Web design pricing structure research

[AndyJames2018]

1. How on Earth could you have been in the industry for 25 years and not understand pricing?
2. Read a book called The E-Myth.

Paul.

Working as a web developer doesn't have anything at all to do with pricing work. I was fully employed !!

 

[AndyJames2018]

The best move I made was joining the Chamber of Trade and then sitting on the committee. I network with a lot of people in the digital space (photographers, copywriters, SEO experts, etc.) That's where a lot of my referrals come from. This has all lead to local council and university websites and I get referrals from my connections there. Reputation is everything.

Sometimes you make your own luck. A council website was hacked some years ago. I alerted a copywriter I knew who had contacts at the council. They weren't satisfied with the response from their developer and allowed me to fix the site. Then they asked me to rebuild the site so that they would be able to add content themselves easily. Now I manage that site and two others I've built for them.

I don't necessarily agree with going niche in this business. I think you could limit your potential. However, starting with local businesses to build a portfolio and pricing accordingly can work.

I think the Chanber of Trade was a good move. This is going to slow moving I reckon and will gain traction over time. I do want to get my procing structure right from the get-go though.

 

[AndyJames2018]

How about turning the question on it's head.
What are your business / picing models?
What services do you offer (if it's allowed to post that info on here)?
From what I'm seeing, the market needs some structure to it.
I had quotes recently for landscaping and all six quotes were within £500 of each other.
You just don't see that for this service.
Just a thought.
Andy

 

[AndyJames2018]

Thanks everyone who replied. I think i've got the gist of what is offered out there.
Nothing seems to have changed much in the past 20 years or so.
Some good advice, some bad. Didn't really get the answer I was after but thats ok.
Good luck everyone.
Andy

Forgot to ask the crucial question. Is it working for you or are you a busy fool?

 

[Shopclicks]

From what I'm seeing, the market needs some structure to it.

There's far too much difference in the quality of work being produced for that to happen. The problem stems from the fact that websites are a mystery to many clients and they don't know the right questions to ask.

When it comes to something like landscaping, it's your garden, and you know what you want. It's easy to ask the right questions and give clear instructions about what you want.

 

[AndyJames2018]

There's far too much difference in the quality of work being produced for that to happen. The problem stems from the fact that websites are a mystery to many clients and they don't know the right questions to ask.

When it comes to something like landscaping, it's your garden, and you know what you want. It's easy to ask the right questions and give clear instructions about what you want.

You are right Shopclicks. I guess other services such as print design or infact many other design services would suffer the same problems.

 

[Shopclicks]

I guess other services such as print design or infact many other design services would suffer the same problems.

I have a client I'm building a site for at the moment. It's a brochure site. The client wants the Tesla site. He wants the look, the layout, the fonts, the snap scroll, everything Tesla. He manufactures Tiny Homes. He is going to pay a lot more for his site than someone who wants me to design their site.

"You want the Tesla site?"
"Yes"
"How much do you think Elon paid for his website?"
"No idea, how much is this going to cost me?"

To be honest, he's a web developer's dream client. He's not paying £500.

 

[fisicx]

What are your business / picing models?
What services do you offer (if it's allowed to post that info on here)?

I price each project based on the amount of work I need to do.

I build word press plugins. Today I did one plugin update for £90 and got started on a second plugin that will earn me £1500.

 

[AndyJames2018]

I have a client I'm building a site for at the moment. It's a brochure site. The client wants the Tesla site. He wants the look, the layout, the fonts, the snap scroll, everything Tesla. He manufactures Tiny Homes. He is going to pay a lot more for his site than someone who wants me to design their site.

"You want the Tesla site?"
"Yes"
"How much do you think Elon paid for his website?"
"No idea, how much is this going to cost me?"

To be honest, he's a web developer's dream client. He's not paying £500.

I get ya - Of course, if a client asks for all the bells and whistles there is a price to pay for that. A £500 brochure style website is just that and acts as a hook to get the cliet/s interested. If the client wants more than a simple 3/4 page standard brochure site, the offer is there. However, if the client wants a complex 'brocure site' then a bespoke quote is the way to go.
What I'm trying to do is build some business sense into what I offer. It is a business after all.
I've learned my past mistakes where I ended up working for virtually nothing.
Thanks for your input
Andy

 

[AndyJames2018]

I price each project based on the amount of work I need to do.

I build word press plugins. Today I did one plugin update for £90 and got started on a second plugin that will earn me £1500.

