Stop wasting time on SEO

[Jake Harris and Wilde]

Hey all,

I guess this is my unpopular opinion in the world of marketing and I wanted to share it here as well (if anyone gives a ****).

There are too many small business owners caught up on SEO, wasting time and money on a niche of marketing that is ridiculously competitive, provides no immediate value and uses too many internal resources.

The last job I had was for a very small company. There was only 4 members of staff including the founder and I was the sales and marketing guy. The business turned over in excess of £2m, had global clients acquired through RFPs and had a reputation for excellent service. The business was roughly 8 years old and for years and even after I left my boss was so keen to move through the ranks of Google. I completely get it. As a small business owner myself I would love to be ranked number 1 on google for Design Agency London, but it is never going to happen and I recognise that.

SEO is sold to small businesses as a long-term investment, no results are guaranteed in the first 6 months, even 12 months, BUT you must commit every month. The minute you stop all the good work is undone and it would have been for nothing. That is ********. SEO agencies allocate you about 2-3 days of work on your site per month for £2500-4500 per month.

Google is sold to us as a magical place where being top is the holy grail, and in some cases it is. But as a small business owner there are much quicker wins than concentrating on meta titles and alt-tags. SEO should be a by-product for small businesses. Slowly move through the ranks by putting out good content for long-tail keywords.

Create content on LinkedIn, reach out direct to people on LinkedIn, go to exhibitions and buy someone a coffee, get a speaking gig, write an ebook and collect emails. These are all quicker wins and quick wins in my experience have been a necessity.

I am more than happy for someone to change my mind. I am open-minded about the subject but as I stand that's my viewpoint...which seems to have got the back up of some SEO marketers AND RIGHTLY SO!

Happy to connect with anyone that has a different opinion to me on LinkedIn. Shout me a connection request - Jake Harris from Harris and Wilde (I can't add a direct link, sorry!)

 

[Calvin Crane]

I do SEO and I would say for the smaller business that is exactly right. There are niches however and even with competition a small business can afford to rank.
What has changed is Google getting so good that the better content is winning the race. So long run it's good. I have seen a drop in SEO requests and myself started to move away and now provide leads. The market is the market!

 

[Darren_Ssc]

SEO can have a dramatic effect if done correctly. The problem comes from people focusing on trophy keywords and phrases that are near impossible to rank for and, even then, would probably not yield the avalanche of sales expected. Compounded, of course, by the expectation that this will all happen in a couple of weeks at most.

 

[fisicx]

I've not paid anyone anything per month and rank really well for a whole bunch of useful phrases all of which earn me a wodge of cash.

So SEO for me wasn't a waste of time. Going to an exhibition or writing an ebook is far to much like hard work. I prefer potential clients to find me. And the ones that do pay my bills.

 

[WebshopMechanic]

Oh Jake.....Jake.....you've just opened up a big old can of worms! (joke)

OK, in my opinion, trying to appear for a competitive, short-tail purchase keyword phrase organically is very tough and doesn't bring in the rewards that it did 5 years ago. In some instances, it's pretty-much pointless to try. You can rank in 1st position but actually appear 7th or 8th on the page behind the PPC ads, shopping Ads and Business listings.

But, there is an argument that many people skip past the paid listings because they know they are paid and not as trustworthy as the organic listings.

Anyone searching for 'Design Agency London' (unless it's the intern searching) would probably look directly at the organic listings because they want a company who is established and who has been there for some time. They know that appearing 1st organically takes effort, skill, and commitment.

Now, I know you have a beef with SEOs and I do too with some (because the cowboys are rife!), but SEO is bloody hard work and it's a skill that is learned over time, not in 5 minutes. Google is becoming more and more complex so ranking is tougher. SEOs get a bad rep because it's a slow burner but that is the name of the game. Yes, you could spend £2500 a month on an agency but you could spend that easily with PPC or Facebook ads too and get sweet FA in return if you didn't know what you were doing.

Some keywords have a high competition level which means it takes time. It's just a different type of marketing channel and a different strategy. The point of SEO is to rank for keywords your customer will be searching for but for the long-term. It's not a quick win. Quick wins, like you point out are a totally different style of marketing. In reality, you need both because you can't rely on just one channel.

If you own your own business (which it looks like you do) then quick wins are fine but, if you have a sales team who leave and run off with your database, the relationship and your client, what do you have? At least with your search listings you have something to work with and to continually build upon. It should also continually improve with effort and a good strategy.

Finally, the objective of a true content-driven SEO campaign should be to capture people at the 'top of the funnel' when they are in the research phase. It's a conversation starter in the AWARENESS phase. (Look up the AIDA marketing principle if you are not familiar).

Instead of aiming for the money term 'Design Agency London' you should aim to appear for terms that provide content that helps them to answer questions like:

• Design agency costs
• How to choose the right design agency
• How to brief a design agency
• Brand design best practice
• Packaging design tips
• Logo design Do's and dont's
• Worst design agency mistakes
• 50 best corporate logo examples
• What to think about when designing a new website
• Brand identity mistakes
• Corporate design case studies

These are just examples but you get the idea. Someone looking for a design agency may not even know what they need but you need to position yourself as the experts / go-to resource for every single area in the design agency sphere. You make your company 'the authority' in your industry and people will find you.

