Why Seo and Linkbuilding fails for most sites

[Hospitality_king]

Following on of my Seo thread, there are obvious facotors to how you can tell of unsuccess of Seo work on websites:

1. the copying of each others keywords for mass spamming
2. Use of rediculous low traffic free submit forms, forums and blogs

Sole trader websites are not up to the job ofr self-promotion success, as there of the wrong type of website for building content and links, so will fail every time.

Fact that owners think there 20 page site can compete with a 1000 page site is bad enough, and that amounbt of content is considreed quite small, but then to argue and assume there can beat a 50k content pages site is insane. But such lunatic obvious exist so dont listen to them.


Why Seo fails is very transparant - Seo gets hired, takes the money but fails to reveal how links are obtained or whats worse where your links get placed... See link quality is key to any success and seems to be reasonable to know where your site is placed online, so any Seo that wont tel, you or send you a list is to be avoided, and many wont go to the effort of inform clients cos it too much hassle when their apamming out the links.



In-direct Seo (Agency spam)


Linkbuilding to the Seo agent it's "spreading the word" but to publishers it's junk spam that affects their website quality and revenue - so to disallow it is a no-brainer. That means untarget links must cancel themselves out to nothing. The Seo loses every time for those in the know and just needs some effort to win the war. The useless comms these Seos send out is laughable and no longer works as why would anyone fall for it, but is another thread entirely.


Ofcourse on subject of link quality swaps just to confirm its failure rate - a 'link partner deal' the deal must be fair, but its not and at some point the Seos got to realise why would a site that has 1000s of visitors a day do a deal with sites that get just 10k visitors a year? You gotta be an insane nutter to even consider this, to give away such an advantage is crazy.



Direct Seo

what the Seos want to saying is 'why you should link back to us' - but instead their comms are really saying is 'why you shouldnt be linking to us' cos when you visit such sites we link builded you to (if you are that stupid in first place) the sites are the biggest trashy built, content-less eyesores ever, so the Seos email work has just failed and wasted their time. You then discover some crap deep links page where your wonderful link will reside - mmmm, nice!

See you got to look at the goal of a website - most sites must get clickthroughs that lead to sales - so rankings wont ever provide enough traffic directly to boost sales, maybe the odd 3 or 4 new clients a month, but with only maybe 10k of visitors per year, conversion will be very low - and with the crap link quality the Seo agents provide, its a bad time in store for many.



Search dependent businesses


Search dependent businesses are short term, cos they cant exist like down to not being 'content' natural, its impossible for a flower sellers site to be equal to a search type website even with a product database (come view my lovely flowers) - they arent the same types and cannot ever be taken seriously as the same. So trying to be the same linkwise is unworkable.



Facts about true link building:


1. You are the only ones who can do this as you are the site owner, and hopefully know where you like your links to be. As owner - you can control your link working output, and such maintain quality.

2. Linkbuilding agents/services are all con artists and a waste of money - dont trust them.

3. The ONLY good link are link that sends conversion visitors to your website. Unlike Serps positions - these links will stay in place for years - they wont fluctuate so their effect is maintained.

 

[webgeek]

Facts about true link building:


1. You are the only ones who can do this as you are the site owner, and hopefully know where you like your links to be. As owner - you can control your link working output, and such maintain quality.

2. Linkbuilding agents/services are all con artists and a waste of money - dont trust them.

3. The ONLY good link are link that sends conversion visitors to your website. Unlike Serps positions - these links will stay in place for years - they wont fluctuate so their effect is maintained.

These Facts about true link building should be corrected. These are the Myths about link building and are false, false, and more false.

Not ever visit is supposed to convert in the traditional sense of buy, download or sign-up. Sure it would be nice, but brand building, demand gen, new product introductions, teasers, validation, secondary authority, trust - all are goals that are not considered conversions but have value.

The majority of top sites in highly competitive niches are only top sites because of the link work done which supplemented their on-page optimisation.