Hi fisicx - Are these bespoke plugins or are the available for everyone to install? How much effor do you have to put in to keep them updated and secure etc?
Andy

 

[fisicx]

Hi fisicx - Are these bespoke plugins or are the available for everyone to install? How much effor do you have to put in to keep them updated and secure etc?
Andy

Both.

The free ones are approved and hosted by Wordpress. They have an upgrade option which brings in regular cash.

Users then get in contact for custom work.

Not a huge effort to keep them updated and secure. And very lucrative.

There are 7million installs of woo commerce. Suppose you have a premium plugin for woo and you get 0.1% of those woo users installing your plugin. That’s 7000 installs. £10/year subscription is £70,000 per year. From just one plugin.

 

[AndyJames2018]

Both.

The free ones are approved and hosted by Wordpress. They have an upgrade option which brings in regular cash.

Users then get in contact for custom work.

Not a huge effort to keep them updated and secure. And very lucrative.

There are 7million installs of woo commerce. Suppose you have a premium plugin for woo and you get 0.1% of those woo users installing your plugin. That’s 7000 installs. £10/year subscription is £70,000 per year. From just one plugin.

Yep - I see where you're coming from and thanks for replying.
Thank you
Andy

 

[fisicx]

It’s a decent way to get a passive income. Mine earn me around £200/week without lifting a finger. Don’t have to deal with clients, no endless emails and chasing up. It’s wonderful.

The big money comes from the custom work. The clients in this case are easy to deal with as it’s all code and css. No content creation, images to procure or site structures to worry about. You just deliver a plugin they install on their site.

 

[Birmingham]

it totally depends what kind of people you are networking with.

are you friends with managers / directors of medium to large businesses? if so you can charge 20-50k a pop.

if you're very friendly with small to medium size business owners, you can charge 1k-5k a time depending if it's a brochure style site or an ecommerce style site etc.

are you dealing with small businesses who you aren't so friendly with? if so you may struggle to sell for 100 pound a month.

totally depends who you're networking with and how friendly you are with them. or how strong is your other sales channel.

do you have a very strong cold-calling department? if so you'll make a lot of sales around 100 a month, and a few in the 4 figures occasionally.

do you have a top-ranking website for web design in your local town, or are you investing in a ppc campaign to target these searches? if so you'll probably be looking at 3 figures for a brochureware site and 4-5 figures for an ecommerce site depending how large and advanced it is and how strong are your testimonials, client list, sales pitch & reputation etc.

 

[NickZ]

Also depends how good you are, there is not only webdesign, design of pictures, making those lighter. setting all tags, having a structure which differes from a corner store and so on.
DIY might be good to get some practice, lean on the design people have which are longer in business.

 

[seaj1one]

Thanks everyone who replied. I think i've got the gist of what is offered out there.
Nothing seems to have changed much in the past 20 years or so.
Some good advice, some bad. Didn't really get the answer I was after but thats ok.
Good luck everyone.
Andy

Hello @AndyJames2018

I'll be starting web development next year. Just getting my skills up first.

There's a YouTube channel that I following and it's Kevin Geary. He talks about pricing. As I'll be new, my aim is to get a min of £500 for a one page website. With that the customer will need to setup their google my business page or complete a questionnaire and I'll set it up for £100.

Regarding hosting, I plan to charge £40 a month min, which includes website maintenance, i.e. updating plugins, creating backups, google search console and CloudFlare (free). The customer has to have hosting with me.

If a customer wants any more pages, I'll be happy to do the about, contact us and service page for between £150 - £200. Initially, I won't be touching e-comm as it's a beast in itself.

If customer wanted to dominate an area, I'll be looking to charge a discovery. How much I charge will depend on how much they say in terms of expected revenue, but starting at £250. If they don't know their expected revenue, they don't know their business therefore, I can't do a discovery. If I can't do a discovery, I can't move forward.

The discovery allows me to scope out the whole project and give a final price. It's the most important part. I do plan on starting with a one page to demonstrate what I can do but also as a way in.

A rough guide is:

• Create custom post type for each service - £200 per service.
• Custom post type for each service area - £200 per service. It could be by county, city or region. It depends on what people are searching for.
• Customer always supply images but if I do the copywriting, I'll charge £100 per page. I'll be upfront and say that I'm not a copywriter. I'd recommend getting one and I'll charge depending on the rates of a copywriter.

