Seeking e-commerce platform recommendations

[campbeji]

Fair enough, I read a few more of your posts and by and large they are helpful, so I apologize for that, I was wrong.

It does make me wonder why you seem to have a go at me though, 2nd time you have been aggressive with me.

I also notice that you still haven't answered the op's question.

Jim

 

[TheWebDesignCompany]

Hello @thetiger2015,

We're looking to find a platform where we can choose a template and therefore not need a graphic designer, and where we can minimize the development side of things as much as possible. Ideally, if we can find another service to connect the e-commerce site to our local sql server, that'd be great, as opposed to us coding it.

There are tons of Shopify themes available or if you wanted another option, WooCommerce, again there are tons of themes available very inexpensively.

 

[TabletSalsa]

Hi TabletSalsa

I'm not a web developer nor do I want to be, but I do know a little about it.

As a lot of people have mentioned there are lots of questions to ask and lots of paths to take. I am going to make a few general assumptions, you want to do this inhouse and you would prefer to do it for as little as possible, that's the approach I take anyway. I have had poor experiences working with developers so I try to stay away from them now.

Anyway, I would use Shopify, perfectly good enough to handle whatever you need, easy to use and maintain as long as you don't try to get to fancy.

I would then get Zapier and set up a 'zap' to create a line in SQL whenever you get a new order, I just tried this on my own setup and it took me two minutes to do the basic job, although I don't actually use SQL so I couldn't test it.

Shopify costs a few pounds and in Zapier the shopify and SQL are premium apps so also cost a bit, I haven't priced it out but under £50 a month at a guess.

I use a similar setup but with my accounts package, Quickbooks, and Trello, this changed my life We went from using paper order forms to using PC and phones, saved so much time and meant that we were much more organised.

It would be fair to say that I am a fan boy of Zapier and Trello

Another good thing about Shopify is that you can set up a virtual terminal for processing card payments, it is a little more expensive than the system I had before on the transactions but it doesn't have a monthly rental, it saved me more than the cost of Shopify each month. Of course that all depends on volumes and how you use card payments etc so do your own sums.

Good Luck
Jim

Thanks for your feedback, Jim! Shopify is where I am leaning to thus far as I've researched.

 

[campbeji]

Thanks for your feedback, Jim! Shopify is where I am leaning to thus far as I've researched.

Hi TabletSalsa,

I like Shopify, but that is only because I have used it. I originally started using it because a 'Guru' I liked said great things about it and as part of a course I did with him I got a discount voucher If he had recommended Woocommerce or WordPress etc I probably would have used them. In saying that I would not build a mission-critical site on WordPress, it is a pia to keep up to date, I have a site at the moment that is broken because word press updated and the theme I am using threw a fit.

Unless you are pushing the boundaries of what you need the site to do you would find that all of the systems will probably do a decent job. From reading what you want I get the impression that you would like 'easy' to be a feature. If so you want one of the hosted type of sites like Shopify, they are a lot harder to break than something that you have hosted yourself.

If it was me I would have a look at what you will be doing with the site, based on your experience, so how many sales a month and total value per month. I'd then take these numbers and look at the costs of the various platforms and work out how much it will cost you to have the store. For example, if you are going to have 500 sales at a total of £10,000 then with the Basic Shopify the cost will be £350.00 ish per month assuming all payments are via credit card, but about £360 ish with the standard plan (which also has added benefits). No idea how much Woo commerce etc would cost but I know that some of the systems I looked at in the past got really expensive. My throughput on Shopify is nowhere near this and I am firmly in the Basic plan, although I do pay a lot less than the £25 per month fee.

The Shopify standard plan does have automation systems built in but I have not used them as I do not have it. I use Zapier, I have a Zap set up that will create an invoice in my accounts system when ever I get an order via Shopify, so that's good. When I get a new invoice in my accounts system I have a Zap that will create a new 'card' in Trello which I use as a production control system. It works really well for us and I set it up myself. When I got Zappier I had a poke about with it for a bit, watched a few videos etc, I then set my Zaps up and they worked first time, it took maybe 5 mins for each.

