Plan.com/ Telecom contract

[Amberwood2505]

I’m new to the hole business thing so I wasn’t aware that a B2B doesn’t give a 14 day cool off period, however I have a genuine complain about the service that I am receiving from the company but they have said all they can do is cancel the contract for the full amount £22 +vat for 36 months. I was on my first day of the contract when I asked to cancel it has now been over a week and my phone isn’t working properly because of the number change over. I spoke to citizen advise who advise I can cancel under Supply of Goods and Services Act and the response I got from the company was that citizens advise don’t know what they are talking about. I was actually happy to go with them at first until I started having issues and now I’m going to be stuck for 3 years?! Surely I have a leg to stand on somewhere?

 

[IanSuth]

I’m new to the hole business thing so I wasn’t aware that a B2B doesn’t give a 14 day cool off period, however I have a genuine complain about the service that I am receiving from the company but they have said all they can do is cancel the contract for the full amount £22 +vat for 36 months. I was on my first day of the contract when I asked to cancel it has now been over a week and my phone isn’t working properly because of the number change over. I spoke to citizen advise who advise I can cancel under Supply of Goods and Services Act and the response I got from the company was that citizens advise don’t know what they are talking about. I was actually happy to go with them at first until I started having issues and now I’m going to be stuck for 3 years?! Surely I have a leg to stand on somewhere?

Read the contract is the answer

Check specifically what they have contracted to supply and what SLA's are in the contract - if they have fallen foul of them then they have broken the contract (or frustrated it coming into effect even) - if they have not then you are bound by whatever the cancellation clauses are in the contract

 

[Ozzy]

Hi @Amberwood2505 and welcome to UKBF, as someone new to business do stick around as we'll support you on your journey.

@IanSuth has already given you the correct answer, the detail is in the contract. As a general rule for you for the future, I'm afraid business does not have any of the consumer protection laws that cover domestic/public in their buying. In a business capacity it can sometimes feel like the wild west so it's ever so important to review the small print in contracts all the time. Something many people do slip up on.

The only time this may be different is if you are operating as a sole trader (not a Limited company) and the service/contract does include some form of finance/borrowing. In those situations then the FCA treats sole traders and members of the public the same as far as rights is concerned, but Limited Companies have no protection. This is unlikely for the telecoms service in your situation but do keep it in mind for the future.

 

[Heyes]

If there's a serious breach you have grounds to cancel - though unlikely to be possible without reasonably allowing the provider to remedy things, and almost certainly not so soon after entering the agreement.

When you're studying the terms of your agreement, keep in mind 'Unfair Contract Terms Act', which may provide leverage - some agreements are sufficiently poorly written to contain stuff which isn't enforceable, though being able to repudiate the whole agreement is unlikely.

Misrepresentation is a possible - through difficult - option.

Some of the Supply of Goods and Services Act *does* apply - but unlikely to be sufficiently so as to enable you to cancel the agreement.

My unasked-for suggestion is to be appropriately patient and hope the initial difficulties are speedily resolved and that the provided service becomes satisfactory.

 

[Heyes]

If there's a serious breach you have grounds to cancel - though unlikely to be possible without reasonably allowing the provider to remedy things, and almost certainly not so soon after entering the agreement.

When you're studying the terms of your agreement, keep in mind 'Unfair Contract Terms Act', which may provide leverage - some agreements are sufficiently poorly written to contain stuff which isn't enforceable, though being able to repudiate the whole agreement is unlikely.

Misrepresentation is a possible - through difficult - option.

Some of the Supply of Goods and Services Act *does* apply - but unlikely to be sufficiently so as to enable you to cancel the agreement.

My unasked-for suggestion is to be appropriately patient and hope the initial difficulties are speedily resolved and that the provided service becomes satisfactory.

Typo (there may be others)...

Misrepresentation is a possible - though difficult - option.

 

[Amberwood2505]

If there's a serious breach you have grounds to cancel - though unlikely to be possible without reasonably allowing the provider to remedy things, and almost certainly not so soon after entering the agreement.

When you're studying the terms of your agreement, keep in mind 'Unfair Contract Terms Act', which may provide leverage - some agreements are sufficiently poorly written to contain stuff which isn't enforceable, though being able to repudiate the whole agreement is unlikely.

Misrepresentation is a possible - through difficult - option.

Some of the Supply of Goods and Services Act *does* apply - but unlikely to be sufficiently so as to enable you to cancel the agreement.

My unasked-for suggestion is to be appropriately patient and hope the initial difficulties are speedily resolved and that the provided service becomes satisfactory.

