Recording your phone calls

[Robert Wheeler]

Hello folks,

Every time I make a phone call these days, I seem to think to myself "Maybe I should be recording this, just in case something goes wrong". I am now beginning to think this is a necessity. I would guess that in about 80% of phone calls I make the other party does not keep carry out the agreed action, or just lies to me flat out in the course of securing a sale. It usually takes about 4 to 5 calls to get a simple task done.

So from now on, I shall be recording every conversations I have with an organisation that tells me that my call may be recorded. Then if there are any issues, I shall making the relevant recordings available for anyone to download and listen to, in order to assist consumers in making an informed decision on what products and services they use.

Listening to some of the stories I am hearing about phone contracts being fraudulently sold etc. I would recommend a few of you guys do it too.

 

[Dawg]

I don't know the exact requirements, but I think you have to tell someone at the start of the call that you are going to record the call. If you don't tell them you can't use it as evidence, so what would be the point of doing it?

This telling them of being recorded might not be taken kindly by your business suppliers and/or clients, as it would be easy for them to think that you don't trust them, and they might just decide not to do business with you.

I wouldn't do business with anyone who did this. I'd think they were treating me like sh1t, and if they were doing it at the start of a transaction what on earth would they be like at the end of it?

 

[Robert Wheeler]

As I said, I would do this with anyone that had a trailer on their calls which says "You call may be recorded...". So they will be aware that the call may be recorded. There will be no issue. I am not talking about small companies or my clients here. I am talking about banks, the tax office (I already record every call with them), major retailers etc.

 

[Beachcomber]

Recording calls may well be helpful when resolving disputes but I would also expect a quick "........just to let you know this call is recorded......" at the beginning of any conversation could put an end to many problems you are having - just the knowledge that they are being recorded will stem the bull from most people.

 

[Robert Wheeler]

In my experience, it makes no difference whether they think they are being recorded or not. Either way, the point is to clarify things they have said in past calls. Sometimes things are said, you file a complaint that you have been misdirected and they flat out deny it. I have actually played recording back to companies down the phoneline and they have still denied they have said what they have said, so publically humiliate them, that is what I say. Take all the ambiguity out of it, make them directly accountable for what they do.

 

[Tej]

Guess business ethics have gone down the pan!
Am still of the old school.. a handshake seals the deal.
Would never think of recording a phone conversation.. dont want to know "how to" either!

 

[Robert Wheeler]

Like I said, this would only apply to businesses I am a customer of, and which have a trailer which says "You call may be recorded". If they reserve the right to record my call, and they make perfectly clear that they understand that the call may be recorded, what is wrong with recording it yourself?

I mean, I would always advise anyone doing any kind of interview with the press to make their own recording in full. This to me seems like the common sense business equivalent. I actually think that not making a recording when they are is remiss. I really could see it being standard practice in the future.

 

[davidakerr]

If someone tells you "this call may be recorded for training purposes" then tell them "you will invoice them for using your voice as a means of training their staff" that usually brings a quick end to the conversation.

 

[Dawg]

I once did the "and I'm recording yours" thing when told by a bank that the call was being recorded. After asking me not to record, and being refused, they rang off.
Basically if you make detailed notes of the conversation, at the time, and date and time them, adding as much detail as possible, these 'contemporaneous' notes will have virtually the same weight in a legal dispute.
Guidance on note making. (From a council document on dealing with abuse, but relevant anyway.)

 

[cjd]

There are a bunch of laws about recording calls so be a bit careful. There's an outline here (skip down to the 'is it legal' bit):

http://www.voipfone.co.uk/Call_Recording.php

I have to say that I've found it invaluable twice now. It's amazing how quickly disputes are cleared up if you offer to email an mp3 file of the conversation to someone.

 

[Call Tracker]

We sell inbound call recording and clients have to make it clear where the telephone number is published that the call may be recorded.

We also have a site where consumers can by pay as you go call recording www.callrecordingservices.co.uk which is for making calls that you may wish to refer to at a later date. Check on the Ofcom website for the legalities on outbound calls.

 

[Robert Wheeler]

But if the company you are calling has already stated that the conversation may be recorded, then there is a mutual understanding that it is acceptable to record the call. They are already aware that the call might be recorded.

