The Need For Chuggers?

[90DC]

Hi all,

When setting up a company, I choose a charity to support in whatever way the company can, whether that be 'sponsorship', providing services, advertising, etc, etc. These decisions take research and time to finalise and a meeting is held with somebody from the charity (Despite how little or much we feel we can help) and that's basically it. The money, services, advertising, support, donations, fundraising that we decide upon continues.

We'd all like to work in a world where cures for terminal diseases, we'd all like children to live away from abuse, the environment to be cared for; trees to be replanted, homeless to have shelter, older people to receive the care they need, domestic violence victims to have support, etc. etc. but what is the need for chuggers?

Whilst I don't abuse 'chuggers' in the street, I would appreciate if they didn't harrass me and drive me away from using different parts of Nottingham City Centre, or any town or city centre for that matter.

Without mentioning my experiences, apart from loose use of the terms 'invasive' and 'harrrassing', I'd like to know other people's experiences of 'chuggers' and if anybody has a spectacular way of making them chugger bugger off.

I think it would also be good to get statistics into public domain, regarding how much the marketing agency and the chugger receive per £1 or per average sign up. I heard somewhere that 'chuggers' can earn around £10 per hour, is this realistic?

Like most people that have ever considered this situation, I inform the chuggers that my charity interests are tied up elsewhere and that I sign up for nothing in the street. Despite this, they seem to have upped the anti in Nottingham and are making target of anybody they consider to have spare income.

Finally, I find it hilarious, when asking for marketing information, such as flyers or business cards, the chuggers don't hold this information. The general excuse for not doing so is that they don't spend money on national advertising, and usually, they end up at the words ITV and Simon Cowell, heaven knows why, they speak so fast!

 

[S-Marketing]

It's not the people who look like they have spare money that they target, its the ones who look gullible. They aren't as disorganised and untrained as they look sometimes.

 

[Remote Resources]

I apologise in advance that it's from the Daily Fail but they have some stats here direct from the charities themselves that you might be interested in.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-chuggers-eat-millions-donated-charities.html

If I wasn't already averse to being harrassed for my bank details in the street and on my doorstep (although they do tend to leave me alone - bonus of being Mrs Angry when shopping cos I hate it), then these figures would most certainly put me off.

I don't agree with chuggers AT ALL.

Oh, and this is how much they earn as an example

Fundraiser / Charity Fundraisers / Street Fundraisers

Do you want to work in a job that can really make a difference .

Tim Lilley Fundraising is an independent fundraising agency. We have an excellent reputation for providing charities with high quality face-to-face fundraising services. We have been securing long-term income for a range of charities for many years, and our relaxed, non-pressurising approach gives people the space and time they need to make a considered decision.

We work with a range of national and local charities and encourage enquiries from all areas of the country. We always try to place fundraisers with their charity of choice wherever possible, and encourage them to form strong links with the organisation.

We are looking for more fundraisers to join our successful team and we are committed to finding loyal supporters for the charities that we represent and we place great emphasis on the development of our fundraisers. We offer them extensive training to ensure that members of the public meet people who are friendly, well-informed, sincere and sensitive. We believe that our fundraisers can begin a lasting relationship between supporter and charity using the simplest method of communication - one person speaking to another. This is something that we have achieved for nearly thirty years.

We ask you to choose one NGO to work for, and encourage you to form close links, attending periodic training sessions with them at their head offices and other events as you see fit.

These include:

Action on Disability & Development
Amnesty International
Friends of the Earth
Plan UK
Shelter
Woodland Trust

You will work for this charity, by yourself in your own area, using our 'differentiated' approach: this means treating everyone as an individual with their own unique aims and concerns; we want them to feel in control; that the focus is on them as much as on the needs of the charity.

Our fundraising is unhurried, respectful and non-invasive. It requires intelligence, assertiveness, commitment and self-awareness. We provide a great deal of ongoing training to help you continually to develop these attributes in your own way. Part of the job is also to attend weekly training and support sessions with other TLFC fundraisers.

The weekly commitment, both training and fundraising, is 22 hours.

Initially, we pay £8 per hour, plus bonuses, for five evenings and a daytime support/training session (this works out at £180 per week minimum plus bonuses and expenses). We pay travel expenses to all training and meetings.

As your confidence grows, we will encourage you to consider full commission which pays better (at least £15,500 pa, on average). Though we are not driven by high earnings, we do bring in thoughtful and loyal supporters upon whom each charity can rely and budget for years to come. We take pride in the sensitivity of our work, and we are paid accordingly.