I have been dying to create a really complicated Zap, but I just can't think of anything I need yet :-(

Good Luck
Jim

 

[TabletSalsa]

Hi TabletSalsa,

I like Shopify, but that is only because I have used it. I originally started using it because a 'Guru' I liked said great things about it and as part of a course I did with him I got a discount voucher If he had recommended Woocommerce or WordPress etc I probably would have used them. In saying that I would not build a mission-critical site on WordPress, it is a pia to keep up to date, I have a site at the moment that is broken because word press updated and the theme I am using threw a fit.

Unless you are pushing the boundaries of what you need the site to do you would find that all of the systems will probably do a decent job. From reading what you want I get the impression that you would like 'easy' to be a feature. If so you want one of the hosted type of sites like Shopify, they are a lot harder to break than something that you have hosted yourself.

If it was me I would have a look at what you will be doing with the site, based on your experience, so how many sales a month and total value per month. I'd then take these numbers and look at the costs of the various platforms and work out how much it will cost you to have the store. For example, if you are going to have 500 sales at a total of £10,000 then with the Basic Shopify the cost will be £350.00 ish per month assuming all payments are via credit card, but about £360 ish with the standard plan (which also has added benefits). No idea how much Woo commerce etc would cost but I know that some of the systems I looked at in the past got really expensive. My throughput on Shopify is nowhere near this and I am firmly in the Basic plan, although I do pay a lot less than the £25 per month fee.

The Shopify standard plan does have automation systems built in but I have not used them as I do not have it. I use Zapier, I have a Zap set up that will create an invoice in my accounts system when ever I get an order via Shopify, so that's good. When I get a new invoice in my accounts system I have a Zap that will create a new 'card' in Trello which I use as a production control system. It works really well for us and I set it up myself. When I got Zappier I had a poke about with it for a bit, watched a few videos etc, I then set my Zaps up and they worked first time, it took maybe 5 mins for each.

I have been dying to create a really complicated Zap, but I just can't think of anything I need yet :-(

Good Luck
Jim

I'm glad you mentioned what you did about WooCommerce regarding keeping it up to date because that helps me again lean more toward Shopify.

 

[fisicx]

I'm glad you mentioned what you did about WooCommerce regarding keeping it up to date because that helps me again lean more toward Shopify.

It’s not as bad as he suggested. Woocommerce is easy to keep updated and theme issues only occur if you buy cheap unsupported themes. I’ve never had a site go down because of an update. And costs are still £0/month.

 

[TabletSalsa]

It’s not as bad as he suggested. Woocommerce is easy to keep updated and theme issues only occur if you buy cheap unsupported themes. I’ve never had a site go down because of an update. And costs are still £0/month.

Hi @fisicx
Do you know how WooCommerce and Shopify compare in terms of integrating the platform with our local sql database? If WooCommerce gives us more flexibility and opportunity for automating tasks, that could be a deal-breaker. Thanks!

 

[Shopclicks]

I'm glad you mentioned what you did about WooCommerce regarding keeping it up to date because that helps me again lean more toward Shopify.

Have you done the maths based on current sales, to determine how much you'll be paying Shopify for the privilege of using their platform?

As opposed to only paying payment transaction fees (for example a Stripe account 1.5% + 20p for UK cards) and hosting (£190/year) with Wordpress/Woocommerce.

 

[campbeji]

I'm glad you mentioned what you did about WooCommerce regarding keeping it up to date because that helps me again lean more toward Shopify.

Hi TabletSalsa,

It wasn't WooCommerce it was Wordpress that I had issues with.

Pretty much have no experience with WooCommerce so can't say one way or another.

Thanks
Jim

 

[fisicx]

Hi @fisicx
Do you know how WooCommerce and Shopify compare in terms of integrating the platform with our local sql database? If WooCommerce gives us more flexibility and opportunity for automating tasks, that could be a deal-breaker. Thanks!

