Vaccine anyone?

[MikeJ]

And I think you mean "talked at"

 

[jpjj]

How many people have you sampled (talked to)?

Are they a representative cross-section of the country?

More to the point how many people has he listened to, rather than ranted at?

 

[Edward Miller]

The vaccine has been thoroughly tested but has caused a severe allergic reaction in at least 2 people on the day it was first administered. Does anyone else wonder why this had not been picked up during thorough testing?

I wouldn't take the vaccine because it is still in it's trial phase, making us all guinea pigs. There is an argument to vaccinate the vunerable, but thats it.
We shouldnt be vaccinating people who have no chance of dying from Covid.

 

[Interestedobserver]

I did not say that, yet again you are misquoting me.
What I said was the opposite :
1 - Cold wet weather puts people off rioting
2 - Frustration will peak in the late spring when (A) the weather gets better & (B) it becomes obvious that suppression is no longer required to stop Granny snuffing it.
The Government have assured us all that everything will go back to normal in June which may be enough to head off social unrest, plus the fact they continue to pour Billions into furlough.
However, Aniela (that font of all knowledge who always puts on links to where he gets his "facts") reckons that June date is a big con and significant suppression measures will remain, so we will see what happens if it is.

On the subject of Granny snuffing it, deaths are down 87% (apart from London [as in right next to Kent London] they're down 94% there), and, even more to the point, :
The Times Mon (1st March 21, p11) :
Public Health England (PHE) reports that deaths from Covid-19 in the over 75s have dropped by 40% in the last week and admissions to intensive care among the over 85s have dropped to near zero in the last couple of weeks.
So, basically Granny is already highly unlikely to snuff it, not from Covid anyway.

September 11th 2020. In the Sweden thread. You predicted riots and said you would have sympathy with anybody who rioted.

That's the problem with this forum - you say stuff about "mark my words" and it just comes back to make you look clueless and out of touch with reality time and time again

Like I say - you must be shocked and disappointed that 6 months later in the latest poll only 12 per cent of those asked thought the lockdown relaxation was too slow. There's been no rioters for you to sympathise with!

Maybe we need to give it another 6 months til we get the riots?

Full quote below:


"But there is more to this than just the economy, you are forgetting about the social damage. You cannot expect young people, esp young men, to act like bleedin' monks for months or even years. More and more people are getting really quite angry about all these restrictions on their lives, and they're made even more angry by the fact the BBC nor the government ever acknowledge it.
You mark my words if this goes on much longer their will be significant social unrest, in fact I'm surprised there hasn't been more of it so far. Obviously I wouldn't condone it but I'm getting so soddin' angry about, and I'm getting angrier every day, that I'll have significant sympathy with the rioters, it may be the only way to get the government to actually listen and change course."

You were wrong then and you are just as wrong now.

More than 30 per cent think we are relaxing the restrictions to quickly.

47 per cent think the pace of relaxation is correct.

But it's all their fault for being scared!!

Just accept they don't think the same way as you.

 

[Justin Smith]

https://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threads/was-sweden-right-after-all.407668/page-24#post-3037886

The word you're looking for is "sorry".

I haven't been talking about riots for the last 6 months you're making that up, hardly anyone riots when it's cold and wet. Plus this peak in deaths will act to reign in most of them, not that they're frightened of catching Covid (most of them will be young I assume) but most probably don't "want to kill granny". That restraint will disappear quite soon.
My post Jan 27 2021.

And I'm still saying that if the government row back on their promise of "it's all over by June".

 

[MikeJ]

You're now denying saying something everyone can see you've said.

 

[Interestedobserver]

I haven't been talking about riots for the last 6 months you're making that up, hardly anyone riots when it's cold and wet. Plus this peak in deaths will act to reign in most of them, not that they're frightened of catching Covid (most of them will be young I assume) but most probably don't "want to kill granny". That restraint will disappear quite soon.
My post Jan 27 2021.

And I'm still saying that if the government row back on their promise of "it's all over by June".

You predicted riots would happen if the lockdowns carried on much longer back on September 10th 2020?

It's all in black and white above. Don't embarrass yourself pretending you didn't say it.

Now 6 months later you are telling us we will get them in June 2021

It's like deja vu

Have you ever got anything right on here?

 

[Mr D]

You predicted riots would happen if the lockdowns carried on much longer back on September 10th 2020?

It's all in black and white above. Don't embarrass yourself pretending you didn't say it.

Now 6 months later you are telling us we will get them in June 2021

It's like deja vu

Have you ever got anything right on here?

The odds are we won't get riots in June.
Very unlikely to get them this year. Unless we have a couple more lockdowns as some appear to be pushing for.