Those fundraisers who show the necessary aptitudes will have the opportunity to progress into management. All the senior management team at Tim Lilley Fundraising have carried out fundraising appeals and we place great emphasis on the ongoing development of our staff.

 

[Minuteman Press]

Chuggers achieve a good ROI (I presume) because they continue to be used as a revenue channel.

But...

I think it's tragic how they represent charities. Speaking as a former Amnesty International activist (and one time President of the AI Oxford colleges society) - how they represent AI is appalling.

Several times I have asked AI chuggers what AI do - not a clue. How does AI work - not a clue. What have they achieved - not a clue.

Explaining that I pay a regular direct debit - I'm asked if I could cancel it and sign up with them instead! Less would be fine!

This is not once - four occasions in Bristol.

Sad times. AI will look back on this period and wonder what the marketing department were doing. ROI vs. devaluing AI. Oh well.

 

[Billmccallum]

Chuggers contribute to carity income, but not nearly as much as to the income of the individuals and companies who employ them.

I would never advocate any charity using them and would never contribute through them.

 

[td2011]

I don't know much about the street fundraising for charities. I don't feel they do any harm when they have respect for the public but quite often they can be quite rude and confrontational. I live in a very busy city, people are rushing about and traffic is heavy and when all you want to do is get to work or are on a tight schedule for lunch, the last thing you need is to be stopped every few yards by a charity worker.

 

[Ryan Junghenn]

It is interesting to hear that in the UK you have a lot of trouble with 'Chuggers', a term I have never heard before.
Here in Australia I rarely see anyone Chugging, we do have a lot of groups at traffic lights asking for change, but all you have to do is shake your head and they move on to the next car.

Regards,
Ryan

 

[td2011]

I think it would be more acceptable and effective if the street charity workers were actually working for a charity rather than an agency and on commission based pay.

 

[chrisbuckley]

Some chuggers are paid commission. Others are paid an hourly rate - for example, Amnesty International chuggers are paid an hourly rate (something like £8/hr).

I mentioned that this might mean that they don't need to hassle as hard but the guy told me that if you weren't meeting targets after a month then you got given the heave-ho.

I hate chuggers with a vengance. I normally refuse to acknowledge their existence but some of them get abusive as you walk by if you do this.

I have little faith in big charities anyway. They are wasteful to the extreme. Donate locally if you really want to help people. Big, international charities are too political and too wasteful. Your local charity will be more grateful for your donations.

 

[OldWelshGuy]

I have been trying to get our local authority to ban ALL street sellers in this type of area. They stand in front of you arms wide open trying to be physically controlling, it is disgusting the way they behave.

I believe that all these people whould be removed from our streets, this includes the market researchers, the people trying to sell mail order catalogues, accident and injury (I thought they had been removed but they still do this where I live) and many others.

Unless it is voluntary labour (tin rattlers and poppy sellers for example) where no payment is made ot the collector, I believe it should be banned.

 

[Ryan Junghenn]

I have often noticed how much people don't like charity collectors aka "Chuggers" and by the statements made in this thread I can see there are some very passionate haters, so I have decided to find out a bit more about your opposition.
In my usual style I have dived straight in the deep end, I have signed up to be a face to face professional fundraiser
I am going to do the training and become a "Chugger" and I will keep you all updated on how it goes.
I look forward to hearing your opinions and feel free to say to me what you have always wanted to say to the street fundraisers. This will be fun

Regards,
Ryan Junghenn

 

[Consistency]

They annoy me because of the way they dress, like designer scruffbags pretending they have just fitted in an hour from the scruffy hippy parafe.

They annoy me because they dart towards you as if they care with their arms wide open as if you are a child they are cheering on to win the egg and spoon race.

They annoy me how they pretend to want to be your friend and wanting to know how you are and if you have had a nice day shopping and have you brought anything nice.

They entertain me when I am in a cafe and I can see them stood outside bobbing up and down, prancing and dancing and making a beeline for a fool.

Should they come towards me, I do not avoid them I hold my hand up briefly to interrupt their talking and then say are you after a direct debit? A bit of mumbling or shock takes place or a big grin and try to pretend I ask or a big Weelllll, so I rephrase "Are you looking for me to sign up a direct debit". I begin to get a bit of a yes and I say "I already donate what I want to donate and do not want to sign up to anything else but I wish you luck and don't want to waste your time when you could be getting somewhere with someone else but I wish you luck". Because the final sentence is long, I rarely get to finish it as they know I mean it and are moving on to their next person.

It is direct but polite and I think fair. They have a job to do like anyone else.

 

[tony84]

When i worked in Manchester city centre, you used to have some in the main entrance to the town centre covering every possible entrance. You would then also have them scattered around the centre and in other closed in areas too.

