School holidays killing business

[philludg]

Im a seasonal business in Cornwall, and it's the middle of June and it's dead, and I mean dead, we are way down on last year, we are putting it down to this stupid rule were parents get fined for taking there kids out of school, has anyone got any thoughts on this stupid rule and is it effecting you?

 

[WHARTY]

It's been around for years now, so doubt it's much to do with the kids being on holiday. Anyway I didn't think the school holidays had started yet?

What is it you do? Maybe it's the weather, I know we are having a pretty poor summer so far this year up north.

 

[philludg]

I belive the government changed the rules in September last year, if you take your children out of school outside the school holidays you will be fined, they weren't as strict before that, so what it means is everyone with kids can only go on holiday for around a six week period mid July to end of August

 

[fisicx]

It's not school holidays killing your business, it's your business plan.

If you rely on tourists then you need to expect trade to die off during term time.

 

[philludg]

As I said we are a seasonal business, the whole of Cornwall relies on tourists, like every other coastal town I would think

 

[Ian J]

We have been going to Lanzarote for Easter for the past few years and this year it was far busier than I have ever seen it before - even busier than when we went in August a couple of years ago so perhaps more people are going overseas at the expense of UK holidays

 

[philludg]

Yes, I think your are probably right, I know we're I would rather go LOL

 

[garyk]

It's been around for years now, so doubt it's much to do with the kids being on holiday. Anyway I didn't think the school holidays had started yet?

No, it used to be at the schools discretion. Now they don't have a judgement to make, unless its visiting family overseas that are in the armed forces or a death in the family any time taken off during term time is put down as 'unauthorised absence' and the council enforce this.

Doing it the first time you probably won't get a fine but repeat it and you probably will!

 

[philludg]

Thanks garyk for putting it a far better way than I did, and it is having a terriable effect on tourism the government have got to do something quick.

 

[fisicx]

Nope, it's only recently that parents started taking children out of schools during term time, 10 years ago is was a rare occasion.

The problem isn't the government, it's the tourist industry jacking up prices during school holidays.

 

[JMRidley]

Prices always have been higher during school holidays (I'm 50 now but can still remember my parents moaning about it) and parents have been taking their kids out of school for much longer than 10 years. And surely now that parents have no choice but to book their hols during school holidays means that prices will be jacked up even further as there will be more people looking for the same weeks. Also means that businesses that are seasonal will need to make as much as possible in a shorter period of time so again prices are therefore likely to be higher not lower.

 

[tony84]

Parents have been getting fines for years if they take kids out of school.
Putting that to one side, who cares about kids education so long as your business flourishes eh?

 

[MyAccountantOnline]

Im a seasonal business in Cornwall, and it's the middle of June and it's dead, and I mean dead, we are way down on last year, we are putting it down to this stupid rule were parents get fined for taking there kids out of school, has anyone got any thoughts on this stupid rule and is it effecting you?

Did many parents actually take children out of school for holidays before the new rules though?

 

[Deleted member 59730]

This whole problem is being caused by the pressure on schools to have rigid teaching guidelines for every week of the school year. No thought has been given for natural absences through illness which can add up to a lot more than a few weeks holiday occasionally.

In some schools teachers do not have time to spot those kids who just sit in class and learn nothing.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2010/may/07/poor-literacy-numeracy

 

[Jeff FV]

This whole problem is being caused by the pressure on schools to have rigid teaching guidelines for every week of the school year. No thought has been given for natural absences through illness which can add up to a lot more than a few weeks holiday occasionally.

In some schools teachers do not have time to spot those kids who just sit in class and learn nothing.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2010/may/07/poor-literacy-numeracy

I'm afraid I totally disagree with this. What are these guidelines and who is imposing them?

The article you link to rightly highlights the "long tail of under achievement" and this is very due to those that don't really value education. Absences from school do have a significant impact upon a pupil's attainment, the aim of the legislation was to target those who are persistently absent from school. It is a bit of a sledgehammer to crack a nut, but on the whole it is a good thing.