Those same young men he was referring to appear to want other things. Getting off with a bird while in prison - a tad harder than getting off with a bird at a party.

 

[Clinton]

Excess deaths in UK dropped to below the five year average two weeks ago.

Given the deaths attributed to Covid over the last seven days (average of less than 200 per day) our "excess deaths" is probably now well below the five year average ie. a negative number or no "excess" deaths!

Stop and think about it for a second. Currently the UK is seeing probably no (or close to no) extra deaths from Covid.

Seriously, there may be more people dying in road accidents everyday than dying from Covid (not having Covid as a side complaint to their heart failure or whatever).

Maybe there are more people dying from asteroids falling on their heads.

Get a grip, folk.

And even the excess deaths we saw before were not all Covid deaths.

There were 50,810 excess deaths in homes in England and Wales registered between March 7 2020 and February 26 2021, according to the ONS.

Of this total, 7,056 – 14% – were deaths involving Covid-19.

14%!

Those who were highly susceptible have, sadly, already been taken out. Out of the rest, many have already had Covid and possess some degree of antibodies and aren't going to benefit a great deal from "the" vaccination (though there will be some small benefit).

If you've already been infected, the case for taking a vaccination risk (and there is always a risk with vaccination) is not great. You need to balance the fact that you've got partial immunity with the knowledge that a vaccination may (not will) give you some additional benefit but does present its own risks.

Except, I suppose, if you want to go on holiday or something and having the vaccination makes it easier to travel / cross borders. Then you've got a choice of trusting your government and its scientific advisers - the same people who lied to you about masks for example. (When there was a mask shortage they told you that the most important thing to do was to wash your hands! Misdirection. Because they didn't want a national panic with people unable to get masks.)

 

[simon field]

Get a grip, folk.

They won’t be able to. They can’t. They’ve forgotten how to!

They need their little hands to be held, their snowflake necks rubbed and to be told everything is gonna be ok. They’ve lost the ability to think for themselves and look up to their esteemed headmaster.

Boris Johnson.

Wow!

 

[Mr D]

Excess deaths in UK dropped to below the five year average two weeks ago.

Given the deaths attributed to Covid over the last seven days (average of less than 200 per day) our "excess deaths" is probably now well below the five year average ie. a negative number or no "excess" deaths!

Stop and think about it for a second. Currently the UK is seeing probably no (or close to no) extra deaths from Covid.

Seriously, there may be more people dying in road accidents everyday than dying from Covid (not having Covid as a side complaint to their heart failure or whatever).

Maybe there are more people dying from asteroids falling on their heads.

Get a grip, folk.

And even the excess deaths we saw before were not all Covid deaths.
14%!

Those who were highly susceptible have, sadly, already been taken out. Out of the rest, many have already had Covid and possess some degree of antibodies and aren't going to benefit a great deal from "the" vaccination (though there will be some small benefit).

If you've already been infected, the case for taking a vaccination risk (and there is always a risk with vaccination) is not great. You need to balance the fact that you've got partial immunity with the knowledge that a vaccination may (not will) give you some additional benefit but does present its own risks.

Except, I suppose, if you want to go on holiday or something and having the vaccination makes it easier to travel / cross borders. Then you've got a choice of trusting your government and its scientific advisers - the same people who lied to you about masks for example. (When there was a mask shortage they told you that the most important thing to do was to wash your hands! Misdirection. Because they didn't want a national panic with people unable to get masks.)

Some of the ones killed off by covid would be ones at risk from flu or other viruses.
So would form part of expected number of deaths anyway.

However the measures put innplace for covid impact multiple other problems too. Flu being one of the bigger killers. Not so much flu around? Not so many flu deaths.

Realistically we are comparing a year like no other with normal years. Which we have not had and probably will not be able to compare any years going forward to the years prior to covid for deaths.

 

[Interestedobserver]

And the current Covid is no longer our worry

This UK Covid Variant was a tough one. Tougher than we realised I think but we got it sorted. Thats not the problem now.

It's new more serious variants (some that don't even exist yet) that are quite clearly the concern ongoing

Do people on here not follow what's happening?

Or just like to remain ignorant on purpose because it makes them feel safe or happy?

You have to be realistic to understand where we are at.

Not scared. But at the same time not over confident.

Cautious and with a plan to only move forward.

Whether you like it or not that's what we are trying to do regardless as a country

If we thought this was over and easy now we could ignorantly take 2 steps forward short term but move 3 steps back long term

And that's no good for any of us.

Everyone should just be happy together that we have a plan to move forward. Even if it's not as quick as they might wish for.

