Has the general public got any clue about SEO

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eventdomain

  • #41
    bdw said:
    Not in my experience. I find that if I am straight with people and explain the situation properly they understand why I need to ask the question at the outset.

    I have another business website and on this I ask online enquirers to select their budget from a range of budget options and tell them why it's best that we are open about this. One of these options is "I'd rather not say". Significantly most enquirers tend not to select this preferring to state a budget figure.

    .
    Click to expand...

    They won't select the 'I dont want to say' bcos they know if they do, you likely will not do the job. The aim is to keep you interested, but not disclose ther real budget bcos if they say
    We have 100k budget
    Click to expand...
    they know most likely, the Consultant will bump up the fee to squeeze more out of them.

    This may be the case or not - BUT their just protecting themselves, that's all. Pleanty of consultants to choose from.... beggers can't be choosers, and the ones with the cash are never the beggers, they have the power and you don't.
     
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    mobyme

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  • #42
    I really cannot see the problem.

    You look at the brief.

    You work out how much you want to do the job and that's the price you give.

    If the client cannot afford it let them find somebody else!

    We are professionals for God's sake; what is it with this desire to work for peanuts?

    Businesses don't buy the cheapest, least ways not twice.

    Businesses buy from professional outfits that inspire confidence that they can deliver.

    Anybody can be a busy fool.
     
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    UKSBD

    UKSBD

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  • #43
    mobyme said:
    I really cannot see the problem.

    You look at the brief.

    You work out how much you want to do the job and that's the price you give.
    Click to expand...

    The problem is, that all takes time.

    Someone sends a request for SEO work, first thing you have to do is check out their existing site, quick keyword analysis and competition analysis, then send a proposal and price.

    This may take an hour or two, you send them back a price saying £800 a month, only to get a reply saying they have only allowed £20 a month.

    Had you known right from the start they only had £20 a month budget, you would have saved all this time.
     
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    Annoying Donkey

    Annoying Donkey

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  • #45
    UKSBD said:
    This may take an hour or two, you send them back a price saying £800 a month, only to get a reply saying they have only allowed £20 a month.
    Click to expand...

    It's your job to convince them that £800/month is worthwhile :D... admittedly this can be a difficult job. I remember someone saying that an SEOs biggest job is managing client expectations...
     
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    UKSBD

    UKSBD

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  • #46
    WeblinkPlus said:
    It's your job to convince them that £800/month is worthwhile :D... admittedly this can be a difficult job. I remember someone saying that an SEOs biggest job is managing client expectations...
    Click to expand...

    maybe getting them from £200 to £800, but I would think the chances of getting the ones who only think it is only going to cost them £20 a month to pay £800 a month is pretty slim :)
     
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    eventdomain

  • #48
    The problem is, that all takes time.
    Click to expand...

    But what do you want - a pain free life?

    If you dont give the client information they want, that allows them to make the hiring decision, their off anyway......

    You got to put effort into getting the sale, although I do agree that clients can expect too much - especially the big branded companies.

    Had one huge player approach us 2 months ago, they wanted a banner for XXX months, could have charged em £1000 easily, but was prepared to settle for £400, they just messed me about - how annoying :rolleyes:
     
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    mobyme

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  • #49
    UKSBD said:
    The problem is, that all takes time.

    Someone sends a request for SEO work, first thing you have to do is check out their existing site, quick keyword analysis and competition analysis, then send a proposal and price.

    This may take an hour or two, you send them back a price saying £800 a month, only to get a reply saying they have only allowed £20 a month.

    Had you known right from the start they only had £20 a month budget, you would have saved all this time.
    Click to expand...

    Couldn't agree more. (see earlier post) I simply will not quote against an unqualified budget. I've got lots of better ways to waste my time.
     
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  • #50
    eventdomain said:
    Had one huge player approach us 2 months ago, they wanted a banner for XXX months, could have charged em £1000 easily, but was prepared to settle for £400, they just messed me about - how annoying :rolleyes:
    Click to expand...

