The Most Flawed Retail Ideas...

mhall

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I hadn't noticed this forum was so pedantic.

Ok SOME of the general public are price driven but the fact remains these sorts of shop are failing left right and centre.

The ones that deserve to go will fail. Those who have just been made redundant, got a bit of cash in their pocket and think that Retail is easy deserve to fail. Those that plan it properly, research it properly and do it properly will survive and, with hard work, will prosper. Even sweet franchises will survive if the people involved have the right attituide and a pragmatic approach - and the right location !
 
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Must mention this, but in Sheffield, someone has opened an sandwich shop next door to a branch of Cooplands - a regional bakery with branches all over South Yorkshire.

:D

I know Cooplands and I wouldn't do that personally. Small businesses aren't as popular as the bigger boys, regardless of quality, service and price.

There's a bakery in Nottingham two doors down from a Greggs, it has been there longer and hangs in, but for every five customers Greggs takes, the independent gets one.

As a consumer, I've tried both, I prefer the independent, but they don't have the professional images of deep filled slices in the window, the brighter colours and the 'brand' above the door. Marketing is where I think many retailers fail. That window display is invaluable, it's your opportunity to entice the customer through the door, but so many retailers are clearly out of touch with the way consumers work.
 
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warnie

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Sep 24, 2007
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Sarcasm, the lowest form of wit

I wasn't personally attacking you however good luck as you're going to need it.

Why spend daft amounts on sweets in a "traditional" sweet shop when you can nip down Tesco and get the same thing much cheaper?

Not true, sarcasm is the finest form of wit:D

Whats worse is tarring businesses with the same brush. Now Damo if you were as clever as what you seem to think you are you would understand that there's good and bad in every business sector.

I can name 2 Traditional sweet shops within 3 miles of us who didn't stand a chance from the start. Thier locations were terrible and they failed to realise that you cannot set one up and survive longterm on a shoestring. We ourselves are on our 2nd shop the 1st one failed again due to it's location.

Our shop now is in a much better location surrounded by 6 schools and good shops around us. So the concept itself can work if you go about it the right way and choose the right place to start up, but this applies to every retail shop.

P.S thanks for the offer of 'luck' I did not realise you had access to our accounts and knew our business inside out:rolleyes:
 
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The Ginger Ninja

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I think the ones who have opened in high rent centres wont stand a chance and thus it has been proven with Sugacane branches closing left, right and centre.

For example the unit in Meadowhall which housed Sugacane was around £200k rent a year, 6 figures in rates, and a ridiculous service charge on top with was almost £100k.

Add on all the staff hours you have to cover and associated costs and it is going to be a struggle even in a centre like that.

Cant imagine Kingswinford having such high rents, which is obviously to your benefit :D
 
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warnie

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Sep 24, 2007
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I think the ones who have opened in high rent centres wont stand a chance and thus it has been proven with Sugacane branches closing left, right and centre.

For example the unit in Meadowhall which housed Sugacane was around £200k rent a year, 6 figures in rates, and a ridiculous service charge on top with was almost £100k.

Add on all the staff hours you have to cover and associated costs and it is going to be a struggle even in a centre like that.

Cant imagine Kingswinford having such high rents, which is obviously to your benefit :D

Too true, the thing is with a sweet shop is that although the margins are high there's only so many people you can serve throughout the day, due to weighing the sweets out. So your only going to be able to take so much. Certainly even with low rents you won't get rich, but it can be a nice relaxing lifestyle.

Another example is a sweet shop about 2 miles from us that has opened up in a small mall just off a busy high street (where there is already a thriving sweet shop). It's rent, service charge and rates are over 5 times what we pay. So they really need to be busy all day long just to cover the overheads oh and they're also tied in to a 10 year lease:eek:
 
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Not true, sarcasm is the finest form of wit:D

Whats worse is tarring businesses with the same brush. Now Damo if you were as clever as what you seem to think you are you would understand that there's good and bad in every business sector.