 

[MASSEY]

I used to bunk off secondary school all the time, they needed to do something to stop this, fining parents seems to have helped. Although i would imagine it's still just as easy to turn up to your form room for the register and then go off for the day

I find the school holidays hit an miss and it probably does affect some businesses depending on the sector.

I think business is also quite affected by the weather, the sun seems to help inspire more people to blow the cob webs off of their wallets.

Although in reality with the right marketing people should be busy all year round.

Luckily we've got a nice customer at the moment keeping us busy for 8 weeks ££££££££££££££££££££

 

[garyk]

The problem isn't the government, it's the tourist industry jacking up prices during school holidays.

Agreed but there needs to be some enforcement to stop this. Difficult for overseas I guess but centerparcs in the UK are one of the biggest culprits for rinsing parents in holiday time.

 

[Philip Hoyle]

Did many parents actually take children out of school for holidays before the new rules though?

Some parents who don't value education would take their kids out at the drop of a hat to save a few quid. They were the ones that needed to be targetted.

As usual, the rules are a sledge hammer to crack a nut, so affect all the more responsible parents who do value the education, but either took time off at appropriate times of the school year (such as the last couple of weeks of the Summer term (early July) when nothing was done anyway), or for the odd day extra at the start or end of the school holidays to enable a Monday or Friday flight for example.

It's a shame that the headmasters let it get out of control in the first place, and an even bigger shame that, as usual, they don't seem to be able to target the real culprits and everyone suffers instead.

 

[tony84]

Agreed but there needs to be some enforcement to stop this. Difficult for overseas I guess but centerparcs in the UK are one of the biggest culprits for rinsing parents in holiday time.

The problem is, they say that they reduce the prices out of season to entiice people and customers see it the other way.

 

[OldWelshGuy]

Back to the original post. I think you are maybe confusing cause and effect. The pound is riding high at the moment, foreign holidays are cheap however that doesn't fit with your school holiday thing does it. Are there a LOT less people/children around than normal (in your area?)

things are changing dramatically, people are moving to short breaks rather than weekly breaks, and of course what is it that you actually do?

 

[Jeff FV]

It's a shame that the headmasters let it get out of control in the first place, and an even bigger shame that, as usual, they don't seem to be able to target the real culprits and everyone suffers instead.

Yep, let's blame the teachers, not those that are taking their children out of school.

As I have said on another thread, the schools now have no flexibility in this, so it is not them that "don't seem to be able to target the real culprits"

 

[1977]

Agreed but there needs to be some enforcement to stop this. Difficult for overseas I guess but centerparcs in the UK are one of the biggest culprits for rinsing parents in holiday time.

We recently went to centre parcs 2 weeks after half term (no fine, the head mistress told my wife time together as a family is as important as anything else).

My wife, out of curiosity booked the same package during the summer holidays and it was more than twice as expensive!

Childs education aside, for the £100 fine we could have got is worth sucking up.

I should add this won't happen again.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Back to the original post. I think you are maybe confusing cause and effect. The pound is riding high at the moment, foreign holidays are cheap however that doesn't fit with your school holiday thing does it. Are there a LOT less people/children around than normal (in your area?)

things are changing dramatically, people are moving to short breaks rather than weekly breaks, and of course what is it that you actually do?

Its not that. I too am involved in a business which relies on Cornish tourism. This is a record year for peak bookings because of the Poldark effect. Easter was more crowded than ever and then visitor numbers fell off a cliff.

The UK could have followed France and Germany by having staggered school holidays for different parts of the country. I once read that Germany saves billions in foreign exchange by having staggered holidays. France has just re-organised their holiday areas on the lines of new regions. (The first suggested areas suffered a setback when someone spotted one of the areas shaped like a penis.)

 

[OldWelshGuy]

I am giving up on this thread as the original question isn't being discussed it has gone into teachers and schools

 

[japancool]

OP -

Have you considered a way to target your business at other people, other than UK families with kids, who won't have the same restrictions?

Singles, couples, foreign tourists etc.?

 

[Gecko001]

High value of the pound could have had an effect. It has gone up dramatically over the last year compared to the Euro. Euro has gone down about 13% relative to the pound making foreign destinations very attractive, especially out of season where packages can be a fraction of in-season prices.