It all depends on what sort of integration you need. Connecting a two databases isn’t overly complicated if the structures are similar. It’s going to need some custom code but the right developer shouldn’t have to much difficulty fixing it.

 

[campbeji]

It’s not as bad as he suggested. Woocommerce is easy to keep updated and theme issues only occur if you buy cheap unsupported themes. I’ve never had a site go down because of an update. And costs are still £0/month.

Hi fisicx,

It was Wordpress, not Woo Commerce, that I was criticising. I have next to no experience of Woo Commerce so can't say anything meaningful about it.

Thanks
Jim

 

[campbeji]

It all depends on what sort of integration you need. Connecting a two databases isn’t overly complicated if the structures are similar. It’s going to need some custom code but the right developer shouldn’t have to much difficulty fixing it.

Hi TableSalsa,

I'd be wary about getting custom code done, I mean fisicx is correct that connecting databases together isn't that hard, even if the two databases are not similar, and a competent developer will be able to sort it out in no time. My concern is that it is a custom code and so can be a weak link in the system. If it stops working then your sales database is going to be out of date. The cost to get a fix put into place can be large, in terms of manual data entry, getting a developer to fix it quickly etc.

These types of errors can creep in because of all sorts of things such as passwords changing, updates to either system, any additional software being used etc. Everyone will say that it is robust and won't break, which is fine but until you have had a stupid thing happen that has brought a system to it's knees and no one knows why then i'd say that caution is worth it.

I'm basing this on experience, which admittedly is 10 years out of date, where in a previous life I ran a large SQL based database for an Aerospace company, I loved it but it was challenging work. No doubt things have got easier since then with software improvements etc

Jim

 

[fisicx]

It was Wordpress, not Woo Commerce, that I was criticising. I have next to no experience of Woo Commerce so can't say anything meaningful about it.

Wordpress is now very stable, updates can be automated and if you install a supported theme there won’t ever be compatibility issues. If you have to pay to keep things updated and working there is something wrong with your installation.

 

[campbeji]

Wordpress is now very stable, updates can be automated and if you install a supported theme there won’t ever be compatibility issues. If you have to pay to keep things updated and working there is something wrong with your installation.

Yeah, except my issue was just last week with a supported theme.

The website is still a mess, even though the website has been 'fixed'.

The failure was so bad that I couldn't even get Wordpress to run, I logged in and it effectively told me that Wordpress was broken and sent me to an error page.

I had to get my hosting admin to do a reinstall or something just so I could get into it.

Jim

 

[Shopclicks]

Do you know how WooCommerce and Shopify compare in terms of integrating the platform with our local sql database? If WooCommerce gives us more flexibility and opportunity for automating tasks, that could be a deal-breaker. Thanks!

You can use Zapier to do this: https://zapier.com/apps/woocommerce/integrations/sql-server

 

[fisicx]

Yeah, except my issue was just last week with a supported theme.

The website is still a mess, even though the website has been 'fixed'.

The failure was so bad that I couldn't even get Wordpress to run, I logged in and it effectively told me that Wordpress was broken and sent me to an error page.

I had to get my hosting admin to do a reinstall or something just so I could get into it.

Don’t really want to get into an argument here but the problem wasn’t the Wordpress update, it was your theme or a plugin at fault. Both of which are easily fixed if you have ftp access.

 

[campbeji]

Don’t really want to get into an argument here but the problem wasn’t the Wordpress update, it was your theme or a plugin at fault. Both of which are easily fixed if you have ftp access.

Hi fisicx

Your right, Wordpress worked fine, it auto updated as it was supposed to do. The Theme I used then threw a fit because it had an issue with the new version of Wordpress. I believe that if the theme had updated first it would have worked fine.