I can name 2 Traditional sweet shops within 3 miles of us who didn't stand a chance from the start. Thier locations were terrible and they failed to realise that you cannot set one up and survive longterm on a shoestring. We ourselves are on our 2nd shop the 1st one failed again due to it's location.

Our shop now is in a much better location surrounded by 6 schools and good shops around us. So the concept itself can work if you go about it the right way and choose the right place to start up, but this applies to every retail shop.

P.S thanks for the offer of 'luck' I did not realise you had access to our accounts and knew our business inside out:rolleyes:

I'm sorry please provide a post where I stated or inferred I was clever?

I've clearly touched a nerve which would make me believe things aren't as rosy for you as you'd imply.

I know, funny:D

I was busy with the shop although now I wished I hadn't of bothered after reading what Damo had to say, I might as well shut up now;)

Feel free to attack other people on this thread who have posted their OPINION.

You really have come across as quite the idiot.
 
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jelly3

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Jul 29, 2007
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Agree with you on that. Nottingham has two or three 'milkshake bars' and they're always empty. There's also a couple of out of town ones. What gets me is that they take on a unit too large for their operations. I'd love to meet the people opening these as it makes no sense to me either.

There is one extremely successful on sight in Manchester and they have queues out the door most evenings. They sell hotdogs and burgers/chips and sell via just eat. You can customise the shakes on the je website. The main complaint is their deliveries are soo slow. They happen to be surrounded by University buildings, and other eateries on one of the busiest roads in and out of Manchester city centre. and they stay open til morning.
 
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jelly3

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I find it funny that men (I guess) are moaning about the viability of businesses that attract women.

Fact of the matter is that many of them DO make money, and good money. We had a salon and was amazed how many women (and some men) spent with us, but spend they did. It's not my place to moralise on whether the lady should feed her kids or have a massage any more than it's my place to help a man decide whether he needs that super drill as an extension to his manhood or not !

We also had a milkshake bar and that to, made good money. The trick is in keeping your costs low and the quality high, it's not rocket science. (although I admit we should have kept an eye on the staff better, thieving gits ! ) The only other thing is to get out or sell it at the right time, Retail, as does everything else, works in cycles. There are no bad ideas, you may just not be in the right place at the right time.


Versatile, what else have you had?
 
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jelly3

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Sugacane are very devious in this regard, as already said they have removed the store list from their website as a number of stores have opened and closed in quick succession:

Sheffield - closed October, and this is one in a busy shopping centre
Barnsley - closed New Year
Doncaster - closed January
Preston - opened November, closed February :eek:
Liverpool - same again (a month or two either way)

And a host of others. Any comments on their page about why the stores are closed, or even mention of it, results in the comment being removed and you being banned from commenting further, They also claim to have "offices" in the UAE and Dubai on their web page. All very dodgy if you ask me.

I found this on the web site, where exactly were you looking????

Sugacane Stores in UK


  • Bakewell - Head Office
    21 Silverdale Park, Darley Dale, Matlock, DE4 2QW
  • Bakewell - Store
    Unit 1 Portland Square, Bakewell, Derbyshire, DE45 1HA
  • Bakewell - Store
    SugaShake & Coffee Nerd
    Unit 4, Granby Croft, Matlock St, Bakewell, Derbyshire, DE45 1ET
  • Buxton - Store
    Unit 5 Cavendish Arcade, Buxton, Derbyshire
  • Chelmsford, Essex - Store
    Unit 8 High Chelmer Shopping Centre
  • Cornwall - Store
    8-10 Fore Street, Camborne, Cornwall
  • London - Central - Store
    44 Queensway
  • London - Harrow - Store
    313 Station Road, Harrow, HA1 2TA
  • Liverpool - Store
    6 Bold St, City Centre
  • Newport, S Wales - Store
    45 Commercial St, NP20 1LP
  • Norfolk - Store
    7 High Street, Derehem
  • Nottingham - Store
    16 The Poultry, Nottingham, NG1 2HU
  • Southport - Store
    207 - 209 Lord Street, Southport, Lancashire
  • Swansea - Store
    6 White Walls, Caste, Swansea, SA1 3AA

