What do you want from Boris Johnson's successor?

[gpietersz]

Smart meters that charge tax when you charge your car.

That had not occurred to me but its doable.

 

[Bob Morgan]

We need a Statesman and not a 'Wannabe Snake-Oil Salesman!'

 

[Employment Law Clinic]

Because of the above, I reluctantly and sadly actually think institutions like the NHS would benefit from being privatised but I don't think it should be. I feel energy, utilities, public transport, and the NHS should be public services run by the public sector for the public affordably or free where appropriate, by employing good quality commercially minded people to run them....but that's a pipe dream.

Isn't that what they do when they buy (or have to buyback, as the private companies fail) the individual train lines? When it was in public ownership (but privately run - at arms length), the East Coast Mainline was, by far, the best trainline. Given the option of flying, using the (Virgin-run) West Coast, or the East Coast, I used to travel regularly between London & Edinburgh, and always chose the East Coast - it was simply great value, excellent food & drink, great service, couldn't fault it - the onboard catering staff were just so good, whereas the occasions I used Virgin, they were terrible & very mean with servings.

The line made a profit, regularly returned money to the treasury, but still they insisted on privatising it again, and it's noticeably not as good since... but no doubt making more money for its shareholders, and less for the taxpayer.


Karl Limpert

 

[MBE2017]

As an electric car owner I pay zero car tax and zero petrol tax. I wonder how the revenue will be taken from the likes of me when there are a majority of EV cars.

Most new vehicles are fitted with trackers ready for mileage charging.

 

[alan1302]

Most new vehicles are fitted with trackers ready for mileage charging.

They often have trackers but not for use for mileage charging.

 

[japancool]

I hope when road usage tax comes in, cyclists pay their fair share.

 

[alan1302]

I hope when road usage tax comes in, cyclists pay their fair share.

How would you work out what they should pay? Weight of the bicycle/car? Amount of wear done to the roads per vehicle?

 

[Mark T Jones]

I hope when road usage tax comes in, cyclists pay their fair share.

I'd love to see the admin on that one b

 

[japancool]

How would you work out what they should pay? Weight of the bicycle/car? Amount of wear done to the roads per vehicle?

Make bicycle lanes pay-to-use. That'd be a start.

 

[alan1302]

Make bicycle lanes pay-to-use. That'd be a start.

You don't have to pay for road use so why charge cyclists?

 

[japancool]

You don't have to pay for road use so why charge cyclists?

Oh, you do. You just pay for it in other ways.

 

[alan1302]

Oh, you do. You just pay for it in other ways.

So they cyclists are already paying for the cycle lanes...

 

[japancool]

So they cyclists are already paying for the cycle lanes...

How?

 

[japancool]

Well, it seems all the candidates (apart from Rishi) are falling over themselves to offer tax cuts.

Good in some ways... bad in others. It's all very well offering tax cuts, but where's the money going to come from? And how are they going to bring the deficit down?

 

[Mark T Jones]

Well, it seems all the candidates (apart from Rishi) are falling over themselves to offer tax cuts.

Good in some ways... bad in others. It's all very well offering tax cuts, but where's the money going to come from? And how are they going to bring the deficit down?

It's basically weak and populist.

 

[Rekkovitch]

I'd like someone who can 110% empathise , relate AND help small business that are struggling by giving much greater concessions for keeping their businesses running. I dont have the luxury to be able to increase my prices year on year inline with any part of the cost of living and that is a real issue. I charged £10 in 2008 and am charging £11 now which is the top end of what the client will pay so I need to try and recoup this through overheads such as electricity etc. If there were a decent concession to mitigate the year on year losses then it would help.


We don't get holiday pay or sick pay like people on the payroll and that alone is absolutely massive. I will add that I have been employed and self employed so I have been both sides of the fence.

Increasingly I am looking at exit strategies as its gett8ng xlose to the point where its not really worthwhile carrying on. Even with cherry picking a good 80% of stuff that was viable 14 years ago is now not cost effective

 

[DontAsk]

How?