 

[andygambles]

Agreed but there needs to be some enforcement to stop this. Difficult for overseas I guess but centerparcs in the UK are one of the biggest culprits for rinsing parents in holiday time.

They run a 95%+ occupancy rate all year so why not charge higher prices during holidays.

 

[14Steve14]

A friend of mine in Devon tells me that he is doing better this year than many previous years. He runs a small buy anything type shop in a busy seaside town. Its the first year I cant remember him whinging about how quite it was.

What has he done differently this year. He has spent more on local advertising at the quiet times of the year and also changed the items he sells during the off peak season. He removed the plastic balls, buckets and spades, and replaced them with other items. He has now encouraged many local residents to use his shop.

He is really looking forward to the main summer holidays as he will be even busier and may even put the buckets and spades back.

Instead of blaming others for you being quiet, what have you done through the quiet times to improve your business. Its not always the fault of others.

 

[KeithGreen]

A good post above and my thoughts exactly.

I wonder if the OP could tell us what type of business he runs. Then we could perhaps provide some constructive thoughts on how he can alter his business plan to attract more term-time trade.

 

[DebbS]

We have a small motorhome hire business based in Devon, had a quiet May, busy June and the school holidays are busy.
People seem to be booking shorter breaks, we try to be flexible on bookings and it seems to be working.
We have heard other tourist based businesses are quiet, most seem to put it down to the election, now the euro exchange rate.

 

[Mitch3473]

We have a small tourist based business in Snowdonia and on my travels in and around the local area this year and last year I have noticed a large increase in the amount of Dutch cars, caravans and campervans. Cant say if they are in the same numbers elsewhere in the UK but maybe there's a window of opportunity for someone.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

Perhaps there was something on Dutch TV?

A few years ago Cornwall had a boom with German, Austrian and Swiss visitors because a German TV station filmed a series of very popular mini-series of Rosamund Pilcher books, in German. In Germany Cornwall was known as Rosamund Pilcher country.

 

[Chris34]

My little brother has just come back from a long weekend in Newquay, it was the weekend before last. He said it was absolutely dead. He went on the Saturday to the Wednesday with 3 of his mates and stayed in a new apartment that is worth around £350,000 and it only cost them about £500 (for all 4 of them). Basically they seem to have built loads of fancy apartments designed for second homes down there but there is no demand down there for them so you can get them really cheap at the moment.

He said that the beaches are as nice as ever but Newquay as a place...

Put it this way, at 9pm on Sunday night they went out to get some food and everywhere wasn't serving food. Yes I know, 9pm is late but we are talking in 'season' here, at the very least you would expect a chippy to be open. He said that there were only two takeaways open in the whole of Newquay. This is a town that boasts how it can cater for over 200,000 people in the peak summer months. He said he was embarrassed because he had been telling his mates at how good it was (remembering from years ago) and how nice the food was in the pubs / restaurants but everywhere was closed.
He said that the pubs stank and were like 'old mans' pubs (his words). He said that it's that bad that he didn't think that Newquay was 'dying' it was more that is was already 'dead'.
Now I know businesses shut early down there if it's 'quiet' but to close early in season is a big no no. Do you think my brother and his mates will go back down there next year? It's supposed to be the tourist capital of Cornwall and the first week of June and everywhere is closing early?

He said that there was a Jet Ski contest with people from across the world attending the event on Fistral Beach (I think). He said that there were loads of people watching the contest so they assumed that the towns pubs would be packed later that day but every single pub was completely dead.

We've been going down there for years as a family and the place seems to be going downhill year on year. My own opinions on the reasons are as follows:

1. - Surfing

Surfing used to be the big draw for people going to Cornwall. In the mid 90's every car seemed to have a surfboard strapped to the roof. The surfers went down there, they created the 'vibe' which attracted the mass crowds, in short it was 'cool'.

Well surfing has been on a decline in the UK since the 90's. Just do a search on Google trends and you will see this decline.

So without the surfers going down there every summer you get less of a 'vibe' which is what makes the place great. So you end up with a load of people turning up to a party that isn't happening any more and they don't come back the next year, a snowball effect.

