I Met a Successful Business Owner Who Succeeded Without an Online Presence

[Local Burak]

I published an article about Google's dominance, the importance of supporting local communities, and the effectiveness of newspaper advertising. Shortly after, I received a call for a consultation.

The caller runs a successful construction company in London, well-established in the area for many years. However, he has no website, no Google Maps listing, and only a neglected Instagram page. He relies solely on word-of-mouth within his local community, delivering high-quality work that satisfies his clients.

He proved to me that what I wrote was true.
Support your community – that’s why I’m here too.

 

[MarketingQuote]

There are lots of companies that run successful businesses without an online presence.

 

[fisicx]

I use loads of local businesses. Many of whom I find via Google. It’s that dominance that gives me a wide choice of local businesses to choose from.

 

[DontAsk]

No surprise there. There are lots of businesses like that. The guy who did some repointing on our house was booked up for almost a year in advance. Just word of month and a very small ad in a local advertising magazine.

Similarly the builder who took a wall out for us.

Tree care specialists the same, although one or two do have a presence on Facebook.

It's the ones who advertise aggressively and. sometime, intrusively, all over SM that I avoid. If they need to do that much advertising they can't have that much work in hand.

 

[japancool]

The caller runs a successful construction company in London, well-established in the area for many years. However, he has no website, no Google Maps listing, and only a neglected Instagram page. He relies solely on word-of-mouth within his local community, delivering high-quality work that satisfies his clients.

That's great. Now do the same for a new startup based in Swindon.

He proved to me that what I wrote was true.

Meaning you didn't know it was true before you wrote it?

 

[HFE Signs]

It depends on the business - Our local corner shop doesn't have a website

 

[japancool]

Our local knocking shop doesn't either.

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

Imagine how much more business he might have if he did have an online presence!

 

[Chris Ashdown]

You either move with the times or stagnate, I think that is a major problem in the USA, the companies who have worked with the times have grown into magga companies , whilst others still churn out the old pre 2000 products and see their sales decrease each year

 

[Local Burak]

Imagine how much more business he might have if he did have an online presence!

That’s exactly what we discussed

I use loads of local businesses. Many of whom I find via Google. It’s that dominance that gives me a wide choice of local businesses to choose from.

This leads to market manipulation due to uncontrolled growth driven by a capital-focused mindset.

I want to clarify my perspective further. I stay updated on the latest industry news to understand how businesses can improve their online presence. In doing so, I also want to open a discussion about Google's dominant role in the market.
Given the recent major changes in the U.S., I think now is the right time to talk about it.

For example, OpenWebSearch is the latest independent search project. It is always open to discussing if it can succeed in its aims.

 

[fisicx]

This leads to market manipulation due to uncontrolled growth driven by a capital-focused mindset.

Eh?

I search for a plumber near me and are presented with a number of choices my search engine of choice. I can read the reviews, visit the websites and make an informed choice. How is this market manipulation?

 

[Mark T Jones]

Rule of thumb

Anyone who tells you 'every business needs insta/website/facebook/linkedin' [insert any promotional medium] is either an idiot or a snake oil vendor

Case in point

My wife has a successful business with a full diary several months in advance (her weakness is not turning business away)

Every so often, she gets spooked into believing she should have a website to 'promote her business'

Usually, after a 10 munute chat, wd conclude that a website would at best be useless, at worst would generate PITA price-cutting enquiries

Last time I lost the argument. A specific project had asked for a website link to validate her credentials, so I built one. Actually, I half-built one, because all they actually needed was sight of her certificates

I suspect it will remain half-built for ever

On the other hand, my website is pretty useful.

 

[JeffPWFB]

Does your wife at least have an email list, Mark T Jones?

 

[Mark T Jones]

Does your wife at least have an email list, Mark T Jones?

She has one, which has been used once (to advise of price increases)

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

Your wife is in the rare position of having a full pipeline, which is not common.

Doing the boring e-stuff like having a website, email newsletters etc helps to ensure that she remains with that pipeline. Saying she doesn't need it now does not mean that she might need it later.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

This industry was a lot more profitable before @Ozzy invented the internet

I do the best deals talking to people in the real world because I know what I am doing
I can convince you to place your bookings with us face to face I am more confident about this fact than I am an online sale

 

[Ozzy]

This industry was a lot more profitable before @Ozzy invented the internet

Sorry about that, but heh it's progress

I do the best deals talking to people in the real world

This ^^^
An art that is being lost in the modern online age is the art of negotiation and connection, where you can really understand the customers needs and build a win-win relationship for each where both get something from working together - rather than being so transactional.