In reality, it's not just about ranking with some crappy keyword-tagged SEO page that offers no value. It's about appearing with a page that:

• Engages the prospect with great content
• Adds a shed-ton of value
• Resolves problems
• Answers questions
• Builds trust (client logos, reviews, events you've appeared at, etc)
• Get's them to sign-up to your mailing list, pick the phone up or send an email

SEO is also part PR too. You don't necessarily need to hire a PR agency as well but you should start appearing on the websites and in the publications that your audience reads. This is the off-site link-building, authority signals kind of stuff that separates the wheat from the chaff. Create useful content and that will be easier to achieve.

Maybe SEO does serve a purpose after all?

I'd like to think that I've delivered for my clients over the years, even in the most competitive niches. I've had no complaints to date so something must be working for them.

Cheers

Matt

 

[Jake Harris and Wilde]

You can rank in 1st position but actually appear 7th or 8th on the page behind the PPC ads, shopping Ads and Business listings.

Exactly. Top will never truly be top.

 

[Jake Harris and Wilde]

I've not paid anyone anything per month and rank really well for a whole bunch of useful phrases all of which earn me a wodge of cash.

So SEO for me wasn't a waste of time. Going to an exhibition or writing an ebook is far to much like hard work. I prefer potential clients to find me. And the ones that do pay my bills.

Good stuff, really happy to hear that. Unfortunately, for so many niche's, small businesses this isn't the case. How long did it take your website to start ranking highly?

 

[Jake Harris and Wilde]

Oh Jake.....Jake.....you've just opened up a big old can of worms! (joke)

OK, in my opinion, trying to appear for a competitive, short-tail purchase keyword phrase organically is very tough and doesn't bring in the rewards that it did 5 years ago. In some instances, it's pretty-much pointless to try. You can rank in 1st position but actually appear 7th or 8th on the page behind the PPC ads, shopping Ads and Business listings.

But, there is an argument that many people skip past the paid listings because they know they are paid and not as trustworthy as the organic listings.

Anyone searching for 'Design Agency London' (unless it's the intern searching) would probably look directly at the organic listings because they want a company who is established and who has been there for some time. They know that appearing 1st organically takes effort, skill, and commitment.

Now, I know you have a beef with SEOs and I do too with some (because the cowboys are rife!), but SEO is bloody hard work and it's a skill that is learned over time, not in 5 minutes. Google is becoming more and more complex so ranking is tougher. SEOs get a bad rep because it's a slow burner but that is the name of the game. Yes, you could spend £2500 a month on an agency but you could spend that easily with PPC or Facebook ads too and get sweet FA in return if you didn't know what you were doing.

Some keywords have a high competition level which means it takes time. It's just a different type of marketing channel and a different strategy. The point of SEO is to rank for keywords your customer will be searching for but for the long-term. It's not a quick win. Quick wins, like you point out are a totally different style of marketing. In reality, you need both because you can't rely on just one channel.

If you own your own business (which it looks like you do) then quick wins are fine but, if you have a sales team who leave and run off with your database, the relationship and your client, what do you have? At least with your search listings you have something to work with and to continually build upon. It should also continually improve with effort and a good strategy.

Finally, the objective of a true content-driven SEO campaign should be to capture people at the 'top of the funnel' when they are in the research phase. It's a conversation starter in the AWARENESS phase. (Look up the AIDA marketing principle if you are not familiar).

Instead of aiming for the money term 'Design Agency London' you should aim to appear for terms that provide content that helps them to answer questions like:

• Design agency costs
• How to choose the right design agency
• How to brief a design agency
• Brand design best practice
• Packaging design tips
• Logo design Do's and dont's
• Worst design agency mistakes
• 50 best corporate logo examples
• What to think about when designing a new website
• Brand identity mistakes
• Corporate design case studies

These are just examples but you get the idea. Someone looking for a design agency may not even know what they need but you need to position yourself as the experts / go-to resource for every single area in the design agency sphere. You make your company 'the authority' in your industry and people will find you.

In reality, it's not just about ranking with some crappy keyword-tagged SEO page that offers no value. It's about appearing with a page that:

• Engages the prospect with great content
• Adds a shed-ton of value
• Resolves problems
• Answers questions
• Builds trust (client logos, reviews, events you've appeared at, etc)
• Get's them to sign-up to your mailing list, pick the phone up or send an email

SEO is also part PR too. You don't necessarily need to hire a PR agency as well but you should start appearing on the websites and in the publications that your audience reads. This is the off-site link-building, authority signals kind of stuff that separates the wheat from the chaff. Create useful content and that will be easier to achieve.

Maybe SEO does serve a purpose after all?

I'd like to think that I've delivered for my clients over the years, even in the most competitive niches. I've had no complaints to date so something must be working for them.