As I said, this is not something I would do with clients. It is for when I am calling larger companies whom I am a customer of, when I am after customer service and needing a record of what is said. For instance, I now have audio records of every conversation I have with representatives of HMRC on the phone.

 

[Animal]

There is nothing in the law to stop you from recording calls for personal use. If it should go to court, you simply supply a transcript of what was said and if the other side denies it, you state to the judge that it is a transcript and if the judge requires you can supply the original recording. The other side most likely will back down at this stage...

 

[Call Tracker]

I think it is what's commonly known as a grey area!

If the call you wish to record is being made to a company/organisation that record calls anyway then why don't you ask for the recording of the call to be sent to you.

 

[Robert Wheeler]

Why would I do that? I can just record it myself. I do not see the problem. If they tell you the call may be recorded, then they are clearly happy for the call to be recorded. There is no issue.

 

[Animal]

It's not grey, Ofcom issued guidance a few years back. It is OK to record calls for personal use. All my calls are recorded now. A few years ago I had a dispute with a certain bank. They imposed charges and ignored my dispute. They took legal action which I defended and counter-claimed. Part of my evidence was the transcript of some of the calls. The other side disputed the accuracy of my transcripts, so I told the judge it was from a recording and offered it was evidence. The judge said that if the other side continues to dispute the accuracy, then he would allow the recordings as evidence. The other side backed down and the outcome was 'to my satisfaction' I understand a well known high street bank was recently fined £50k and part of the evidence was recordings...

 

[cjd]

It's fine. please see:

Is it legal?

Generally, yes, provided you follow some rules - there are various regulations you should be aware of and the law is different for home use and business use.

In summary, you may record calls at home so long as they are for your own personal use only and you may record calls if you are a business so long you take "all reasonable steps" to inform all parties that you will be recording them. “All reasonable steps” is not defined but may include written warnings on your web site and/or a voice warning.

Most organisations use phrases like these at the beginning of each call:

"For training purposes and your own security, your call may be monitored and recorded."

"In order to ensure excellent customer service, your call may be monitored or recorded."

Less formally, you could just say something like “I’m recording this conversation so that I have a proper record of it, is that ok?”

In some circumstances businesses may record without obtaining consent.

Ofcom’s guidance is here:

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archive/oftel/consumer/advice/faqs/prvfaq3.htm

Please note: Our notes here, like Ofcom’s, are simply an attempt to point you at some of the law regarding recordings; you should obtain your own legal advice if you have any doubts.

Source material:

The interception, recording and monitoring of telephone calls is governed by a number of different pieces of UK legislation. These are the main ones:

Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 (“RIPA”)
Telecommunication (Lawful Business Practice)(Interception of Communications) Regulations 2000 (“LBP Regulations”
Data Protection Act 1998
Telecommunications (Data Protection and Privacy) Regulations 1999
Human Rights Act 1998

http://www.voipfone.co.uk/Call_Recording.php

 

[klantee]

Does anyone actually know if when you have informed the business that you are recording this telephone conversation, can the recorded conversation then be used in a court of law as evidence in your favour?

 

[cjd]

Does anyone actually know if when you have informed the business that you are recording this telephone conversation, can the recorded conversation then be used in a court of law as evidence in your favour?

No, it's too much of a legal quagmire; but my bet would be yes.

 

[klantee]

I have always believed, and by previous experience, if you have credible evidence to support your case, then the judge will usually allow it!

As the logic suggests that if what you say has been done to you is proven, then how can anyone who is "forced" to listen to it deny it?! I will always use my judgment of logic first, and then reason later when it comes to legal matters... Thanks for confirming my thoughts. k

 

[cjd]

I have always believed, and by previous experience, if you have credible evidence to support your case, then the judge will usually allow it!

As the logic suggests that if what you say has been done to you is proven, then how can anyone who is "forced" to listen to it deny it?! I will always use my judgment of logic first, and then reason later when it comes to legal matters... Thanks for confirming my thoughts. k

Unfortunately, the laws relating to the use of evidence in the UK courts have very little to do with logic; often evidence that would prove a case one way or the other will be disallowed because of the way it was obtained.

 

[mushroomdjm]

does anybody know if there is a time limit on how long recorded telephone conversations can be stored for? i'm having a 'he said/she said" dispute with my bank & want to be sure they still have the recordings. any info would be greatful