 

[fisicx]

It’s what I do all the time with clients round the world. A zoom/teams/whatever call to get to know them, ask questions and then get started on the project. Proves to be far more lucrative as I can often upsell.

 

[DontAsk]

Imagine how much more business he might have if he did have an online presence!

Perhaps too much!

 

[DontAsk]

Your wife is in the rare position of having a full pipeline, which is not common.

It's not rare at all, but how full is full?

Local tradesmen I use never seem to have slack periods.

 

[fisicx]

The plumber we use has a basic website and GBP. He needs one lead per day. Any more than that is pointless as he can’t do any more.

I’m sure there will be some who can survive without an online anything but most need something.

 

[JeffPWFB]

She has one, which has been used once (to advise of price increases)

Good. That might be enough. I admire anyone who refuses to dance to Google's algorithm changes with a blog or website yet makes money regardless. It's exactly why I concentrate on email copywriting.
If she ever feels business is going quiet, she might want to stoke the fire with two or three emails a week to her list. Soft sell rather than hard sell, maybe talking about the quirky side of her job (if it has one) or an unusual task she recently worked on. Anything that breaks the monotony of the uber-professional yawn-fests with which businesses bombard our inboxes.
I wish her well. Vive la resistance.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Your wife is in the rare position of having a full pipeline, which is not common.

Doing the boring e-stuff like having a website, email newsletters etc helps to ensure that she remains with that pipeline. Saying she doesn't need it now does not mean that she might need it later.

Disagree

A minority, probably but far from rare

A Category of people whose marketing relies on being present, being relevant and being good at what they do.

It applies to most domestic trades and many others

In reality her weakness is being reluctant to turn clients away. My suggestion is that she should put up prices and drop clients who are outside a decent radius or just a pain. Possibly as much as 50%.

It would take 2 or 3 months to rebuild with better customers- mostly just by asking existing clients, and possibly a teeny bit of time on Facebook communities.

 

[Local Burak]

Some businesses do just fine without a website, while others rely on it completely. But maybe having an online presence isn’t just about being visible, about having the right strategy to bring in leads when needed.
I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given. I’m just wondering if relying on a single Google campaign is enough or if businesses need multiple approaches to generate leads.

---

Of course, the size of the business and the industry make a big difference. When I ask this, I’m thinking about service based businesses where the product is the service itself. That’s just my focus on the market.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Some businesses do just fine without a website, while others rely on it completely. But maybe having an online presence isn’t just about being visible, about having the right strategy to bring in leads when needed.
I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given. I’m just wondering if relying on a single Google campaign is enough or if businesses need multiple approaches to generate leads.

---

Of course, the size of the business and the industry make a big difference. When I ask this, I’m thinking about service based businesses where the product is the service itself. That’s just my focus on the market.

It definitely isn't a given.

Any discussion about what a medium a business needs has to start with a discussion about the circumstances and targets of that specific business - looking for universal/generic answers is pointless and is an indicator of snake-oil

 

[MikeJ]

Our local knocking shop doesn't either.

How did you find it then?

 

[fisicx]

I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given.

Disagree. Plus it all depends on your definition of being online.

 

[DontAsk]

I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given.

Simply not correct as the many businesses who are not online demonstrate.

It maybe more true for new start-ups, who need to get noticed, but it is definitely not a given for established businesses.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

An art that is being lost in the modern online age is the art of negotiation and connection, where you can really understand the customers needs and build a win-win relationship

.........and simple face to face sales? I despair at the inability of shop staff to recognise sales opportunities. 'No sir we've not got the Phirrips 2000 in stock but have got the Oshi Dashi 500 on special at the moment.'

 

[NickGrogan]

I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given.

When I ask this, I’m thinking about service based businesses where the product is the service itself.

No its not and certainly not for service based businesses.

I'm looking at opening a new service based business shortly, global reach, 0.5M turnover year 1, XXM by year 3.

There are no plans for a website beyond protecting the company name, and there are certainly no plans for SEO, online ads, PPC, etc.

 

[fisicx]

I despair at the inability of shop staff to recognise sales opportunities.

Minimum wage serfs dealing with awkward and entitled customers (not you) every day. They don't care about anything except going home when the shop closes.