Through their taxes, just like motorists.

Despite what people would like to think, excise duty on petrol and VED are not hypothecated for road building. They all go into the same pot as other taxes.

 

[gpietersz]

Despite what people would like to think, excise duty on petrol and VED are not hypothecated for road building. They all go into the same pot as other taxes.

Not hypothecated, but they are a tax that is dependent on road use. If you do not drive you do not have to pay either, if you have a car that is bigger you will usually pay more.

 

[alan1302]

How?

Tax that everyone pays...motorists and cyclists pay the same taxes and most cyclists are motorists as well.

 

[japancool]

Tax that everyone pays...motorists and cyclists pay the same taxes and most cyclists are motorists as well.

What taxes are you referring to? Do cyclists pay emissions taxes?

And what if they are not motorists?

 

[alan1302]

If they are not what? Tax payers? Motorists?

 

[simon field]

Make bicycle lanes pay-to-use. That'd be a start.

Many bicycle lanes are not fit for purpose, which is why many cyclists ride on the road instead, where it’s safer.

 

[japancool]

If they are not what? Tax payers? Motorists?

Motorists.

 

[alan1302]

Motorists.

Why does it matter if they are motorists or not?

Motorists don't pay for roads so why should cyclists? Roads are built for everyone to use.

 

[japancool]

Why does it matter if they are motorists or not?

You were the one that brought up motorists.

Motorists don't pay for roads so why should cyclists? Roads are built for everyone to use.

Of course they do. They pay taxes that cyclists do not.

 

[simon field]

---

---

You were the one that brought up motorists.



Of course they do. They pay taxes that cyclists do not.

Which taxes?

 

[Mark T Jones]

You were the one that brought up motorists.



Of course they do. They pay taxes that cyclists do not.

Cyclists currrently pay tax at the exact same rate as equivalent motorists - ie zero excise duty and zero fuel duty. - same as an EV. They do however cause far less congestion, cause far fewer serious accidents and require far less infrastructure.

In return I'd expect proper dedicated facilities, not the tokenistic dangerous nonsense we have to put up with now.

In theory I wouldn't being opposed to cyclists being required to be insured and even to paying - in practice it would be wholly unworkable, the cost of setting it up and administering it would far exceed revenues. For context, it's estimated that there are currently about 1 million uninsured/untaxed vehicles on the road- that huge, lumps of metal easily visible to ANPR - how on earth would you control cyclists?

 

[simon field]

Cyclists currrently pay tax at the exact same rate as equivalent motorists - ie zero excise duty and zero fuel duty. - same as an EV. They do however cause far less congestion, cause far fewer serious accidents and require far less infrastructure.

In return I'd expect proper dedicated facilities, not the tokenistic dangerous nonsense we have to put up with now.

In theory I wouldn't being opposed to cyclists being required to be insured and even to paying - in practice it would be wholly unworkable, the cost of setting it up and administering it would far exceed revenues. For context, it's estimated that there are currently about 1 million uninsured/untaxed vehicles on the road- that huge, lumps of metal easily visible to ANPR - how on earth would you control cyclists?

Agree 100%.

Add in the health benefits of cycling, translating to less burden on the nhs, it’s a no-brainer that getting more people onto two wheels is the future - especially with the rapidly growing popularity of E-bikes.

Hopefully, lots more motorists will be priced off the roads due to the costs of running a motor vehicle.

 

[japancool]

zero fuel duty

EV drivers do, however, pay VAT on the electricity they use for driving, which cyclists don't.

Ultimately though, cyclist lanes take up space and have a cost associated with them. If roads are widened to accommodate them (which happened around here), there's also a carbon cost involved.

If more infrastructure and facilities are created to support cyclists, then I would want to see them banned from driving on the pavement. They talk of electric scooters being a danger to blind or disabled people - bikes can be too, if ridden irresponsibly.

 

[japancool]

Add in the health benefits of cycling, translating to less burden on the nhs, it’s a no-brainer that getting more people onto two wheels is the future - especially with the rapidly growing popularity of E-bikes.