  • Barnsley - Store (coming soon)
  • Billericay - Store (coming soon)
  • Cardiff - Store (Coming soon)
  • Chester - Store (Coming soon)
  • Derby - Store (coming soon)
  • Derbyshire - Chesterfield Store (Coming soon)
  • Manchester - Arndale Centre Store (Coming soon)
  • Edinburgh - Shandwick Place Store (Coming soon)
  • Leeds - Store (coming soon)
  • London - Bromley - Store (Coming soon)
  • London - Camden High Street - 106 Camden High Street, London, NW1 - Store (Coming soon)
  • London - Muswell Hill - Store (Coming soon)
  • London - Oxford Street (Coming soon)
  • Manchester - Trafford Centre Store (coming soon)
  • Neath, S Wales - Store (coming soon)
  • Norwich - Store (coming soon)
  • Oxford - Store (coming soon)
  • Sheffield - Meadow Hall - Store (coming soon)
  • Solihull - Store (coming soon)
  • St Albans - Store (coming soon)
  • Warrington - Store (coming soon)
 
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The Ginger Ninja

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^^^^ That list wasn't there a few days ago :D

A lot shorter than it used to be, too. I'd also question if it is accurate as I was in Bakewell last Sunday, went to Portland Sq and couldn't see it nowhere. Also the Manchester Arndale store was there when I was in Manchester three weeks ago, and it says "coming soon". Very odd.
 
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warnie

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I'm sorry please provide a post where I stated or inferred I was clever?

I've clearly touched a nerve which would make me believe things aren't as rosy for you as you'd imply.



Feel free to attack other people on this thread who have posted their OPINION.

You really have come across as quite the idiot.

Clever? you Damo wished me good luck because I was going to need it. To make a statement like that without having a clue about my business, then yes that comes accross to me as you trying to be clever. It also makes you sound like an idiot a lot more than me.

As for things being rosey when have I implied that? all I have stated is that despite the fact that according to you we're about to go bust, the shop is still managing to support 2 families. I have also stated in other posts on this thread that it will never make anyone rich.

That Damo is why I 'attacked' you and no one else on this thread.
 
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As for things being rosey when have I implied that? all I have stated is that despite the fact that according to you we're about to go bust, the shop is still managing to support 2 families. I have also stated in other posts on this thread that it will never make anyone rich.

That Damo is why I 'attacked' you and no one else on this thread.

Anyone in retail that is still going deserves all due credit as its not been easy the past eighteen months or so, and it certainly won't get easier anytime soon. So with this thread title being "most flawed retail ideas..." it simply can't apply to the likes of Warnie who are there and still doing it today.
 
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jelly3

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I think the Nottingham 'branch' may exist. Atleast there's a sweet shop there. Located in a unit occupied by Timberland until a couple of years ago.

Does make me wonder who had the crazy idea of putting a sweet shop just off the main walking route, between mid range fashion retailers and pubs.

What makes me laugh is their international offices. Iraq? Seriously.

If you want to speak to the UK branch you email a Google email address with some bloke's first name, any other branch (Or he probably calls them consulates or something, and you email more@website

It's a case of making yourself appear bigger than you are, so when people go into your shop in Bakewell, Derbyshire, you can tell them all about your franchisees in Dubai, Mauritius and the UAE.

BIG LOL.
 
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mhall

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Versatile, what else have you had?

As you are nosey:

1. Training Company- for the last 15 years
2. Newsagent - 4 years, waited too long to get out, lost our shirts
3. Petrol Station - 2 years - got out just in time
4. Sweet Shop - 2 years - should have stayed in it, relationship issues
5. Beauty Salon - 3 years - lease expired, not worth the grief
6. Nail Salon/ Hairdressing - 2 years - Just not worth the grief
7. Gym - 12 months - (disaster, just escaped bankruptcy)
8. Milk shakes - 12 months - in and out, did what it was supposed to do
8. Gift Shops - for the last 9 years, hardest but love the grief
9. Coffee shop - for the last 7 years, steady but very hard work
10. "Greasy Spoon" - 3 years - great laugh, too much like hard work for minimum spends

Blimey, going back through that makes me feel very old and I can track my life through the businesses we have had. How worryng is that?
 
