Refusal to provide company name/number

[daniel.snip]

Hello,
I asked an LLP company to provide me with they registered number in order to check company details on The Companies House website.

They have refused.
Do they have a right to refuse ?

Many thanks
Dan

 

[KAC]

Have you tried just searching by name?

 

[daniel.snip]

Hi,
No, they operate under trading name .

My simple question to the forum is ; can LLP or LTD company refuse a public person this informations ?

Many thanks
Dan

 

[TomJ83]

@daniel.snip

Have you traded with this business?

 

[daniel.snip]

I did not trade with that business yet.

It is a regular High Street business. I have visited they website and there is no such information. So I email them asking for the company registered number.
The answer was; "We are a partnership and therefore cannot help you in this matter."

as far as I know
every limited partnerships or limited liability partnerships (LLP) has certain information that must be displayed on they stationery and must also be displayed on any web site owned or operated by the LLP or LTD.

• The place of registration - eg; "Registered in England & Wales" or “Registered in Scotland”
• The registered number
• The fact that it is a Limited Liability Partnership
• The address of its registered office

Now. Is the registered number of such company is a PRIVATE or PUBLIC information?

I asked this company to provide me with they registered number in order to check company details on The Companies House website.
Do they have a legal right to refuse ?
Or is it a company duty to provide such information on request?

Thanks

 

[Chris Ashdown]

What makes you think they are limited and not just a partnership

 

[STDFR33]

Perhaps you are assuming that this partnership is an LLP, and not an unincorporated partnership?

 

[Newchodge]

Whether they hace a right to refuse or not, and I am not sure, I would immediately put such an organisation on my bargepole list. Ie do not touch with a ....

 

[daniel.snip]

Well I honestly don't know what they are or who they are.
Therefore I simply asked them a question.
They must have set up some kind of company, and every company must be registered in this country. unless it is sole trader (also must be registered in revenue) ...

so it is impossible to check an unincorporated partnership?

 

[STDFR33]

No, they do not have to set up a company.

If it an unincorporated entity, they do not have a company number for you to check.

I think their 'refusal' has more to do with that you don't understand the different legal entities used to trade as a business in the UK and you have been asking for something which may be impossible for them to provide.

 

[SteveHa]

There is no requirement to set up a company for anything legally. Unincorporated partnerships are nothing more than the sum of the partners, and do not posses the same legal identity that companies and LLPs do. As such, there is nothing to check.

 

[Ian J]

so it is impossible to check an unincorporated partnership?

Yes.

If you need to find out more about them prior to trading with them a credit report from one of the credit reference agencies might help

 

[daniel.snip]

perhaps this is what they are after all (Unincorporated partnerships), bunch of people running a business where it is impossible to find out who...
I wonder who take a legal responsibility if bad thinks happen..

I honestly did not know you can run a business that way in UK.
Sounds quite convenient if you don’t want be exposed.

many thanks to everyone.

 

[Ian J]

perhaps this is what they are after all (Unincorporated partnerships), bunch of people running a business where it is impossible to find out who...
I wonder who take a legal responsibility if bad thinks happen..

I honestly did not know you can run a business that way in UK.
Sounds quite convenient if you don’t want be exposed.

Exposed as what?

If the company goes belly up the partners are personally responsible for all of the debts so it's not all as rosy as you might think

 

[daniel.snip]

Thank you Ian. and everyone on the forum for a great response and advice.

 

[Newchodge]

But if they operate under a trading name and refuse to give the name and address of the partners, when the business goes belly up, who do the creditors sue?

As a sole trader I thought there was a requirement that all documentation inludes the phrase 'Fred Bloggs, trading as Big Knickers' and the business address of Fred Bloggs? Doesn't the same apply to partnerships?

 

[STDFR33]

I'm no expert, but you'd sue the partnership, and then you could go after assets of any of the partners if they fail to pay up. And you'd go for the one with the big house and Ferrari. Though, you need still have the predicament of needing to know who the partners were.
I simply wouldn't give any credit to a business that wasn't transparent with it's ownership.

Perhaps @smallclaimsassistance could give some insight?

 

[DavidWH]

Assuming they're a partnership, you may find this thread of interest if you plan to do business with them.

 

[smallclaimsassistance]

I'm no expert, but you'd sue the partnership, and then you could go after assets of any of the partners if they fail to pay up. And you'd go for the one with the big house and Ferrari.

Correct. Suing a partnership does give you more options than suing a company or a ltd liability partnership. You do of course need to know who the partners are, but it's not clear that that is the problem here.

The OP hasn't explained why he needs the company number. If, as it seems, he's after the name of the organisation, and it doesn't appear on their website, first step is to check their online terms and conditions, or "legal information", as it's often termed. That will usually confirm their legal identity and official name. If no joy with that, check their "about us" or "meet the team" (etc) page, and look up the business owner/s on Companies House Beta. If it's a company or LLP, the name of the boss will give you their directorial appointments, and you then have the information you require. If they're not on CHB, it's a partnership, and, as stated above you can take action against either the partnership or the individual partners.

Dean

 

[Gecko001]

perhaps this is what they are after all (Unincorporated partnerships), bunch of people running a business where it is impossible to find out who...
I wonder who take a legal responsibility if bad thinks happen..

I honestly did not know you can run a business that way in UK.
Sounds quite convenient if you don’t want be exposed.

many thanks to everyone.

There is no requirement to "register" a business in the UK. It is a common urban myth that there is.

You seem to be implying that there is something suspicious or unusual about a partnership which is not Ltd. In fact many, if not most, businesses run as partnerships are not Ltd.

Remember the partners of a partnership which is not limited, are each personally responsible for any financial responsibilities of the partnership. If the partnership ran into financial troubles, each partner would be personally be responsible for paying creditors. Compare with a Ltd company where the directors would have no personal financial responsibility to pay creditors should the company go bust.