Site owners do not have to be SEO gurus. Their job is to run their business successfully, manage operations, perhaps drive sales and clean the loo - depending on how big their staff levels are at the moment. A reputable marketing/SEO practitioner can do the bulk of the work, be aware of the backlinks and manage others. They wouldn't need to be link-builders either - they just need to know how and where to acquire them.

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Link work isn't voodoo, shouldn't be done in the dark without anything revealed about where they are put or the content surrounding the links and should be managed by someone with a clue. Unfortunately, the average site owner is not equipped to oversee this effectively, because some unscrupulous link builders can use smoke and mirrors to disguise their efforts.

Link builders are no different from roofing installers or auto mechanics. A good one is worth their weight in gold, can make your life pain-free (in one aspect anyway) and should be expected to explain what they will do and what it will cost before they do it, then confirm what they did after the fact. You can't hope to be able to do any of their jobs as well as they can, particularly if you don't like html, heights or petroleum distillates.

You do what you do best and let them do what they do best!

 

[Elliottc26]

There is also the idea that link building is old school and dead. In part, it is, if you're thinking about past practices (and spamming isn't effective link building). However, there is still value when link building is done well - relevant + quality = good.

But number of links is worthless. Sites with a lower PA and DA can rank higher than those with higher PA and DA for instance.

So, quality and relevance matters (think signals). SEO tends to lean more toward content marketing, UX, industry connections, and technical these days.

 

[Hospitality_king]

The majority of top sites in highly competitive niches are only top sites because of the link work done

False - you are so wrong and is why Seo and linkbuilding has abad name at is hass. One of our sites was built on pure content only - not one link was chased by us, and we got 40k of one-ways point our way for no effort expend on our part - that why you and others are sadly wrong - so that's the first proof.

2nd proof is most serious and best part of proof you can get. K - to get quality link for clients needs a reason for the content site to give out the link right, so question is what has some low-life Seo got to exchange in return for a link on a million traffic site - lets see you get out of that one friend.

I'm gonna say that Seo agent dudes hasn't got squat to make it worthwhile of getting a free link. You got to have some benefit to get benefit back and even more so to take the risk of request a total free link off a monster site - god seos arrogance offends me much And what has client got to say in this? it is after all there site being used as spam fodder rght? What they think when they find out site been put on a trash 5 page blog with no link profile - that drive us nuts and then complain big time I tell ya....

Seo freelancers wont get on to quality sites - just accept this and quit.

So, quality and relevance matters

but you guys never going to see such quality - so why do Seos lie to people. If you think you haven't been sussed out since the web began, they live in cloud cookoo land, people are so wise to the bs of Seo now - and more the Seos bang on about tech talk and what Google is doing etc - don't fool the educated into become clients of theirs.

You know that behind every website is a fully qualified designers right - you think site owners don't chat bout Seo with their designer and get advise this way - course they do lol - 50% of their Seo is done already included with the price of web design or in design is a manager system to aloow owners to Diy themselves - noone needs seo consultants no more. So onsite seo consultantcy is dead.

Now we just got to wait while free linkbuilding dies off - shouldn't be long to go. Several factors that Google has done proves it - penalties to comment sections, blogs and Yell pages type directories - ie non-specific b2bs sites, not target links is bad bad way friend..

We get request all the time for article submits - this seemed at one pint to be the new link exchange thing, but now this is a joke, no metter how written a article is, its not about words or expert knowledge - its about whats in it for the other bloke, this is all that matters cos it about traffic and quality traffic so you get conversion, it not about egotist writing.

 

[Hospitality_king]

However, there is still value when link building is done well - relevant + quality = good.

Yeah - but sole trader site is wrong type for house content. So no content means no reason for other to want to link out - got to be that benefit in return, cant change human nature and want something back, it only fair..

 

[StevePoster]

Why SEO and linkbuilding fails for most sites? The reason is that the SEO practitioner doesn't even know the needs of every website and these are not the same because every site needs different SEO process.

 

[ChrisGoodfellow]

As an editor, I'm on the raw end of bad link builders every single day. In spite of our efforts to check new members our comments and blog section get hit regularly. I understand the new penguin update means that the links will have to be relevant to have any positive effect (most of them come in from things like essay writing services), hopefully this will help.