In the terms it says:

Termination
15.1. Either Party may terminate this Agreement (in whole or in relation to an individual Service) on no less than 30 days' prior written notice to take effect at the end of the specified calendar month.
15.2. Without prejudice to any other rights or remedies, either Party may, by written notice to the other, terminate this Agreement (in whole or in relation to an individual Service) on with immediate effect on written notice if:
a. the other Party commits a material breach of this Agreement which is incapable of remedy;
b. the other party commits a material breach of this Agreement which is capable of remedy and fails to remedy such material breach within 30 days after receiving written notice requiring it to remedy that material breach

So I’m guessing pay the full invoice for the month even though I don’t have full working services and then wait for 30 days to see what they do?

It’s so frustrating because they are causing issues with my day to day business because I cannot get hold of certain people due to this issue and even though it’s just me running a small dog walker business three days a week seems unfair that I am in this situation but I am aware that in future I shouldn’t sign up without reading the small print, just annoying because they called me whilst I was working so trying ti concentrate on work and the phone call was where I should have said call me later! Well you live and learn.

 

[Heyes]

In the terms it says:

Termination
15.1. Either Party may terminate this Agreement (in whole or in relation to an individual Service) on no less than 30 days' prior written notice to take effect at the end of the specified calendar month.
15.2. Without prejudice to any other rights or remedies, either Party may, by written notice to the other, terminate this Agreement (in whole or in relation to an individual Service) on with immediate effect on written notice if:
a. the other Party commits a material breach of this Agreement which is incapable of remedy;
b. the other party commits a material breach of this Agreement which is capable of remedy and fails to remedy such material breach within 30 days after receiving written notice requiring it to remedy that material breach

So I’m guessing pay the full invoice for the month even though I don’t have full working services and then wait for 30 days to see what they do?

It’s so frustrating because they are causing issues with my day to day business because I cannot get hold of certain people due to this issue and even though it’s just me running a small dog walker business three days a week seems unfair that I am in this situation but I am aware that in future I shouldn’t sign up without reading the small print, just annoying because they called me whilst I was working so trying ti concentrate on work and the phone call was where I should have said call me later! Well you live and learn.

The 30 days provision may be subject to a minimum period - if so it'll be stated.

You should certainly pay when due, otherwise you're in breach. (Although that may not trigger further action from the other party.)

What's worth remembering is that whatever the agreed terms, some service providers will voluntarily agree to early termination without penalty... either because they're genuinely decent, or concerned about a potential worsening of their reputation.

Additionally, in some cases, the person with whom you speak by phone is inadequately trained and doesn't have full knowledge of the terms. Also they probably have limited authority, and somebody at a higher level is likely to be able to suggest and action a favourable resolution should they so choose.

Whatever the situation, as you note, you've learned a valuable lesson.

 

[Amberwood2505]

The 30 days provision may be subject to a minimum period - if so it'll be stated.

You should certainly pay when due, otherwise you're in breach. (Although that may not trigger further action from the other party.)

What's worth remembering is that whatever the agreed terms, some service providers will voluntarily agree to early termination without penalty... either because they're genuinely decent, or concerned about a potential worsening of their reputation.

Additionally, in some cases, the person with whom you speak by phone is inadequately trained and doesn't have full knowledge of the terms. Also they probably have limited authority, and somebody at a higher level is likely to be able to suggest and action a favourable resolution should they so choose.

Whatever the situation, as you note, you've learned a valuable lesson.

I will see what they say as on there terms it says all complaints that aren’t rectified should be escalated and they haven’t don’t that yet, I have been advised to also send a complaint via post with proof of issues and the I will wait and see what happens. I appreciate the advise

 

[japancool]

Have you notified them in writing that they must fix the issues?

 

[Amberwood2505]

Have you notified them in writing that they must fix the issues?

I advised I didn’t trust them to not do it again so wanted to cancel as it has been a week and still no fix

 

[IanSuth]

I advised I didn’t trust them to not do it again so wanted to cancel as it has been a week and still no fix

That does not answer the question


Have you at any point notified them in writing of the issues (as that is what the contract says is the trigger for them rectifying) ?

 

[Heyes]

I will see what they say as on there terms it says all complaints that aren’t rectified should be escalated and they haven’t don’t that yet, I have been advised to also send a complaint via post with proof of issues and the I will wait and see what happens. I appreciate the advise

Thankyou.

Returning to commerce after an absence, I wasn't familiar with the company and so have now looked at them.

