Opening Coffee / Bistro Bar September

[top-tastic]

Hi

Myself and partner are opening a Coffee / Bistro Bar in September, we have keys to the premises now, so we are working hard to get everything sorted. We also have a premises license, so we will be trading alcohol as well....

We believe quality is the key, and so looking to offer the right service and product for the right price....(obviously lower than everyone else).

Any advice that anyone wants to throw our way.

Already speaking to Cardsave, as have meeting with them on thursday.

Thanks in advance for any help given.

Darren

 

[GeorgeStrait]

right price....(obviously lower than everyone else).

Maybe re-consider this

 

[thebiznizdotcom]

Just one point....why be cheaper? Why not just be better. Often people find that they have to slash prices to compete, but if you give real value for money (I mean, really good quality food, served quickly with a smile) most people will not only go out of their way to use you but be prepared to pay that little bit extra. Smile alot and connect with your customers and I think you'll be on a winner. Good Luck.

 

[top-tastic]

When I say cheaper, I dont mean cheap....I think 2.95 is expensive
For a latte, we will be cheaper than that, but give the service and experience the
Customer wants, so they come back again and again. My photography
Studios will also be part of the business and the building we have is large.

 

[top-tastic]

Maybe re-consider this

Thanks for this, but not the advice I was looking for

 

[Hodgson111]

Have you looked into latte art?
I think if you could perfect it and finish all of your latte's with it and other drink, it will definetly make your drinks have a look of better quality and it should make you stand out from the rest of the coffee stores in your area.

 

[IndiCafe]

1. Have you worked in the food and drinks industry at all? If not, the best advice would be to spend some time doing so to be sure that
(a) you have an aptitude for it, and
(b) you enjoy it.
2. you will often hear people say "work ON your business, not IN it", however I strongly believe that to make a cafe/bistro work you need to be highly involved at least at first.
3. If you're into quality, you need trained staff. That means professional baristi for your coffees and experienced chefs for your kitchen, not to mention Front Of House staff who won't panic when things get busy. There's no easy answer... quality costs. Good for you for choosing quality over price as your marketing strategy.

 

[Josh_Farmer]

Hi

Myself and partner are opening a Coffee / Bistro Bar in September, we have keys to the premises now, so we are working hard to get everything sorted. We also have a premises license, so we will be trading alcohol as well....

We believe quality is the key, and so looking to offer the right service and product for the right price....(obviously lower than everyone else).

Any advice that anyone wants to throw our way.

Already speaking to Cardsave, as have meeting with them on thursday.

Thanks in advance for any help given.

Darren

PLEASE do not agree to cardsave! Trust me, I registered just because i seen that statement!

 

[AndyBlue]

PLEASE do not agree to cardsave! Trust me, I registered just because i seen that statement!

If you are looking at card machines Elavon are doing a great deal for Costco members we have switched both businesses across and are saving some decent money and as we were already with Elavon have nt had to commit to a new term contract, so you may need to check this bit out as i believe you do with cardsave.
As far as pricing goes quality counts and sometimes less is more, in our barbers I put our prices up considerably and yes some customers stopped coming, however it meany that i still taking same amount of money but was able to get rid of a member of staff so not being busy fools, and am considerably better off. We offer quality over price and it works.

 

[GeorgeStrait]

Thanks for this, but not the advice I was looking for

Well pardon me for offering an opinion based of the very little and sketchy information you provided.

What the hell do you exactly want advice on then???? You only mention price, quality and cardsave, and your obviously not that keen on quality if your going to undercut everyone, your going for the lower end of the market - if that's your target customer then fine, just thought as an idie it's worth considering being different.

Good luck

 

[dkeenan]

Hi. Do you have a website yet? You could try cafebarwebdesign.com

That will give you a site and let you update menus etc.

 

[Josh_Farmer]

If you are looking at card machines Elavon are doing a great deal for Costco members we have switched both businesses across and are saving some decent money and as we were already with Elavon have nt had to commit to a new term contract, so you may need to check this bit out as i believe you do with cardsave.
As far as pricing goes quality counts and sometimes less is more, in our barbers I put our prices up considerably and yes some customers stopped coming, however it meany that i still taking same amount of money but was able to get rid of a member of staff so not being busy fools, and am considerably better off. We offer quality over price and it works.

Cardsave have many clauses in there contracts, meaning no matter what you'll always owe them money

Elevon in my experience have always been great and offer pretty low rates.