Yes, it turned out to be fairly easy to fix using FTP, we had to take out all of the theme files and replace them with the files from the new version. Now when I say easy to fix, it was simple for the guy who runs the servers, I would have been able to do it but it was knowing what the problem was that gave me issues. For someone who isn't familiar with wordpress/ftp at all it would have involved getting some one to do it. I'm lucky, my server guy loves this stuff and helps me for free, I hate to think how much it would have cost to get someone to do it for me.

My point is that TabletSalsa is looking for a system that is easy to use and will work well. That probably has a lower threshold that it would mean to you, and even me. I used to be an 'expert' in this stuff, 10 years ago, but it feels like you don't look at it for a few months and it all turns into a foreign language.

I feel that TabletSalsa is looking for a 'product' type system rater than a DIY system. That is why I recommended Shopify (or similar) and Zapier.

Jim

 

[TabletSalsa]

Have you done the maths based on current sales, to determine how much you'll be paying Shopify for the privilege of using their platform?

As opposed to only paying payment transaction fees (for example a Stripe account 1.5% + 20p for UK cards) and hosting (£190/year) with Wordpress/Woocommerce.

Hi @Shopclicks
I appreciate you bringing that up because it's one area I am still trying to fully understand. My understanding is that Shopify will cost more annual than WooCommerce. And then in terms of transaction fees and/or credit card fees, perhaps we could use Shopify payments. I believe the credit card fees for Shopify are comparable to the transaction fees for WooCommerce based on what I have researched.

 

[TabletSalsa]

Hi TableSalsa,

I'd be wary about getting custom code done, I mean fisicx is correct that connecting databases together isn't that hard, even if the two databases are not similar, and a competent developer will be able to sort it out in no time. My concern is that it is a custom code and so can be a weak link in the system. If it stops working then your sales database is going to be out of date. The cost to get a fix put into place can be large, in terms of manual data entry, getting a developer to fix it quickly etc.

These types of errors can creep in because of all sorts of things such as passwords changing, updates to either system, any additional software being used etc. Everyone will say that it is robust and won't break, which is fine but until you have had a stupid thing happen that has brought a system to it's knees and no one knows why then i'd say that caution is worth it.

I'm basing this on experience, which admittedly is 10 years out of date, where in a previous life I ran a large SQL based database for an Aerospace company, I loved it but it was challenging work. No doubt things have got easier since then with software improvements etc

Jim

Hi @campbeji
I'm considering using a solution like Zapier or Skyvia which will not require coding from what I understand.

 

[TabletSalsa]

If we manually process our customers credit cards for a payment of an order, are we able to avoid paying the credit card fees / transaction fees associated with Shopify, WooCommerce, etc?

 

[Shopclicks]

If we manually process our customers credit cards for a payment of an order, are we able to avoid paying the credit card fees / transaction fees associated with Shopify, WooCommerce, etc?

Whichever company you choose to process your payments, they are going to charge a fee for the transaction. It's far safer for you and the customer to let that happen through your PCI compliant website.

Overall, your fees are going to be lower with Woocommerce as you are only paying a card processing fee. How much you pay depends on the card processor you use.

 

[japancool]

If we manually process our customers credit cards for a payment of an order, are we able to avoid paying the credit card fees / transaction fees associated with Shopify, WooCommerce, etc?

Manually process how, via a card machine?

 

[TabletSalsa]

@japancool and @Shopclicks

Right now for our current site, we are sent the customers card info that they entered when submitting their order. Then when we ship the order, we log into Bank of America online and manually input the card information and amount and charge them that way, if I understand correctly.

So, if we could setup our future e-commerce site to essentially gather and store the customers card info, then perhaps we could manually (through BOA online) charge them for their order and eliminate having to use a card processor all together and the fees associated with it?

 

[Shopclicks]

Right now for our current site, we are sent the customers card info that they entered when submitting their order. Then when we ship the order, we log into Bank of America online and manually input the card information and amount and charge them that way, if I understand correctly.