Hopefully, lots more motorists will be priced off the roads due to the costs of running a motor vehicle.

That's all very well and good - but I hope the government doesn't leave behind disabled people who may not be able to cycle, or cycle very far. And from what I've seen happening in Leeds, I'm not hopeful.

 

[Mark T Jones]

You were the one that brought up motorists.



Of course they do. They pay taxes that cyclists do not.

EV drivers do, however, pay VAT on the electricity they use for driving, which cyclists don't.

Ultimately though, cyclist lanes take up space and have a cost associated with them. If roads are widened to accommodate them (which happened around here), there's also a carbon cost involved.

If more infrastructure and facilities are created to support cyclists, then I would want to see them banned from driving on the pavement. They talk of electric scooters being a danger to blind or disabled people - bikes can be too, if ridden irresponsibly.

OK - you win on completely irrational argument points.

Are you aware that if EV drivers don't charge their cars, they won't pay for electricity?

Moving on from this nonsense, if an incoming PM was this focused on taxing cyclists, I'd be seriously concerned about their priorities.

 

[Ozzy]

I cannot see any form of taxation on cyclists being manageable, but I do agree with the need to be insured. To throw an equivalent in the mix, my daughter works in the equestrian industry. She has insurance that covers her riding her horse (or giving lessons to others) on the road should the horse injure someone or damage a car. I actually don't know if that is a legal requirement but it should be as should riding a car (or electric scooter) on the road.

I do think taxation is overcomplicated though. Why pay tax on buying a car, then tax on charging/fueling it, and then tax on using it. The tax system is compounded upon compounding continuously.

 

[Mark T Jones]

I cannot see any form of taxation on cyclists being manageable, but I do agree with the need to be insured. To throw an equivalent in the mix, my daughter works in the equestrian industry. She has insurance that covers her riding her horse (or giving lessons to others) on the road should the horse injure someone or damage a car. I actually don't know if that is a legal requirement but it should be as should riding a car (or electric scooter) on the road.

I do think taxation is overcomplicated though. Why pay tax on buying a car, then tax on charging/fueling it, and then tax on using it. The tax system is compounded upon compounding continuously.

Agree..

The only reservation I have around insurance is the practicality of enforcement

The plus side is that simple, packaged policies would be readily available- at present it's a bit of a mish mash

 

[simon field]

I cannot see any form of taxation on cyclists being manageable, but I do agree with the need to be insured. To throw an equivalent in the mix, my daughter works in the equestrian industry. She has insurance that covers her riding her horse (or giving lessons to others) on the road should the horse injure someone or damage a car. I actually don't know if that is a legal requirement but it should be as should riding a car (or electric scooter) on the road.

I do think taxation is overcomplicated though. Why pay tax on buying a car, then tax on charging/fueling it, and then tax on using it. The tax system is compounded upon compounding continuously.

Speaking personally, I have cycling-specific insurance, as do the vast majority of responsible recreational / commuter cyclists that I know. We all have expensive bikes, ride a lot, and know there are risks, both to ourselves and other road users.

You’ll always have your paperboy/girls, old Mrs Miggins on her daily shopping bike, 13 year old lads doing wheelies, and the bloke in a donkey jacket with a fag on, who ride on the pavement where possible - they’re probably terrified of riding on the overcrowded roads and where there’s no decent provision for bikes, I don’t blame them!

Here in Sunny Norfolk for instance, the council likes painting lines on roads, or shoehorning them into bus lanes (?) and going ‘there you go!’

 

[Paul Norman]

This thread demonstrates one of the challenges got any government, our PM

On this thread we have quickly focussed in on a debate about one aspect of the government's challenge - balancing the way road users of various types should pay for the roads. Or not pay for the roads. It's a useful debate, and as is emerging, full of many differing views. And of course, no one wants their neighbour to get something for nothing, it seems.

But the PM, and the cabinet, have to balance all this, together with all the other stuff that I read. Should unemployed people be allowed smart phones? Should poor people pay more tax? How do we ring fence Rees-Moggs wealth in order to protect ourselves against communism?