 

[top-tastic]

1. Have you worked in the food and drinks industry at all? If not, the best advice would be to spend some time doing so to be sure that
(a) you have an aptitude for it, and
(b) you enjoy it.
2. you will often hear people say "work ON your business, not IN it", however I strongly believe that to make a cafe/bistro work you need to be highly involved at least at first.
3. If you're into quality, you need trained staff. That means professional baristi for your coffees and experienced chefs for your kitchen, not to mention Front Of House staff who won't panic when things get busy. There's no easy answer... quality costs. Good for you for choosing quality over price as your marketing strategy.

Thanks for this, and yes my partner has spent 10 years in spain, over that time she has run 2 busy restaurant/bars.
I will only be helping out when needed as still have full time consultancy role, to keep some income coming in.

 

[top-tastic]

Well pardon me for offering an opinion based of the very little and sketchy information you provided.

What the hell do you exactly want advice on then???? You only mention price, quality and cardsave, and your obviously not that keen on quality if your going to undercut everyone, your going for the lower end of the market - if that's your target customer then fine, just thought as an idie it's worth considering being different.

Good luck

George, I was looking for any advice, other than reconsider....to me that is not advice.....if you look at everyone elses comments, they are helpful...yours was not. Then to say what the hell do I want advice on...To give you more detail see below.
We are not undercutting everyone else, we are in fact going to be offerings a high quality coffee, but offering less than alot of the top named coffee shops, as believe their prices are too high....
We will not be cheap...we will be offering top quality service, with a smile, backed by our products and suppliers....
There are other things we will be offering as the space is large, catering for networks, business meetings, mother & baby groups, and other groups like this.
Thank you to everyone who has so far given meaningful advice, its all been noted.
Have a great evening

 

[mhall]

Thanks for this, but not the advice I was looking for

Sorry, but that is actually very good advice

 

[top-tastic]

Sorry, but that is actually very good advice

Which advice is that....to reconsider.....

 

[top-tastic]

Cardsave have many clauses in there contracts, meaning no matter what you'll always owe them money

Elevon in my experience have always been great and offer pretty low rates.

Thanks for this, I have emailed them, asking for further information....
Much appreciated

 

[Billmccallum]

Sorry, but that is actually very good advice

I have to agree with George and Mhall, re-considering the price point is GOOD ADVICE, even if you don't want to hear it.

Surprisingly, many consumers will avoid premises if they percieve them to be "Too Cheap" and are quite happy to pay a premium for first class service.

People are paying £26 for a Sunday roast by Gordon Ramsay (even when he's not in the kitchen), at the same time people are paying £7.95 the same thing in small outlets.

 

[top-tastic]

Maybe re-consider this

George, I would like to apologise on here mate....when you said re-consider, I took it you mean't reconsider opening a coffee shop....thats me not reading things correctly....so my bad, and take back what I have said....

Any yes, we are looking at pricing, and as said in a previous statement we will be selling top quality coffee, with great service and comfort....so price will be based on that.

Again thanks to all who have commented so far, its all a great help.

 

[Palms]

My advice is to decide which target you want to attract and stick with it, it is very difficult to shift how you want to be perceived once you are open. If this is high end, your logo, colours, layout and style should suggest this. Dont conflict. If you want to have more quanitity and go cheaper, dont make it look high end, it will put people off.

Quality of customer vs quantity of customers are both viable business models but you in general cant have both.

Mother and toddlers will not want to share the same space as business people wanting to discuss business. But, both are excellent ideas, just not together imo.

As for price, I think it is good not to price yourself out of the market but know your demographic and what it's expectations are of a cafe. Have you checked out the employment rates, what the demographic of the area is etc...

On another note, you could perhaps get people to rent a bit of space, ie a local wedding cake maker could put a display in to sell her cakes (unless you are going down this road).

hth

 

[Richie N]

I agree don't go too cheap, cost your menu items before opening and make the menu simple to read.
It's easier to give a discount or offer on the prices than to increase them soon after opening if your not covering your overheads etc.

 

[IndiCafe]

When it comes to espresso it is actually possible to sell a higher quality product at a lower price. Seriously, every coffeegeek knows that making better coffee than costabucks isn't difficult and if you factor in buying freshly roasted beans rather than the stale stuff the chains use then you're already streets ahead on quality. OK, you may not make as large a profit per unit as the chains who use cheap roasting/packaging methods to keep costs to a minimum, but when word gets around that you're selling much superior coffee at the same/lower price, you'll get repeat sales and a local reputation that will put a dent in your local Mermaid's milk jug, so you may find you recoup the difference through higher volumes of customers.

