Bullies!

[Gillie]

I am getting very worried about the trend of kids on facebook to use it in a totally inappropriate manner.

The amount of bullying on that place is unbelievable. Kids are setting up groups just to abuse other kids and bully them.

Ok, so usually they can be reported to facebook and if enough do so, they are then deleted, by very often its too late and the damage has been done.

I have just spent the last two hours with the police round at my house taking formal statements from my youngest who has been assualted three times this week on his way to or from school and once actually in school where nothing was done.

School do not feel they can control the two lads doing it anymore and so I was left with no option but to call in the police and press a formal complaint of assault on these two bullies.

The two lads concerned though, really have no morals or scruples, as all this afternoon one of them spent over an hour constantly ringing my lads mobile and it was me he talked to and the abuse and foul mouth I got from him was scary!

So these lads and their group of small friends are now wandering around on facebook setting up groups as fast as they are deleted suggesting ways to hurt my son. Facebook delete the groups, but I can't understand why they don't delete the accounts of the kids concerned.

I have sent them an email asking them to, plus of course taking screen shots that the police would like to see as well.

Its not been a very enjoyable few days here in Cloggie Land, and its the poor lads birthday tomorrow and I am debating keeping him off school, as of course the tradition these days is to (gently) punch the birthday boy, and although informing school of the possibility, we feel these lads will make the most of it and take it a little too far.

Sorry I am rambling now - tired and just a tad stressed - but I am told that progress will be made, but I can't see how, these lads will get a telling off and lie low for a while, then just start again.

The circles just go on and on!

 

[Hedgie]

I have removed my kids from Facebook and taken my own profile off as well. I don't think social network sites are productive for kids or adults for that matter. Facebook owners never take anything seriously.

Have you considered homeschooling Gillie although I realise your kids are probably a bit older than mine.

 

[Gavin-Design-Right]

totally agree, keep him off he is most likley dreading going to school. Hope it all gets sorted out for you and the wee man nnoone deserves that.

 

[Gillie]

I have removed my kids from Facebook and taken my own profile off as well. I don't think social network sites are productive for kids or adults for that matter. Facebook owners never take anything seriously.

Have you considered homeschooling Gillie although I realise your kids are probably a bit older than mine.

Homeschooling is not an option. Middle one merely has one term until his A levels and the youngest is 15 tomorrow and is coming to the end of his first year of GCSE's.

I do monitor what my kids get up to on Facebook and their older sister even got involved whilst away at University and got her friends to report it too.

But it doesnt matter if your kids are on facebook or not, the others still use it to stir up others to join in with the bullying.

 

[Hedgie]

Homeschooling is not an option. Middle one merely has one term until his A levels and the youngest is 15 tomorrow and is coming to the end of his first year of GCSE's.

I do monitor what my kids get up to on Facebook and their older sister even got involved whilst away at University and got her friends to report it too.

But it doesnt matter if your kids are on facebook or not, the others still use it to stir up others to join in with the bullying.

Yeah, I guess you are right on that one. Its the others kids that cause the problerms on Facebook. Thankfully we have had no issues with secondary school but only 2 kids gone through with 4 more yet to go that way.

 

[Gillie]

We now have a 14 year old girl on there putting on various walls that my son should die as he is in her eyes the scum of the earth.

Is the only way with bullies to treat them as they treat others, or stand up to them and hope that by involving the authorities they see the error of their ways?

 

[Esk247]

facebook is becoming a bully capital, mainly because they're finding it difficult to control the profiles by the looks of it.

it isn't just children that are affected. there have been a few cases here where certain types have tried to gain advantage in local arguments by posting up certain groups such as '**** **** is a stupid fool' and 'add this group if you're sick of *** ***'

but the fact is, Facebook is just one of hundreds of websites where people can cyber-bully.

 

I'd go round and punch out their parents.... bullying always needs a firm response

 

[Esk247]

We now have a 14 year old girl on there putting on various walls that my son should die as he is in her eyes the scum of the earth.

Is the only way with bullies to treat them as they treat others, or stand up to them and hope that by involving the authorities they see the error of their ways?

it's easy to get in a temper and start setting up groups in response to the bullying..however..this can also get you in to trouble and it lessens your effect with the authorities.

will they see the error of there ways? no, i've dealt with enough people my age who are total fools and they remain fools. they want a re-action, if they don't get it, they get bored.