And so on.

And it must be someone who shares none of the character imperfections that we allow ourselves.

 

[simon field]

The tax system is compounded upon compounding continuously.

Agreed. If you or I tried to put vat on top of tax we’d be thrown in prison!

One rule for them….

 

[Newchodge]

This thread demonstrates one of the challenges got any government, our PM

On this thread we have quickly focussed in on a debate about one aspect of the government's challenge - balancing the way road users of various types should pay for the roads. Or not pay for the roads. It's a useful debate, and as is emerging, full of many differing views. And of course, no one wants their neighbour to get something for nothing, it seems.

But the PM, and the cabinet, have to balance all this, together with all the other stuff that I read. Should unemployed people be allowed smart phones? Should poor people pay more tax? How do we ring fence Rees-Moggs wealth in order to protect ourselves against communism?

And so on.

And it must be someone who shares none of the character imperfections that we allow ourselves.

I think the best quote I have heard from any of the contenders so far was from Tugendhat who has said he won't discuss income tax, NI, VAT, corporation tax rises, reductions until he has a proper 10 year economic plan. (Or words to that effect). If you have a proper plan you can see the competing needs and assess them. Just saying you will do away with the NI hike does not loo at the effect of that.

Except of course the NI hike should never have been brought in and should be done away with .....

 

[IanSuth]

Car tax and/or a mileage based road usage tax.

I reckon from back of fag packet calculations, it would need 6p per mile for EV to replace lost income to treasury

 

[IanSuth]

Speaking personally, I have cycling-specific insurance, as do the vast majority of responsible recreational / commuter cyclists that I know. We all have expensive bikes, ride a lot, and know there are risks, both to ourselves and other road users.

You’ll always have your paperboy/girls, old Mrs Miggins on her daily shopping bike, 13 year old lads doing wheelies, and the bloke in a donkey jacket with a fag on, who ride on the pavement where possible - they’re probably terrified of riding on the overcrowded roads and where there’s no decent provision for bikes, I don’t blame them!

Here in Sunny Norfolk for instance, the council likes painting lines on roads, or shoehorning them into bus lanes (?) and going ‘there you go!’

You should try here where a major A-Road now has cycle lanes despite both highly wide pavements being marked as shared use, it means cycles have more tarmac than motor vehicles, busses struggle to pass each other without straying into the cycle lane and motorcycles can't filter (and it is a major commuting route. All because transept are local and they could get hold of EU money for the road resurfacing if cycle lanes were put in, so it saved the council money from their budget)

https://goo.gl/maps/4xM9giNeVUKa1bGZ9 (you can see a couple of the bollards saying the footpath is shared use on the left)

 

[gpietersz]

You should try here where a major A-Road now has cycle lanes despite both highly wide pavements being marked as shared use, it means cycles have more tarmac than motor vehicles, busses struggle to pass each other without straying into the cycle lane and motorcycles can't filter (and it is a major commuting route. All because transept are local and they could get hold of EU money for the road resurfacing if cycle lanes were put in, so it saved the council money from their budget)

I would like to see a calculation of the net effect of cycle lanes and cycling. Where I used to live, in Cheshire, it was common to see a line of cars stuck behind cyclists, and therefore polluting more.

Cycle lanes often slow traffic as you said.

Cyclists currrently pay tax at the exact same rate as equivalent motorists - ie zero excise duty and zero fuel duty. - same as an EV. They do however cause far less congestion, cause far fewer serious accidents and require far less infrastructure.

No tax on EVs is a temporary concession that will not last if EVs become the norm. Given the space given to cycle lanes and their usual emptiness they probably require more infrastructure per user or per person mile travelled. They similarly cause a disproportionate amount of congestion in some places, as I said above.

I also do not understand what you mean by "equivalent motorists"

Are you aware that if EV drivers don't charge their cars, they won't pay for electricity?

That is like saying if users of petrol cars never buy petrol they will not pay fuel duty.