 

[kulture]

When it comes to espresso it is actually possible to sell a higher quality product at a lower price. Seriously, every coffeegeek knows that making better coffee than costabucks isn't difficult and if you factor in buying freshly roasted beans rather than the stale stuff the chains use then you're already streets ahead on quality. OK, you may not make as large a profit per unit as the chains who use cheap roasting/packaging methods to keep costs to a minimum, but when word gets around that you're selling much superior coffee at the same/lower price, you'll get repeat sales and a local reputation that will put a dent in your local Mermaid's milk jug, so you may find you recoup the difference through higher volumes of customers.

Absolutely true. BUT there is more to making good coffee than just getting in good quality, just roasted beans. When we had a cafe, we found a local independent supplier who came round, tested and helped set up the machine. Tried all their beans and blends and did a taste session where we agreed on the best bean blend for us and our machine. Trained all our staff on how to use the machine PROPERLY. Finally showed us how to clean it properly and how important it was to keep cleaning it.

All too often new cafes sell great coffee on day 1 and as the days/weeks go past the coffee taste deteriorates because they have omitted to clean, or forgotten that grinders need adjusting as they wear, or some other basic mistake.

 

[IndiCafe]

Yep There's a shocking amount of knowledge involved in making espresso-based drinks well... I admit I was just highlighting one component in mentioning the beans.

Here's some things many folks may not know.
- Coffee beans are constantly changing throughout the day as humidity levels change. A good barista will change the grinder setting perhaps 6 times per day to compensate. Not doing so means crap espresso. (Most Cafe Nero staff don't even know how to adjust the grinder setting!)
- Once coffee beans have been ground you have a maximum of 3 minutes before they go stale through oxidisation. Think of what happens when you bite into an apple and leave it on the table. Same thing, but moreso. Never use pre-ground coffee...and never fill the grinder's dosing chamber with grinds to make life easier during busy periods, or the result will be flat, black, bitter espresso rather than rich, brown, sweet crema.
- espresso machines ideally should be cleaned approximately every hour. The essential oils from the beans, left inside the machine, go rancid in 45 minutes, and end up in your cup. Bitter!

Basically, 80% of the difference between good and bad coffee is due to the technical knowledge and skill of the barista. Pushing buttons has nothing to do with it, any more than making good food in a restaurant is about pushing 'start' on a microwave oven.
That said, it's still easy to make a better job than the chains, since they do such a poor job. And when customers taste a good coffee, they do start to realise how low their standards have been in the past. I see it on a daily basis, and I'm told exactly that by our customers several times a day.

 

[Tiery]

I can give U some advices. If U want to open a pub, U must have a free Wi-Fi, because we are in XXI century and now, almost everyone have a notebook or a smartphone, etc. Have best dealers and professional personal. Good luck with your business.
Regards.

 

[Forum Retail]

I work with different coffee shops all over the country, if you have decifded on the till you are putting in thats fine if not have a look at coffeeshoptills.co.uk

 

[Sparx]

Thanks for this, I have emailed them, asking for further information....
Much appreciated

Cardsave's contracts used to be a little more perplex, they are much more simple now - 1 year renewing contracts - put simple, hope that helps my friend.

 

[top-tastic]

Thanks to everyone so far who have offered me advice, it has all been noted.

We are having our new machine installed later this month, and the engineer will be training us on it, also my girlfriend who has 10 years experience.

We have tried a number of coffees, and decided on the one we are to run with, and the distributor has agreed that as long as we purchase from him (Friend of mine) then other coffee shops will not be able to purchase the same coffee..

They are suppling us with all advertising material for the coffee we will be selling along with uniforms, cups etc...which was a great deal.

We are having wifi installed end of the month, as we agree technology today means nearly everyone has smart phone of some sort or IPAD

There is lots going on at the minute, but its all coming together slowly.
We will also be the only coffee shop that is licensed to sell alcohol, rather than a pub who sells coffee...

We will also be installing freeview in the bar, and playing music, which means a prs license, but for what it is going to cost us, its worth it...

We are looking forward to this in a big way, so once again thank you to everyone who has offered advice. This forum is very helpful to say the leased.

 

[IndiCafe]

Sounds good and I wish you all the best. In your original post you mentioned that 'quality is key'. If you decide to follow through with that as a coffee shop then please PM me and I'll gladly give you a steer. When it comes to good quality coffee you should never be dealing with distributors. Sorry if that bursts a bubble. Their coffee is not fresh. You need to deal directly with roasters. I can point you to a coffee trainer in your area who (with a little dedication on your part) will get your key staff making coffee better than your competitors, using beans that cost more but are better. Please don't make the mistake of making bad coffee and thinking it's 'good enough'. The days of that being a sustainable coffeeshop business are long gone.
Also (and please don't take offense) people with 10 years experience in catering are precisely the people who need training in coffee because they are usually doing it wrong, but with a slight tweak they could do it well.