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Philip Hoyle

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    A boutique in a lonely road no one passes by

    That reminds me of a client (now bankrupt) who opened such a shop in a side street of a village (well away from the shops in the centre, although there weren't many shops in the centre either), that only avid hill-walkers would pass as it was the route to the top of a rather steep hill - no parking outside and not even a main road - just a side road leading to a few houses. The only research she'd done was that she'd seen lots of hikers walking past - she was convinced that the average hill walker had money to spend and would happily call in on their way to/from the hill top! Inevitably, the shop was absolutely deserted Mon-Fri (not traditional hiking days). She wouldn't open on Sundays, so that only left Saturdays where a few hikers would have a look around, but I don't think hikers in full walking gear are in the mood to strip off and start trying on party dresses! She could go literally days, and sometimes a week or two without selling a single thing! Only lasted 6 months until her savings ran out!
     
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    jelly3

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    As you are nosey:

    1. Training Company- for the last 15 years
    2. Newsagent - 4 years, waited too long to get out, lost our shirts
    3. Petrol Station - 2 years - got out just in time
    4. Sweet Shop - 2 years - should have stayed in it, relationship issues
    5. Beauty Salon - 3 years - lease expired, not worth the grief
    6. Nail Salon/ Hairdressing - 2 years - Just not worth the grief
    7. Gym - 12 months - (disaster, just escaped bankruptcy)
    8. Milk shakes - 12 months - in and out, did what it was supposed to do
    8. Gift Shops - for the last 9 years, hardest but love the grief
    9. Coffee shop - for the last 7 years, steady but very hard work
    10. "Greasy Spoon" - 3 years - great laugh, too much like hard work for minimum spends

    Blimey, going back through that makes me feel very old and I can track my life through the businesses we have had. How worryng is that?

    Wow, grafter, I bow to you.

    NB. Always been nosey, have 2 binoculars at home just to watch the neighbours. It is an affliction that started in childhood. I used to knock on neighbours doors and pretend I was locked out and needed the loo, just so I could see what their upstairs rooms looked like. Once I was locked in someones house for 3 days......I cannot tell you how much I loved that.
     
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    As you are nosey:

    1. Training Company- for the last 15 years
    2. Newsagent - 4 years, waited too long to get out, lost our shirts
    3. Petrol Station - 2 years - got out just in time
    4. Sweet Shop - 2 years - should have stayed in it, relationship issues
    5. Beauty Salon - 3 years - lease expired, not worth the grief
    6. Nail Salon/ Hairdressing - 2 years - Just not worth the grief
    7. Gym - 12 months - (disaster, just escaped bankruptcy)
    8. Milk shakes - 12 months - in and out, did what it was supposed to do
    8. Gift Shops - for the last 9 years, hardest but love the grief
    9. Coffee shop - for the last 7 years, steady but very hard work
    10. "Greasy Spoon" - 3 years - great laugh, too much like hard work for minimum spends

    Blimey, going back through that makes me feel very old and I can track my life through the businesses we have had. How worryng is that?

    Nice variety of businesses. If there was one you'd go back to, which would it be?

    And what do you mean by 2. Lost our shirts?

    Cheers,
     
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    mhall

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    Nice variety of businesses. If there was one you'd go back to, which would it be?

    And what do you mean by 2. Lost our shirts?

    Cheers,

    We are currently closing down the training company - very nice while it lasted, especially as we stayed well away from any government funding training but the last twelve months have been just finishing off contracts, companies are very short sighted but training is often the first casualty in a recession. Given the choice I'd expand in Retail Training. May just go dormant for a couple of years and then take another run at it. That gives us the extra time we need for the shops to make sure they stay showing increases but we have a few major challenges that we are sorting.
     
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