don't like receiving cold calls then get a phone with caller ID, if you do not recognise the number then don't answer the phone, let it go to the answering service.But IF you do this you may never know if it was a cold caller or a potential new client on the phone.

What's wrong with TPS? Other than the fact that lazy and/or ignorant cold callers don't bother to check, of course.

 

[maxine]

What's wrong with TPS? Other than the fact that lazy and/or ignorant cold callers don't bother to check, of course.

and lazy/ignorant people don't bother to report breaches...
... they just start threads like this one
... and so it goes on

Yawn

 

[Psl]

What's wrong with TPS? Other than the fact that lazy and/or ignorant cold callers don't bother to check, of course.

Nothing wrong with TPS. In fact I may just set up a cold calling company to sell TPS registration services, for a premium of course.I thnink I will start with cold calling accountants and website designers

 

[cjd]

are we in danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in calling for a ban?
.

I'm in favour of chucking the whole bathroom plus the en-suite and downstairs bog

 

[Dawg]

I'm in favour of chucking the whole bathroom plus the en-suite and downstairs bog

Thank you for sharing.
We hope your telephone business prospers.
Mileages may vary.

 

[cjd]

Thank you for sharing.
We hope your telephone business prospers.
.

An opt in scheme would solve the problem at a stroke, but I suspect that those strange few that had opted in might find themselves in need of one or two more phones)

(Telephone business is prospering and includes a few dozen outbound call centres, thanks for your interest. I'm still going to introduce the most comprehensive inbound call screening the world has ever seen as soon as I can get the development time. Meanwhile the 166 service gets hammered.)

 

[Rhyl Lightworks]

Cold calling is one of the plagues of the current time both for businesses and members of the public. True there might be 1 in 1000 cold calls that are worthwhile but don't cold callers realise that most of us are too busy to listen to the 999 others.

I believe the onus should be on those people that wish to receive such calls to opt in to them, and it should be a criminal offence to call somebody who has not opted in. At present one has to opt out through the tps, and some cold callers ignore this anyway, usually with little or no penalty. This way, cold callers may make calls to people that are more receptive to them and not waste their time calling people who are rude to them, which must happen a lot.

Barrie

 

[Dawg]

I'm still going to introduce ze most comprehensive inbound call screening ze world haz ever seen as soon as I can get ze development time.

Sounds about ripe for a 'Downfall Youtube'

 

[Psl]

I believe the onus should be on those people that wish to receive such calls to opt in to them, and it should be a criminal offence to call somebody who has not opted in. At present one has to opt out through the tps, and some cold callers ignore this anyway, usually with little or no penalty. This way, cold callers may make calls to people that are more receptive to them and not waste their time calling people who are rude to them, which must happen a lot.

Barrie

Then it wouldn't be cold calling, it would be luke warm calling?

 

[Bri]

... they just start threads like this one
... and so it goes on

Yawn

Ouch!!!! Maxine, that would have hurt a lesser man.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Basically there are two types of cold calls. Those that are relevent and those that are not. Its the same with junk emails.

I have made relevant cold calls for years. It is certainly harder now because of all the hard-sell junk calls. Very few cold callers and junk emailers to my business bother to do the most basic research.

Approaching those that are natural prospective customers in the right way is OK.

(My biggest long-term customer came about through a cold call I made to one of their regional buyers. He told me in no uncertain words that I was wasting his and my time making the call. He then relented and I became a supplier because what I was selling was highly relevant. That call resulted in £30k+ per annum for 20+ years.)

 

[bdw]

I have made relevant cold calls for years.

Who decided they were relevant?

 

[Deleted member 59730]

If you know that someone is actively looking for your product or service it is surely relevant.

Not relevant is selling advertising in a directory you have never heard of.

 

[Kernowman]

The common theme it seems is that firstly, the number of nuisance calls that are irrelevant to your potential needs (poor marketing) are wasting your time and secondly, the poor standard of professionalism you are encountering (poor training and management). When you don't have these situations, my feeling is that most people have not got an allergy to being contacted by phone for a product/service that may of benefit to them and if it is carried out in a respectful and professional manner there is no issue at all.

Maybe the worst thing you can do is slap the phone down because they have become conditioned and totally immune to that response, in fact it is very likely factored into their targeting structures and part of their daily work load, so in reality you are perpetuating the system by being reactive.

Even a minor flicker of interest is seized it seems, so they then believe you have "consented" to being called on in perpetuity which also may open the flood gates to more phone calls and/or half a forest of junk mail into the bargain. Worse than that, they may even sell your details on to other agencies without anyone's knowledge

In theory then, TPS and CTPS is supposed to immunise us against this relentless onslaught, but the real world is far away from that idyllic scenario. Reporting each and every nuisance caller consumes even more of your precious time and energy and goes against the grain for people that have more than enough to do with their busy business hours. Maybe we should all petition our MP's to make the legislation stronger and the penalties more severe for infringements? Is the infringements complaint system effective enough? Is it being policed effectively right now? I think not. The ethical and responsible telesales agents however should have no fear of this at all, it's the rogues that need addressing.

One thing is concrete fact though, moaning and squabbling about it on this forum is not a cure