I see if that we are here to help business thrive. Customer can choose how many pages they want based on their budget and my proposed site map. As the company grows, I believe we can too. As an example, if you charge £100 per month for hosting, but the customers generate £5000 of business, to the customer it's worth it.

I can afford to turn down business as I have a full time job but the one thing that I learned from Kevin Geary is that it's all about how much revenue you can generate for the customer, not how much you are charging them.

 

[fisicx]

@seaj1one - those prices are way above what most small businesses will want to pay. £40/month for hosting is crazy expensive even with those extras you are offering.

Good luck with your new business but I think you will struggle to get many good leads.

 

[Birmingham]

plus retention will be poor as soon as a client's mate tells him how easy it is to make a new page for free in wordpress

 

[seaj1one]

Hello @AndyJames2018

I'll be starting web development next year. Just getting my skills up first.

There's a YouTube channel that I following and it's Kevin Geary. He talks about pricing. As I'll be new, my aim is to get a min of £500 for a one page website. With that the customer will need to setup their google my business page or complete a questionnaire and I'll set it up for £100.

Regarding hosting, I plan to charge £40 a month min, which includes website maintenance, i.e. updating plugins, creating backups, google search console and CloudFlare (free). The customer has to have hosting with me.

If a customer wants any more pages, I'll be happy to do the about, contact us and service page for between £150 - £200. Initially, I won't be touching e-comm as it's a beast in itself.

If customer wanted to dominate an area, I'll be looking to charge a discovery. How much I charge will depend on how much they say in terms of expected revenue, but starting at £250. If they don't know their expected revenue, they don't know their business therefore, I can't do a discovery. If I can't do a discovery, I can't move forward.

The discovery allows me to scope out the whole project and give a final price. It's the most important part. I do plan on starting with a one page to demonstrate what I can do but also as a way in.

A rough guide is:

• Create custom post type for each service - £200 per service.
• Custom post type for each service area - £200 per service. It could be by county, city or region. It depends on what people are searching for.
• Customer always supply images but if I do the copywriting, I'll charge £100 per page. I'll be upfront and say that I'm not a copywriter. I'd recommend getting one and I'll charge depending on the rates of a copywriter.

I see if that we are here to help business thrive. Customer can choose how many pages they want based on their budget and my proposed site map. As the company grows, I believe we can too. As an example, if you charge £100 per month for hosting, but the customers generate £5000 of business, to the customer it's worth it.

I can afford to turn down business as I have a full time job but the one thing that I learned from Kevin Geary is that it's all about how much revenue you can generate for the customer, not how much you are charging them.

Just to add, I haven't covered all the costs of my plugins that I use but it's a start. I would also look at Bricks.io or Builderius if you are using some of the builders like Elementor or divi. It will allow you to charge more and it's on a LTD.

Accessibility is a big thing and will become a ranking factor. You can charge to make the site accessible. As the 2 builders don't add extra divs for things like h1 tag, the performance is not an issue. You can also point out that your competitors use h6. If someone uses a h6, there would need to be a good reason.

One thing that I do plan on doing is giving away a cheat sheet on how to maintain your site. They provide their email address and name and I get a lead. When they see what we do, I figure they will convert as a customer. All that I'm doing is educating the customer.

 

[fisicx]

@seaj1one - that's a very confusing and inaccurate post. If you do start building sites and want to charge the customer because you plan to use Elementor you need to rethink your whole strategy.

An people will not give you an email address to get a cheat sheet - not when there are already thousands of free resources.

Methinks Kevin Gearey is talking a load of BS.

 

[seaj1one]

@seaj1one - those prices are way above what most small businesses will want to pay. £40/month for hosting is crazy expensive even with those extras you are offering.

Good luck with your new business but I think you will struggle to get many good leads.

I'm happy with those prices. I feel that web developers either provide sub standard service or are not charging enough. Simple as that.

 

[seaj1one]

plus retention will be poor as soon as a client's mate tells him how easy it is to make a new page for free in wordpress

It's easy to make a page but not responsive or up to standards. Otherwise there will be no market. People who want to use a free WordPress theme, I'm not interested in. This is the point. Why target those who don't want a web developer?

 

[seaj1one]

@seaj1one - that's a very confusing and inaccurate post. If you do start building sites and want to charge the customer because you plan to use Elementor you need to rethink your whole strategy.

An people will not give you an email address to get a cheat sheet - not when there are already thousands of free resources.