And be damn grateful the scientists have created these vaccines. Which were never guaranteed. Thats a triumph in itself.

Be positive, happy and grateful.

 

[simon field]

And the current Covid is no longer our worry

This UK Covid Variant was a tough one. Tougher than we realised I think but we got it sorted. Thats not the problem now.

It's new more serious variants (some that don't even exist yet) that are quite clearly the concern ongoing

Do people on here not follow what's happening?

Or just like to remain ignorant on purpose because it makes them feel safe or happy?

You have to be realistic to understand where we are at.

Not scared. But at the same time not over confident.

Cautious and with a plan to only move forward.

Whether you like it or not that's what we are trying to do regardless as a country

If we thought this was over and easy now we could ignorantly take 2 steps forward short term but move 3 steps back long term

And that's no good for any of us.

Everyone should just be happy together that we have a plan to move forward. Even if it's not as quick as they might wish for.

And be damn grateful the scientists have created these vaccines. Which were never guaranteed. Thats a triumph in itself.

Be positive, happy and grateful.

Have you noticed that you seem to be more frightened than anyone else?

Surely you can see this?

Just chill.

 

[Interestedobserver]

Have you noticed that you seem to be more frightened than anyone else?

Surely you can see this?

Just chill.

Not frightened at all.

It's you guys who cant accept we have to social distance etc that seem to have all the problems/worries?

Maybe some of you are scared of losing stuff? I don't know.

But right now you are spending your time complaining about stuff you can't do anything about.

You all need to find a way get some happiness and contentment back in your lives I think.

We are winning the battle. If you guys had your way we would just throw away a winning position.

 

[MikeJ]

They won’t be able to. They can’t. They’ve forgotten how to!

They need their little hands to be held, their snowflake necks rubbed and to be told everything is gonna be ok. They’ve lost the ability to think for themselves and look up to their esteemed headmaster.

Boris Johnson.

Wow!

Oh no! He's called us snowflakes! Whatever next? Please, not the "sheeple" word? That's the thing that really drives us back under our stones.

This is where we are. I'll type it slowly because one thing we've realised is the gammon can't read fast. The virus we had last year is defeated. The vaccine is doing it's job. The variants that we're aware of are almost certainly not a problem, based on the information we have. No, Justin, this isn't proof of anything.. It's an assumption based on the evidence we have so far. Call it a guess if you want.

The issue we're now facing is future variants. We don't know what that will bring. The virus only mutates when it moves from person to person, so we need to drive down the amount of infections to low levels. Then we can live with the background Covid that will still be around, and control it with the vaccines we have. IF we open up now, we've still got well over half the population that are likely to get infected. They'll not die, probably won't be hospitalised even, but each time someone catches it, we run the risk of a new variant that isn't covered by the vaccines we currently have. That will lead to new lockdowns. Putting up with this for a few more months is something most of us think is worthwhile in the long term.

Call that "snowflake" if you want. I call it not being an ignorant moron.

 

[Interestedobserver]

Spot on.

We are supporting measures which are trying their very best to avoid the same people who cry and complain about having to wear masks and lockdown from having to do it again next winter and beyond

Not being an ignorant moron is a great description

 

[simon field]

Oh no! He's called us snowflakes! Whatever next? Please, not the "sheeple" word? That's the thing that really drives us back under our stones.

This is where we are. I'll type it slowly because one thing we've realised is the gammon can't read fast. The virus we had last year is defeated. The vaccine is doing it's job. The variants that we're aware of are almost certainly not a problem, based on the information we have. No, Justin, this isn't proof of anything.. It's an assumption based on the evidence we have so far. Call it a guess if you want.

The issue we're now facing is future variants. We don't know what that will bring. The virus only mutates when it moves from person to person, so we need to drive down the amount of infections to low levels. Then we can live with the background Covid that will still be around, and control it with the vaccines we have. IF we open up now, we've still got well over half the population that are likely to get infected. They'll not die, probably won't be hospitalised even, but each time someone catches it, we run the risk of a new variant that isn't covered by the vaccines we currently have. That will lead to new lockdowns. Putting up with this for a few more months is something most of us think is worthwhile in the long term.

Call that "snowflake" if you want. I call it not being an ignorant moron.

Oh look it’s one of the shouty ones!

You’ve really got it bad haven’t you - the armchair epidemiologist thing?

We’ll see how it pans out with your ‘might, maybe, possibly, could be’ scenarios shall we.

 

[MikeJ]

It's the "Piers Morgan" approach now.

Aww., diddums, did the nasty man speak back to you?

 

[simon field]

Who or what is ‘Piers Morgan’?

 

[MikeJ]

Exactly...