    So whats this magical site that gets 3 million visits a day and can charge what it likes.?:|

    Hearing a lot of hot air but no proof.Come on whats the URL.?

    Don't be shy.:)

    Earl
     
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    SEO Lady

    SEO Lady

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  • #51
    mobyme said:
    Couldn't agree more. (see earlier post) I simply will not quote against an unqualified budget. I've got lots of better ways to waste my time.
    Click to expand...

    Recently I asked a potential new start website to get quotes from SEO companies from googling 'seo companies' and then come back to me after speaking with them. Let them spend the time talking to him and explaining things, then when he comes back to me I know what his budget expectations are, and also I can ask him what he wants to achieve and he will tell me.

    The hardest thing for new start sites is explaining what SEO entails and then figuring out what they want and finally, mutual agreement on how to measure results (which takes at least an hour explaining why Gpage1 cannot be achieved for terms akin to 'home loans' and 'medical insurance') and then you get into another day of Adwords explanation.

    Isn't it great though, when people call you and say "I want this this and this, and this is my budget range" :D
     
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    eventdomain

  • #52
    I can understand you wanting to not waste time, but people wont want to spend £800 on SEO work that can only apply to the free results pages, and where these are always sitting below the sponsored paid adverts.

    The best promotion spots are above the free results for a reason - they work. :)
     
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    SEO Lady

    SEO Lady

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  • #53
    eventdomain said:
    I can understand you wanting to not waste time, but people wont want to spend £800 on SEO work that can only apply to the free results pages, and where these are always sitting below the sponsored paid adverts.

    The best promotion spots are above the free results for a reason - they work. :)
    Click to expand...

    They work - as in, generate clicks. This easy to do. The hard part is getting consistant ROI conversions. This is where SEO for organic results pays off, tons of clicks @ no cost.
     
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    SEO Lady

    SEO Lady

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  • #54
    eventdomain said:
    I can understand you wanting to not waste time, but people wont want to spend £800 on SEO work
    Click to expand...

    Example: Client spends 5figs/month on Adwords. SEO builds up SERPs to Gpage1 in 3 months @ £800/month. Adwords cost then reduced by 60%. SEO does maintainance work at a vastly reduced cost. Client has equal if not increased revenue, at the same time saving £6k/month.

    This is a rough example from one of my clients.

    Still want to pay every day for top position? Or would you prefer to invest short term for long term results?
     
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  • #58
    The hard part is getting consistant ROI conversions. This is where SEO for organic results pays off, tons of clicks @ no cost.
    Click to expand...

    SEO does not assist or force conversion - that's what websites are for eg:

    Copywriting sales text
    Clever use of images to highlight
    Graphics that aid selling
    Special offers
    etc

    SEO has nothing to do with content, that's down to the website owner to arrange - not some SEO bod. Content demands domain expertise, which SEOs just don't have.

    Tons of clicks at no cost? Well, for starters theres always a cost eg: time is ahuge cost, as is the money needed for promotion, after they all underestimate whats involved in content delivery. :D

    Not forgetting 70% of all these clicks are next to useless - its just people clicking away bcos they made a mistake and clicked on the wrong url, or its untargeted traffic due to people sticking their links on general websites, so yep, lots of it, sure - but its useless.
     
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    SEO Lady

    SEO Lady

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  • #61
    eventdomain said:
    SEO has nothing to do with content, that's down to the website owner to arrange - not some SEO bod. Content demands domain expertise, which SEOs just don't have.
    Click to expand...

    BS

    eventdomain said:
    Not forgetting 70% of all these clicks are next to useless - its just people clicking away bcos they made a mistake and clicked on the wrong url, or its untargeted traffic due to people sticking their links on general websites, so yep, lots of it, sure - but its useless.
    Click to expand...

    So, to parallell that equasion, the majority of clicks (paid for / organic) are next to useless... Incorrect, that statement leads to the assumption that 30% of clicks result in a conversion whether paid or organic?
     