Cheers

Matt

Some fantastic points Matt, I really appreciate you taking the time to send this over. There is no denying SEO plays a part long-term with the right partner and the right content. I still think that a startup or small business in a competitive space shouldn't be allocating large resources of time and money to SEO!

 

[fisicx]

Good stuff, really happy to hear that. Unfortunately, for so many niche's, small businesses this isn't the case. How long did it take your website to start ranking highly?

About 2 weeks.

No link building, I just built a site that ticked all of Google's boxes. It's not difficult.

 

[WebshopMechanic]

If you're a small business then you need to work on it from the start. I admit, it's unlikely to bear fruit in the first couple of weeks but, the sooner you start, the sooner the leads will be generated.

However, the fact that you pointed out 'building relationships' as a no.1 priority is correct.

Whether you are prospecting on LinkedIn, creating content on your own website, talking to bloggers, getting on the radar of journalists, helping potential clients in chat forums, commenting on blogs / social, replying to customer support emails, or even closing deals over the phone, it's all about building 'the relationship'.

Nobody wants to be sold to. They simply want somebody they can trust to solve their problems when they need them.

 

[Karimbo]

Can't believe someone used clickbait to reel in viewers on a forum. You seem to create a straw man arguement for SEO being a rip off at the expensive end, but that isn't SEO, that is a rip off which exists in every sector.

Realy question is why do you use clickbait to get people to read the post and get people to add you on linkedin?

 

[StevePoster]

You can rank in 1st position but actually appear 7th or 8th on the page behind the PPC ads, shopping Ads and Business listings.

Exactly. Top will never truly be top.

But there is, Its zero rankings in Google. It is considered as the most relevant piece of information in the subject of the users query.

 

[gpietersz]

I agree Jake is being rather sweeping, but anyone paying an SEO faces two problems:

1. Its difficult to measure results
2. Most business owners have no idea of how to assess an SEO's competence

I agree neither is unique to SEO, but bad SEO can be damaging and there are a lot of snake oil SEOs around so its worse for SEO.

 

[Aishley Giles]

I agree on your points but rather paying to agencies why not we do it ourself. Of course, it takes time, we can give an hour daily for this.

 

[gpietersz]

Aishley, SEO has become quite complex these days. DIY means learning enough to avoid doing silly things like keyword stuffing, link buying, while also learning how to write the right content and structure a site correctly, and know when to add schema.org and twitter and open graph meta data.

 

[NathanGrieve]

SEO is something i try to focus on as a secondary indicator. If i am creating great content, organic clicks will come. I stay away from stuffing keywords into posts

 

[fisicx]

If i am creating great content, organic clicks will come.

Not any more they don't. Or at least not in any quantity.

I stay away from stuffing keywords into posts

This hasn't worked for years.

SEO is a whole different animal to the one @Jake Harris and Wilde describe. There are still a huge number of unexploited niches for which you can rank well for little effort.

 

[NathanGrieve]

What are you suggesting?

Not any more they don't. Or at least not in any quantity.

This hasn't worked for years.

SEO is a whole different animal to the one @Jake Harris and Wilde describe. There are still a huge number of unexploited niches for which you can rank well for little effort.

What do you suggest?

 

[fisicx]

It all depends on your marketing strategy. You said SEO was secondary which suggests your traffic comes from other sources.

But if you want to rank well you first need to sort out what you want to rank for. You then build the whole site around these keywords. The content and navigation will be the central core of your site development. Build authority and trust and google will reward you.

 

[Happy Koala SEO Agency]

i think for small businesses and startups - it is probably better to have a well converting webpage or clickfunnel sales funnel and send traffic to it through adwords or facebook to get leads.

just concentrate on 1 product or service and expand from there.

SEO can come later when they can afford it and want to grow their company.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

I will answer your question as a question

How did the majority of your customers find you, and how did you find your suppliers,

There is no perfect answer rolls Royce aero engines probably do not have to spend much on advertising, but do spend a lot on selling their products, A company selling EU wide online need to advertise itself on the best cost efficient way which may well be PPC or being in the top 20 odd in search engines

 

[Nochexman]

Just wanted to say thank you for a really interesting debate. Kudos to Jake Harris.

 

[Instamixes]

Like all other things SEO also has its pros and cons. SEO is a long term game you should not expect fast results from SEO. I think one should focus on both Paid Media And SEO.

 

[Paulo1Chop]

Hopefully this SEO post will not get ranked because of all the SEO related mentions of SEO about SEO!

 

[Dotzo.networks]

For small businesses first, they have to focus on the content and concentrate on posting on facebook. Always remember to be active.

 

[fisicx]

For small businesses first, they have to focus on the content and concentrate on posting on facebook. Always remember to be active.

You have posted a load of contradictory stuff this morning. None of which makes any sense.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

You have posted a load of contradictory stuff this morning. None of which makes any sense.

Random seo people posting gibberish to get to the promised land of 'post a link'. Par for the course innit?