 

[Interestedobserver]

Oh look it’s one of the shouty ones!

You’ve really got it bad haven’t you - the armchair epidemiologist thing?

We’ll see how it pans out with your ‘might, maybe, possibly, could be’ scenarios shall we.

It's already panned out Simon?

You should be delighted we have a roadmap out

You Covid deniers are just so impatient!

Summer is coming! Be happy.

Pubs will be open again soon and you won't even have to buy food in them!

Now you guys just need to behave for a few more weeks and not do anything to go and spoil it all for everyone

You can make it through! Youve done the hard bit!

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Excess deaths in UK dropped to below the five year average two weeks ago.

Not surprising.

Due to measures not to catch THE virus we are not catching ANY viruses. Numbers for flu tests this winter are ZERO.

Everyone except Justin are obeying the rules so there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

 

[Interestedobserver]

Not surprising.

Due to measures not to catch THE virus we are not catching ANY viruses. Numbers for flu tests this winter are ZERO.

Everyone except Justin are obeying the rules so there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

Wow we should lockdown every winter!

Lol

 

[Clodbuster]

Wow we should lockdown every winter!

Lol

I agree, hit the bed and pull up the duvet.

 

[Justin Smith]

It's already panned out Simon?
You should be delighted we have a roadmap out
You Covid deniers are just so impatient!
Summer is coming! Be happy.
Pubs will be open again soon and you won't even have to buy food in them!
Now you guys just need to behave for a few more weeks and not do anything to go and spoil it all for everyone
You can make it through! Youve done the hard bit!

Even if we get completely back to normal in June (and Aniela thinks that promise is a big con, and he might be right) we have over three months more of this, and for what ? Nearly all the significantly vulnerable have been vaccinated for Gawd's sake, what to they want ? How far are this deceitful lot going to move the goalposts ? Even the soddin' swimming pools are shut for well over another month, just when they're admitting obesity has caused many of the deaths. They are now even vaccinating people at the same risk as me, and I do not want them to "protect me" till June by suppressing my life. Not in my name....

There are no Covid deniers on here, why do you keep coming out with demonstrably false accusations ? Is it because your case is disappearing as the death rate falls through the floor?

 

[Justin Smith]

Not surprising.
Due to measures not to catch THE virus we are not catching ANY viruses. Numbers for flu tests this winter are ZERO.
Everyone except Justin are obeying the rules so there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

You are wrong in nearly all you say.

I have no option but to stick to most of the rules because most of the things I want to do are shut.

Despite that I have had a few mild colds / viruses. I can tell when I I have one because my hill walking times get worse.

There are fewer cars on the road ! Not that many fewer, I have to queue to drive home every night, it really isn't that much quicker than in "normal times".

 

[Deleted member 59730]

You are wrong in nearly all you say.

No I am not. I cannot help if you cannot read.

 

[Justin Smith]

No I am not. I cannot help if you cannot read.

Yeah alright, you are correct, there are hardly any cars on the roads, anything you say......

 

[Interestedobserver]

That's been suggested by Chris Whitty.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-...-news-uk-new-national-lockdown-covid-vaccine/

You see that shows you are either plain ignorant or deliberately try to find things to twist and create controversy or complaints. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you aren't ignorant. Which basically mean you twist stuff to try and cause an impact.

Without even opening the link I remember when asked he said we may need some type of social distancing next winter and we may have a situation where we still wear masks in some crowded situations and we continue with sanitizing hands etc. So I"m clearly not ignorant as I actually read the detail.

But in the world of you conspiracists that obviously becomes "Whitty says we might have to lockdown again next winter"

You are all a bunch of drama queens let's be honest

You conspiracists are the actual "snowflakes" ongoing

The rest of us just get on with life without trying to find something to complain about every day

On the other hand if I'm mistaken and you are actually plain ignorant - hopefully I've just educated you above so you can tell your mates it's not that bad after all

 

[Clinton]

... there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

Traffic has returned to near pre-pandemic levels.

Technically, if there's one less car, it's "fewer" cars, but your comments on this have the same exaggerated, drama queen quality about them as the nonsense you spouted about Brexit. <irony warning> Remember the Brexit armageddon predictions - starvation, locust plague, asteroids hitting Earth?

OMG, what the hell are you, a 16 year old girl from California?

 

[Newchodge]

Not surprising.

Due to measures not to catch THE virus we are not catching ANY viruses. Numbers for flu tests this winter are ZERO.