 

[Scott-Copywriter]

I've never seen anything as severe as this before. They sound like a bunch of psychopaths.

If it was up to me I'd lock them all up for the rest of their teenage years.

 

[mobyme]

Have you tried to find out why your son has been singled out in this way?
My wife used to run the local Guides group and we found out that our daughter was being bullied because of it. These feral kids seem to home in on the slightest thing.
I suffered from it a bit as a child as well because I had a strange accent and stood out as being different, which is probably why I react so badly when I see people being put down or bullied in the forums.
I'm not saying finding out why it is happening will make it any easier to stop altogether, but it might help you to take measures to lessen his exposure to it.

 

[Esk247]

These feral kids seem to home in on the slightest thing.

feral is exactly the correct word to use..they act like a pack, they hunt for any potentially easy targets and unfortunately, under Labour..this seems to have increased..after all..you cannot discipline the feral creatures for they are 'mis-understood' or 'part of a gang culture' which seems to make it acceptable to cause other people or animals suffering of some description.

i just don't get it myself..we're all used to a bit of banter but this kind of stuff is bordering on the psychopathic

 

[maxine]

I have gone right off facebook and wont allow my son to have an account on there (age 11, even though all his friends are pestering him to set one up). It seems like a place for kids and weirdos to air their dirty laundry in public all the time and just stir up reactions from showing off to bullying.

Our sons junior school actually sent a letter out to all parents saying that parents have broken the law by allowing their junior school children to go on there and pointing out some risks etc. Most parents took no notice!

Teenagers seem to be obsessed by it because of the pack culture and fear of missing out on something that is going on or what is being said about them.

Just watch an episode of Jeremy Kyle and facebook gets a mention every time!

I don't know about the bullying side of it Gillie. We went through some bullying episodes with my stepdaughter when she was about 14 and it was pretty scarey at the time with all sorts of threats and things that went on. Part of me says it is not worth trying to stand up to them on your own as the pack just sees it as a challenge and it gets worse from our experiences (though not of fb, it was all by texting at that time).

 

[Beachcomber]

What a horrible, horrible situation - my heart goes out to you all as I understand how crushing this constant abuse (and moreso the constant threat of more abuse) can be.

Personally I'd pursue the police to prosecute - take screenshots of everything you find with times / dates, build up a detailed file of all evidence you can find.

Note phone calls with times and dates + contents of any calls - as well as pursuing facebook to close accounts you can file compleints with these kids mobile phone providers.

I'd also file complaints with the bullies ISP's - using internet access for this kind of abuse is against theit T&C's and they can have their connection withdrawn.

As well as this, I'd take legal advice Re. a private prosecution - build up your evidence until you have a good few months of hard facts while discussing the matter with your solicitor and ask him to maybe serve some kind of legal notice of intent on the parents - a kind of cease and desist letter.

Finally, maybe it would be a good idea to enrol your son in a self defence class - not only so he can protect himself but mainly for the confidence building / self esteem side.

Hope it gets better soon.

 

[Beachcomber]

School do not feel they can control the two lads doing it anymore........

Then why the hell haven't they been expelled?

 

[papverpoppies]

Have you also noticed the trend on facebook to put photos of young children up.

Anyone could become a 'friend' of that person, to find out where they live..

Why do parents do it?

Stick their own photo there if they want to, but to use their young children like that is dreadful.

I was searching for someone the other night, and it was her young Daughters photo that came up..

I feel sorry for some young children to day, the pressures are horrendous, and belonging to 'bully' gangs seems to be what it is all about.

What a terrible way to have to grow up.

Poppy

 

[papverpoppies]

What a horrible, horrible situation - my heart goes out to you all as I understand how crushing this constant abuse (and moreso the constant threat of more abuse) can be.

Personally I'd pursue the police to prosecute - take screenshots of everything you find with times / dates, build up a detailed file of all evidence you can find.

Note phone calls with times and dates + contents of any calls - as well as pursuing facebook to close accounts you can file compleints with these kids mobile phone providers.

I'd also file complaints with the bullies ISP's - using internet access for this kind of abuse is against theit T&C's and they can have their connection withdrawn.