I think it highly unlikely you'll be able to cancel in the way you might hope.... because although that 30 day provision enables you to cancel it's subject to an early termination fee (which is quite likely equivalent to what you're due to pay for the full term).

 

[Amberwood2505]

That does not answer the question


Have you at any point notified them in writing of the issues (as that is what the contract says is the trigger for them rectifying) ?

Yes, on multiple different occasions. Via the online chat system they have and via email

 

[japancool]

Yes, on multiple different occasions. Via the online chat system they have and via email

Write to them.

Tell them what the fault is, and tell them they have 30 days to fix it.

 

[Amberwood2505]

Write to them.

Tell them what the fault is, and tell them they have 30 days to fix it.

That was my next port of call. Although I don’t want a fix I want to cancel but I don’t think that will happen

 

[fisicx]

You will not be able to cancel. And check the whole contract. I bet there is a clause that says something like: we do not guarantee the service. Which means if it falls over they are not liable for anything.

 

[IanSuth]

That was my next port of call. Although I don’t want a fix I want to cancel but I don’t think that will happen

Your best bet is that you write to them in a clear way laying out exactly what the faults are and how they don't meet x, y & z that are in their terms/sales literature/communications to you and thus are material breaches (don't get silly with this, if they say in literature "you will get a type x router" and you have been given an equivalent or better type y that is not a material breach)

You can try saying this is written confirmation of issues notified to them on x date via their chat (but they may argue this point) and so you consider the 30 days they have to rectify to be from that point and if not fully rectified by date y (30 days from x) you will consider them to be in breach of clause 15.2 and the contract terminated without penalty but you may actually have to use the date of the letter not the original communications by chat/email as the contract says writing.

That way either you issues get sorted or you can get out using their own wording

 

[Amberwood2505]

Thankyou.

Returning to commerce after an absence, I wasn't familiar with the company and so have now looked at them.

I think it highly unlikely you'll be able to cancel in the way you might hope.... because although that 30 day provision enables you to cancel it's subject to an early termination fee (which is quite likely equivalent to what you're due to pay for the full term).

Which I am obviously not going to be doing!

You will not be able to cancel. And check the whole contract. I bet there is a clause that says something like: we do not guarantee the service. Which means if it falls over they are not liable for anything.

indeed it does, cannot guarantee a fault free service

 

[Amberwood2505]

Your best bet is that you write to them in a clear way laying out exactly what the faults are and how they don't meet x, y & z that are in their terms/sales literature/communications to you and thus are material breaches (don't get silly with this, if they say in literature "you will get a type x router" and you have been given an equivalent or better type y that is not a material breach)

You can try saying this is written confirmation of issues notified to them on x date via their chat (but they may argue this point) and so you consider the 30 days they have to rectify to be from that point and if not fully rectified by date y (30 days from x) you will consider them to be in breach of clause 15.2 and the contract terminated without penalty but you may actually have to use the date of the letter not the original communications by chat/email as the contract says writing.

That way either you issues get sorted or you can get out using their own wording

Thank you, I will try that, it’s only a sim that I got with them as I had the phone already so not issues with item provided being different but better just the fact that none of my texts are sending to anyone

 

[Amberwood2505]

The only thing I may have is they advised a new sim would come to me before the change over date and that I would be advised what date the change over would happen on and neither of that was done

 

[japancool]

The only thing I may have is they advised a new sim would come to me before the change over date and that I would be advised what date the change over would happen on and neither of that was done

Let me get this straight.

You've ported your number to them.
They were supposed to send you a new SIM. This has not happened.
You are now using your old SIM on their service.

Is that right?

 

[Amberwood2505]

Let me get this straight.

You've ported your number to them.
They were supposed to send you a new SIM. This has not happened.
You are now using your old SIM on their service.

Is that right?

Correct

 

[japancool]

Correct

And did they specifically tell you that they had moved your SIM onto their network?

 

[Amberwood2505]

And did they specifically tell you that they had moved your SIM onto their network?

Not actually sure, I had 24 hours without a working phone and they told me that was because they were porting the details over, when I asked the next day why it wasn’t working still they told me the sim wasn’t registered, I explained that it had been the same sim I had been using for years now so I wasn’t sure why it wasn’t working they registered it and then when I rebooted my phone it worked, or so I thought, I then had a whole issue with the texts not sending and they told me my calls and data are connected to them but my texts aren’t which is why they aren’t working and that I should of had a new sim which I don’t. It has been over a week since and because of all this is the reason I wanted to cancel but I’m not entitled to unless I pay the full amount