£12/hour for SEO - too cheap?

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creospace

  • #201
    I think the point that's being made here is that you can't separate good SEO from good webdesign. If an SEO tries to do his job he should be able to say that his work is wasted because the site isn't worth it?

    This brings in a moral dilema in that should SEO's take work where they know for a fact that the site will chase away punters once they get there.

    And further more should anyone be doing SEO if they can't tell the difference?
     
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    RedEvo

    RedEvo

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    May 12, 2007
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  • #202
    Bathead said:
    Every aspect of the business is important. SEO, website, operations, accounts.... blah

    A good SEO will want to as understand the business as fully as possible. A good SEO will then want to understand the target audience. There may be aspects of the website the SEO will advise on changing, not only code wise but presentation too. SEO is (should be) an intrinsic part of the business, so yes all areas of the business need to considered. I don't see SEO as a bolt on. And I don't see a choice between SEO or a website, they both go hand in hand.

    Mick
    Click to expand...

    Bang on on my view. I can't think of a single SEO project we work on where we haven't changed things on a website that are not strictly speaking what most would refer to SEO. You need an holistic approach.

    d
     
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    Wiggy

    Wiggy

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    Sep 11, 2007
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  • #203
    In a few months I will be able to contribute to this thread. . .

    I have a made a decent living from my websites since 2001 without any deliberate SEO. . .Obviously, I am now aware of many things intrinsic to the website design that are good SEO, but until I came across you lot, I never worshipped at this particular altar. . .Any good SEO was fortuitious happenstance.
    So far I have lived and died by PPC and running a good business. The inbound links I have accumulated over the years come primarily from satisfied customers. . ."I get all my Kanekalon from www.Afrocare.com" is scribbled all over the web. . .
    Now I have soaked up some information [Thanks again] and when I write a title, product name or description I actually think about keyword density. . .

    If/when any of this bears fruit, I will be able to compare life after SEO with life before SEO and like I said earlier, make a useful contribution to this thread. . .
     
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    Mark-UK

    Mark-UK

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    Jan 8, 2007
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  • #204
    I did write a post yesterday but my bloody pc timed out, it basically said the same as redevo, in all my seo and ppc projects I've always found myself talking to the client on website usability/design etc and recommending ways to improve the site, its part and parcel of being an seo and ppc consultant.
     
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    rickb

  • #205
    I'm British and my clients are british. Anyway back to the subject at hand.
    It's obviously clear that assuming a website can convert on SEO alone is like adding salt to boiling water and assuming it will be soup.
    Click to expand...

    I gathered as much that you're a Brit - it's just that I thought a native English speaker with an office in Latvia would have a cost advantage. Especially with the more labour intensive aspects of SEO.
     
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    creospace

  • #206
    I gathered as much that you're a Brit - it's just that I thought a native English speaker with an office in Latvia would have a cost advantage. Especially with the more labour intensive aspects of SEO.
    Click to expand...

    If I chose to exploit it then yes, but I haven't cos (I'm a control freak and) I can't trust people to do work of any quality here so I use people in the uk.

    I'm not here to take advantage of any cheap labour, it's just the unusual circumstance I find myself in more than anything. The cheaper cost of living is offset by the fact I live bang in the centre of the capital.
     
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    rickb

  • #208
    I think the point that's being made here is that you can't separate good SEO from good webdesign.
    Click to expand...

    Absolutely true - but I find many who are even marginally competent in SEO aren't good at design.
    Which isn't surprising given the difference in the nature of the skills required.
    Not that creative thought is not required in SEO - quite the opposite, a good SEO professional must be able to see the bigger picture and think outside the box. But it doesn't require an apptitude for visual creativeness. It's more like "creative accounting"!
     
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    I, Brian

    I, Brian

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  • #210
    A lot of coding is outsourced abroad, not necessarily because of price alone, but because they are some exceptional programmers outside of the UK. I know some big name SEO companies that outsource to places such Russia, simply because they regard the people they are working with as genii.