As well as this, I'd take legal advice Re. a private prosecution - build up your evidence until you have a good few months of hard facts while discussing the matter with your solicitor and ask him to maybe serve some kind of legal notice of intent on the parents - a kind of cease and desist letter.

Finally, maybe it would be a good idea to enrol your son in a self defence class - not only so he can protect himself but mainly for the confidence building / self esteem side.

Hope it gets better soon.

Bullies - are weak and pathetic, they pick on those they know will not answer back.

That is why they go around in gangs, for the support, because on their own they are nothing.

If you can find the strength and the nerve to stand up to them, most of them crumble and go away.

I hope it gets sorted also.

Good Luck

Poppy

 

[Gillie]

Well I thought it would be manners to head in to school to let them know about the situation so they can monitor it etc whilst he is in school.

So I am taken into an office where its suggested that my son and the two lads plus one girl all sit down together, to chat and air their issues and see if they can resolve them!

Whatever happend to the days of bullies being hauled over the coals so that they stopped and realised what little darlings (well I was going to swear!) they are, but no, we have to all sit down together to consider the feelings of the bullies.

If this society of ours got any 'wetter' and 'do gooder' we will need permission soon to have an opinion!!

 

[Beachcomber]

If this society of ours got any 'wetter' and 'do gooder' we will need permission soon to have an opinion!!

Too true - does the head actually think they will respond to this touchy feely approach or will the offenders leave the meeting thinking that the worst punishment they can expect for bullying is a 10 minute sobbing session with some damp lettuce of a teacher????

Tell 'em straight - the school has a duty of care - any assult occuring will be reported to the police and their faliure to prove said care will also be reported.

They probably don;t want to exclude the bullies for fear of it looking bad on their ofsted reports.

I've had many dealings with teachers - you have to wade through several layer of bull before they realise you are not one of the parents that will be fobbed off with their 'we know best' attitude and start to actually deal with the situation.

Good luck, get yer elbows out!

 

realy sory to hear about this gillie,i would recomend sending kids to a boxing club or something like taekwondo i went to a boxing club from age 10 -18 and realy enjoyed it and my son did taekwondo for the same time ,neither need to be full contact although boxing was when i did it both teach self disiplin and confidence and self defence,and the thing bulys dont like in my experiance is a bloody nose and sometimes im afraid its the only thing that works,its wrong and i hate it but now and again

 

[Gillie]

Then why the hell haven't they been expelled?

Yes after getting a lecture (ok not quite) or rather helpful advise from him who likes to pester me ... I headed into school and talked to various to find out why these lads have not even been questioned about it all, and suggest that I want school to take action, as by ignoring it they are merely reinforcing to these idiots that they can attacked anyone to or from their way to school.

I now await a further response and to find out what action they are taking.

realy sory to hear about this gillie,i would recomend sending kids to a boxing club or something like taekwondo i went to a boxing club from age 10 -18 and realy enjoyed it and my son did taekwondo for the same time ,neither need to be full contact although boxing was when i did it both teach self disiplin and confidence and self defence,and the thing bulys dont like in my experiance is a bloody nose and sometimes im afraid its the only thing that works,its wrong and i hate it but now and again

Oh brat of mine in the past would have reacted and hit back, but due to problems with his temper (he gets the red mist thing) he now takes various steps to make sure he doesnt loose it, and not fighting back and not even defending himself is one of them, all in the name of not becoming a thug himself.

So he has no issues with not being able to defend himself, the possible issue could be that if he lost it, he would probably do more damage than they ever could (bar the use of weapons of course).

This is one of the reasons its so frustrating for him - he knows he could floor both of them, but he daren't go there!

 

[MikeD08]

Oh brat of mine in the past would have reacted and hit back, but due to problems with his temper (he gets the red mist thing) he now takes various steps to make sure he doesnt loose it, and not fighting back and not even defending himself is one of them, all in the name of not becoming a thug himself.

So he has no issues with not being able to defend himself, the possible issue could be that if he lost it, he would probably do more damage than they ever could (bar the use of weapons of course).

This is one of the reasons its so frustrating for him - he knows he could floor both of them, but he daren't go there!

I'd be tempted to let go, just once and give the little buggers a taste of violent retribution. Definately not the right way to handle it, but it could be the only way.