 

[fisicx]

I've been a UKBF member for donkey's years and never even knew there was a blog section!

Just had a look and it just seems to be a load of self promo posts - so you can easily see why it would be attractive to SEO spammers.

 

[ChrisGoodfellow]

@fisicx I was talking about BusinessZone.

http://www.businesszone.co.uk/community-voice/blogs

 

[fisicx]

OK, but I can't look at the blog for more than a few seconds because I can't get rid of the full screen 'Sign me up' thing. I click to close and it keeps coming back. Again and again and again.

But the bits I did manage to see were the same. Mostly self promo-posts which makes them attractive to SEO and other spammers. That's why it's a constant struggle. Remove the links from the posts and they lose their attraction.

 

[Hospitality_king]

So, quality and relevance matters (think signals). SEO tends to lean more toward content marketing, UX, industry connections, and technical these days.

That fails, as even top sites has hard time controlling spam, and for most other sites content buiding is not option, never mnind quality content, you need masses of it to win the game.

See me theory bout Seos is they all got a giant list of sites right... and post client links to this - but all these sites wont be million plus traffic websites, as such owners wont never deal with low life and low level parasites, as the client links are off taget - make sense yes? If you owned such a huge site, you wont want bad links on it as it brings your site down a notch in quality terms, and quality is your traffic magnet.

So Seos are buggered there.

 

[Elliottc26]

That fails, as even top sites has hard time controlling spam, and for most other sites content buiding is not option, never mnind quality content, you need masses of it to win the game.

See me theory bout Seos is they all got a giant list of sites right... and post client links to this - but all these sites wont be million plus traffic websites, as such owners wont never deal with low life and low level parasites, as the client links are off taget - make sense yes? If you owned such a huge site, you wont want bad links on it as it brings your site down a notch in quality terms, and quality is your traffic magnet.

So Seos are buggered there.

It's apparent you really do not have a clue what you are talking about. Your theory is actually called, "Paranoia-induced guess work".

You need to stop "flaming" and "gaslighting" as it adds nothing to any discussion you're posting in.

 

[Hospitality_king]

It's apparent you really do not have a clue what you are talking about. Your theory is actually called, "Paranoia-induced guess work".

How is keeping a site's quality for the user - somehow translate into a guesswork? Quality not matter anymore to searchers? Ofcourse these parasites got a list - its easier way to keep their spam work efforts down.

U are Seo and PPC worker? U no get any business from my clients now, and we are talking of 1000's Yu lose....

 

[searchangel]

This is so wrong. As someone who used to work as an SEO all rounder but now only does link building, it's fairly insulting to say ALL of us are a waste of time and money.

I only ever build white hat links, and to say it's a waste is an insult to the amount of time I actually put into my work.

 

[rf-harris]

It is mainly because the person doing SEO or link building focuses more on quantity of the backlinks than the quality which is more important. Building 10 high quality backlinks are certainly more effective than building hundreds of low quality backlinks.

 

[Hospitality_king]

It is mainly because the person doing SEO or link building focuses more on quantity of the backlinks than the quality which is more important.

Ahhh - that's the 3rd reason of my criteria - lets deal with the first.

The 3 reasons why link building fails:


1. False promises to the clients

2. Unathorised spamming of publishers sites

3 SEos will be refused entry from quality and high traffic sites


If the Seos cant guarantee quality or good traffic flow for clients (which they cant) - then they are claiming to provide service that will never be delivered. and that is lying and theft, a con job - and they should never take the money in first place.

Seos simply hide behind the excuse that "we cannot guarantee positions of ranking" - and fhink it will protect em form the backlash of angry clients who got ripped off. Its a disgusting practise, so don't lie to clients or make out they can do a job when they cant get the results and its out of their control cos any results is total controlled by publishing sites and engines and that's life.

always buy advertising and links direct from the steis emselves - never hire agants to do this cos you get spammed to loads of low quality blogs and open forms that are very bad, and the good sites will always delete the links, costing the clients much ££££.that they paid to the Seo agent. pusl clients will got enterd into a separate contract by the Seo with the publisher owned site and that will be law contract that client is now cant get out of.