It got to the point where i actually managed to find a route avoiding all of them to go and buy my dinner...why should i have to do that just to do a straight walk to a cafe.

We used to give enough money in work we would have dress down days every friday - £1 a week to charity, we would also do other events (Jeans for Genes day, some coffee morning thing - not sure what that was for, pudsey, children in need etc etc etc). All in all i would imagine i would give £100 a year to charity, which isnt a lot but its significant.

Today i went to stockport, there is like a central area they were in the middle and over to every side so you couldnt get round...luckily i had a hoodie on (with it being winter) so i looked like a bit of a scally...guess what, they avoided me

So lesson learnt if you go shopping, a pair of trackies and a hoodie is the answer.

I dont mind people that stand in supermarkets to one side surrounded by their posters, its when they come over to you that i get offended.

 

[chrisbuckley]

If you ever wanted to learn cold calling or wanted to practise NLP then chugging is a great platform to try it I reckon.

 

[OldWelshGuy]

On a different note, this week we have actively changed direction while walking in town to deposit money in 5 charity buckets, the people were stood there, with a smile, no hassle, a nice big poster behind them telling us what they were collecting for, and we threw a few quid in each.

My problem is the way people are conned as they are not aware these chuggers are employed and not volunteers, it is immoral

 

[Ryan Junghenn]

Firstly thanks for the great responses, you all seem like very reasonable people and not just getting on your high horses. (rare in Internet forums)

Next, I lasted 2 days in my position as a chugger then i really couldn't handle seeing people being pressured into something which they were not really happy with.
I went with the "smile, be friendly and stand off to the side" approach, then if anyone wanted to come have a chat with me they could, but after being told that "You have to get in front of people otherwise they wont stop" I decided that I couldn't morally annoy dozens of people just to get them to sign up.

One thing I would like to add though, is that there is no reason to get grumpy at chuggers, simply do as 'Consistency' does, be direct and polite. Many chuggers are people who are helping save lives. It is the only profession that saves lives and is hated for it.

I still believe that the best way to raise money for charities is by giving a great experience and getting the Donators connected with the cause, like charity holidays and other events.

I also still believe that the best way for our world to become a better, more stable and a happier place is through education and experience. Educating on how we can all easily help each other and Experiencing the joy of helping those in need.

Regards,
Ryan Junghenn

 

[OldWelshGuy]

If we teach morality, if we can nurture a social concience, if we can educate our children about the things that go on in the world, instead of pretending it doesn't exist due to the rediculous political correctness that goes on in schools, then we stand a chance.

My daughter is 12, she has run her own websites now for a couple of years and she makes money at it. SHE decided she should support charities and good causes, paying by direct debit is 1 case, and I believe this is because she has seen my wife and myself giving to charity, buying a snack and a cu of soup for a homeless guy etc, and generally openly talking to each other about the 'duty' to help those less fortunate than us, due to the belessings we have received in life.

There was a time in my life when putting a siungle £1 into a charity tin would have meant cutting back on something or going without. I believe that we have a duty to 'give' both financially and physically of our time, in order to help others.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

There needs to be some new laws to control chuggers.

For a start they trade on peoples belief that the money being collected is a donation for a particular charity. Its not, its a payment to a third party company who will make a donation on your behalf. This needs to be made perfectly clear at the time of sign up.

Secondly it needs to be made perfectly clear how much of the money being donated is actually going through to the charity. I have seen countless reports where 80% or more of the money being donated is being swallowed up by the chugging company. If you donate £100 a year only £20 gets through to the charity. A further 50% is then probably swallowed by the charities admin charges. As a result it costs you £100 to donate £10 of money. This should be in big large letters at the top of every sign up form.

There is also the question of data security. I have seen chuggers simply put completed sign up forms in to a bag and leave it in the street while they hassle other people. Leaving the bag unattended with peoples banking details.

I think people also need to look closer at the charities that allow their names to be used in these rip off ways. If a charity thinks so little of people wanting to support them, they will allow them to be ripped off in this way, then they dont deserve my support at all.

Dont forget that all the adverts you see on TV are exactly the same - its chugging in a different form.

I personally think any chuggers, survey takers or claims/accident people that interrupt any conversation I'm having with the Mrs as I walk down the street are just rude.