So, if we could setup our future e-commerce site to essentially gather and store the customers card info, then perhaps we could manually (through BOA online) charge them for their order and eliminate having to use a card processor all together and the fees associated with it?

You have at least two concerns here.
1. How are you securely storing customer card details? PCI compliance?
2. Do you really think you're not being charged a card processing fee by BoA?

 

[TabletSalsa]

You have at least two concerns here.
1. How are you securely storing customer card details? PCI compliance?
2. Do you really think you're not being charged a card processing fee by BoA?

Ok, good points. I actually just learned BoA is charging us a % which is higher than most of these payment processors. So, I'll throw that idea out. Thanks!

 

[japancool]

I had the same thoughts as Shopclicks. How are you actually receiving those card details? What you describe doesn't sound terribly secure.

Ok, good points. I actually just learned BoA is charging us a % which is higher than most of these payment processors. So, I'll throw that idea out. Thanks!

How long have you been trading? It is somewhat concerning that you've only just found this out.

 

[japancool]

eliminating the need for someone to manually take online orders and process them into our own database.

What does your SQL database actually do?

 

[NEF]

I used opencart for years and I liked it BUT I later moved to woocommerce and hosed on cloudways. Installed a cache plugin, used all there provided security, cache and performance enhancements and cloudflare. I wouldn't change anything now, fast, heaps of control and very east once you get the hang of it , just takes a little times, updates are very simple.

 

[japancool]

I used opencart for years and I liked it BUT I later moved to woocommerce and hosed on cloudways. Installed a cache plugin, used all there provided security, cache and performance enhancements and cloudflare. I wouldn't change anything now, fast, heaps of control and very east once you get the hang of it , just takes a little times, updates are very simple.

Why did you move away from Opencart?

 

[TabletSalsa]

I had the same thoughts as Shopclicks. How are you actually receiving those card details? What you describe doesn't sound terribly secure.



How long have you been trading? It is somewhat concerning that you've only just found this out.

Other folks in accounting handle that so I knew next to nothing about the BoA side of things.

 

[fisicx]

Other folks in accounting handle that so I knew next to nothing about the BoA side of things.

Maybe you need to ask them as this will limit the sort of website you plan to build.

 

[Kerwin]

@japancool and @Shopclicks

Right now for our current site, we are sent the customers card info that they entered when submitting their order. Then when we ship the order, we log into Bank of America online and manually input the card information and amount and charge them that way, if I understand correctly.

So, if we could setup our future e-commerce site to essentially gather and store the customers card info, then perhaps we could manually (through BOA online) charge them for their order and eliminate having to use a card processor all together and the fees associated with it?

This is a massive no and is extremely insecure. You need to read this now:

A guide to PCI compliance

PCI DSS sets the minimum standard for data security. Follow our step-by-step guide to validating and maintaining PCI compliance for every organization.

stripe.com

and fix all your problems ASAP.

 

[danawhite]

I recommend Shopify and can provide recommendations about shopify store boosting. I've actually encountered the conversion rate was decreasing, and I couldn't do anything about it! I sincerely recommend that you delve into the topic of Shopify store boosting and take a look at these helpful information how to increase conversion rate shopify

 

[EcomAlistair]

Does Shopify offer an API? You could write something fairly easily in SQL Server to poll a REST API to pull in and process new orders.

Bingo

 

[EcomAlistair]

@japancool and @Shopclicks

Right now for our current site, we are sent the customers card info that they entered when submitting their order. Then when we ship the order, we log into Bank of America online and manually input the card information and amount and charge them that way, if I understand correctly.

So, if we could setup our future e-commerce site to essentially gather and store the customers card info, then perhaps we could manually (through BOA online) charge them for their order and eliminate having to use a card processor all together and the fees associated with it?

You could easily build a custom Stripe checkout into which you can pass order total and key metadata to help you link it to the order form.

You could also utilise GoCardless for the UK segment of your customers - very cheap going this route, but defo something you'd need to speak with your customers about