2. - Parking

Families are being charged around £6 per day to park a car so they can take their kids for a 'cheap' day on the beach. The problem is it's no longer a 'cheap' day on the beach. £6 per day for a two week holiday is £84. This is after paying extremely high petrol costs to get there in the first place. Then they have to pay 'beach prices' for the ice creams. A family of 4 would do well to come back from that cheap day at the beach with much change from £30.

The council have tried to milk the tourists of the little money they have got left but all it's done is shoot themselves in the foot because they won't put up with it and won't go back.

3. - Quality

The quality of everything seems very poor in comparison to what we get up here in the Manchester area. If you are looking for a souvenir it's all cheap tat. There isn't really anything that strikes you as being a quality 'local' item. The service has also gone downhill. We get far better service at most places that we go to up here in Manchester than we do in Newquay.

When I found out Frankie and Bennies were opening in Newquay a lot of people said that's not what Newquay needed, but I myself thought it was great because it should make the other local food outlets up their game a little and improve the service / food. I'm not saying Frankie and Bennies is good, I've never been there, but a national chain should have a well run ship regarding customer service and consistent food quality, something which the majority of the local food outlets severely lack.

4. - Price

For a family to go to Newquay for two weeks it's going to cost them about:

Fuel = £150 to £200
Parking = £50 to £100
Accommodation = £1,000 to £1,500
Food, ice creams treats, Arcades, days out £500+

A holiday in Cornwall wouldn't leave you much change from £2,000 if any.

For £2,000 you could get a very nice all inclusive holiday abroad with virtually guaranteed sunshine.

.....................................

So I think that Newquay is suffering for a variety of reasons and this will be having a knock on effect to the rest of Cornwall because usually when we used to go to Newquay we would visit other areas of Cornwall, as do most tourists.

Feel free to forward the comments onto the local council.


Chris.

 

[Hunnie]

"Nope, it's only recently that parents started taking children out of schools during term time, 10 years ago is was a rare occasion"
I disagree,
I brought up my 3 children 30-40yrs ago and as a widow I had to look for cheaper ways to have a holiday. Consequently I took them out of school right at the end of term when they would be otherwise be wasting their time doing things such as watching videos/ playing games in class.
You were allowed up to 10 days then with no fines.

 

[Scoped Solutions]

I would say that budget airlines and the strong pound coupled with our less than predictable weather are more likely to be causing people to jet off to warmer climes than anything to do with rules on taking kids out of schools. Last year, against my wife's better judgement, we swapped Spain for a nice beach front cottage in Kent. It rained from the day of arrival to the day we left (2 days early it was so depressing!) - hardly endearing us to the Great British Holiday.

On the subject of fines for kids being taken out of school - I agree with it. I pay my taxes to pay teachers wages to teach full classes of children. Not to manage absences and repeat lessons because Billy's been in Ibiza for two weeks because his parents found "a deal".

 

[Patrick @ BIG in the UK]

Thanks garyk for putting it a far better way than I did, and it is having a terriable effect on tourism the government have got to do something quick.

Sorry... Children being in school is having a terrible effect on tourism and the government must do something quick?

I'm sure there would be a far worse outcry from far more people if the government wrote off the month of June and told kids to do what they liked.

 

[Patrick @ BIG in the UK]

I would say that budget airlines and the strong pound coupled with our less than predictable weather are more likely to be causing people to jet off to warmer climes than anything to do with rules on taking kids out of schools. Last year, against my wife's better judgement, we swapped Spain for a nice beach front cottage in Kent. It rained from the day of arrival to the day we left (2 days early it was so depressing!) - hardly endearing us to the Great British Holiday.

On the subject of fines for kids being taken out of school - I agree with it. I pay my taxes to pay teachers wages to teach full classes of children. Not to manage absences and repeat lessons because Billy's been in Ibiza for two weeks because his parents found "a deal".

I think this a spot on too. You only have to look at some of the website out there - icelolly for example, who'll send a family of 4 to a hovel in Spain for £500 with a £5pp deposit. When you weigh that up against a cold, dull, equally expensive UK break - it's a no brainer (for those who don't mind bedbugs and poor customer service!).