As the law becomes clearer, the Seo industry will colampse as more seo clients get sued for breach of contract with publisher, while the seo agent gets to walk away leaving there client to face the Courts sytems

 

[Matt.WD]

Is it not just a case of you get what you pay for? If you use the lower end providers, you're probably going to end up with rubbish. Whereas more reputable SEO firms that cost a lot more, are more likely to deliver?

 

[searchangel]

Is it not just a case of you get what you pay for? If you use the lower end providers, you're probably going to end up with rubbish. Whereas more reputable SEO firms that cost a lot more, are more likely to deliver?

Yeah, this guy has probably paid someone £100 for 1000s of links and now is having a rant about all link builders.

I will only work with clients who pay £1,000 a month minimum, and that's for around 15 links, and none of them go anywhere low quality. OP doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

[Hospitality_king]

Yeah, this guy has probably paid someone £100 for 1000s of links and now is having a rant about all link builders.

OP doesn't know what he's talking about.

Really, I get 5000 free links every 3 month - for nothing while you mentioned u only deliver 15 to your clients - for wot u say is quality/ wich I serious doubt btw... as I got knowledge of website systems you don't possess, and why I think that is your link numbers that tell the story alone, without other factors been involved here.

I get 500k of visitor to just one of my 4 sites man, So woy u get in a year traffic wise - I get in 1 single day day and I dont pay no £1000 for thoe links either... smart or what....

and I bet at leats 50 of those 500 are quality - high quality references to my sites, so wot u think bout that man? People spend £££ on links for the wrong services dude - they got it all wrong and keep doing it this way for past years.... they never learn.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Why would i have links so that customers can click on them and be taken away from my site, which seems to go against all the things i do to get them onto my site in the first place

 

[Hospitality_king]

they just need to know how and where to acquire them.

I don't believe in that hogwasy - its all lies design to sell their service.

 

[Hospitality_king]

Why would i have links so that customers can click on them and be taken away from my site, which seems to go against all the things i do to get them onto my site in the first place

But people are wise to it and so doesn't work anymore.. Youd never pay for seo agent to do this, at least not sane people anyway

 

[searchangel]

Really, I get 5000 free links every 3 month - for nothing while you mentioned u only deliver 15 to your clients - for wot u say is quality/ wich I serious doubt btw... as I got knowledge of website systems you don't possess, and why I think that is your link numbers that tell the story alone, without other factors been involved here.

I get 500k of visitor to just one of my 4 sites man, So woy u get in a year traffic wise - I get in 1 single day day and I dont pay no £1000 for thoe links either... smart or what....

and I bet at leats 50 of those 500 are quality - high quality references to my sites, so wot u think bout that man? People spend £££ on links for the wrong services dude - they got it all wrong and keep doing it this way for past years.... they never learn.

How do you know I don't possess them? I've been working in SEO for years, I just much prefer the link building side of things so I only focus on that.

And you doubt the quality of the links I get yet you don't know anything about what I do. If you class national news outlets and universities as low quality then you're right.

I'm doubtful about your claims to having that much traffic and getting that many links to your site. We can all be really successful on a web forum with no proof, but if I were managing a site with that much traffic, I wouldn't be spending my time belittling people on internet forums.

 

[searchangel]

Why would i have links so that customers can click on them and be taken away from my site, which seems to go against all the things i do to get them onto my site in the first place

Always use target="blank" so a new window opens

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Sorry that's rubbish what ever you do they have left your site and very poor chance they come back, you follow a link hoping it leads you closer to your requirement

I have also never understood that Google with its years of knowledge of most sites, that they would place any importance to such a easily manipulated thing as links to raise the score on a site

 

[fisicx]

But people are wise to it and so doesn't work anymore.. Youd never pay for seo agent to do this, at least not sane people anyway

You are eventdomain aren't you. It's the same old stuff he used to spout. And when I say he, I mean you.