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    eventdomain

  • #63
    sirearl said:
    Not quite you did mean to say thats what products are for.?;)

    Earl
    Click to expand...

    I know what I said thanks.

    the majority of clicks (paid for / organic) are next to useless
    Click to expand...

    I said that their useless clicks, so they must be useless when its the wrong visitor type. I reckon its based on people 'checking out' websites, and also due to untargeted link placement. If someone sent you to the wrong website, you won't stick about for long, bcos you want the right product or whatever.

    that statement leads to the assumption that 30% of clicks result in a conversion
    Click to expand...

    No, that statement means 74% of clicks are not going to result in a conversion.
     
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    Colin Parker

  • #66
    UKSBD said:
    The problem is, that all takes time.

    Someone sends a request for SEO work, first thing you have to do is check out their existing site, quick keyword analysis and competition analysis, then send a proposal and price.

    This may take an hour or two, you send them back a price saying £800 a month, only to get a reply saying they have only allowed £20 a month.

    Had you known right from the start they only had £20 a month budget, you would have saved all this time.
    Click to expand...

    An interesting thread which highlights a business/marketing classic ...

    You must ALWAYS decide exactly who your target customer is, evaluate what their wants and needs are, anticipate their objections, have a USP over your competitors and a compelling reason why your target customer should do business with you.

    Armed with that direction and information you must then decide how you will market to that target customer, but guess what ...

    Most businesses ... including SEO's as proven in this thread ... don't do this basic marketing exercise.

    That's why we are getting posts like the above ...

    If you offer a SEO service and you are not prepared to/cannot achieve results for less than say £200 a month ... and you don't want to 'waste time' trying to upsell the uninitiated ... then a) advertise that your service starts from £200 a month, b) market to businesses who are more likely to pay £200+ per month and c) have some damn good proof that businesses who pay you £200+ a month get oodles of profit back in return.

    If you don't do a) b) or c) ... the clown isn't the guy who wants to spend £20 a month ... you are the clown for having a marketing strategy that consistently pulls in the wrong type of customer.

    But ... surely SEO is all about optimising relevant keywords that deliver the target customer to your client?

    So, if any SEO is consistently complaining about getting the wrong type of enquiries it tells me a lot ...

    If he can't market his own business correctly ... how the hell is he going to SEO/market mine?

    Colin Parker
     
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    matt.chatterley

  • #67
    RedEvo said:
    I would suggest most business people are confused at best and by enlarge clueless. This is why the less than scrupulous SEO companies prosper. They play on it.

    We prefer to educate but I know we lose work as a result of 'telling it like it is'.

    d
    Click to expand...

    And it's not just SEO - thats a good summary of a lot of 'technical' areas, really. We also tend to hear "Oh. No. We don't need a specification written - we just want you to build X - it'll be fine...." now and then :)

    (Granted for v. small projects a formal spec isn't always essential, but some of these have been quite substantial)!

    Some people respond well to a truthful approach and appreciate it - but quite a lot (particularly when it comes to things like SEO) simply head off to find someone who will give them the 'right' answer (e.g. the one they want).
     
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    eventdomain

  • #75
    Stretchy said:
    I'm intrigued, what would we need a degree in to understand your business?If you dont mind me asking:)
    Click to expand...


    Ofcourse, for starters my business is actually in the Event industry and for that you need a diploma to enter the sector these days.

    I was also a Manager, and thus hold a second Diploma in management studies and a third diploma in Business Administration.

    That's why, actually I would have gained a fourth Diploma, but dropped out of college.
     
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    eventdomain

  • #80
    ONEPORTFOLIO said:
    No - insufficient interest.

    Colin Parker
    Click to expand...

    I think you better take a look at this:

    8. Meeting Planner
    Employment of meeting and convention planners is expected to grow faster than the average for all professions over the next decade or so. The number of jobs planners hold is forecast to jump 16 percent, thanks to the growing importance of meetings to increasingly global companies.
    Click to expand...


    http://finance.yahoo.com/career-wor...careers-of-2010?mod=career-salary_negotiation
     
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