 

[DontAsk]

.........and simple face to face sales? I despair at the inability of shop staff to recognise sales opportunities. 'No sir we've not got the Phirrips 2000 in stock but have got the Oshi Dashi 500 on special at the moment.'

It's an opportunity to sell the item that makes them most commission.

When I was a teenager and worked in a DIY store we were constantly being told to steer people away from Dulux, etc., to our own brand paint, as the markup was huge. The staff discount was also better and it was good paint (Ripolin, but I think the UK factory closed down long ago).

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

1

I’m not questioning whether a business should be online, that’s a given

Only someone that is online only would say this

I can get stuff done using contacts that are not online or at least not accessible to the public online
Why?
Because some professionals don't want to be dealing with low or non value enquiries all day long

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Minimum wage serfs dealing with awkward and entitled customers (not you) every day. They don't care about anything except going home when the shop closes.

Maybe they should be made or paid to care?
The missus went into BOOTS at the weekend after some 10% max strength IBULEVE Gel. They hadn't got it, but had got BOOTS own brand and a Voltarol alternative.....but didn't tell her. She left empty handed.
At £9.45 a pop and 2,232 stores across the UK just one episode like that each day per store for a year loses BOOTS £7,698,726, but more importantly my finger was xxxxxxxx sore all weekend.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

Maybe they should be made or paid to care?
The missus went into BOOTS at the weekend after some 10% max strength IBULEVE Gel. They hadn't got it, but had got BOOTS own brand and a Voltarol alternative.....but didn't tell her. She left empty handed.
At £9.45 a pop and 2,232 stores across the UK just one episode like that each day per store for a year loses BOOTS £7,698,726, but more importantly my finger was xxxxxxxx sore all weekend.

Why do you require all this gel your Lordship

 

[Local Burak]

Eh?

I search for a plumber near me and are presented with a number of choices my search engine of choice. I can read the reviews, visit the websites and make an informed choice. How is this market manipulation?

Today, Google is taking legal action against fake listings on Google Maps, uncovering over 10,000 entries. This serves as an official case study of how manipulation exists on the platform. There was a similar case last year as well. These fake listings, often created by scammers, are filled with fake reviews, misleading consumers and affecting search results.

Happy to hear that many people disagreed with my statement about the necessity of online presence. What I actually meant was that online presence is a given today and should be used strategically to boost your business. However, after meeting with a successful business owner who doesn’t rely on it, I’m now questioning whether online presence is truly essential for everyone. Why does he want it? Maybe his local community is no longer enough for him, and he’s aiming for a larger, more widespread business. It’s something I’m still pondering.

 

[fisicx]

Today, Google is taking legal action against fake listings on Google Maps, uncovering over 10,000 entries.

That's not quire correct. There are millions of fake GBP and billions of fake reviews. Google isn't taking any legal action.

Manipulation of anything is common place. Not just GBP but the organic listings, directories, forums, local resources and especially social media. It's so endemic that one could argue you can't trust anything you read online.

And it's just as bad offline. There are endless reports of dodgy builders, car sales and many others.

 

[Local Burak]

There are millions of fake GBP and billions of fake reviews. Google isn't taking any legal action.

I meant it also when I said "This serves as an official case study of how manipulation exists on the platform."

 

[Mark T Jones]

Happy to hear that many people disagreed with my statement about the necessity of online presence. What I actually meant was that online presence is a given today and should be used strategically to boost your business. However, after meeting with a successful business owner who doesn’t rely on it, I’m now questioning whether online presence is truly essential for everyone. Why does he want it? Maybe his local community is no longer enough for him, and he’s aiming for a larger, more widespread business. It’s something I’m still pondering.

It isn't essential for everyone (that's a fact, not an opinion)

Why does he want it? is a good question - and the discussion that any reputable business offering 'marketing' services should be asking each customer early on.

Why do they thinks it's necessary?

What, precisely. are they looking to achieve?

Anything from lead-gen (are they set up to handle leads if / when they happen?) to a simple holding/reference point for credentials/pictures and testimonials?

These are the discussions which separate a professional from a chancer...

 

[fisicx]

I meant it also when I said "This serves as an official case study of how manipulation exists on the platform."

What is your solution to the problem? Especially as it’s been going on for far longer than the internet has existed. Even your opening post is a form of manipulation to try and influence the direction of the thread.