Everyone except Justin are obeying the rules so there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

As is evidenced by this report
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56359861

 

[Interestedobserver]

I reckon my personal car mileage has reduced from 30,000 ish miles a year to 5,000 ish

And I won't be letting it get anywhere to close to where it was before ever again

I won't miss those journeys for sure

So far I've had less colds this year as well. And anything I get only seems to last a few hours rather than a few days. I assume with less social contact and maybe wearing masks you get smaller doses of anything going around?

 

[Justin Smith]

You see that shows you are either plain ignorant or deliberately try to find things to twist and create controversy or complaints. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you aren't ignorant. Which basically mean you twist stuff to try and cause an impact.
Without even opening the link I remember when asked he said we may need some type of social distancing next winter and we may have a situation where we still wear masks in some crowded situations and we continue with sanitizing hands etc. So I"m clearly not ignorant as I actually read the detail.
But in the world of you conspiracists that obviously becomes "Whitty says we might have to lockdown again next winter"
You are all a bunch of drama queens let's be honest
You conspiracists are the actual "snowflakes" ongoing
The rest of us just get on with life without trying to find something to complain about every day
On the other hand if I'm mistaken and you are actually plain ignorant - hopefully I've just educated you above so you can tell your mates it's not that bad after all

I think you are being a tad unfair there.
If we have to wear masks and socially distance we are not over this are we ? And you cannot run society with masks and social distancing of any sort, and nor should we.

 

[Mr D]

Traffic has returned to near pre-pandemic levels.

Technically, if there's one less car, it's "fewer" cars, but your comments on this have the same exaggerated, drama queen quality about them as the nonsense you spouted about Brexit. <irony warning> Remember the Brexit armageddon predictions - starvation, locust plague, asteroids hitting Earth?

OMG, what the hell are you, a 16 year old girl from California?

So we cannot travel a distance, we cannot go visit relatives, cannot go on holiday, lots of people still working from home, most shops are shut - yet traffic has returned to hear pandemic levels. What is wrong?

 

[Justin Smith]

As is evidenced by this report
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56359861

Many people drove a lot less earlier last year, particularly long journeys, but not now, despite teh fact we are suppose to be in a lockdown now...
I had to wait as long as in pre lockdown days to turn right out of our road this morning. When we went down to Reading in mid Jan I was surprised how much traffic there was on the M1 / A46 / M40, it really wasn't that much different to "normal". We kept asking each other where are all these people going if many work places are shut, all holidays are banned and so is meeting up with people ? ! ?

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Not surprising.

Due to measures not to catch THE virus we are not catching ANY viruses. Numbers for flu tests this winter are ZERO.

Everyone except Justin are obeying the rules so there are fewer cars and motorbikes on the roads and less accidents.

This is what I said.

Ordinary winter flu tests this year are zero. If your flu was not serious enough to be tested by the NHS it was hardly life threatening.

To clarify flu tests carried out by the NHS and not a dose of Man Flu needing a few extra hankies.

 

[Interestedobserver]

I think you are being a tad unfair there.
If we have to wear masks and socially distance we are not over this are we ? And you cannot run society with masks and social distancing of any sort, and nor should we.

I'm being "a tad unfair"

You are being a total drama queen

If we have to keep sanitizing our hands and wear masks in some places it's a lot better than we might have thought we would have been and only snowflakes like you are going to be complain

Trust me

And it's nothing like lockdown as the other snowflake above was trying to claim

Honestly - drama queens the lot of you

Like I say you conspiracists are the real snowflakes

Minor things like washing your hands and wearing masks in crowded places cause you great concern and worry ?

That's absolutely nothing compared to lockdown and having to close businesses etc

And normal rational people will not be concerned in the slightest if that's what it takes to be able to go out and do stuff next winter

Instead of being in the minority of 12 per cent you will find yourselves in a minority lower than 1 per cent if that's all you are going to be complaining about next winter

You guys are the irrational ones and the snowflakes

The rest of us just get on with life and are normal

 

[Deleted member 59730]

And normal rational people will not be concerned in the slightest if that's what it takes to be able to go out and do stuff next winter

Japan is normally like this. They wear masks when they have the slightest cold, They don't shake hands. Its normal.

 

[DontAsk]

Many people drove a lot less earlier last year, particularly long journeys, but not now, despite teh fact we are suppose to be in a lockdown now...
I had to wait as long as in pre lockdown days to turn right out of our road this morning. When we went down to Reading in mid Jan I was surprised how much traffic there was on the M1 / A46 / M40, it really wasn't that much different to "normal". We kept asking each other where are all these people going if many work places are shut, all holidays are banned and so is meeting up with people ? ! ?

Do you think your own journey was more necessary than theirs?

 

[Interestedobserver]

Do you think your own journey was more necessary than theirs?

M1/A46/M40

That's not the way to Sweden is it Justin?