 

[Beachcomber]

I'd be tempted to let go, just once and give the little buggers a taste of violent retribution. Definately not the right way to handle it, but it could be the only way.

Tricky one.
You can't reason with the unreasonable but I'd hate for Gillie's son to end up going to far and putting some kid in hospital or worse. You don't want to give the bullies an opportunity to cry 'victim'

It's all to easy to properly hurt someone when the old mist decends.

 

[Gillie]

Voilence cannot be the answer surely, as it begets more. So where does it stop? My lad hits back, for them to come back at him with a weapon or just more of them, thus putting him in hospital?

And am I foolish to place all my trust in the police and school?

If we didn't, what kind of society would this turn in to then?

Either way, its dammed demoralising!

 

[Beachcomber]

Either way, its dammed demoralising!

People often forget we are still tribal animals and this shows itself in tribal behaviour that doesn;t fit into our modern day view of what is right.

You are right about the violent response - this can lead to revenge attacks, attacks on friends etc ,etc.

As I mentioned before - I'd look at attacking this from all angles, the police, the school, the parents and private legal action - maybe even a restraining order or revocation of internet access from the offenders ISP.

One thing is for sure - you will need to fight through several layers of apathy before things start to happen.

 

[Jon123]

Finance - its the only way to really hit people where it hurts. If the other kids don't have rich parents sue them (There parents will sort out there kids in minutes with the threat off legal action if they cannot afford it) or sue the headteacher for gross misconduct.

Then press - pay for an article in the local paper to name and shame them/ the headteacher.

Failing that intimidation as opposed to violence might work.

Its funny how labour have made even bullying in to a income producing sector with all the hours/red tape/ legal/police fees and hours.

Personally I think compsec is right pay the parents a visit with some hired help. Kids fear unbelievably when there parents are in fear.

I think you are right not letting your son fight back if he does the police will side on the bullys side but if one off the bullys fell down some steps and no one was around it would sure shake them up.

Direct combat never solves anything look at us sending in the troops to the middle east!! BUT our special forces were doing a very good job before light was made of the situation if you see what I mean.

Jonny

 

[midgetman]

Gillie,

I dont have any answers for you, all i can say as a father is that my heart goes out. there is nothing worse than seeing your children suffer in any way.

 

[iArtist]

I am very sorry to hear this Gillie, very sorry indeed. I know how it is to be on the receiving end of this type of thing.

Re your kid and school..I would have no hisitation in removing him and moving him to another school.

I have moved my kids for things not relating to bullying and it was the best thing I did. Not nearly as disruptive as you imagine and it is the only way to get away from those nasty kids and start afresh.

Meanwhile, take as hard a line as you can with the bullies. I filed an online complaint re this myself recently and it is illegal it is called 'malicious communications'. Adults can be arrested for sending nasty emails to blogs, to email and so on. Not sure what they do re kids, but it is a criminal offence now to cause someone anxiety and distress via internet or phone communication.

Good luck and let us know how this progresses.

 

[Gillie]

Thinking of the stress involved in moving schoolsfor him, the loss of friends, the new surroundings etc, and also the sheer fact he is half way through his GCSE course, which for those who are not aware, is not a simple case of sitting various exams at age 16, its formed as coursework done through the two years, and exams they sit as well for various subjects, plus he is at present going to a Language College and other schools in the area are Science based or IT based, so he will not be able to do certain subjects, so in effect, I would be putting him a year behind his contemporaries, means there is no chance of him moving school.

Facebook have now been bombarded with requests to shut down various things upto some 400 times, so perhaps they are listening, don't know, aint logged on to check yet this morning!, but such is the power of friends lists and friends of friends lists!!

 

[An Oasis]

I'd go round and punch out their parents.... bullying always needs a firm response

I'm afraid I'm with our violent Irish IT bod on this issue.

The system hands are tied because the scum are ££££££££££ and our useless government does nothing to help, just makes it harder for all concerned to educate those that want to be educated.

Having been involved in the education system and stopped a 30 year old FE student from being beaten to a pulp by a gang of idiots on day release from school (because they were scum) the system does not want to know. I refused to fill in the standard report form and instead wrote an email to the Head of the school concerned and CC'ed it to my head of division, the college principle, the head of student welfare...the **** hit the fan big style, the email to the principle never made it as it was pulled from the system...the management at Wigan & Leigh College are a bunch of cowards.