    But with outsource work comes trust, as rickb points out. I can get cheaper development work in India, but I know the Brit I hire isn't going to post my password lists to Pakistan.

    2c.
     
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    Nuventure

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    Dec 8, 2007
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  • #211
    JustOneUK said:
    That's what I charge.. too cheap?

    The reason?.. I don't have a portfolio, I don't talk about sites that I have SEO'd apart from my own. I do get a surprising amount of work though.

    Thoughts pleeeeeese :)
    Click to expand...

    Depends if you are any good. Not having a portfolio or being able to show examples of your work, or having testimonials from customers means you may need to price yourself low to get the work.

    Is this why you are getting a surprising amount of work? Or is it through word of mouth for a job well done? If so you need to capitalise on that and put testimonials and such on your website along with examples so that people can compare you with other services.

    I know that if I was looking for SEO services I would A) Want to know how you fair in terms of your service. What your claims are. B) Look for recommendations C) Look at your prices for value for money.

    If you want to price yourself higher then you need to show customers exactly why they should pay a higher price. It is no good just upping your prices because you think you deserve a pay rise, explain to your customers why you are worth it.

    What are your claims? Could you get a website onto the first page of google in a matter of weeks? What gurantees do you offer?

    Also, rather than charging per hour, why not consider charging for a job well done? If an SEO consultant is worth their salt then they should be able to say that if the results are not what was agreed then the customer is entitled to money back.

    This would give greater reassurance than someone simply saying to me "Its £25 a hour and I'll try my best to get you to number 1". I would much rather go to someone who says "Its a £100 to get you on the first page or your money back".
     
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    tommy123

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    Dec 12, 2007
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  • #213
    My seo has been getting top 10 google rankings for the past 4 years for clients but it wasnt until i told him to break away from non-disclosure contracts that he started getting real clients. Without a portfolio how will future clients be confident enough in you to pay a part of the contract ahead of time or charge a reasonable price. When i say portfolio, i mean a portfolio of clients with contact phone numbers and emails and tough keywords .
     
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    RayB

  • #214
    tommy123 said:
    My seo has been getting top 10 google rankings for the past 4 years for clients but it wasnt until i told him to break away from non-disclosure contracts that he started getting real clients. Without a portfolio how will future clients be confident enough in you to pay a part of the contract ahead of time or charge a reasonable price. When i say portfolio, i mean a portfolio of clients with contact phone numbers and emails and tough keywords .
    Click to expand...

    The best SEO's work on word of mouth, have a waiting list, turn work away, and never advertise.

    That is the sort of SEO I would (and do) work with - no more, no less.
     
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    tommy123

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  • #215
    RayB said:
    The best SEO's work on word of mouth, have a waiting list, turn work away, and never advertise.

    That is the sort of SEO I would (and do) work with - no more, no less.
    Click to expand...

    Have to disagree on word of mouth part Ray, Most clients wont pass an seo's reference around if hes too good or too bad. If hes too bad it will give them a bad reputation for giving his reference to others. If the seo is too good and his prices are under the current market charges, the client will want to try as hard as possible to keep that seo to themselves.My seo has maybe one or 2 honest clients that will pass teh word on his services to others but on the most part, most clients are greedy by nature especially if its a subcontract work also.

    Let me pm you an example of a few tough keywords that my seo has worked on for a site and you can judge for urself what im talking about.
    sounds fair?;)
     
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    tommy123

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    Dec 12, 2007
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  • #225
    JustOneUK said:
    PM the keywords to me also - For some strange reason I'm interested in taking a peek :)

    Regards...
    Click to expand...

    Pm sent, you can peek at his work now:D

    As Ray said these are rankings in google.com and not googke uk. He did do work for one guy on google uk, got him into the first page for a toy related keyword and client never paid the remaining 50%.
    Hope you like. he has been doing this for clients for 4 years but was a subcontractor at first for some good sized seo companies, so he just started branching out on his own.
     
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