Methinks Kevin Gearey is talking a load of BS.

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean. I have no intention of using Elementor. In turns of my proposed cheat sheet. While there are thousands out there in the world, there are not thousands within a radius of a mile from me. That is the beauty of local SEO. So my strategy is just fine and Kevin Gearey makes sense.

My question to you is, are you here to give practice and modern advice or not? I read a lot of the chain and you went from web design/development to plugin.

What where the problems that you faced that made you so anti web design/development?

 

[Shopclicks]

People who want to use a free WordPress theme, I'm not interested in. This is the point. Why target those who don't want a web developer?

I don't think you have any idea how this industry works. University of YouTube?

 

[seaj1one]

I don't think you have any idea how this industry works. University of YouTube?

Based on what I said, what's missing?

 

[Shopclicks]

Based on what I said, what's missing?

Experience.

 

[seaj1one]

Experience.

Is there anything tangible that you can say? Can you break down my post to what you disagree with and say why please?

 

[seaj1one]

@seaj1one - that's a very confusing and inaccurate post. If you do start building sites and want to charge the customer because you plan to use Elementor you need to rethink your whole strategy.

An people will not give you an email address to get a cheat sheet - not when there are already thousands of free resources.

Methinks Kevin Gearey is talking a load of BS.

Also, can you share good quality resource that people can use?

 

[seaj1one]

Also depends how good you are, there is not only webdesign, design of pictures, making those lighter. setting all tags, having a structure which differes from a corner store and so on.
DIY might be good to get some practice, lean on the design people have which are longer in business.

Totally agree ?

 

[Shopclicks]

Is there anything tangible that you can say? Can you break down my post to what you disagree with and say why please?

I'm not going to pull your posts apart on someone else's thread. If you want to talk about your own plans, start your own thread.

 

[seaj1one]

it totally depends what kind of people you are networking with.

are you friends with managers / directors of medium to large businesses? if so you can charge 20-50k a pop.

if you're very friendly with small to medium size business owners, you can charge 1k-5k a time depending if it's a brochure style site or an ecommerce style site etc.

are you dealing with small businesses who you aren't so friendly with? if so you may struggle to sell for 100 pound a month.

totally depends who you're networking with and how friendly you are with them. or how strong is your other sales channel.

do you have a very strong cold-calling department? if so you'll make a lot of sales around 100 a month, and a few in the 4 figures occasionally.

do you have a top-ranking website for web design in your local town, or are you investing in a ppc campaign to target these searches? if so you'll probably be looking at 3 figures for a brochureware site and 4-5 figures for an ecommerce site depending how large and advanced it is and how strong are your testimonials, client list, sales pitch & reputation etc.

I'm also with you there. It so depends on the customer.

 

[seaj1one]

I'm not going to pull your posts apart on someone else's thread. If you want to talk about your own plans, start your own thread.

I'm sharing my thoughts to help with the original question regarding pricing and sharing my thoughts. The person who submitted the question felt that his question was not answered. Having read the whole feed, I see why he feels that way.

 

[Shopclicks]

I'm sharing my thoughts to help with the original question regarding pricing and sharing my thoughts. The person who submitted the question felt that his question was not answered. Having read the whole feed, I see why he feels that way.

Don't expect everyone to agree with your thoughts. I'll give you one example:

People who want to use a free WordPress theme, I'm not interested in.

That is ridiculous. I have 50+ websites built on free themes. Why charge a client for something they don't need?

 

[seaj1one]

Don't expect everyone to agree with your thoughts. I'll give you one example:


That is ridiculous. I have 50+ websites built on free themes. Why charge a client for something they don't need?

I started a new thread. but the easy reply is that why go to wordpress when they can use wix for free. Are you saying that the free themes are best for customers and your service is also free? Can you provide context with the 50+ websites built on free themes built please. i.e. did you charge £1, £200, £550. The original question regarding the question is about pricing.

 

[Shopclicks]

Are you saying that the free themes are best for customers and your service is also free?

Obviously not. I have built 50+ client sites on free themes. Others use a paid version but only if they need it.

Can you provide context with the 50+ websites built on free themes built please. i.e. did you charge £1, £200, £550.

I build professional websites. Those are not professional prices.

Wix is for amateurs and hobbyists.

 

[fisicx]

My question to you is, are you here to give practice and modern advice or not? I read a lot of the chain and you went from web design/development to plugin.