OldWelshGuy - Some councils now set a limit on the number of chuggers allowed on their streets. Not sure what the situation is here in Wales though. Interesting thing is I went to London last month and didnt see any chuggers at all, yet last week when I walked through Cardiff I saw them everywhere

 

[Consistency]

There are towns and cities that are being dragged down by beggars and big issue sellers. A man I know has on occasions given to the big issue sellers but not accepted the magazine. Big mistake - he now avoids certain streets as everytime he is seen, there is one in particular who will shout him and say "mate been a bad day today" and want money. I have seen him too and he looks high on drugs with his eyes half shut.

While I have mixed feelings and sympathies for the homeless, this one has been selling the big issue for well over a year in his same spot. when he was spoken to sometime ago with the offer of help, he said he had a keyworker and that he had got a flat recently but had lost it again within months due to personal problems.

I was reading a report about a certain city being a dump. There were councillors defending the city and I was reading the comments that people had posted.

They were saying that out of town shopping centres are more preferable because they are clean, opening times clearer, no beggars, alcoholics and drug addicts and there were toilets that were clean and not confined to a shop.

I think while there is consideration in the post above that there should be greater clarity on chuggers and where the money is going, there is no clarity at all when it comes to big issue sellers. How much of that goes on drugs or drink?

I do have sympathy for some of them but they are a problem in certain aspects.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

I have to leap to the defence of the Big Issues sales guys (I agree with the rest though).

A Big Issue seller is not begging, he is selling a magazine that he/she has had to buy out of their own money. It is more of a micro business than begging. I have never seen issues with any Big Issue sellers.

There is a long waiting list for Big Issue sales pitches and they are not just given to anyone. Those that do get a spot have to remain drug free for the period they are selling and can not be intoxicated whilst selling the Big Issue. If they are caught doing either they loose their pitch and can no longer sell the Big Issue.

Cardiff has a no-beggers allowed policy and that keeps the beggers away from Cardiff. (I must admit I find a begger asking for money to buy a bottle of Strongbow far more honest than the chuggers).

Cardiff does have a big problem with alcoholics, especially on St Mary Street where lots of Spars, Tesco's, Sainsburys and others are open almost 24/7 selling alcohol. It is something the council are working in partnership with the shops to resolve.

This is all based on my experience in Cardiff and things maybe a lot different where you are

 

[OldWelshGuy]

I have helped out in the mobile soup kitchens in Cardiff, and it is positively mild compared to Swansea. Swansea is dangerous.

 

[Consistency]

A lot of the big issue sellers I do not have a problem with but this one in particular is vile. Give or buy off him once and show any kindness and he is a leech and acts as though we have a responsibility to him. I would never buy a big issue magazine as I have had that experience too of the man I spoke about. I perhaps would if it was an area where I did not live or frequented less than once a year.

I would much rather donate to the soup kitchens or salvation army.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

Consistency - It would be worth having a word with the local Big Issues office. The sales guys are supposed to work to strict guidelines and it sounds like these individuals are operating outside of them.

OldWelshGuy - I had no idea Swansea was so bad, but there again I dont get there much

 

[td2011]

It's a shame some of you have had negative experiences with big issue sellers. I've never had a bad exerience and actually I find the big issue sellers much more friendly than chuggers. Obviously not every city and town is the same and each has it's own troubles. I think it's important not to let one person ruin it for everybody else.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

td2011 - One company I worked at was so impressed with the Big Issue sales people in Cardiff they gave them PC training etc and even employed a handful of them part time. I wont name who the company was because it is a secret project of theirs as they dont want to be swamped with applicants.

They candidates were hand picked based on how well they interacted with the public

 

[Ryan Junghenn]

I just had an Idea and thought your opinions would be helpful in discussing it. Instead of Chuggers, what if there were entertainers and buskers who were giving you a pleasant experience. They could have a sign which said something like "Supporting xxx charity, through my love of music. Please support xxx charity with your love"
Well positioned entertainers can make goo money, there was a 12yo at a market who would make $300 a day just doing Michael Jackson dances.
Not only that but if they really wanted to push the point the charities could push the point and run Press releases saying, "Which would you prefer, chuggers or entertainers? please support local tallent who are helping the planet."

I'm sure with a bit of time the signs and things could be better, but I know I would prefer to be entertained rather than husseled.

Ryan Junghenn

 

[Deleted member 120672]

I hate being chased and hounded on the high street by these vulture teams too! I wrote to the Council saying I don't window shop as I hurry to get where I'm going and avoid them. They replied saying they have no power to stop it as there's a loophole meaning they can do as they like basically hence why they've taken over the high street.
If you're eating your sandwich at lunch, talking to a friend etc. you get stopped still. The only thing I've found that DOES work is talking on a mobile (even if no-one's there) they're at least civil enough to leave you alone when you're on the phone! Only way I've found that works.