It could have been much much worse for them. Oh and if any of the dickheads from Wigan & Leigh College are reading this a Thank You would have been nice.

 

the thing all stems back to the home often kids have parents who dont install basic values in there ofspring and let them run riot.
They go to school the school can do nothing and so it goes on, until the little loves are causing havoc all over the shop.
Thats why boxing clubs ext work!if you go in there and and gob off only one outcome will come of it .
my kids have never had a fight in there lives or run riot all over the town, because as parents we told them right from wrong, i have never given in to them and showered them in expensive stuff nor have i ever hit them .
its not hard but some people are just crap parents and turn out horrid kids.

 

[An Oasis]

...my kids have never had a fight in there lives or run riot all over the town, because as parents we told them right from wrong, i have never given in to them and showered them in expensive stuff nor have i ever hit them .
its not hard but some people are just crap parents and turn out horrid kids.

And the state now dictates how parents should parent, how teachers should run schools, how the Police should Police...how utterly ridiculous is that? We have far too many woolly thinking idiots in politics who fail to see how badly their ill thought through ideas are performing.

Smaller & better run government, who stay out of matters that they know nothing about is needed. And…when these idiots do make a ruling they should be forced to floor walk and understand exactly what they have done. These fecks should be forced to get hands on or back off and stay away from matters that they do not understand.

 

And the state now dictates how parents should parent, how teachers should run schools, how the Police should Police...how utterly ridiculous is that?
Very in a work mate

 

[Esk247]

as i always say:

teachers to teach
police to police
nurses to nurse

when the MPs head to Westminster though, it all changes:

managers to teach teachers how to teach
directors to decide how the police police
chief execs deciding how much nurses can spend on nursing people

just wait till all the information comes out about care homes (planned mass closures are imminent)

 

[Stephen Berry]

..........Tell 'em straight - the school has a duty of care ...................faliure to prove said care will also be reported.
................
They probably don;t want to exclude the bullies for fear of it looking bad on their ofsted reports...............

Hi Gillie, I'm getting angry at the bullies just reading what you have written - you are in a terrible situation.

Just a quick one from me, a school governor. Beachcomber is quite right on all counts. The school MUST have a written procedure for dealing with bullying allegations - ask the head teacher for it and read it with him (!). Make your formal complant in writing to the head teacher with a copy to the chair of governors. They are obligated to take it seriously and deal with it. Keep everything in writing - progress reports, actions taken, incidents and keep these as regular reports for action to both head teacher and chair of governors. This is something which they have to PROVE to Ofsted that they have dealt with satisfactorily and in accordance to their written proceedure. If they do not - then they are more frightened of Ofsted than being frightened of excluding.
So ... keep it written, keep it formal, keep it cc to the chair and keep it on the governors agenda.

keep us posted. please excuse haste - train to catch - will look for progress reports. and good luck.

 

[Gillie]

Hi Gillie, I'm getting angry at the bullies just reading what you have written - you are in a terrible situation.

Just a quick one from me, a school governor. Beachcomber is quite right on all counts. The school MUST have a written procedure for dealing with bullying allegations - ask the head teacher for it and read it with him (!). Make your formal complant in writing to the head teacher with a copy to the chair of governors. They are obligated to take it seriously and deal with it. Keep everything in writing - progress reports, actions taken, incidents and keep these as regular reports for action to both head teacher and chair of governors. This is something which they have to PROVE to Ofsted that they have dealt with satisfactorily and in accordance to their written proceedure. If they do not - then they are more frightened of Ofsted than being frightened of excluding.
So ... keep it written, keep it formal, keep it cc to the chair and keep it on the governors agenda.

keep us posted. please excuse haste - train to catch - will look for progress reports. and good luck.

Thanks Stephen.

Well one of the bullies concerned on Friday was excluded from school as he was caught drinking vodka in the toilets, boy it gets better and better!!

I have a meeting with school later today to formalise by concerns, so watch this space.

 

[Gillie]

This article was sent to me today http://news.therecord.com/news/local/article/684907 it would appear that its becoming big in Canada to take schools to the small claims for not dealing with it.