The advice to anyone asking about pricing is: it depends. Mostly on your marketing plan. Target those with cash to spend and you charge more. If you just want to churmn out sites then charge less and get more business.

I moved from website development to plugins because it's far more lucrative. My hourly rates more than doubled and it generates a decent passive income.

What where the problems that you faced that made you so anti web design/development?

Dealing with clients. They rarely know what they want and are often unable to provide the resources necessary to build the site. Building custom themes and plugins mean there is always a set of specifications. Easy. Had an email from a client yesterday, I had the plugin demo up and running soon after and will finish today. Earned a lot more than you plan to charge for a one page site.

 

[fisicx]

Also, can you share good quality resource that people can use?

All depends on what they want to do.

Maintenance mean different things to different people.

For example keeping the WP core, themes and plugins updated could be classed as maintenance.

Others may consider revising content and and new material a maintenance task.

Monitoring ranking, traffic, leads and conversion is also maintenance.

A google search for any of the above returns a huge range of resources. What you won't find is anyone collecting email addresses in return for a cheatsheet.

I've watched a number of Kevin Geary videos and none of them appear to cover the fundamentals of website design. I also disagree with much of what he says but that's maybe just personal differences.

 

[seaj1one]

The advice to anyone asking about pricing is: it depends. Mostly on your marketing plan. Target those with cash to spend and you charge more. If you just want to churmn out sites then charge less and get more business.

I moved from website development to plugins because it's far more lucrative. My hourly rates more than doubled and it generates a decent passive income.


Dealing with clients. They rarely know what they want and are often unable to provide the resources necessary to build the site. Building custom themes and plugins mean there is always a set of specifications. Easy. Had an email from a client yesterday, I had the plugin demo up and running soon after and will finish today. Earned a lot more than you plan to charge for a one page site.

I do plan to get what ever resource from the customer upfront along with the payment. I had a friend who asked me to build a website. He mentioned that he wouldn't be demanding and understand what goes into building a website. I said I could build it in 3 weeks but I'll need him to complete a questionnaire and supply loads of pictures.

It turned out to be a customer from hell. I didn't hear from him for 3 weeks then he demanded the site go live urgency. He only gave lines answers to my questions. I ended up doing research myself and messages him back and forth to find out how his service works. We then disagreed on price so I ended up doing the website for free.

The biggest lesson that I've learned is regardless if it's a friend or not, I'll do the questionnaire over the phone. I'll also expect to receive the photos before our meeting. As soon as I have everything that I need to begin, at that point I'll ask for payment and provide a timescale. That's way, I'm hoping since no payment has been made the customer has no hold over me. I can also engage to see if the customer is the right fit.

I agree that price for sure depends. I was sharing my plan with Andy to see if helps him or at least to spark some ideas on how it can charge his potential customers. From an earlier chat I think you had with him or someone else he may consider going down the plugin route.

Many thanks for your reply and I get what you're saying. I wish I had your skills now.

 

[fisicx]

Many thanks for your reply and I get what you're saying. I wish I had your skills now.

It has taken many years to get to where I am now. It can be a slow process.

With regards getting the content and images upfront. Don't do this.

As soon as you get the deposit install WP and your preferred theme (I build my own). Add all the necessary pages and a bunch of dummy content and sit back. All of the above takes less than an hour. If you are clever you can write a script that does it all for you. You will have the money in the bank and nothing more to do until the customer delivers the content. Which may take months as you have discovered.

Getting the cash in advance means you retain control.

 

[seaj1one]

All depends on what they want to do.

Maintenance mean different things to different people.

For example keeping the WP core, themes and plugins updated could be classed as maintenance.

Others may consider revising content and and new material a maintenance task.

Monitoring ranking, traffic, leads and conversion is also maintenance.

A google search for any of the above returns a huge range of resources. What you won't find is anyone collecting email addresses in return for a cheatsheet.

I've watched a number of Kevin Geary videos and none of them appear to cover the fundamentals of website design. I also disagree with much of what he says but that's maybe just personal differences.

What sort of things are missing from Kevin Geary's would you say. I can ask him to cover it.

I do like the way you role with the plugin.

I'll see how it goes with the cheatsheet. If I can provide enough resource that will help someone, it may work.

For the maintenance it'll include wp core, themes and plugins, security and performance. Any updates to content, I'm looking to charge for that. I know that some people do include it but I'm looking not to.