 

[Hospitality_king]

I'm doubtful about your claims to having that much traffic and getting that many links to your site. We can all be really successful on a web forum with no proof, but if I were managing a site with that much traffic, I wouldn't be spending my time belittling people on internet forums.

like others I give my time on here for free, I don't get paid for advising on forums, so it really annoys me when a few attack me when I give my time in helping them.

If u come on forum and admit in a post that u only get 15 quality links of power for each client, then that sound like jus a small timer (no offense) - if it more than that in links - you should say that or people will assume u aren't that good, ofcoursr cos u said obly 15 links, I took that as the truth.

How do you know I don't possess them? I've been working in SEO for years

Er cos I own technology that blocks out linkbuilders - so that hhow I knows exactly how to stop guys like u. linkbuilders assume they have the right to annoy and spam others without paying for it. the cheek and arrogance of Seos today - their chancers - tryig got get advantage for free off of what others have built up - that not promotion, its theft man - theft...

 

[BDLtd]

lol 5k free links a month?! Sounds legit xD

 

[Hospitality_king]

lol 5k free links a month?! Sounds legit xD

All free to boot - lovely so don't care if say 4000 of those links are naff - cos other 800 will be targeted.. Course - my maion traffic is complete word of mouth.

 

[Hospitality_king]

Actually, SEO does not fail

Yes it does - all the time. I spent 20k building a site, to just prove the very point of just how much it failed profit-wise.

Although I enured it excelled in other areas like traffic, members, award wins and even got it into media. I been there, done it and got tee shirt friend.. I never Seo my sites beyond on-site stuff, cos my sites always do very well in natural traffic return - actually, huge seo spend would be risk for us compared to better options like Apps, free links and media.

 

[searchangel]

Yes it does - all the time. I spent 20k building a site, to just prove the very point of just how much it failed profit-wise.

Although I enured it excelled in other areas like traffic, members, award wins and even got it into media. I been there, done it and got tee shirt friend.. I never Seo my sites beyond on-site stuff, cos my sites always do very well in natural traffic return - actually, huge seo spend would be risk for us compared to better options like Apps, free links and media.

SEO didn't fail, you did.

 

[Hospitality_king]

SEO didn't fail, you did.

Not quite - as we made $16k off it, so not too bad for a non seo site - plus site could makes that again over next few years, then there the sale of mit on top too. Mes could be lookin at a further $130k lol.

 

[searchangel]

Course you could mate

 

[BDLtd]

Lol something tells me you bought those 4 sites from somewhere like Flippa, if they do exist, and are struggling to maintain the initial revenue. You hired a dodgy SEO company to help you out, maybe several of them through a lack of commercial & technical knowledge, they let you down so now you write ranty posts about how terrible SEO is as a result....to people that are all making honest and successful livings doing the very thing you claim doesn't work xD

Those thousands of links you get a month are probably why SEO isn't working for you btw. No way that's a good thing, especially if you think only 10% are of any quality xD

 

[searchangel]

he's full of it mate. I'm sure he's a troll

 

[fisicx]

Not quite - as we made $16k off it, so not too bad for a non seo site - plus site could makes that again over next few years, then there the sale of mit on top too. Mes could be lookin at a further $130k lol.

Anyone here care to translate this.

I'm still convinced he is EventDomain. Especially as he avoids answering the question. The BS is the same as ED used to post.

 

[searchangel]

he's an ass. How do you report something? I haven't seen anything constructive come from him, just insulting the industry. Why is he on a forum if he hates the industry so much.

 

[Hospitality_king]

How would you be able to find my website when I haven't posted the domain on here? You actually need serious professional help.

Chill out man

Pretty easy actually - I checked your company name in your link profile (Search Angel). So what's your uniform resource locator man?

 

[BDLtd]

Lol he can barely type yet manages four websites, I would love to see one of them especially the one with the thousands of links... I wonder why SEO isnt working for him?! Derp

 

[searchangel]

Lol, I was going to start my own company called search angel a few years back but I didn't have the time.

Constantly being condescending and making assumptions. Generally not adding anything to the conversation .Unless you actually prove that what you are saying is true I will be using the blocking option on here.

I've been around the block for a few years and there's always been one absolute guarantee. People who talk the way you do will never be a success.