 

[Bob]

Might be worth your while having a look at the videos on this website. Their coffee is exceptional

 

[IndiCafe]

Might be worth your while having a look at the videos on this website. Their coffee is exceptional

Bingo. One of the best. Steve Leighton roasted the beans that were used by this year's World Barista Champion, Alejandro Mendez. Normal guy, very helpful, the very best quality.

 

[Bob]

Bingo. One of the best. Steve Leighton roasted the beans that were used by this year's World Barista Champion, Alejandro Mendez. Normal guy, very helpful, the very best quality.

Have been drinking his coffee for a couple of years now - albeit in a domestic Gaggia bean to cup machine that I treated myself to when I retired. Have always found their service first class and our friends love the coffee
I have no doubt that a trained barista could make it even better, but I'm very satisfied. The coffee always has a superb crema

 

[seonn5]

You should be aware of the quality of food and water. Especially the service is always comfort for customers to find.
That is one very important factor in the type of business you choose.
If you have a particular business that people do not get the same type of advantage is that you get.
Wish you success!

 

[Tax-UK]

Food quality is the key in my opinion, I have seen restaurants loosing their regulars because the new chef wasn't up to scratch. Once you lose a client due to bad food quality the negative marketing starts spreading (word of mouth)

 

[craignic]

I am just in the process of launching a restaurant marketing system for restaurants which may suit your coffee shop.

Basically you target every customer and get them to subscribe to your mailing list by accessing the sign up form online - either on their desktop PC or by scanning a QR code on their smartphone which instantly brings up the sign up form.

Once subscribed, users get email updates whenever you have a new offer or news about your business.

The most powerful feature is that subscribers can share offers with their friends or associates - by email, Facebook, Twitter etc.... and your subscriber list grows and grows as you get more referrals.

This system is much more affordable and effective than traditional advertising and you can spread the cost with a monthly subscription.

 

[Y.Gunay]

Hi

Myself and partner are opening a Coffee / Bistro Bar in September, we have keys to the premises now, so we are working hard to get everything sorted. We also have a premises license, so we will be trading alcohol as well....

We believe quality is the key, and so looking to offer the right service and product for the right price....(obviously lower than everyone else).

Any advice that anyone wants to throw our way.

Already speaking to Cardsave, as have meeting with them on thursday.

Thanks in advance for any help given.

Darren

First of all i would like to say good luck on your family business.

i would recommend you look at the high street giants to learn why they became successful ,eg Star Bucks you can learn a lot from them (interior design, variety of products, pricing, customer service, advertisement) main thing to concentrate on is the pricing i recommend you stick to the market price rather than going cheaper. A take away tea might cost 70p what does it take to make it (tea bag,water,sugar,spoon,cup,lid,electric,staff,vat,tax) dont just sea it as tea.

 

[top-tastic]

Thanks for everyones comments so far. We have been open 9 days now, and things just get better and better. Same customers are coming back day after day, and love what they are getting.

We have had lots of great feedback, so fingers crossed things can only get better. Onwards and upwards.

Thanks Again

Darren

 

[Hancock & Fox]

As much as I don't have first hand experience of running a business like yours, I do run an interior design consultancy which caters to commercial clients and I am also a partner in a leisure/entertainment consultancy business.
A big part of what I do is helping business owners to communicate the ethics and individual strengths of their business to their clients via the design, layout and general visual communication of the premises.

This is a statistic which was recently brought to my attention: only 15% of consumers in the UK choose a service or product based on price as their primary consideration.
Please believe me when I say that if you're banking on your prices being your primary way of attracting business, you're barking up the wrong tree and might not attract the type of clientele you ideally want.

You have to give people an experience which they can't get anywhere else. Give them a lifestyle choice which they want to leave their home and be part of.
Obviously I don't know the exact locality of your business or the surrounding social/economic factors but I'd focus far more heavily on how your business is perceived visually and image-wise rather than prices.

Good luck and I hope you make all the right choices!

 

[IndiCafe]

Thanks for everyones comments so far. We have been open 9 days now, and things just get better and better. Same customers are coming back day after day, and love what they are getting.

We have had lots of great feedback, so fingers crossed things can only get better. Onwards and upwards.

Thanks Again

Darren

Excellent news.
Whilst it's all fresh, what would you say are the biggest lessons you've learned since opening? Dos and Don't, if you like. Would be helpful for others with similar plans.

 

[vvaannmmaann]

Thanks for everyones comments so far. We have been open 9 days now, and things just get better and better. Same customers are coming back day after day, and love what they are getting.

We have had lots of great feedback, so fingers crossed things can only get better. Onwards and upwards.

Thanks Again

Darren

How much for a Regular Americano ?